The future of E-books [Archive] - Thoughts Media Forums

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arawn

01-12-2006, 09:15 PM

Hi,
I’m thinking on writing a paper on the future of the E-book. Yet I know very little, so I would really appreciate some help.

Some thing I been thinking about:
1.If a E-reader can be as cheap and as easy on the eyes as ordinary paper, why would anyone use paperbooks except for nostalgia?
2.I’ve gotten the impression that this technology is exists to an affordable price.
3. But if so why doesn’t the E-book market explode?

When browsing the forum I see a lot of discussion about formats. Why is this an issue? If there is a profit some big electronics company will produce and sell a cheap e-reader machine, like the DivX DVD. Is it about copy protection? Yet, I’ve been told that if you can watch a text on screen it can be OCRd down to a textfile. And P2P hubs are full of Ebooks. I can understand that the big book companies aren’t throwing themselves over the technology but why not a third party? I mean compare with the MP3 format. The music industry did everything to stop it but in the end they were overrun by consumer interest. Shouldn’t we see something like this on the E-book front? Or are book lovers fewer and less insistent then music lovers?

Are there any gurus or bibles on this subject that I should know about?

McDeHack

01-12-2006, 10:00 PM

I do not believe that many people know of the existance of ebooks.
At the present time I have 28 books in the library on my Ipaq.
What a library to carry in ones pocket.
There has been a few times that when people ask what I am reading, and when I explain, they are amazed, and have never heard of ebooks.
I recently read or heard that there is a library that is lending out ebooks on CD. So it is begining to happen.

JD Silver

01-12-2006, 10:54 PM

Greetings!

I am an avid reader of ebooks, and have a 100's of books stored on my hard drive. My favorite is Mobipocket, which is quite fast and configurable. Some websites for purchasing ebooks are www.fictionwise.com, or www.mobipocket.com. The built in Microsoft eReader is very slow.

Most books with a current copyright are published with a form of DRM to protect the publisher from copying. Currently, the marketspace is a niche market, catering to a small audience. Publishers are hestitant to enter the market due to copyright concerns. The success of iTunes will likely reduce their apprehension about placing a book on the 'net, but it will take awhile for acceptance to increase.

The general public does not realize the potential of a PDA or cell phone, and many user's express concern about the size of the screen or font. They don't realize that the font can be adjusted by the user. The introduction of the Sony eReader at CES2006 indicates that acceptance of the concept is increasing.

The benefits are obvious...hundreds of ebooks can be stored on a CD, and your reader device is only limited by the size of its memory card. On the down side, it is difficult to render pictures from a book on the ebook unless the book has carefully converted to the format.

One issue is the cost of ebooks. The general public expects that the pricing of an ebook would be significantly less than a physical book, which is not the case. Obviously, the market would quickly increase if there was a reduction of the eprice over the hard copy.

arawn

01-13-2006, 12:47 AM

Thank you for your replies people.

I don’t have an E-reader a such (except Acrobat, I suppose thats an E-reader?) Yet I have downloaded a couple of hundred books. like movies or music, not read many, but still. I had a lecture at the library about E-books when they proudly presented som kind of format and documents that became unreadable after month or so and my thought was: If practically every book is availbale through P2P why bother? Compare to music or games, even people who buys the product tends to use the cracked one because it’s less hustle. Couldn't that be a reason people don't invest in E-book equipment?

I do not believe that many people know of the existance of ebooks.

Still a huge number of people encounter pdf-files in their daily lifes. The leap to look for a portable device to carry your work or pleasure everywhere shouldn’t be long.

Publishers are hestitant to enter the market due to copyright concerns. The success of iTunes will likely reduce their apprehension about placing a book on the 'net, but it will take awhile for acceptance to increase.

But shouldn’t they be afraid? If all an author have to do is put a book up on a server, what would you need publishers for?

I mean what will happen when you can buy a cheap palm computer-telephone-e-reader that can read pdf files? Just like a Mp3 or Divx player that doesn’t care about where the music or movie came from?

One issue is the cost of ebooks. The general public expects that the pricing of an ebook would be significantly less than a physical book, which is not the case.

How do the publishers motivate that?

JD Silver

01-13-2006, 02:31 AM

Hi Again,

You have certainly raised some interesting points about ebooks, and the issue of copyright law will prove to generate an interesting report. One could consider the copying of an ebook to be similar to lending a book to a friend. Could make an interesting court case.

In the ebook industry, there has been a rise of 'unpublished' authors successfully marketing ebooks. One issue to remember is that authors of ebooks, downloadable music, and software do need to be paid if they are going to continue to produce the products. Even if an author bypasses the traditional publishing process, they still should be paid for their time, if that is their profession.

Obviously, offering material online free of charge using P2P would be great for the consumer. Unfortunately, people still expect to be paid for their work, and it is on that model that our society currently functions.

Nurhisham Hussein

01-13-2006, 02:49 AM

I don’t have an E-reader a such (except Acrobat, I suppose thats an E-reader?)

Yes, Acrobat counts as an e-book reader - but I should say it's probably the worst of the lot, because it was never designed as such. It was meant for cross-platform document viewing, with an emphasis on keeping the formating intact - very different from the requirements of a good e-book reader, which requires a lot more customisation to suit the individual reader. I've only very rarely come across e-books in pdf form, and generally avoid it like the plague.

I had a lecture at the library about E-books when they proudly presented som kind of format and documents that became unreadable after month or so and my thought was: If practically every book is availbale through P2P why bother? Compare to music or games, even people who buys the product tends to use the cracked one because it’s less hustle. Couldn't that be a reason people don't invest in E-book equipment?

A couple of things here - you are correct in stating that draconian DRM regimes are one reason why many people get turned off from buying e-books. At least one major publisher agrees with you - Baen (http://www.baen.com/library/). Second, i have to disagree with the notion that many books are available in e-book formats - for the most part, a lot of the books you see on P2P are not available as official e-books, and are typically full of typos and OCR mistakes. The Harry Potter books come to mind, but also The Lord of the Rings, Tom Clancy's novels and many more. For that matter, there's a huge back catalogue of books still under copyright that are also not available anywhere in e-book form, legally or no.

Still a huge number of people encounter pdf-files in their daily lifes. The leap to look for a portable device to carry your work or pleasure everywhere shouldn’t be long.

Again, you need to make the distinction here between documents, and books. As you say, many come across pdf files on a day to day basis, but its quite a leap to go from there to thinking in terms of books. My wife is an avid reader, but she can't get around the small screen - to her the experience is not the same. I've been dealing with pdf files since almost the start of my working career, but I only just discovered e-books two years ago. And for most, the value proposition of a portable e-book reader is too low, especially for a dedicated device.

But shouldn’t they be afraid? If all an author have to do is put a book up on a server, what would you need publishers for?

Marketing and distribution; and filtering. The first function is where they make their money - in essence they provide that service to authors. They also use their branding to help readers in their choices - for instance you would associate Del Ray with fantasy and science fiction. The second part is an invisible service that they provide to readers - they only publish what they think readers will want to read, and by so doing filter out bad authors, and bad texts. Of course, this doesn't always work, but that service is there.

As for publishing through the internet without a publisher, you might want to look up Steve Jordan's thread here (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42138&highlight=steve+jordan) on the problems of an independent author. It ain't that easy.

I mean what will happen when you can buy a cheap palm computer-telephone-e-reader that can read pdf files? Just like a Mp3 or Divx player that doesn’t care about where the music or movie came from?

Have you tried reading a pdf file on a Palm or Pocket PC or any portable device? Let me tell you, it sucks very, very badly. And Adobe's DRM is one of the worst. If anyone saw pdf reading on a portable device as an e-book experience, then I wouldn't be surprised if it put them off the whole notion entirely.

One issue is the cost of ebooks. The general public expects that the pricing of an ebook would be significantly less than a physical book, which is not the case.

How do the publishers motivate that?

Brick and mortar thinking. What really boggles the mind is that they charge hard cover rates on first launch for potential best sellers. I can't imagine anyone paying those kinds of prices. But for the most part, I find the most e-book prices pretty palatable, and generally a quite a bit cheaper than the equivalent paperback.

arawn

01-13-2006, 12:34 PM

Even if an author bypasses the traditional publishing process, they still should be paid for their time, if that is their profession.

Sure. But that is a seperate issue. I want to understand what drives E-book process. If most material is de facto accessible, that is what will the development of the reader, wether that is illegal or not. Once again compare to DivX and MP3.

SteveHoward999

01-13-2006, 01:01 PM

If you want to write a paper on eBooks, take a look here for reference material - there are plenty of papers already written

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=ebooks+pda&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en

eBooks are not for everyone, but many of us love them. I have always been an avid reader, but stated emphatically 3.5 years ago that I could never use a PDA to read a book. 6 months later my wife bought me a PDA and I discovered that actually I LOVE reading eBooks.

I have a library of several hundred eBooks, mostly MS Reader format. Mostly legal too ;-) It is fantastic to be able to travel knowing I won;t ever run out of things to read. if you've ever flown international;ly you'll appreciate that carrying a PDA is a lot easier than carrying 3 paperback books.

Acrobat on PDA sucks for reading books, but if you have to read academic papers you are going to find most are in pdf format. I'm finishing up my Masters this week, and have been reading papers till they came out of my ears. I use a VGA PDA and that makes all the difference for making pdf documents readable on PDA ... you can almost get a full A4/letter page on one screen, provided your eyesight is up to it. I've probably read 150 or more papers using the PDA in the last 10 days!

Most people, as has been stated already, have no idea whe eBooks are. Most publishers have no idea that charging the same price (or even MORE) for an electronic copy of a book as for the paper version is crazy. I wish more publishers were as enlightened as BAEN.

Don't believe anyone who says there is a limit on the number of books available, Sure some publishers or writers object to their work going electronic (J K Rowling is a classic short-sighted example) but just check out placed like www.fictionwise.com to see how many books are available. If you read through that lot, you can always check out the Gutenberg project for out-of-copyright books.

PDA phones are going to become a lot more popular this year. Until now, PDAs have been seen as a geek's toy, or a business luxury. With so many smart phones and PDA phones on the market, there are going to be a lot more people discovering the power and versatility of PDAs over the next couple of years. eBooks will certainly get more popular too.

SteveHoward999

01-13-2006, 01:07 PM

http://www.coe.unco.edu/JimGall/Myths.pdf

arawn

01-13-2006, 02:04 PM

Yes, Acrobat counts as an e-book reader - but I should say it's probably the worst of the lot, because it was never designed as such.
OK

Second, i have to disagree with the notion that many books are available in e-book formats - for the most part, a lot of the books you see on P2P are not available as official e-books, and are typically full of typos and OCR mistakes.

Oh I understand that they often aren't official. but for the purpose of reading it seems to matter little. Likewise with OCR typos. I haven't explored this to a greater degree but the books I've been looking for I've found, in some form. And my impression is that if there was a demand they would get uploaded. I believe that the greatest reason why books aren't extensivly available is the lack of a reading platform. (compare with audibooks those exist in abundance.)
But if a reader was cheap, accessible and people wanted to read I see no reason why those wouldn't be there as well.

Again, you need to make the distinction here between documents, and books. As you say, many come across pdf files on a day to day basis, but its quite a leap to go from there to thinking in terms of books.

It is? Perhaps I'm not typical but I doubt I'm the only one who gets irritated when I'm reading a book, press Cntrl+F and nothing happens.

My wife is an avid reader, but she can't get around the small screen - to her the experience is not the same.

And you believe this is feature problem rather then a attitude?

Marketing and distribution; and filtering. The first function is where they make their money - in essence they provide that service to authors. They also use their branding to help readers in their choices - for instance you would associate Del Ray with fantasy and science fiction. The second part is an invisible service that they provide to readers - they only publish what they think readers will want to read, and by so doing filter out bad authors, and bad texts.

I can only see that the first function matters. If anyone can download the book from the authors website what distribution are we talking about?

Review sites are legion. If I want to know about a book I go to a relevant message board and ask. I don't see few producer paying for this to get a stamp of approval.

As for publishing through the internet without a publisher, you might want to look up Steve Jordan's thread on the problems of an independent author. It ain't that easy.

I understand that if no one knows about you it will be tough, but if you are one of the bestsellers, those who make the publishers the big money?

Have you tried reading a pdf file on a Palm or Pocket PC or any portable device? Let me tell you, it sucks very, very badly. And Adobe's DRM is one of the worst. If anyone saw pdf reading on a portable device as an e-book experience, then I wouldn't be surprised if it put them off the whole notion entirely.

No I haven't. Still it's not always the greatest technical solution that wins in the end, compare Betamax and VHS. Were the latter had a higher quality.
PDF files seems to dominate and the pirated books are either hmtl, pdf or pure text.

Steve Jordan

01-13-2006, 07:47 PM

As an author and e-book seller, I'd like to throw my 2 cents in.

I perused this very forum, asked a lot of similar questions, and finally came up with a business model: To sell e-books online, at a cost more in line with my low production costs ($2.50USD), in multiple formats, and without DRM entirely. The theory went, if the price is conveniently low enough, stealing is minimized, and DRM is not needed.

I've been selling for 3 months now, including soliciting reviews from other sites, offering freebies and regular commentary, and sending out about 30 periodic announcements and e-mails to PPC, Smartphone, e-book and Sci-Fi web sites per month. I've had exposure in the thousands by now, and great reviews from 2 online sites.

Still, after 3 months, I haven't seen impressive sales. I initially offered a free anthology series, which has been downloaded 600 times since I opened. But my book sales are still in the low 2-digit range.

I believe there is a huge inertia from the paper books market that has not yet been overcome. Most people aren't looking for e-books... they are still shopping at bookstores, which carry no e-books... or they go to outlets like amazon.com, which sells few e-books, and doesn't advertise them strongly, unless they are e-copies of an established author's print book.

Also, the PPC market isn't growing too fast. (In fact, I've been surprised to see my local computer and office supply outlets cutting back on the number of PDAs they sell, or even display.) Smartphones are a growing market, but compared to regular phones, it's a drop in the bucket. Most people haven't gotten used to regular reading on small screens, or figured out which reader they are comfortable with. There's a long way to go before everyone has a PDA or smartphone that they use for entertainment, not just light duty, PIM and phone calls (this forum group notwithstanding).

Finally, the market is still geared towards big names, famous authors, etc, who haven't mucked much with the e-book market. Us newbies, amateurs and forward-thinkers are trying it, but we're not what the market is highlighting, so people don't flock to us. They want to know what Stephen King is doing online... not Steve Jordan.

But, like a ripple in the middle of the ocean that eventually becomes a wave (maybe even a tsunami!), e-books are developing... markets are adjusting... advertising is forming... business models are morphing... and eventually, it'll happen.

Steve Jordan

01-13-2006, 08:00 PM

As for publishing through the internet without a publisher, you might want to look up Steve Jordan's thread on the problems of an independent author. It ain't that easy.

FYI, that one is: www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42138 It was a very informative thread!

I understand that if no one knows about you it will be tough, but if you are one of the bestsellers, those who make the publishers the big money?

One problem your question highlights, is the fact that big publishers aren't into the e-book market, primarily because they do not know how to make money at it (yet). So they go to the authors, and make it worth their while to stay with the publishers in the traditional print world. It would not surprise me to discover that clauses limiting e-books and self-distribution are being written into many book and author contracts these days.

Rest assured, when the number of e-book readers grows to rival the print market, publishers will figure out how to profit on e-books. But until then, they will continue to hoard the bestselling authors as much as possible, and keep them concentrated on the print market.

Nurhisham Hussein

01-14-2006, 12:48 AM

I haven't explored this to a greater degree but the books I've been looking for I've found, in some form. And my impression is that if there was a demand they would get uploaded. I believe that the greatest reason why books aren't extensivly available is the lack of a reading platform. (compare with audibooks those exist in abundance.)
But if a reader was cheap, accessible and people wanted to read I see no reason why those wouldn't be there as well.

First, most books I have tried to find don't exist in e-book form - legally or illegally. I disagree about the lack of a reading platform being the reason for ebooks not being more widely available - after all if you have a PC, you can read an e-book.

It is? Perhaps I'm not typical but I doubt I'm the only one who gets irritated when I'm reading a book, press Cntrl+F and nothing happens.

You've completely lost me there - what does Ctrl-F do?

My wife is an avid reader, but she can't get around the small screen - to her the experience is not the same.

And you believe this is feature problem rather then a attitude?

Both - especially if you're talking about a fixed format container like pdf.

Review sites are legion. If I want to know about a book I go to a relevant message board and ask. I don't see few producer paying for this to get a stamp of approval.

Most of the stuff I'd be interested in don't have a review.

I understand that if no one knows about you it will be tough, but if you are one of the bestsellers, those who make the publishers the big money?

Ah...but how do you go from unknown to bestseller? How are you going to capture the huge part of the paying public that doesn't bother with the internet? How are you going to capture MY attention, considering I have absolutely no interest in the crap that gets passed as bestsellers these days?

Have you tried reading a pdf file on a Palm or Pocket PC or any portable device? Let me tell you, it sucks very, very badly. And Adobe's DRM is one of the worst. If anyone saw pdf reading on a portable device as an e-book experience, then I wouldn't be surprised if it put them off the whole notion entirely.

No I haven't. Still it's not always the greatest technical solution that wins in the end, compare Betamax and VHS. Were the latter had a higher quality.
PDF files seems to dominate and the pirated books are either hmtl, pdf or pure text.

I don't think you understood what I meant. I use a VGA device, and even then it's a frustrating experience. To use your analogy, how would you like a video technology that only allowed you to see one-fourth of the screen at a time? Where you have to scroll left and right, up and down to read a complete sentence? For portable use html and txt ARE the superior technology, and also far more ubiquitous.

Steve Jordan

01-14-2006, 05:11 AM

I don't think you understood what I meant. I use a VGA device, and even then it's a frustrating experience. To use your analogy, how would you like a video technology that only allowed you to see one-fourth of the screen at a time? Where you have to scroll left and right, up and down to read a complete sentence? For portable use html and txt ARE the superior technology, and also far more ubiquitous.

Ah... I thought that was the complaint with PDF as an e-reader format, but you may be the first to say it definitively. This is why I don't have the same complaint: I use tagged PDF documents, that don't require left-to-right scrolling. They reflow, just like other e-book formats. (My PDF formatted e-books are tagged, too.) Is VGA somehow incapable of reflowing PDFs, or (do you know) are you just working with untagged PDFs?

Sorry, this is aside of the point of this thread, but I had to ask.

arawn

01-14-2006, 05:17 PM

If you want to write a paper on eBooks, take a look here for reference material - there are plenty of papers already written
It almost always is. :mrgreen: And it make writing so much easier. But really I’ve been curious about this for quite sometime so I’m looking for an angle.
I was about to write that I actually could use google, all by myself, then I saw the scholar feature. I had no idea it existed and I’ve been looking for something like this. Thank you.

Most publishers have no idea that charging the same price (or even MORE) for an electronic copy of a book as for the paper version is crazy.
That seems rather hard to believe. I would have thought most people intuitively would think that distributing an electronic datafile would cost very little. Even publishers uses the internet I assume?

Most people, as has been stated already, have no idea whe eBooks are.
So? If there is a product and a market, then ignorance seem to be a job for the marketing department. There seems to be no situation where a paperbook would get one over an ebook so why aren’t one of the cheap electronic companies churning out e-readers?

PDA phones are going to become a lot more popular this year. Until now, PDAs have been seen as a geek's toy, or a business luxury. With so many smart phones and PDA phones on the market, there are going to be a lot more people discovering the power and versatility of PDAs over the next couple of years.
On the long run that would probably be the way. I have been told that the most avid readers are middleaged women not the most PDA intensive consumer group. You would think a simple dedicated reader would be easier to massmarket.

arawn

01-14-2006, 06:34 PM

To sell e-books online, at a cost more in line with my low production costs ($2.50USD), in multiple formats, and without DRM entirely. The theory went, if the price is conveniently low enough, stealing is minimized, and DRM is not needed.

That sounds very reasonable. But ,as you say, the greatest group litterature consumers aren’t browsing for E-books. Then there is the question how many people there are who wan’ts to buy your books in the first place. The internet is full of talented people who supplies their stories for free. It would interesting to make a comperative study between two similar authors where one used your model and another tried it the old-fashioned way.

One problem your question highlights, is the fact that big publishers aren't into the e-book market, primarily because they do not know how to make money at it (yet). So they go to the authors, and make it worth their while to stay with the publishers in the traditional print world. It would not surprise me to discover that clauses limiting e-books and self-distribution are being written into many book and author contracts these days.
That make sense. I even believe I’ve read something about it.

SteveHoward999

01-14-2006, 07:04 PM

Most publishers have no idea that charging the same price (or even MORE) for an electronic copy of a book as for the paper version is crazy.

That seems rather hard to believe. I would have thought most people intuitively would think that distributing an electronic datafile would cost very little. Even publishers uses the internet I assume?

Yeah but look at the music industry. The cost of buying music online is just as high as buying a CD. I think people who are motivated to buy music and books on-line are perceived in the same way - they are technically savvy, financially 'comfortable' (or have good credit ;-)) with the money to spend on their gadgets. I am sure the vendors know fine well that they are charging more than we think we should pay for the electronic files, but we are rich and will buy them anyway. There are other things to consider too.

For instance - if the files are so cheap that we all buy them and stop buying paper books, there is a whole industry employing many many thousands of people that will suffer. Sure it would take a long time for the book industry to fade away, but as fewer people buy books, the price of the printed volumes would go up and so fewer books would be sold ... a vicious cycle would set in.

The Internet has already started this very process with newspapers ...

Most people, as has been stated already, have no idea whe eBooks are.
So? If there is a product and a market, then ignorance seem to be a job for the marketing department. There seems to be no situation where a paperbook would get one over an ebook so why aren’t one of the cheap electronic companies churning out e-readers?

Try reading an ebook on a plane just before take-off. Someone told the air crew that electronic devices can interfere with navigation so PDAs must be turned off. Why that matters when they are on the ground and can see where they are going, but does not matter when they are flying in the air and need to use instruments seems to be something they have failed to consider ;-)

Part of my own issue with dedicated eReaders is that they are so large. This is less of an issue for middle-aged women. They want or need a larger device. So long as my eyesight holds out I will continue to use a PDA with VGA(or better) screen ... it's a lot more portable.

The other issue I have with eReaders is price. I don't recall seeing any under $100, and I am sure I have seen some over $300. Add that to the cost of the books and they become very expensive. I spent more on my PDA, sure, but then it does so much more.

You would think a simple dedicated reader would be easier to massmarket.

It's easy to sell that thought to me, and to you. But we are already nicely settled in geekdom.

I showed my PDA, complete with video player, book reader, map software, GPS etc to scores of people over the years. Every one (maybe out of politeness) said how great it was. Every one has reslutely failed to buy one for themselves. Right now the perception is that PDAs (and, by inference, book readers) are still geeky toys. You make the point fairly, that it is up to the marketing departments to sell eReaders.

For true success they need to be trying to get the attention of non-geeks. For that to work it needs to be as easy to buy and use an eBook as it is to buy a DVD.

I keep asking my wife why it is not possible to browse a paper book in a book store, then go to the counter and purchase an electronic version of the book. Or even buy the book and get en electronic version tucked inside the back cover ... I'd buy that! Better yet, buy the complete works of Stephen King (insert your favourite Author there) on CD-ROM for a **reasonable** charge. I think I would be happy to pay for that CD if it had multiple book formats on the disc, and some additional biographical info and a list of film/tv offshoots.

And what about films? How many films are inspired by or based on existing books? I love to browse the special features on DVD. I would be very happy to discover an eBook there that I can pull off the DVD and onto my PDA. - OK I like that idea. It's 12 noon (Central America time) on Saturday 14th January 2006 and I thought of it first Time-Warner/AOL.

;-)

Steve Jordan

01-14-2006, 07:13 PM

It would interesting to make a comperative study between two similar authors where one used your model and another tried it the old-fashioned way.

When you say, "the old-fashioned way," are you referring to giving them away... or selling them in print?

I'd like to make money selling e-books (I'm not in it just to hear people say nice things about me). I could make the most money in print, but breaking into the print industry is incredibly unlikely for a new, unknown author like me, no matter how good I may (or may not) be.

Now, I could give them away... and, like my free anthology serties, would expect to see downloads in the hundreds to thousands, but get no money. Or, IF I broke into print publishing, I could make a good income thanks to the publishing house putting their incredible resources and sales engine behind me... but I can't get editors or publishers to even LOOK at my material, good or bad, so I can't get in.

So there's your comparison: Either way would beat my e-book model hands-down, but print isn't available for me, and free is pointless. (I'll note here that having over 600 downloads of my free book has not created much buzz about me, or sales of the rest of my books, so it has not proven to be an effective marketing tool.)

So, at this point in the e-book industry, the likelihood that I will make much money is extremely slight. I can only hope that, after I've made some sales and gotten good reviews and unsolicited comments of my work, I can take that to a print publisher, as a sort of resume, and get my foot in the door. Or I can wait until the e-book industry starts to really move, or word-of-mouth of my work reaches epic proportins, and then maybe make some real money. Both are long-term goals, and the only goals I can aim for at this time.

Steve Jordan

01-14-2006, 07:19 PM

And what about films? How many films are inspired by or based on existing books? I love to browse the special features on DVD. I would be very happy to discover an eBook there that I can pull off the DVD and onto my PDA. - OK I like that idea. It's 12 noon (Central America time) on Saturday 14th January 2006 and I thought of it first Time-Warner/AOL.

That IS a good one... even if it was just the novelization of the movie. I'd buy that.

SteveHoward999

01-14-2006, 08:31 PM

That IS a good one... even if it was just the novelization of the movie. I'd buy that.

Hmmm - maybe. I bought a book years ago that was a 'novelization' of a film, but I didn't realise until I read it. Very disapointing. I guess if it came with the movie and there was no doubt what it was I would be happy enough.

Steve Jordan

01-15-2006, 02:12 PM

Hey, for an e-book on a DVD, you could have both!

(and by the way, you DO go too far. Michelob sucks! Try a Sam Adams. :wink: )

Jorgen

01-15-2006, 04:24 PM

Still, after 3 months, I haven't seen impressive sales. I initially offered a free anthology series ...

Going into deep water: perhaps you should have given the best of your novels away. They are all very, very good and way above the anthology series. From the books I know, I would have given either Robin or Midgards Militia (well, I haven't finished the latter yet but it looks like another favourite) away to create the buzz. Those of you who have read any of the novels: get them while you can!

But, Steve, I may well be completely wrong - as I have said before, I generally don't like short stories and if I hadn't "known" you through the discussions here, I would probably never have read it.

Jorgen

CoreyJF

01-15-2006, 04:27 PM

I see you are a neighbor. I will check out you work, I like supporting local artists.

So there's your comparison: Either way would beat my e-book model hands-down, but print isn't available for me, and free is pointless. (I'll note here that having over 600 downloads of my free book has not created much buzz about me, or sales of the rest of my books, so it has not proven to be an effective marketing tool.)

What are you doing to market your ebooks? Right now, Print Publishers most powerful tool is there marketing infrastructure. What are you doing to build that fan base which would in turn make your work more appealing to a print publisher?

So, at this point in the e-book industry, the likelihood that I will make much money is extremely slight. I can only hope that, after I've made some sales and gotten good reviews and unsolicited comments of my work, I can take that to a print publisher, as a sort of resume, and get my foot in the door. Or I can wait until the e-book industry starts to really move, or word-of-mouth of my work reaches epic proportins, and then maybe make some real money. Both are long-term goals, and the only goals I can aim for at this time.

I think starting with ebooks is a great idea, I plan on using a similar route when I am ready to publish. If you can develop a core fan base and demonstrate that to a publisher, they are more likely to take a chance on you. Like all business, they have to justify their return on investment.

CoreyJF

01-15-2006, 05:08 PM

Some thing I been thinking about:
1.If a E-reader can be as cheap and as easy on the eyes as ordinary paper, why would anyone use paperbooks except for nostalgia?
2.I’ve gotten the impression that this technology is exists to an affordable price.
3. But if so why doesn’t the E-book market explode?

I hope not. Don't get me wrong, I love ebooks. When I was a English teacher, I would teach straight from my annotations in my ebooks on my pocketpc. I also love the flexibility of being able to take a large library where ever I go. You can make notes without destroying the book. You can look up a word without putting your device down and it has a built in book light.

That being said, there is a visceral quality to reading a book that is not matched by its electronic counterpart. I don't know, maybe that is just the bibliophile in me, but there is something in the smell and feel of an old book that speaks to my soul.

I do think that one day the majority of books will be published electronically. I don't think the technology is quite where you are saying it is. I have great vision, so I don't mind reading on a small screen, but it would quickly give my wife a headache. Right now the average consumer simply isn't carrying a device that would allow for the comfortable reading of ebooks. Personally I think once a high resolution, flexible e-paper is successfully mass produced, then you will see the ebook market explode.

Steve Jordan

01-15-2006, 05:21 PM

What are you doing to market your ebooks?

My marketing includes announcements and press releases every month (at least), to coincide with new releases or good news (like positive reviews). I send those out to about a dozen PDA and e-book-related sites, and almost a dozen Sci-Fi-related sites.

I also solicit reviews to draw interest... right now, I have reviews on www.ebook-reviews.net and www.digireader.com. (Unfortunately, the holidays have cut back their reviewing schedules, and the noticeably lower sales of Factory Orbit may be the result of that.) I am still looking for other sites to review my material.

Finally, e-mails go out to buyers of my books, advising them of the latest release. I hoped word-of-mouth from readers would help spread the word, but if readers are talking, not too many are listening or buying.

I'm still trying to think of other promotional tactics (apart from simply buying ad space), but haven't come up with anything of note. Jorgen: Maybe giving away one of the full novels would have been a better choice, but without knowing how each book would be received, that was a crapshoot. I picked the anthologies because readers would be able to get an impression of my work in smaller bites (or should I say bytes? :wink: ). Oh, well. Live and learn.

Steve Jordan

01-15-2006, 05:34 PM

CoreyJF

01-15-2006, 07:17 PM

That being said, there is a visceral quality to reading a book that is not matched by its electronic counterpart. I don't know, maybe that is just the bibliophile in me, but there is something in the smell and feel of an old book that speaks to my soul.

When I studied architecture in college, I had an art teacher who forced students to use old-fashioned pencils when drawing or sketching. "Feel the warmth of the wood!" he would always say. Today, my friends and I jokingly use that phrase for anyone who has that similar fixation on older tools, especially when there is little or no difference in the final result.

I've read on paper for most of my life. On the other hand, I also learned to type on a Royal typewriter, but I can now type on this PC keyboard... or on a handheld's mini keyboard, or on-screen keyboard. I read Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy on my PDA, and I still laughed at the funny parts. When I write, I use a uniball pen, not a quill, and no one complains about the lack of aesthetics in my signature.

Reading on e-book screens just takes doing and getting used to. The younger generations especially, will pick it up easily. Eventually, everyone will be used to them, and won't think too much about the difference. (I imagine the ones who will think a lot about the difference, will teach art!)

As I said in my earlier post, I am sure the e-book market will explode some day. The technology just isn't quite there for the average user. I myself love reading ebooks and have even taught strait from my pocketpc. I have been reading ebooks for many years, but the reality is, it is not as physically comfortable or as appealing as reading a bound book. I am an avid reader and being technophile as well as bibliophile I can appreciate the ebook for what it has to offer. But considering literature is meant to be appreciated and enjoyed, you should not so easily dismiss aesthetics; it does lend itself to the overall experience, therefore having an effect on the "final result". And as for comfort, I have 20/20 version and after a evening spent with a good book, I have far less eye strain if that book was bound versus on my handheld.

I think when the technology improves we will see a shift for most books. When you have durable, foldable, lightweight and inexpensive e-paper that is at least the size of an open paperback book, we will see a proliferation of ebooks. Hopefully they will still print bound books for those of us who can appreciate the beauty of the wrapping as well as the present inside.

Embracing new technology doesn't not require one the abandon the past, a blended approach works best for most things in life.

SteveHoward999

01-15-2006, 07:33 PM

I have been reading ebooks for many years, but the reality is, it is not as physically comfortable or as appealing as reading a bound book. I am an avid reader and being technophile as well as bibliophile I can appreciate the ebook for what it has to offer. But considering literature is meant to be appreciated and enjoyed, you should not so easily dismiss aesthetics; it does lend itself to the overall experience, therefore having an effect on the "final result". And as for comfort, I have 20/20 version and after a evening spent with a good book, I have far less eye strain if that book was bound versus on my handheld.

The one thing that gets overlooked often in conversations like this is YMMV - Your Mileage May Vary ... your experience may be different from mine.

Like you, I am a technophile and a biliophile, and my eyesight is easily p to reading small text on a PDA for hours without eyestrain.

However I no longer enoy paper books. I have to put more effort into readnig a book. I have to use both hands to hold it, I have to turn pages, I get pins and needles in my hands (carpal tunnel) if I hold a book too long, I keep my wife awake if I have the light on in bed to read ...

My initial resistance to reading books on PDA was based on the same grounds that you argue keep paper books alive for you. But I quickly discovered that, for me, the convenience and portability of a PDA far outweigh any romantic ideal of reading a smelly old book :-)

CoreyJF

01-15-2006, 11:03 PM

The one thing that gets overlooked often in conversations like this is YMMV - Your Mileage May Vary ... your experience may be different from mine.

Like you, I am a technophile and a biliophile, and my eyesight is easily p to reading small text on a PDA for hours without eyestrain.

The conversation thread is about the masses switching to switching to ebooks.

While you may be able to read for hours comfortably on a PDA screen, many cannot with the technology as it stands today. On a basic biological level, there is more eye strain caused by reading on a small screen versus a book.

Nor has the technology become affordable and prevalent enough that Tom, Dick and or Harry is going to go for a swim and leave it on their beach towel.

My comments are based on two distinct points

1. There are still some technological hurtles before ebooks will be adopted en masse

2. For some, the act of reading can be enhanced by the, touch, texture and feel of of an old book. That can be a joyous experience for some and it is my hope that future generations will have the option of experiencing it for themselves.

Again, I love ebooks, I have a library full of them. When I was a teacher I used to scan stuff just so I could have it on my handheld. But before the technology can become the "main' way people read, it still has some growing to do, and I hope their will always be a market for people wanting the a beautifully bound book.

SteveHoward999

01-15-2006, 11:18 PM

The conversation thread is about the masses switching to switching to ebooks.

You carefully snipped the rest of what I said - which means I failed to make my point. For some people, and I include myself, reading books on PDA is more preferable than reading paper books. I am not fool enough to think we are anything but in the minority today.

For others, paper books are a more pleasurable reading media, for reasons you already mention, and also because gadgets like PDAs are "just not for me". In other words, even if cost were no issue, a significant percentage of people will never even consider reading books on PDA or computer because they just won't. The real future of eBooks is with the young. Do a search on scholar.google for Mark Prensky's articles on Digital Natives. He has plenty to say that shows why older people will never fully adopt modern technology.

CoreyJF

01-15-2006, 11:40 PM

The conversation thread is about the masses switching to switching to ebooks.

You carefully snipped the rest of what I said - which means I failed to make my point. For some people, and I include myself, reading books on PDA is more preferable than reading paper books. I am not fool enough to think we are anything but in the minority today.

As you quoting me and implied that I was overlooking the fact that "your experience is different from mine." I was pointing out the context of my statements were based on why the technology is not ready for the masses. I was not stating that ebooks couldn't be a better solution for some. In fact you snipped out of my statement that I think the future will be mostly digital.

Steve Jordan

01-16-2006, 12:31 AM

In the same way that the invention of paperbacks didn't mean the end of hardbacks, e-books won't mean the end of print books. It will probably mean some books may come out in hardback first, then paperbacks and/or e-books later... and some books will go straight to paperback and/or e-book. Eventually, maybe books will exist in hardback and e-book formats only (assuming those who are visually disabled can use audio e-book reading technology).

Compared to hardbacks, paperbacks had smaller type, and were printed on cheaper paper or newsprint. But people got used to that, and many who grew up on paperbacks can't even imagine lugging around a hardback book, blowing through that huge type, or paying so much for a single book. E-books are in the same position as the first paperbacks: Getting people to accept the differences in exchange for the advantages of the format.

I think the conversion point really will be the "killer app" that finally gets people to buy a device that will read e-books... then they will try them, the publishers will offer more, and the conversion will start. It may be a PDA... a dedicated e-reader... a "mini-PC"... or some other odd thing that just happens to have a good screen on it. I don't know what, and I don't know if anyone does... but it'll reveal itself eventually.

It might turn out to be content, that can only be read on an e-book. Can you say "iPod"? Can you say "porn"?

E-books will eventually make it big because of the same reasons paperbacks made it: Lower price, convenience, portability. E-books have portability in spades, but they still have to break through price and convenience barriers.

Paper books will always be around, if only for their nostalgic or traditional value. But just as some people are happy with only paperbacks today (I do not own hardbacks), people will someday be satisfied with an entire library of e-books only. And many will have 90% e-books, and a few beloved tomes in hardback.

CoreyJF

01-16-2006, 01:03 AM

I agree that ebooks will eventually become big. Once the technology matures I have no doubt that there will be a proliferation on ebooks. My guess is e-paper or whatever follows that will be key.

I personally have tons (literally) of hardbacks for two reasons, I don't like waiting for the paperback release and I do like the physical experience of reading a hardback. But I also have plenty of paperback and ebooks as well.

Another reason I would hate to see a complete and total elimination of the physical book (again I also think and hope there will always be a market for actual books) would be the loss of the brick and mortar bookstore. I can spend hours walking around a bookstore with my wife and a cup of coffee. That is an experience that can't be matched online. It is a different process online, at least for me. It tends to be more targeted, less browsing. Walking through a bookstore I am more likely to find an unusual gem then when I browse, fictionwise, mobi or even my beloved Audible.

Yes I know Audilbe is spoken word and a different beast entirely.

Steve Jordan

01-16-2006, 01:30 AM

I wish I could enjoy bookstore browsing like I used to. But these days, cruising through the Sci-Fi/Fantasy shelves usually means a flood of books that all look and sound the same, and a crick in my neck from trying to examine the walls of sideways titles!

What I wish I still had was a bookstore where the workers knew me and my buying tastes, and could recommend new books that have come in, that they have already checked out themselves. You just can't get that from your supermall's Barnes and Noble. And there are no old-fashioned non-franchise/privately owned/small staff bookstores near enough to my home to make me a regular.

(This is why I started writing: Having such a hard time finding stuff I wanted to read!)

CoreyJF

01-16-2006, 02:02 AM

Steve Jordan

01-16-2006, 03:07 AM

I have to admit I tend to go to Borders since it is walking distance from me, but have you tried Politics Prose on Connecticut Ave?

With a commute from downtown DC back to Germantown, I don't usually stick around when the whistle blows.

The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that someone will have to come up with a content exclusive to e-readers to push the public over, just like iTunes pushed the public over to purchase iPods. I don't see any device capturing the public's interest (or wallets) without exclusive, desirable content.

And I know I said "porn," but it will probably be content that people won't be ashamed to be seen viewing in public. Maybe some kind of constantly-updating blog, reality show or website that people "just can't be without." A "Truman Show" kind of phenomenon.

Of course, I wouldn't rule out porn...

CoreyJF

01-16-2006, 03:53 AM

Steve Jordan

01-17-2006, 04:06 AM

e-paper could do it, but I don't think it has to be that. The new video iPod could do it... a PSP could do it... if the content was right.

Suppose Random House, say, decided to put their ENTIRE CATALOG out in e-book format, very cheap, and optimized for the video iPod? iPod sales through the roof. Suppose a software maker made it easy to somehow convert every book you ever wanted into a format redable on a PSP? PSP sales you'd never believe.

So far, publishers have not cooperated with e-book publishing. The first one that does, and does it in a big way, will get the wave started. The content will drive the e-book revolution. And let's be honest, I put my books online because I hoped to be part of that... one of those who got that wave started. Of course, I'm a small fish in a big ocean. But even a small fish that jumps the right way can get a good wave going.

CoreyJF

01-27-2006, 01:28 AM

I don't think it will be a PSP or IPOD type device. I think for it to hit critical mass, it will need to be an inexpensive device. Something not much more then the price of a hardback. Something you can take to the beech or pool.

Steve Jordan

01-27-2006, 04:29 AM

I think there's room for both dedicated devices and combo devices. Instead of thinking of the PPC market (sorry, everyone), consider the cell phone market as a better example: The variety spans from simple phones to mini-computer multimedia data center monsters.

Sure, there will be people who will like an inexpensive dedicated reader, and those should always sell... in fact, if they're cheap enough give 'em away! On the other hand, a reader that can do other things (like carry your PIM data, let you play games, surf the web) will be popular for the same reason that cutting-edge stylish, picture-taking, MP3-playing, text-messaging cell phones are popular... even at high prices. The right combination of features would sell a combo device. Especially if the desired content is there.

A subscription service similar to the cell phone's service market could get the devices into people's hands in the first place (you get the device at a discount, in exchange for a year's subscription making their content available to you, say, a year of Sports Illustrated, US News, NY Times, or Oprah Magazine). You can still buy other content, at an additional cost to your subscription. Then, after the initial subscription period, you can purchase anything available, and/or subscribe to other services.

(Okay, I'm claiming this idea... it's Thursday, Jan 26 2006, at 10:30PM EST.)

Jorgen

01-27-2006, 07:11 AM

I think for it to hit critical mass, it will need to be an inexpensive device. Something not much more then the price of a hardback.

You are absolutely right. E-paper of some kind is expected to be used even as part of the packaging of consumer goods, in other words cheap.

But the same way as ebooks and music are overpriced because publishers can get away with it, we will have to sit out some expensive readers first. Don't stop polishing your PDAs yet.

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-03-2006, 01:39 AM

Jorgen

02-03-2006, 08:33 AM

Content is of course very important and is what keeps the market alive right now. However, cheap and easy-to-use hardware is necessary to sell to the masses. PDAs are not easy enough to use as ebook readers, the screen is only just about OK (well, I like the Palm and PPC screens, but my father could not read the text on any of them) and certainly not cheap.

Which content? The has always been and will always be the $64000 question.

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-03-2006, 01:04 PM

Which content? The has always been and will always be the $64000 question.

Exactly why I'm asking! In the same way that iTunes kicked off the widespread use of the iPod, there must be some thing that people will want bad enough to buy whatever e-book reader is available, right now, to get it! As someone trying to sell e-books, I'd like to know if there's something additional I can offer to my present (and potential new) customers. Not only for their benefit, but for my bottom line.

It's hard to imagine books themselves filling that bill with only printed words. Maybe some addition to the content that printed books can't provide, and that everyone would want?

Jorgen

02-03-2006, 06:27 PM

It's hard to imagine books themselves filling that bill with only printed words.

Is that what you meant? Well, words alone works for a lot of books and will work for ebooks as well.

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-04-2006, 12:43 AM

Yeah, that didn't exactly come out right. I meant to say that maybe e-books need something other than just the text of a book to make it compelling to readers... at least in the near-term, when people need a reason to buy e-book readers and read e-books.

Or maybe a particular subject matter or compositional approach that is uncommon to print. There have been a few attempts at compositions that take advantage of text links to jump back and forth in the story, or between multiple storylines.

PetiteFlower

02-04-2006, 03:01 AM

I think in order for there to be an e-book revolution, there would have to be content ONLY available in ebook format, that was highly desired. Like, say, the next Harry Potter book coming out only as an ebook. Or maybe, a month earlier as an ebook. THAT would spur people into the electronic age!

A thought - what prompted the move from VHS to DVD? Sure, the quality and usability was part of it, but I think the availability of DVD special features is what REALLY made people want to switch :)

Steve Jordan

02-04-2006, 05:09 AM

Exclusive early content... yeah, that's a good one!

Jorgen

02-04-2006, 07:01 AM

No, the argument should be that you can have a nice selection in your pocket at all times and that you - though you have to invest $30 in an eInk reader :D - can buy more books for $2 each.

Jorgen

PetiteFlower

02-04-2006, 08:24 PM

That already exists, clearly it's not going to make the majority switch.

Steve Jordan

02-04-2006, 09:54 PM

Agreed (except fpr the $2 part... see the thread about e-books being so expensive). As much as I wish otherwise, the public clearly needs more of a reason to switch to e-readers. Hence the effort to develop new marketing ideas.

I like exclusive content, and exclusive early content. Exclusive early content is easy to work out: Simply make a deal with someone who's producing a popular book series (Rowling, Clancy, Steele, etc). But what would make good exclusive content? It also needs to be a popular subject/content type, and it should be something that you won't mind showing others who see you with it. You want the "Oh, wow, is that XYZ? Can I see that?" viral marketing factor to kick in.

It could even be naughty/salacious, without being legally or morally unsuitable for public consumption. (Although I wouldn't rule out an underground content market like porn driving e-book use, if it's linked to primarily illegal or immoral content, it will never get into the mainstream.)

In that light, I could suggest content similar to the lite men's mags like "Maxim" and "Stuff" (lots of trash talk, guy stuff, and girls, but no porn or nudity). Also any other mags that people tend to want to hide from the public, for fear of looking silly, geeky, overly effeminate/masculine, young, old, or just plain weird. ("Dollhouse Miniatures" comes to mind.) Graphic novels are also a possibility: beat that "comic book" stigma by reading it on your PPC and looking cool (Does not apply in Japan)!

How about catalogs? A complete catalog from popular clothing, toy or electronic manufacturers, or from specialty stores like Victoria's Secret or Sharper Image, downloaded perhaps 2-3 times a year, could be great content for e-book readers ("Check it out-- I have the whole Armani collection right here! EEEEEE!!"). Especially if it includes exclusive items not in the print catalogs, or online coupons redeemable at the counter (to make you bring the reader with you).

Jorgen

02-05-2006, 07:25 AM

That already exists, clearly it's not going to make the majority switch.

No, it doesn't

1) $30 reader? Does not exist.
2) cheap ebooks around the two-dollar mark? Only few are available under, say (to make Steve happy), $2.50.
This is anyway an arbitrary value grasped out of thin air: sell plenty and even with a $2 pricetag, there should be plenty for both e-publisher and author. Very cheap books will make it less of an incentive for stealing the contents or borrowing the ebook from the library (you have to wait for it to be free).
3) easy-to-use reader - I forgot it in that message, but see my earlier messages. The readers of today are not easy enough to use. PDAs demand quite an amount of dedication or that you have someone around who can teach you and solve the problems. The reader should be as easy to use as a toaster.

I assume that the books will be DRM-free. I believe DRM will suddenly disappear into a black hole just like copy-protection of software did in the late 80ies. This is necessary for two reasons:
1) you should not be forced to continue with the same ebook-reader supplier the rest of your life and
2) this is necessary to make ebooks easier to use

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-05-2006, 01:25 PM

2) cheap ebooks around the two-dollar mark? Only few are available under, say (to make Steve happy), $2.50.

Thanks! :wink:

I assume that the books will be DRM-free. I believe DRM will suddenly disappear into a black hole just like copy-protection of software did in the late 80ies. This is necessary for two reasons:
1) you should not be forced to continue with the same ebook-reader supplier the rest of your life and
2) this is necessary to make ebooks easier to use

Actually, although 80s copy protection waned, it is coming back with more expensive and more widely used software (Microsoft, Adobe). They now use online registration and built-in IDs to make sure software runs on only a specific 1 or 2 PCs.

No, it doesn't work much better than e-book DRM... my point is that DRM won't leave that easily, as long as it's the best weapon against software theft. Unfortunately, other technologies use DRM of sorts (think "car keys"), and they work fine. It's just that software DRM is an idea before it's time, and its kludgy operation is what drives us all nuts.

Maybe if all e-book readers someday come with some kind of fingerprint ID tech, to make unlocking as easily as touching your screen, we won't care about DRM in e-books any more. But in the meantime...

Jorgen

02-06-2006, 07:09 AM

I agree.

I don't think that DRM will disappear easily or that the prices will come down to the level I suggest. However, in the late 80ies we were all very surprised when seeing how fast copyprotection disappeared. Suddenly the market gave in.

The next step is up to the publishers. If they see their sales of paper books and/or ebooks slowing, they will change their price plans.

Funnily enough Microsoft seems to take most of the blame for DRM. They are after all only doing what the publishers demand and the publishers alone whether they want to use the DRM in MS Reader or not.

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-06-2006, 01:06 PM

In this case, I wasn't blaming M$ for e-book DRM (I've got plenty of other things to blame on them!). I was referring to their software controls on Office Suite, Word, Excel, etc, and Adobe's similar controls on Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator, etc.

Both have set up systems where a user must call or get online and register the software with a specific PC, to get an unlock code directly from (M$ or Adobe). Only then will software work on your PC. And if you try to move it to another PC, the software will lock itself out of function, requiring you to call (M$ or Adobe) to unlock it (if they believe you are not violating their licensing agreement, and you can prove it is removed from the other PC).

Both companies let DRM slide for years, knowing they were allowing the customers to rope themselves into dependency to the software (scary, isn't that?). And now that Word, Photoshop, etc, have become defacto worldwide standards, they are now enforcing DRM to the max.

I suspect that if e-book DRM "just went away," it would really just be hiding in the woods preparing to come back and bite us when we least expect it. And by that time, it will be too late. Better to work out an acceptable DRM solution now, than to deal with draconian licensing later.

Jorgen

02-06-2006, 03:46 PM

My remarks about critique of Microsoft wasn't aimed at you.

But since you mention it: securing the Office Suite is going to bite MS, as OpenOffice and AbiWord are multiplatform and by now both very good. Nothing can really compete with PhotoShop and InDesign though there is talk about making the former for Linux.

DRM on ebooks must go away. Having to maintain multiple platforms to read ones books is not a good option. If I changed to, say, a Sharp PDA or an eInk reader I would have to keep a Pocket-PC alive just to read my DRM books. Would I even want to look at a PPC display if I got used to an eInk screen? Probably not. And even if I wanted to, I couldn't buy the same books for the Sharp.

Jorgen

Steve Jordan

02-06-2006, 04:16 PM

Having to maintain multiple platforms to read ones books is not a good option. If I changed to, say, a Sharp PDA or an eInk reader I would have to keep a Pocket-PC alive just to read my DRM books.

You're right, that's why it's a lousy DRM system. I still believe it can be improved, to wit: Identifying the e-book's owner/purchaser on whatever reader you have (like with a built-in fingerprint reader, etc) and unlocking the book. But until a system that works independently of the reader and the seller is in place, you might as well dump 'em all.

And meanwhile, drop the prices to reduce theft! Duh!

Steve Jordan

02-06-2006, 04:26 PM

But since you mention it: securing the Office Suite is going to bite MS, as OpenOffice and AbiWord are multiplatform and by now both very good. Nothing can really compete with PhotoShop and InDesign though there is talk about making the former for Linux.

You're right about that, too. I'm personally waiting for the day when my boss realizes he'll have to buy a separate version of M$ Office for all our PCs in the future... we'll be adopting OpenOffice for sure, and we only have a dozen employees!

As for Photoshop, Corel is a good alternative, always has been (okay, it's NOT Photoshop, but it gets the job done). There's no good alternative for InDesign yet, especially as Adobe just bought Macromedia, but at its price, just wait.

DRM isn't dead yet, but unless the SW makers lower prices and stop acting like thieves themselves, it won't be long before their days become numbered.

Steve Jordan

02-06-2006, 05:24 PM

Here's an interesting article about the development of e-textbooks... from 2001. (I also posted this in the Rowling thread, because that's where mention of e-textbooks came up.)

http://chronicle.com/free/v47/i36/36a03502.htm

It's interesting to note where the article's writers and interviewees thought the e-book market would be in 3-5 years, as well as the attempts to package, discount sell, and promote e-textbook use, and their (minimal) success.

Okay, I'm going to stop posting now.

CoreyJF

02-06-2006, 10:30 PM

Hmm... we keep debating hardware (PDA, smartphone, e-paper, etc), but I notice I'm the only one mentioning "content." For the record, does everyone think "content" is irrelevant, or is everyone just unintentionally bypassing the subject?

I ask, because I've been trying to figure out what kind of content might be popular and/or compelling enough to help kick off e-book reader buying. People I've discussed this with have suggested romance material... serialized stories (soap- or reality-style, mostly)... specialized news (sci-fi, NASCAR, celebs, etc)... like that.

So, I ask officially: Does anyone have comments on "content"? Or should I drop it?

I doubt it will be content. There is plenty of great e-content out there. It won’t make the masses run out and buy a reader. Especially considering if the content is so great, it will make it into print eventually. People have always been willing to spend major cash on music devices. I remember my parents buying a very early walkman. It is not as big of a jump moving from analog to digital content when there has always been a device involved. To play that tape, CD or vinyl/wax you always had to have a device of some sort and over they years they have always been fairly pricey, at least to start. The same is not true for books. We are talking a complete paradigm shift in the consumption and use of books for that to occur. I see my mother and father buying an IPOD long before an ebook reader.

Steve Jordan

02-08-2006, 02:43 PM

I notice you said "iPod," not "MP3 player." MP3 players were around for years before the iPod, and even iPod sales didn't soar at first... even with all the "free" content out there. Not until the public saw the smooth connection between iPod and iTunes, that player sales went through the roof. Now, people who don't even consider themselves technophiles have those oh-so-commercially-visible white headphones. It was the well-engineered combination that did it.

The proper combination of compelling content and well-integrated device could make an existing reader's sales take off similarly, whether it be a smartphone, PPC, or dedicated e-reader. If compelling content came out in a single e-book format, say M$Reader's .lit, it could easily be enough to homogenize the entire industry into .lit to keep up (remember, MP3 wasn't the only music format competing out there... it's not even the best sound format, far from it... it's just the one everyone adopted, because there was more content there). And at that point, anything out there that could read .lit could see record sales.

If some say that book sales aren't doing as well as they could be... is that because people have decided they don't like the feel of paperback books? Hardly. Maybe it's a lack of compelling content. Why do sensationalist and fad books sell so well? Because they're something new and different, for people who are starved for new and different. And those people can easily drive or influence a new market.

Can't ignore the power of content.

Jorgen

02-08-2006, 08:00 PM

Most people like paperbacks and do not seem enthusiastic about ebooks.

Books (and most other things) used to be cheap in the UK, but were pretty expensive at the time I left (2003). The high prices, competition from TV and the Internet are probably the main reasons for the cuts in the book sales. I also seem to have noticed that it was the same old authors that were published in the UK and the US but I may be wrong.

Jorgen

CoreyJF

02-10-2006, 01:41 AM

Can't ignore the power of content.

Do you actually believe what you are saying or is it just a self serving statement. (There is no good content in the bound book world – buy my ebooks – only $2.50)

BTW while Market Paperback did decline, there was an increase in sales of discounted Hardbacks, Trade paperback and used books.

You seem unwilling to accept some basic concepts.

Music and books are completely different commodities. People have always had to buy a device to play music; often those devices have been fairly expensive. Pretty much since the development of inexpensive printing, books have been an affordable commodity; no “player” device needed.

It is not about content. If the content is that good and can demonstrate some public interest, then publishers will put it in print form.

A large percentage of the book buying population simply doesn’t have enough geek factor to enjoy ebooks the way most of us on this site do.

It is not safe to show you have an IPOD on the NY Subway, but it would be OK to whip out an expensive e-reader or Pocketpc? Is the AVERAGE CONSUMER going to sit on the edge of the pool or beach with there current devises? Fall asleep in bed with what would amount to a $300 paperweight if you dropped it.

Yes I know IPOD wasn’t the first, I had a RIO in 98. I used an IPOD as example because of its mass appeal and as demonstration of its difference. My statement was that my parents would be more likely to buy an IPOD then an ebook reader. I stand by that. The average consumer won’t accept the current technology as a suitable replacement.

Steve Jordan

02-16-2006, 10:19 PM

Thought you'd like to see this AP article on the present state of e-textbooks:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/EDUCATION/02/16/etextbook.demand.ap/index.html

Jorgen

02-17-2006, 08:05 AM

Very interesting. Yes, being able to underline and make margin notes is a must for textbooks.

Jorgen

CoreyJF

02-17-2006, 11:04 PM

Thought you'd like to see this AP article on the present state of e-textbooks:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/EDUCATION/02/16/etextbook.demand.ap/index.html

Yes, it makes many of my points

Steve Jordan

02-18-2006, 02:05 PM

Yes, it makes many of your points...

Steve Jordan

02-22-2006, 06:48 PM

Another article that makes a few points:

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/06_09/b3973111.htm

I personally take note of the word "content" bandied about a few times. ;) Also, commenters at bottom sound much like those in this thread, including a commenter (James Doe) who suggests the cost of $2 a book.

A final commenter asks whether anyone's worked out an e-book that can read to you, like an audiobook. I admit that's something I wish my books could take advantage of... but I know there's no computer-driven voice tech that would be natural sounding enough to make that attractive to many people, unless absolutely necessary. Have you ever heard Acrobat's built-in voice, for example? I'd rather hire someone to read to me...

Jorgen

02-23-2006, 08:22 AM

including a commenter (James Doe) who suggests the cost of $2 a book.
I told you that you were too expensive! :)

Good article but the comments were even more interesting.

Jorgen

tanalasta

02-23-2006, 11:17 AM

I'd pay for eBooks if they were as readily available and priced as iTunes... Or if they were included (e.g. mini-CD or download link) with the paperback. It's not like eBooks on pda are more convenient or easier to read or even more pleasant to use than their paper or audio counterparts.

Honestly, I don't see how licensing/distribution of a 500kb to 1Mb eBook could possibly justify a price-tag equivalent to that of the paper version. No wonder why there are so many eBooks available not so legitimately on the internet (e.g. Harry Potter - remember the news articles about how it was available within 24 hours of release)...

The only exception to this rule is www.laridian.com (PocketBible) and some medical reference programs. The main advantage being portability (medical texts are heavy) and the ease/speed of a search function as you don't read these books cover-to-cover most of the time.

Steve Jordan

02-23-2006, 01:02 PM

Considering how heavy textbooks can be (especially when you are carrying 6-10 of them for classes), it's always amazed me that more students--and their parents--haven't opted for e-textbooks yet (see the first article I linked to). Doctors are already detecting health issus with kids lugging around all those books in improperly-designed backpacks, and especially without them. You'd think parents, at least, would be encouraging it (though the tech could be too far beyond them).

I think cost may be a factor there... if e-texts, like e-books, are only a few bucks less expensive, and can't be resold, the financial incentive isn't there.

I'm considering putting out a poll: "Why haven't you bought my e-books yet?" to see if $2.50 is just too damn expensive for people. Should I do it? ;)

SteveHoward999

02-26-2006, 07:41 PM

Hmm... we keep debating hardware (PDA, smartphone, e-paper, etc), but I notice I'm the only one mentioning "content." For the record, does everyone think "content" is irrelevant, or is everyone just unintentionally bypassing the subject?

I think content is irrelevant, because verything you could want to read is already available on portable device, whether legally or not, whether as some form of eBook or via web pages, RSS etc.

In other words *what * you can read is less important than how you can read it.

Back to my earlier comment about DVDs with eBooks of the films. Let's take that a little further. If we had 'pocket' DVDs which could be played on our portable devices, that had the same menu facility, the same 'extra features' a copy of the film as eBook, critical reviews, actor biographys ... in other words a full-blown multimedia package with everything you might want to watch and read related to the film (use your own imagination to see just how far that could really go) ... well surely that would drive the use of pocket devices for reading (and other things too) wouldn't it?

--

SteveHoward999

02-26-2006, 07:49 PM

You're right about that, too. I'm personally waiting for the day when my boss realizes he'll have to buy a separate version of M$ Office for all our PCs in the future

:-) You mean, even though it's been like that for years he still doesn't know that? Activation has been thre since Office XP (2001? 2002?) and the 'rules' were to only install to one machine for loads longer than that. Yes I know - doesn't mean people follow the rules, but it is particularly important for employers to follow such rules coz it hurts hard if they get caught out ...

SteveHoward999

02-26-2006, 07:56 PM

Very interesting. Yes, being able to underline and make margin notes is a must for textbooks.

Jorgen

"But after making the purchase, he noticed a few things amiss: He couldn't run a highlight marker over key points or jot notes in the margins, nor could he curl up with the tome without printing out the pages."

With the right software, e.g. MS Reader, these things are possible. Curling up with the ook is easier if it's on an electronic device!

What you cannot do with electronic books is 'riffle' ... and that IS a problem.

SteveHoward999

02-26-2006, 08:19 PM

One of the feedback notes says

Why shouldn't you pay about the same price? After all, you're getting the same content. And could everyone please stop the "you're not paying for paper" rant? Of course publishers are paying for paper. Now they're also paying to have it digitized into countless additional formats, re-proofed, re-sold, re-marketed, re-publicized (everything has to be redone, realigned, reformatted, rewritten) and all to make little to no money as everyone is discounting to try to grow this market. Try to look at things in more than one dimension.

Seems like someone is being a little short sighted here.

Electronic books have no print costs
Electronic books have no distribution costs
There are no building overheads or staff wages to pay (bookstore)
There is no third-party profit-taking (printers, distributors, book stores)

Book stores make something in the region og 25% to 50% markup on the books they sell - so if they buy a book for $5 they sell it to us for $6.25 to $7.50. Straight away, that says to me that eBooks prices should be cut right back to the same price bookshops pay wholesalers. The printing and distribution costs are probably replaced, at least in part, by the overhead of running web sites to sell and download the books from. I'm not convinced the cost is so high for eBooks as it is for printing and distributing paper copies, but still - a reduction on cost of up to a third the papar price is justifiable without beginning to break sweat.

I'd love to see real figures, rather than rely on my guestimation. I'm pretty sure the reality is that the publisher and writer can make the same money out of an ebook by selling it for significantly less than half the cover price of the paper version.
[/list]

Steve Jordan

02-27-2006, 12:37 AM

SteveHoward999

02-27-2006, 01:50 AM

CoreyJF

03-02-2006, 11:50 PM

Umm... were you on vacation? ;)

Okay, first you say content is irrelevant... then you describe a package of multimedia content to sell readers! Content is relevant. I and others have suggested exclusive content... early releases of a popular book in e-book format, before print. Incentive! That's good, relevant content.

Regarding M$ Office: We still run Win2K and Office 2K at the office. We like it. We're not upgrading 'til everything blows up. Don't tell Bill.

I am not saying that I can’t imagine a day when some future version of the e-books replaces main stream printed books. At least the paperbacks, I think there will always be a market for hardcover. But you are kidding yourself if you think this is around the corner. The average reader and publisher do not currently have any incentive to switch formats. Your argument about exclusive content is fundamentally flawed.

Whose content? Are most writers going to turn down a print offer? What is the incentive to the Publisher to do a Prerelease in E format? Unless you are saying that some unknown type writer (ignored by the publishing world whose genius is clearly not appreciated) is going to write something so amazing (and refuse to allow it to be published in print format) that it will push every Tom, Dick, Harry, Mon, Dad, Aunt, Uncle, and Grandmother out there to go by an ebook reader!

Your AVERAGE reader is simply not going to go out and purchase an ebook reader. For there to be a true shift to ebooks, the majority of the people will need be comfortable using the technology and the devices will need to be more affordable. Some known or unknown, next best thing to sliced bread writer, is NOT going to convince them to switch. At some future point, when they can buy a durable, weather resistant device for a nominal fee, and are comfortable using it, then this might happen. E-book readers as they stand are not for your average consumer.

If you are talking about some here to unknown convergent device, maybe… but not with the technology as it stands. I have the Samsung I-730. I love it, but it is not as comfortable reading an ebook on it as it is a physical book. Before you go telling me about you or your friend with Carpal Tunnel that finds ebooks easier to read or how you or yours never gets eye strain reading an ebook. Think in terms of the general population. Is the AVERAGE reader going to feel, physically, emotionally, technologically, and financially comfortable using an ereader. The technology is not there yet. Yes people keep saying, it is right around the corner. Well, I have heard that about flying cars all my life as well. I am sure it will be some day, but I think there will be at least one generational change before that happens.

There has been a lot of talk about music, and comparing digital music to ebooks, Viva la digital revelation. I have made several statements in this thread as to why they are different, but even if you ignore all of that or disagree any part of it; there is a fundamental difference between the active and passive natures of these two activities that can not be ignored. Reading requires more focus, attention and interaction. Unlike music, it completely looses its purpose if it drifts to background noise. Going back to technology, small screens won’t work for most people. The constant clicking is annoying and you can’t fit the same amount of material on a small screen. Yes, many readers auto scroll, but who reads at a constant rate. If you are talking about a larger device, see my previous paragraph.

Steve Jordan

03-11-2006, 02:43 PM

SteveHoward999

03-11-2006, 03:37 PM

Is anyone here planning to check these devices out when they're released in the next month?*

I've seen similar machines at trade shows. They have alwasy been bulky, and rather plain-looking. None of the book readers I've seen have ever caught my interest. Why should they? I have a PDA, laptop and PC where I can read books and do a zillion things in addition.

Like you have said, eBook readers are a niche market. I really think that the boost in eBook popularity will come from poowerful cell phones, not from dedicated readers ... especially if they are priced at $350!!

Steve Jordan

03-11-2006, 04:54 PM

Yeah, I've had my eye on smartphones of late, to replace my cell and my PDA. However, I'm insisting on a PDA-sized screen, SD card slot and any kind of HW keyboard (built-in or peripheral) for it. A lot of that is because I intend to use it as I use my PDA now, including reading e-books. The rest is because I refuse to give up my PDA's screen size or quality, in order to have a built-in phone.

Actually, since I'm not in the market for a device yet, I can wait until there are more devices available, more options (hopefully I can get one sans camera), and slightly better prices.

SteveHoward999

03-11-2006, 05:19 PM

I'll not be getting a smartphone 'till there's one with a screen at least as good as my E830 and more reasonably priced than the HTC Universal.

Even then ... I really prefer to have a great phone and a great PDA. Right now if you want a PDA/phone or a Phone/pda you have to make compromises on the features of one or other or both.

CoreyJF

03-16-2006, 11:20 PM

I've heard that Sony's ereader will be priced at around $350... haven't seen a price for iRex yet. I don't know that I'd call it pricey, but I haven't seen one up close, so I can't say how much a value it will seem for the money.

Although I'm naturally curious, I've seen some badly executed products from Sony lately (their "nanokiller" MP3 player was a pretty piece of c**p), and iRex's pedigree (Royal Phillips spin-off) hasn't proven to be effective in the market either. Is anyone here planning to check these devices out when they're released in the next month?*

*Question not directed at Corey, obviously

Don't paint me out to be some sort of Luddite. I am not against ebooks or readers; I buy and read ebooks regularly. I just think that before ebooks can capture a large market share: the technology will need to mature, the population will have to be more comfortable with the technology, and the price will have to be significantly reduced for the readers.

Steve Jordan

03-18-2006, 04:14 PM

I just think that before ebooks can capture a large market share: the technology will need to mature, the population will have to be more comfortable with the technology, and the price will have to be significantly reduced for the readers.

Which is why I didn't expect you to bother checking out the new e-readers. Not calling you a Luddite... just knew you wouldn't be interested.

arawn

03-29-2006, 07:14 PM

Hi again,

I've been checking up on the market on e-books and it does seem small both in my country Sweden and internationally.
They sell I believe around 15 million$ a year but with a good growth over the last two years. Papperboks sells for billions so it's little wonder publishers aren't very concerned or interested in the e-book market.

http://www.idpf.org/doc_library/industrystats.htm

The main publishing organization in my country (E-lib) told me that DRM for e-books is more of a way to show that the material is illegal to distribute, then a mean to stop it cold. As they said anyone can scan and pdf a paperbook, so why spend a lot of effort on DRM?
They make a steady small profit, with the libraries as their main market.

Someone with a lot to say and who says it well is the SF author Cory Doctorow.

Microsoft DRM talk,
http://www.dashes.com/anil/stuff/doctorow-drm-ms.html

This in particular caught my eye:

Here are the two most important things to know about computers and the Internet:

A computer is a machine for rearranging bits
The Internet is a machine for moving bits from one place to another very cheaply and quickly
Any new medium that takes hold on the Internet and with computers will embrace these two facts, not regret them. A newspaper press is a machine for spitting out cheap and smeary newsprint at speed: if you try to make it output fine art lithos, you'll get junk. If you try to make it output newspapers, you'll get the basis for a free society.

And so it is with the Internet. At the heyday of Napster, record execs used to show up at conferences and tell everyone that Napster was doomed because no one wanted lossily compressed MP3s with no liner notes and truncated files and misspelled metadata.

Today we hear ebook publishers tell each other and anyone who'll listen that the barrier to ebooks is screen resolution. It's bollocks, and so is the whole sermonette about how nice a book looks on your bookcase and how nice it smells and how easy it is to slip into the tub. These are obvious and untrue things, like the idea that radio will catch on once they figure out how to sell you hotdogs during the intermission, or that movies will really hit their stride when we can figure out how to bring the actors out for an encore when the film's run out. Or that what the Protestant Reformation really needs is Luther Bibles with facsimile illumination in the margin and a rent-a-priest to read aloud from your personal Word of God.

New media don't succeed because they're like the old media, only better: they succeed because they're worse than the old media at the stuff the old media is good at, and better at the stuff the old media are bad at. Books are good at being paperwhite, high-resolution, low-infrastructure, cheap and disposable. Ebooks are good at being everywhere in the world at the same time for free in a form that is so malleable that you can just pastebomb it into your IM session or turn it into a page-a-day mailing list.

The only really successful epublishing -- I mean, hundreds of thousands, millions of copies distributed and read -- is the bookwarez scene, where scanned-and-OCR'd books are distributed on the darknet. The only legit publishers with any success at epublishing are the ones whose books cross the Internet without technological fetter: publishers like Baen Books and my own, Tor, who are making some or all of their catalogs available in ASCII and HTML and PDF.

The hardware-dependent ebooks, the DRM use-and-copy-restricted ebooks, they're cratering. Sales measured in the tens, sometimes the hundreds. Science fiction is a niche business, but when you're selling copies by the ten, that's not even a business, it's a hobby.

Every one of you has been riding a curve where you read more and more words off of more and more screens every day through most of your professional careers. It's zero-sum: you've also been reading fewer words off of fewer pages as time went by: the dinosauric executive who prints his email and dictates a reply to his secretary is info-roadkill.

Today, at this very second, people read words off of screens for every hour that they can find. Your kids stare at their Game Boys until their eyes fall out. Euroteens ring doorbells with their hypertrophied, SMS-twitching thumbs instead of their index fingers.

Paper books are the packaging that books come in. Cheap printer-binderies like the Internet Bookmobile that can produce a full bleed, four color, glossy cover, printed spine, perfect-bound book in ten minutes for a dollar are the future of paper books: when you need an instance of a paper book, you generate one, or part of one, and pitch it out when you're done. I landed at SEA-TAC on Monday and burned a couple CDs from my music collection to listen to in the rental car. When I drop the car off, I'll leave them behind. Who needs 'em?

Here Doctorow but it more succintly:

Ebooks need to embrace their nature. The distinctive value of ebooks is orthogonal to the value of paper books, and it revolves around the mix-ability and send-ability of electronic text. The more you constrain an
ebook's distinctive value propositions -- that is, the more you restrict a reader's ability to copy, transport or transform an ebook -- the more it has to be valued on the same axes as a paper-book. Ebooks *fail* on those axes. Ebooks don't beat paper-books for sophisticated typography, they can't match them for quality of paper or the smell of the glue. But just try sending a paper book to a friend in Brazil, for free, in less than a second. Or loading a thousand paper books into a little stick of flash-memory dangling from your keychain. Or searching a paper book for every instance of a character's name to find a beloved passage. Hell, try clipping a pithy passage out of a paper book and pasting it into your sig-file.

Ebooks: Neither E, Nor Books
http://craphound.com/ebooksneitherenorbooks.txt

Have you people read Eric Flint's palavers at Baen?

According to him, freely distributing e-books doesn't hurt sells and offers numbers that prove it, and he claims that the notion that piracy hurts sells is completly unsupported by hard figures.

the theory behind the Free Library is that, certainly in the long run, it benefits an author to have a certain number of free or cheap titles of theirs readily available to the public. By far the main enemy any author faces, except a handful of ones who are famous to the public at large, is simply obscurity. Even well-known SF authors are only read by a small percentage of the potential SF audience. Most readers, even ones who have heard of the author, simply pass them up.

Why? In most cases, simply because they don't really know anything about the writer and aren't willing to spend $7 to $28 just to experiment. So, they keep buying those authors they are familiar with.

I think my hard figures demonstrate how absurd that claim is. It does not follow that simply because a copy is available for free that sales will therefore be hurt. In fact, they are more likely to be helped, for the simple reason that free copies-call them "samplers," if you will-are often the necessary inducement to convince people to buy something.

There's a different analogy which I think, in many ways, captures the reality even better. Anyone who has ever bought a car-new or used-knows perfectly well that one of the standard techniques used by a car salesman is to offer you the opportunity to take a "test drive." So far from being concerned that a test drive represents "lost mileage," car dealers know damn good and well that it's often the test drive which closes the sale.

Does it always? Of course not. Usually, in fact, people simply take the test drive and wind up walking away. Does the car dealer then start moaning about "lost sales," or whine about the mileage he's given up on a new car?

Hell, no. The dealer just shrugs his shoulders, writes it off to the inevitable overhead expense of his business, and offers the next customer a test drive. But if car dealers followed the moronic practices of most publishers (and, to the best of my knowledge, the entire music recording industry) they would sternly refuse to let anyone even sit in one of their cars-much less give it a test drive-unless they'd already paid for it.

I leave it to you to imagine just how long such a car dealer would stay in business.

http://www.baen.com/library/palaver6.htm

Do anybody here know of any study about e-book piracy?
This is the best I've found.

eBook-community FAQ
Draft proposed FAQ: July 2, 2005

6. What is eBook 'piracy'? Under what circumstances does it occur?

Because of its illegality facts about eBook copyright violation are difficult to come by. The following observations have been made:
· The number of works involved is vast: one partially pirated eBook collection lists over 100,000 books by over 10,000 authors. Even allowing for non-book items and extensive duplication (see below) this is far larger than any legitimate collection currently in existence.
· Most of the books have been scanned from printed works rather than copied from existing commercial eBooks.
· Distribution is largely through the IRC (Internet Relay Chat) system. The Usenet Newsgroup system, once popular, is now little-used. Unlike pirate music distributors, eBook pirates don’t make much use of file-sharing systems like Kazaa and BitTorrent.
· The collections include both pirate eBooks and legitimately copied eBooks from sources such as Project Gutenberg.
· There is massive duplication and needless obscurity in pirate 'catalogues' due to different names being used for titles, categories and authors. Sometimes this is due to careless spelling, or to various different conventions being used.
· Pirated eBooks may be available in one format or many. There is no apparent preference for any one format over another.
· The proofreading on scanned pirate eBooks varies from excellent to very poor.
· The most popular genres for pirate eBooks are science fiction and fantasy, followed at some distance by crime and mystery books and non-fiction about computers.
· eBooks appearing in pirate sources tend to be either very popular books by established authors (e.g. the Harry Potter series) or out-of-print books appealing to one particular individual who has scanned them for their own use and made them available in the hope of persuading others to read them.
Whether eBook piracy currently affects the commercial sales of eBooks, or will in the future, is impossible to say. Eloquent arguments have been made on both sides of the issue. However, at the present time (June 2005) it is probably true to say that a new writer whose works are starting to appear as commercial eBooks has little to fear from large-scale piracy.

Any comments on how accurate this is?

Steve Jordan

04-02-2006, 06:10 PM

There's a lot of good stuff in there (a lot. A LOT. Yes, that's a big post.) Most of it is corroborated by other sources I've come across, and much of it that I don't know about firsthand, I sure hope is true.

I fully agree with Doctorrow's comments on the differences between print and e-books, and why e-books fit a niche that print books do not. Compact, easily transmitted/transported, searchable (he didn't mention translatable)... that's the point to e-books, isn't it? Many of the people I've spoken to cannot really make the mental disconnect of novels and paper, so naturally they can't imagine one succeeding without the other. Frequently, it is these people who just need to be shown the workability of the other options, and it becomes completely clear to them why e-book novels work. They may not become converts, but at least they won't assume all e-book readers are crazy or stupid, and may recommend investigation into e-books to others.

The issue of obscurity, and the customer's monetary risk to overcome same, is a huge obstacle. E-books are good at lowering the monetary risk, but people still have to be exposed to the author's work. As a bookseller myself (clearly hobby-level), I've discovered firsthand how difficult it is to get people or groups to "spread the word" about a new author or their work, even when the author goes out of his way to make connections, engage potential customers, offer incentives, solicit comments, and actively respond to them. Short of inventing bogus or "viral" marketing campaigns, or spending thousands on conventional advertising and losing my shirt, I'm still trying to figure out what will work (and for the record, having little success).

Steve Jordan

04-05-2006, 09:08 PM

Here's a tidbit: Borders plans to sell the Sony e-book:

http://www.gizmag.com/go/5449/

arawn

04-16-2006, 11:02 AM

Anyone care to comment about where the majority of e-book piracy takes place?

Distribution is largely through the IRC (Internet Relay Chat) system. The Usenet Newsgroup system, once popular, is now little-used. Unlike pirate music distributors, eBook pirates don’t make much use of file-sharing systems like Kazaa and BitTorrent.

I have no idea, but I don't understand how a chat client could be a better medium then a filesharing system to copy a book.

Steve Jordan

04-16-2006, 12:34 PM

It probably has more to do with the fact that "ebook pirates" are already using IRC for chat, so they use it to swap ebooks too. If they were mostly using AIM, they'd be swapping there.

Usenet is probably the most efficient way to swap files out there (debatable, sure), but people are simply getting out of the habit of using it like they used to. But check it out sometime, and you see it still has a huge population of image and multimedia file sharers.

Learner

04-17-2006, 01:54 PM

To be able to carry around a libary of books is the reason I purchase ebooks already. But why would I buy a separate reader? There are several free ereaders on the net. Just download one to your PC/PPC buy a book/s and start reading.

Steve Jordan

04-18-2006, 06:23 PM

There are still a lot of people who might be interested in the efficiency and portability of e-books, but do not use or like handheld computers or smartphones, or cannot imagine reading text on one (ask around--you'll find many more of them than you!). So hardware companies are intent on creating standalone readers for "all the non-geeks."

So far, appearance, cost, ease of use and screen quality haven't hit the "magic spot" that will generate sales of the readers. But it could happen.

Steve Jordan

04-22-2006, 01:58 PM

For anyone who's interested: I've collected the various links to sites and articles that have been my reference for e-book usage, sales, and DRM issues (including this one) and put them all on SteveJordanBooks.com, on this link (http://www.stevejordanbooks.com/reference.htm) (handhelds can access this link (http://www.stevejordanbooks.com/hand/reference.htm)).

I just thought putting them all in one place would make research and reference easier. I plan to keep adding to the links, as interesting and valuable e-book articles and sites come up.

GadgetsForever

05-03-2006, 06:30 PM

I think consumer response to ebooks is a fascinating phenomenon, probably bc I am a book worm. Too bad there isn't a book worm emoticon.

I remember back in college a prof I had (interesting background trained as engineer and switched to Spanish lit PhD program) was fascinated by the thought of how people would react to a world in which physical books are outmoded.

Steve Jordan

05-04-2006, 01:32 AM

Well, I think most of us agree that the paper book isn't likely to disappear, at least not anytime soon. But if the trends in rising paper and printing costs continue, and if e-books reach the mainstream, paper books could become rarities, even luxury items someday. It's worth considering a world where paper books become valuable gift-level items, instead of the almost throwaway status they have today.