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  #1  
Old 03-07-2009, 10:00 PM
Ed Hansberry
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Default Ballmer Takes Shot At Android

http://www.1800pocketpc.com/2009/03...es-android.html

Ballmer recently gave a talk at the Microsoft Public Sector CIO Summit in Redmond recently and took the time to rib Android just a bit.

"With that said, we did sell more Windows Mobile devices last year than Apple did iPhones - just an important factoid to have. Blackberry was a little bit ahead, and Google was nowhere to be seen, except in Silicon Valley, I'm sure. But we'll do our best to help you with that challenge."

Ballmer should spend less time ribbing the competition and look in his rear view mirror. Android only has one phone right now, but it won't be the last. Already there are almost as many people browsing on the web with Android with its small market share as there are with Windows Mobile, which sold over 20 million devices last year. People want browsing and as it gets out that Android has a good browser, just like the iPhone does, people will take a serious look at it.

I know, IE 6 mobile is on the way, but it isn't here yet, and until it is readily available, it means nothing.

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Old 03-08-2009, 12:49 AM
markkcurtis
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Default ...and doesn't use a dictionary.

He should also spend some more time looking up the meaning of words before slinging them around in public...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factoid
 
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  #3  
Old 03-08-2009, 05:04 AM
stuxstu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Hansberry View Post
<div class='os_post_top_link'><p>Ballmer should spend less time ribbing the competition and look in his rear view mirror. Android only has one phone right now, but it won't be the last. Already there are <a href="http://marketshare.hitslink.com/mobile-phones.aspx?qprid=55" target="_blank">almost as many people browsing on the web with Android</a> with its small market share as there are with Windows Mobile, which sold over 20 million devices last year. People want browsing and as it gets out that Android has a good browser, just like the iPhone does, people will take a serious look at it.</p><p>I know, IE 6 mobile is on the way, but it isn't here yet, and until it is readily available, it means nothing.</p>
Actually I think you off a little there. Yes, people who buy the iPhone and Andriod are surfing the net with the phone (mostly consumers). But that does not mean the Windows Mobile users are "internet surfers". I don't surf the net on a phone and have very little use for it. Outside of checking my personal email, I don't care to surf the net on a 3" screen. Internet surfing is a consumer interest and most business users have no use for surfing the web and most business want their employee's to work and not goof off on a phone. The Blackberry and Windows Mobile are for business, that is their main market.

No matter how cool an iPhone is, it virtually useless compared to the blackberry I used to have or WinMo (tilt) that I have now for business.

Though you are right that Microsoft need to catch up on the UI experience.
 
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Old 03-08-2009, 05:53 AM
Rocco Augusto
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Originally Posted by stuxstu View Post
Internet surfing is a consumer interest and most business users have no use for surfing the web and most business want their employee's to work and not goof off on a phone...
Browsing the Internet has other uses besides goofing off. Windows Mobile customer don't browse the web because they're "business users," but instead because Microsoft offers the worse Internet browsing experience of any other smartphone platform on the market.

The closest self programmed solution Microsoft has to an okay browsing experience on a Windows Mobile device is their new browser which we were told almost a half year ago was going to be using the Internet Explorer 6 HTML rendering engine.

Microsoft has fallen greatly behind in the mobile Internet market and if they offered more up to date solutions then more of those 20 million customers they sold handsets to last year would browse the web. Business users or not.
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Old 03-08-2009, 12:09 PM
virain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Browsing the Internet has other uses besides goofing off. Windows Mobile customer don't browse the web because they're "business users," but instead because Microsoft offers the worse Internet browsing experience of any other smartphone platform on the market.

The closest self programmed solution Microsoft has to an okay browsing experience on a Windows Mobile device is their new browser which we were told almost a half year ago was going to be using the Internet Explorer 6 HTML rendering engine.

Microsoft has fallen greatly behind in the mobile Internet market and if they offered more up to date solutions then more of those 20 million customers they sold handsets to last year would browse the web. Business users or not.
There's more to the device than surfing the web. I own Android G1, and to be honest, browsing experience is not all that peachy. Few points, just off my head -
If you open website with a lot of links and lot of text, xda-developers.com for example. It is very difficult, almost impossible to hit the right link on a first try without resizing page a few times and then scrolling all over looking for that link. WM uses stylus, HUGE advantade on 3" screen! there isn't web address box on Google browser. so to put in something like: http://forums.thoughtsmedia.com/newr...reply&p=703893 is pretty much imposible you have to navigate to it from the Google search. And forget about cut and paste from the web page, it is either all or none, no such thing as select text. Some newer web pages that use latest scripting tech , forms, etc are useless as you can't enter text in the text box! Just try Hotmail. I can go on and on..., but it's late already, and I need to get some sleep. As for me personaly... I don't see how Google's browser is better even compare to old Pocket IE. But everyone has his own needs. If I have a choice I pick IE.
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Old 03-08-2009, 01:10 PM
Ed Hansberry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stuxstu View Post
I don't surf the net on a phone and have very little use for it. Outside of checking my personal email, I don't care to surf the net on a 3" screen. Internet surfing is a consumer interest and most business users have no use for surfing the web and most business want their employee's to work and not goof off on a phone.
Our business has a ton of need for web browsing. We access customer web sites, bank sites, government sites, the intranet, competitors sites, etc. The web is not just for consumers. There is a TON of business to business done online, at least in the US. That may be different in other countries. I suspect though that other countries have similar business web needs.
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Old 03-08-2009, 01:27 PM
Gerard
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My sense is that for many current and perhaps also potential WM device users, once Fennec becomes a 'finished' product, Internet use will get a whole lot more tempting via these devices. Firefox isn't just another browser of many; it's created something more like a 'movement' where many users get it to be part of something, then find that it's actually more capable while also being safer than IE. And being free to use, there's no risk, no hindrance to adoption. While the same may also be said of Android, there's still the hardware needing to be bought to get it and also the fact that it's still really wet behind the ears. If Fennec proves to be more than a poor cousin to Firefox, by guess is that it will generate a major shift in consumer attention and probably help make a lot more money for Microsoft incidentally.

And yeah, while my business (I'm a violinmaker/restorer) may not be exactly mainstream, I find the web to be abundantly useful in helping clients in more ways all the time. And the better the service I provide for my clients, the more likely they are to stick with me and keep doing my advertising for me. Both as a direct resource-finder for musicians (who often lack search skills, though less so by the year) and as a research tool for my own side of the work, the Internet's value to my work is becoming essential. And while I do use my netbook to most of that stuff these days, the WM phone's browser comes into it on occasion for quick searches while talking with clients across the workbench.
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Old 03-08-2009, 02:20 PM
Stinger
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I really don't see how Microsoft can compete against free in the long term. It's been reported that not only is Android license free but Google are offering free support to the likes of Motorola. If you're a manufacturer in a shrinking economy, it's almost a no-brainer to go with Android.

Personally, I haven't been very impressed with what I've seen of Android so far. I wonder about application compatibility between devices with different hardware specs. I wonder when they're going to add the features so obviously missing from the G1. Ultimately, it's the manufacturers and carriers, not the end-users, that Google needs to impress though.

Didn't Ballmer say something very similar about the iPhone before it was released?
 
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Old 03-08-2009, 08:16 PM
Rocco Augusto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by virain View Post
If you open website with a lot of links and lot of text, xda-developers.com for example. It is very difficult, almost impossible to hit the right link on a first try without resizing page a few times and then scrolling all over looking for that link. WM uses stylus, HUGE advantade on 3" screen!
Well of course you're going to have problems with those pages, each one you mentioned was optimized for use with the inferior Windows Mobile browser and/or Microsoft products. A handful of sites are in no way an example for the Internet as a whole.

As a web developer, since the release of the iPhone, every project I have taken on one of the requirements have been the additional building of an mobile WebKit version of their site or that the site that was being built was WebKit friendly. Not once in my entire web development career has any company ever asked me to build a site that was Windows Mobile friendly or cellular phone friendly.
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Last edited by Rocco Augusto; 03-08-2009 at 08:18 PM..
 
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Old 03-08-2009, 09:53 PM
virain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Well of course you're going to have problems with those pages, each one you mentioned was optimized for use with the inferior Windows Mobile browser and/or Microsoft products. A handful of sites are in no way an example for the Internet as a whole.

As a web developer, since the release of the iPhone, every project I have taken on one of the requirements have been the additional building of an mobile WebKit version of their site or that the site that was being built was WebKit friendly. Not once in my entire web development career has any company ever asked me to build a site that was Windows Mobile friendly or cellular phone friendly.
BTW, I understand you are the developer for this site as well. So my question is: How come website dedicated to Mobile devices and mobile internet experiences can not be used to full extend on a mobile browser, neither "inferior" PIE nor superior WebKit. I understand that WebKit is something new, but how is it superior to IE? Beats Me. I agree it is different, but superiority? I doubt it.
And one more thing, If Android browser so great, how come Opera Mini is one of the most popular downloads at the Android Market, number 4, last time I've checked?
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Last edited by virain; 03-08-2009 at 10:05 PM..
 
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