iPAQ 5450 Bluetooth Internet Access Problems

[Beprahst]

I have an iPAQ 5450 and a Thinkpad with a Belkin Bluetooth card in it. I established a Bluetooth internet connect a couple of weeks ago to use my laptop internet connect to surf using the iPAQ. It worked fine.

But now, I'm having issues. I haven't changed any settings that I know of. I've deleted and re-established the connection, but not it wants a Network logon and tries to dial the BT Null modem which only has a +1 in the dialing strings.

I've tried deleting the modem settings under the Bluetooth setting in the connections settings. I've tried deleting everything and soft resetting. But it just won't surf and tries to "connect" to the network by asking for my login and then dialing the +1 string and hanging because that is all that is in the string.

It didn't do this a couple of weeks ago when I first connected.

Anyone have any suggestions? Really weird!

[freitasm]

Have a look at Bluetooth Guides (http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449) for a list of things to check for this kind of problem...

[dhettel]

Just off the top of my head, you have trashed the ICS setting in someway, or you have deleted your orignal connection and created a new connection using dialup, instead of a network connection.

That would be my guess.

[Beprahst]

I looked through the Bluetooth Guides. Everything seems to be in order. I can follow the instructions/screen prints. I don't remember it asking for ID, password, and domain. If the PC is already connected, why would it need this? Also, after it asks for this, it tries to dial a BT Null Modem...even though I specified that the computer I'm connecting to is always connected to the Internet via a LAN (as opposed to the dial up option) connection. So I go to ICS and go the the Bluetooth settings and delete the Bluetooth modem entry. It connects without asking for a logon or trying to dial a BT Modem(the icon turns green), but can't surf. I tried the vxUtil and tried to ping...couldn't ping anything...not even my router gateway. In the Bluetooth PAN Driver I've tried setting specific IP addresses as opposed to using DHCP. That didn't work either.

Any other suggestions?

[freitasm]

One of the guides is a list of things to check if the LAN access doesn't work... Have you gone through it?

You'll be surprised people sometimes let little things go undetected.

Not surprising, most of the problems are solved by:

- checking IP address on the Bluetooth virtual adapter
- changing software firewall configuration to allow localhost communication to and from localhost :wink:
- making sure the DNS configuration is correct.

Have a look in this article (http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=833)

[Beprahst]

I have no problem connecting PPC to Laptop for Activesync, just for the Internet Connection bluetooth service. So I didn't reinstall the belkin software. Maybe I should.

On the Bluetooth PAN User Driver on the PPC I have set the IP address, subnet, and default gateway and name servers to setting I wouls use if going wifi as opposed to using DHCP. I switched to this after not working with DHCP.

I don't have a setting on my Belkin Laptop Bluetooth configuration about allowing other devices to connect othe Internet/LAN. It is set to "allow all devices to connect".

There are no IP settings for the Laptop Bluetooth card itself.

I did the welcome.exe thing on the PPC.

I don't know what your suggestion about "changing software firewall configuration to allow localhost communication to and from localhost". I don't use a local firewall on my Laptop, so I don't think that applies. Plus the laptop surfs fine....just can't surf when connecting to it from the PPC.

DNS configuration...again, on the PPC, I set it to a specific setting. I've also tried the DHCP setting (letting the server assign one).

From the article you provided a link to...

Not using 3COM.
No personal firewall.
I don't see a spot for the BT adapter on the Laptop to have a DNS entry. Where do you put that? My BT configurator on the Laptop doesn't seem to have a spot for that.

Laptop IP = 193.168.1.103. I set the PPC to .104.
tried the vxUtil...can't ping.
Ran Welcome.exe

I think the issue is that when I create a BT connection on the PPC and pick "Internet Connection", it asks wether the PC is always connected to the LAN or dial up needed. I say it is always connected. But in the PPC Connection Settings, for the connection to the internet, it lists Bluetooth Settings. In those Bluetooth Settings, it lists a Bluetooth modem to use for the connection. Why would it do that if I have a Bluetooth connection to a laptop that is always connected to the internet via a LAN. So I go in and delete the modem form the Bluetooth setting in the ICS and the icon connects, it doesn't ask me for my ID, password, and domain, which I think is a good thing. But then it can't surf either.

When I set up the Internet connection the first time, it never tried to dial a Bluetooth Null Modem, it never asked be for my ID, password, and domain. Now when I create a BT connection for Internet surfing to the Laptop, it does.

I can use the wifi function to surf fine through my wireless LAN at home through my Linksys router. But either at work (or at home for that matter) sometimes I want to connect and surf via Bluetooth.

Thanks for your help so far...probably one little setting somewhere, but like I said...it used to work.

[freitasm]

I have no problem connecting PPC to Laptop for Activesync, just for the Internet Connection bluetooth service.
...
There are no IP settings for the Laptop Bluetooth card itself.
...
I don't see a spot for the BT adapter on the Laptop to have a DNS entry. Where do you put that? My BT configurator on the Laptop doesn't seem to have a spot for that.



On your desktop right-click My Network Places. Then select Properties. You'll see an adapter corresponding to your ethernet card, and another one called Bluetooth Network. That's where you have to enter 192.1.68.0.1... And from the real adapter you have to configure ICS to bridge to the "Bluetooth Network".

I think the issue is that when I create a BT connection on the PPC and pick "Internet Connection", it asks wether the PC is always connected to the LAN or dial up needed. I say it is always connected. But in the PPC Connection Settings, for the connection to the internet, it lists Bluetooth Settings. In those Bluetooth Settings, it lists a Bluetooth modem to use for the connection. Why would it do that if I have a Bluetooth connection to a laptop that is always connected to the internet via a LAN. So I go in and delete the modem form the Bluetooth setting in the ICS and the icon connects, it doesn't ask me for my ID, password, and domain, which I think is a good thing. But then it can't surf either.


When I set up the Internet connection the first time, it never tried to dial a Bluetooth Null Modem, it never asked be for my ID, password, and domain. Now when I create a BT connection for Internet surfing to the Laptop, it does.

The Bluetooth LAN connection can only be initiated from the Bluetooth applet. The Bluetooth entry in the Settings | Connection panel is for using a mobile as a modem, and it's not related to the LAN access.

If you try to connect over Bluetooth and it starts dialling... Then your configuration in the desktop is not correct. Have a look in my comments in this message regarding the adapters configuration :wink: !

[Beprahst]

OK...getting close...I can taste it!
Let me see if I've got this straight. Under the network settings, in the real ethernet adapter, I enable "internet connection sharing". It tells me that it is going to set the IP (for the bluetooth adapter I assume...it's in the little drop down box) to 192.168.0.1.

I then go a look at the Bluetooth adapter properties and sure enough, the IP is set to 192.168.0.1 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0.

There is no entry for the DNS setting...which I noticed in your other articles/postings could be a problem. Now I understand this part of it, but don't know what to set it to. It just says that an issue might be a BT adapter on Laptop without a DNS entry. So I tried the 192.168.0.1 again in the Primary DNS entry. Let me know if that is incorrect.

Now, back to the real Ethernet Adapter. Under the configure tab where I specified that I wanted to enable Internet Connection Settings, there is a "settings" pushbutton. That takes me to another window with two tabs...Applications and Services. There is nothing under applications. and Services lists "FTP", "Internet Mail Protocal v3 (IMAP3)", etc. None are checked. Should anything be in these windows/checked?

OK, with these settings I mentioned above, I rebooted Laptop and PPC. I deleted the PPC BT Internet connection and recreated it. As soon as it connected, it started to try and dial the Bluetooth Null Moden again. So something still isn't correct.

I'll bet when I first installed the Belkin BT Card and the software, it made correct settings. I'll bet my corporate LAN guys have a network policy out there that overwrites it and so that's why it vanished.

Anyhow, thanks much for sticking with me and helping me out. I think I am close. Let me know what you think now.

It's 1:30AM and my wife just asked me if I'm coming to bed. Besides, I can't see straight anymore anyhow!

[freitasm]

Yep, almost there... To find what DNS to enter in the virtual Bluetooth adapter, run the Command Prompt (Windows Key + R and CMD in the box) and enter IPCONFIG /ALL into the command prompt window. You should see the DNS servers in there! These are the addresses your computer is using, and should be there.

Do not enter 192.168.0.1 in the DNS spaces because there's no DNS server in this computer :wink:

[Beprahst]

OK. I've got the Bluetooth adapter settings on the Laptop as:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : xxxxxx.com (I probably should not show this in a public forum)
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.252.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.194.100.1

I've got the real ethernet adpater settings as:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : xxxxxx.com (same as above)
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.252.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.194.100.1

I set the real ethernet adapter to share the connection.
Again, there are no "applications" or "services" to share the connection enabled through the "settings" pushbutton on the sharing tab.

The company LAN uses a proxy setting...so in the ICS on the PPC I have tried with that and without that (not knowing if using the connection through the laptop would automatically apply it anyhow.

On the PPC Bluetooth PAN USer driver...I have it set to DHCP/obtain IP from server. Do I need to specify the 192.168.0.1 on the PPC?

I know you said that the ICS settings should not use the Bluetooth settings, but everytime I delete and recreate the the BT Internet Connection on the PPC, it creates ICS settings for Bluetooth and sets them as active. So I go in there and delete them each time.

Right now, the PPC BT Internet Connection connects, doesn't try to dial anything, but still cannot surf.

If I can't get all the settings, I might reinstall the Belkin Laptop software. It seemed to get it right the first time. Then I'll right down all the settings it created!
Ugh.

[freitasm]

If you have VxUtil, just after the connection (but you can't surf), try pinging the desktop, using the IP address. If it times out then the connection is really invalid. If it replies, then all your problems are DNS related now.

Don't worry about specifying 192.168.0.1 on the PPC. A DHCP request will be sent out and a server will reply - ICS will route this.

It could be the DHCP server in your company doesn't like the ICS (which is another address) trying to tap into the network - if this is the case then you have to see the net admin :cry:

[Beprahst]

Well, I think I've tried everything. I set the real LAN adapter to share the internet connection and to share it with the BT Virtual LAN Adapter. The BT Virtual LAN adapter gets set to the 192.168.0.1 IP address. I put in the DNS that shows when I do the IPCONFIG at the DOS prompt. No luck. Right now when it connects, it tries to dial a BT Null Modem still.

I can actually surf when I connect using the Active Sync Connection from the PPC and set the option on the Laptop for Active sync to have an Internet connection. So I guess that's a work around.

But it seems strange that it works through the ActiveSync connection and not through the connection that is support to work.

I reinstalled the Belkin software...didn't help.

I swear when I first installed the Belkin card, I didn't do anything...didn't set the LAN adapter for internet sharing, I didn't have to set the BT Adapter to 192.168.0.1, and I didn't have to set any DNSs. All I did was install, setup the connection and it worked.

I had to do a hard reset this weekend because the WiFi card wouldn't turn on. The 5450 definitely has some quirks.

Thanks for all your help.

[freitasm]

I'm sorry - can't think of anything else that I've tried before. IT has to be a network configuration. If you turn of the wi-fi, does it connect via Bluetooth?

Perhaps another DHCP server in the network?

[Beprahst]

I've tried it at work via a hard-wired LAN connection as well as at home via my 802.11b.

Actually the first time I tried it after I install it, it worked from a hotal room using a DSL connection and on the company WAN. Then when I tried several weeks later at another hotel, it didn't. And has not worked since either in the office or at home.

So, several different configurations...wifi on and wifi off, since I don't leave the wifi card in the laptop when not using it.

[Xanadu]

I recently got a 2215 and tried to establish a non-Activesync method of browsing the net via bluetooth (using WinXP Pro, BTW). Every time I attempted to enable ICS, it had problems with my non-static, non-routable IP address. (I'm behind a Netgear DHCP-enabled gateway/router.) Digging deeper into the ICS helpfile, I found the following:

You should not use this feature in an existing network with Windows 2000 Server domain controllers, DNS servers, gateways, DHCP servers, or systems configured for static IP addresses.

Looks like I fail on three counts (DHCP, gateway, and router). What's your setup like?

-Xan

[Janak Parekh]

Looks like I fail on three counts (DHCP, gateway, and router). What's your setup like?
That comment has to be wrong. I've done BT LAN access over ICS using a Belkin BT USB adapter on a machine using a static IP without any problems whatsoever.

--janak

[Xanadu]

Looks like I fail on three counts (DHCP, gateway, and router). What's your setup like?
That comment has to be wrong. I've done BT LAN access over ICS using a Belkin BT USB adapter on a machine using a static IP without any problems whatsoever.

--janak

I'm using DHCP. You're using a static IP. That's why yours works.

Here's where I got that quote: Network Connections>[Ethernet Adapter]>Properties>Advanced>Learn more about Internet Connection Sharing

-Xan

[Janak Parekh]

I'm using DHCP. You're using a static IP. That's why yours works.
:oops: Sorry, I misread your post. I got my head totally backwards.

In any case, you do indeed need a static IP. Since you're behind a NetGear router, just assign yourself one that's outside the DHCP pool, and you should be set. Well, there's also the problem of making sure the NetGear and ICS not attempting to assign the same IP addresses (i.e., if both try to offer 192.168.x.x, the ICS-assigned addresses won't work).

--janak

[Xanadu]

I'm using DHCP. You're using a static IP. That's why yours works.
:oops: Sorry, I misread your post. I got my head totally backwards.


Hehe. No problem. I figured as much. :)


In any case, you do indeed need a static IP. Since you're behind a NetGear router, just assign yourself one that's outside the DHCP pool, and you should be set. Well, there's also the problem of making sure the NetGear and ICS not attempting to assign the same IP addresses (i.e., if both try to offer 192.168.x.x, the ICS-assigned addresses won't work).

--janak

I'll have to give that a try. I gave up too early last time. :?

-Xan

[freitasm]

I'm using DHCP. You're using a static IP. That's why yours works.
:oops: Sorry, I misread your post. I got my head totally backwards.

In any case, you do indeed need a static IP. Since you're behind a NetGear router, just assign yourself one that's outside the DHCP pool, and you should be set. Well, there's also the problem of making sure the NetGear and ICS not attempting to assign the same IP addresses (i.e., if both try to offer 192.168.x.x, the ICS-assigned addresses won't work).

--janak

Janak is right. I'm behind a router. and I've configured the router to assign numbers in a range that is not conflicting with ICS.

The ICS DHCP does not hand addresses outside the computer running it, unless on the interface receiving the ICS. The warning in the help file is just because people go to easily into having a computer facing two LANs, sometimes with same addresses in it.

Just set your DHCP in the router to another subnet (192.168.1 in my case) and you're all go. More than one DHCP will not hurt, providing they've have different numbers to giveaway.

[Xanadu]

Ok...I'm still having the same problems. Here's what I did:

- Router IP changed from 192.168.0.1 to 192.168.0.51
- DHCP IP range is 192.168.0.2 to 192.168.0.50
- Host computer changed from DHCP-assigned IP to 192.168.0.1

When I tried to enable ICS, I got the following message box error:

An error occurred while Internet Connection Sharing was being enabled.

Internet Connection Sharing cannot be enabled. A LAN connection is already configured with the IP address that is required for automatic IP addressing.

What am I missing?

-Xan

[freitasm]

Ok...I'm still having the same problems. Here's what I did:

- Router IP changed from 192.168.0.1 to 192.168.0.51
- DHCP IP range is 192.168.0.2 to 192.168.0.50
- Host computer changed from DHCP-assigned IP to 192.168.0.1

When I tried to enable ICS, I got the following message box error:

An error occurred while Internet Connection Sharing was being enabled.

Internet Connection Sharing cannot be enabled. A LAN connection is already configured with the IP address that is required for automatic IP addressing.

What am I missing?

-Xan

- ICS will assign in the range 192.168.0.x, so move your router to 192.168.1.x if possible
- You host computer can be any fixed address, so put 192.168.1.51 and limit the range on the router as you did
- The Bluetooth adapter IS THE ONE that needs to be 192.168.0.1, not the host computer adapter.

[Janak Parekh]

- The Bluetooth adapter IS THE ONE that needs to be 192.168.0.1, not the host computer adapter.
Doesn't ICS automatically set the BT adapter's IP up as 192.168.0.1 as long as you tell it that's the "internal network"?

You definitely need to do the rest, though. Keep at it, you're almost there! :)

--janak

[freitasm]

- The Bluetooth adapter IS THE ONE that needs to be 192.168.0.1, not the host computer adapter.
Doesn't ICS automatically set the BT adapter's IP up as 192.168.0.1 as long as you tell it that's the "internal network"?

You definitely need to do the rest, though. Keep at it, you're almost there! :)

--janak

Yes, it does. But because Xanadu had this address on the real NIC, ICS is throwing the error "An error occurred while Internet Connection Sharing was being enabled.". When he changes the physical NIC to something else, ICS will do its stuff.

[Xanadu]

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you, freitasm and Janak! :lol:

Everything's working beautifully. I was confused by the seeming arbitrary nature of ICS (e.g. hard-coded subnet associations). Is it just me or does ICS look like a complete hack?

One small glitch is that my BT connection gets reset when I use the "switch user" feature of WinXP to change to my wife's account. You'd think a service like Network Access would be designed to survive the switchover, right?

Anyways, thanks for all your help and patience. :)

-Xan

[Janak Parekh]

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you, freitasm and Janak! :lol:
Congrats! :D

Is it just me or does ICS look like a complete hack?
It is indeed a limited-scope NAT (network address translation)/firewall solution. Win2k Server and Windows Server 2003 have a much, much richer and robust version of ICS, called Routing and Remote Access.

One small glitch is that my BT connection gets reset when I use the "switch user" feature of WinXP to change to my wife's account. You'd think a service like Network Access would be designed to survive the switchover, right?
Nope. Bluetooth security profiles are stored per-user, and so this is semi-intentional. Hardware Bluetooth access points do exist to make a better network-level integration, but they're still fairly expensive. If you find yourself using this long-term, that's probably a better solution.

--janak

[freitasm]

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you, freitasm and Janak! :lol:
-Xan

:mrgreen:

I tell you something: most of the traffic in our Bluetooth forums are LAN Access problems, and of those, I'd say 90% are solved by IP address changes and firewall changes.

Congratulations and welcome to the wireless world :beer:

[Xanadu]

Is it just me or does ICS look like a complete hack?
It is indeed a limited-scope NAT (network address translation)/firewall solution. Win2k Server and Windows Server 2003 have a much, much richer and robust version of ICS, called Routing and Remote Access.


I'm surprised that it's not included with XP Pro. Remote access was standard-issue with NT.


One small glitch is that my BT connection gets reset when I use the "switch user" feature of WinXP to change to my wife's account. You'd think a service like Network Access would be designed to survive the switchover, right?
Nope. Bluetooth security profiles are stored per-user, and so this is semi-intentional. Hardware Bluetooth access points do exist to make a better network-level integration, but they're still fairly expensive. If you find yourself using this long-term, that's probably a better solution.

--janak

I've been tempted. You can buy refurbished models for under $100 from major manufacturers. I'm just trying to establish my usage patterns with my new iPAQ before embarking on a breadth-first spending spree. :D

The main reason I'd get a BT access point is my lingering distrust of WiFi's security layer. 802.11i can't get here fast enough for me! :?

-Xan

[Janak Parekh]

I'm surprised that it's not included with XP Pro. Remote access was standard-issue with NT.
RAS is indeed supported in XP as it was in 2k or NT. RRAS, e.g., the Routing (including the NAT code) bit is a different beast entirely, and first debuted in NT Server, and has remained only in the server line.

The main reason I'd get a BT access point is my lingering distrust of WiFi's security layer. 802.11i can't get here fast enough for me! :?
Well, you could set up 802.1x... but I bet that'll need WM2k3 Server too.

--janak

[egandt]

I've been working on getting bluetootth networking to work through a modem connection, and am having a large number of problems. First bluetooth works from my ipqa5500 to my laptop, I can activesync over it and transfer files over it without issue. So I deceided to go one step further and connect to the internet over it, I followed the directions and setup connection sharing between my dialup and the bluetooth network, then checked that I was given an IP I am its 192.168.0.146, so I tired to ping the device from the windows machine and it works I can monitor packets being transfered and a responce is received, so the connection works, but from the PocketPC I can not get anywhere except its self including pinging the desktop (192.168.0.1). I can see the ping packets come into the desktop, but then nothing is ever returned.

Simply put, I can send data to the pocket PC when connected to the bluetooth network (hell if I setup the dialup connection to automaticly start when required by a machine on the bluetooth network the connection is made), but I can not communicate from the PocketPC to either the desktop or the internet through the connection. I receive no errors, just no packets ever return to the PPC from the desktop.

A very confused indevidual,
Eric Gandt

[freitasm]

Do you have a personal firewall (Zone Alarm) installed? It sounds like outgoing packets from your computer are ok, but incoming are blocked...