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  #1  
Old 12-28-2008, 12:00 AM
Rocco Augusto
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Default Google Android Cutting Into Windows Mobile Marketshare

http://pocketnow.com/index.php?a=po...&t=news&id=6490

"Let's be frank, the impressive number of folks jumping ship to new OSs and other companies claiming increased smartphone market share are clear indicators that plenty of customers want something other that Windows Mobile, and the latest words out of Microsoft's largest mobile partner certainly reconfirm our suspicions. A unnamed HTC executive speaking to Smarthouse admitted that the sales of its flagship Android device are, in fact, hurting sales for HTC's Windows Mobile offerings. Now, we'll probably have to wait a bit longer for more comprehensive numbers -- if they're ever actually released -- but we have a feeling that people want something different, and Google's first dip into the mobile OS space is certainly a viable alternative."

 

This is unsurprising news. In 2008 we saw a drastic increase in touch based Windows Mobile devices, such as the HTC Touch Pro and HTC Touch HD but at the same time we also saw almost all Windows Mobile device makers move away from Windows Mobile Standard platform, which in my opinion is the bread and butter of the Windows Mobile ecosystem since it competes directly with RIM's Blackberry dominance in the business world. Unfortunately as good as Windows Mobile Standard is the same cannot be said for Windows Mobile Professional. The Pocket PC platform was designed for a different time and for new users of the operating system can be incredibly difficult and frustrating to grasp. Heck, even after I spent some time with the HTC Touch Diamond I had to trade it in for an easier to use device. Sure T-Mobile's G1 isn't the most attractive device on the block - in fact it's a hideously ugly device - the beauty of the first Google Android device lies in the software. Google's Android platform is fun and easy to use and most importantly it is incredibly exciting.

Microsoft had a dream with Windows Mobile. Create a mobile operating system and license the technology to OEMs so they can create awesome exciting new devices. Unfortunately Windows Mobile hasn't changed at all since I started using it on my Motorola MPx220 way back in the day. Sure, we might have received a fancy new homescreen with Windows Mobile 6.1, but that is just Window dressing on a house that is already falling apart. The fundamental flaws of what holds Windows Mobile back are still present well over a half a decade since I started using it. Google on the other hand paid very close attention to Microsoft's dream and tweaked and applied that dream to the current generation of mobile devices and users.

Can Microsoft come back and create the software and excitement needed to save it from obscurity? Only time will tell. In the meantime however, I would expect to see Google Android continue to nibble away on Microsoft's market share well into 2009; especially as more and more companies release more Android based devices.

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  #2  
Old 12-28-2008, 10:42 AM
richardmp
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Wink Agree with what you say

First time posting here, I caught your article from a pocket pc thoughts feed on my google homepage.
I have had a series of WM devices - 2 x O2 XDAs, the newer version from T-Mobile in the UK, then a Treo 750, through my work - I am continually on the road, and access to my emails, calendar and contact lists are essential. WM's compatibility with my work Exchange servers, and a quad band phone have meant that I can leave my laptop at home when travelling unless I really need it. I haven't gone the blackberry route as I don't like the way it works, and from our purchasing set up, it's more expensive than accessing webmail. The handset changes that I made were in pursuit of better hardware, with the expectation that I would have to cope with the software.
I had all sorts of additional software (registry access, SPG everything, wisbar, etc.) installed on the WM devices to make them work as I wanted them to work: is that a good sign from Microsoft that this is possible, or a bad sign that it is required? I was really curious about android, then discovered how ungainly the hardware is, and swapped my trusty Treo (I loved that phone) for a symbian powered Nokia e71. Interestingly, I haven't had to add anything to the software to use the e71 as I want (other than mail for exchange), and in 3 months of usage it hasn't crashed, or made me think "I wish it did x".
MS would now have to do something quite special to get me to switch back: someone would have to come up with some good hardware (I can't tell you how impressed I am with the e71) and MS would have to come up with some software to match!
As an aside, do you think I could load android on to my e71 or Treo 750 ?

R
 
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  #3  
Old 12-30-2008, 12:42 AM
Pony99CA
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Default Consumers and Operating Systems

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Unfortunately as good as Windows Mobile Standard is the same cannot be said for Windows Mobile Professional. The Pocket PC platform was designed for a different time and for new users of the operating system can be incredibly difficult and frustrating to grasp.
I just don't understand comments like that. I haven't used Windows Mobile Professional, but I use an iPAQ hx2795 WM 5 Pocket PC and a Motorola Q9m WM 6 STandard device every day. I don't see that much different in terms of usability. In fact, I think if you married the Q9m form factor (with its great keyboard) with WM Professional, you'd have a great device.

You can navigate so much easier with a touchscreen that I don't see how people can compare WM Professional and WM Standard in that regard. Where WM Standard wins is in one-handed usage, but I don't see many real problems with combining the two. (Microsoft just hasn't done it yet. )

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Sure T-Mobile's G1 isn't the most attractive device on the block - in fact it's a hideously ugly device - the beauty of the first Google Android device lies in the software. Google's Android platform is fun and easy to use and most importantly it is incredibly exciting.
But will that excitement wear off? Remember, Windows Mobile has been around in some PDA form for 10 years now, and the Pocket PC as we more or less know it today since 2001. So, yeah, I'm sure some of the bloom is off the rose.

However, read this MSNBC article that says, for most consumers, hardware is more important that the OS. That may not be true for smartphones, but will consumers who haven't used a smartphone yet care?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Microsoft had a dream with Windows Mobile. Create a mobile operating system and license the technology to OEMs so they can create awesome exciting new devices. Unfortunately Windows Mobile hasn't changed at all since I started using it on my Motorola MPx220 way back in the day.
The use of flash memory for storage in WM 5 so you wouldn't lose all of your data when your battery died was an insignificant change? The support of newer screen sizes from the 176x220 original Smartphone didn't matter? Adding Office Mobile to WM 6 didn't matter?

Maybe the user interface hasn't changed much, but that's a different claim. Microsoft does have some work to do there, certainly, if they want to capture the buzz that Apple and Google have.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Google on the other hand paid very close attention to Microsoft's dream and tweaked and applied that dream to the current generation of mobile devices and users.
Google had the benefit of watching Microsoft's (and other companies', including Apple) successes and failures. It's not surprising that they might be able to avoid some of the pitfalls.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Can Microsoft come back and create the software and excitement needed to save it from obscurity? Only time will tell. In the meantime however, I would expect to see Google Android continue to nibble away on Microsoft's market share well into 2009; especially as more and more companies release more Android based devices.
It's not like new companies aren't releasing WM devices, though. TechFaith, ZTE and Mobinnova have been in the news lately, for example.

However, I also expect Android (and maybe even Nova) to take some WM market share. They're the new kids on the block and really have nowhere to go but up.

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  #4  
Old 12-30-2008, 03:59 AM
me
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Hi Rocco,

Sounds like you'll soon be writing for "Android Thoughts".

I think it's great that competing mobile OSs have come out, because that could only improve Windows Mobile. I hope Microsoft is getting the message.

I hope though, that the trend is not all towards these "all-touch" phones, in other words, everyone trying to make Iphone wannabes. The Iphone is apparently quite good at what it does, from what I've heard, and I doubt any of its imitators (including G1) come close.

However, I'm not interested in an all-touch phone. I currently have an MDA (HTC Wizard-WM5), and that is too touch-oriented to me. For my next phone, I'd like to have a keyboard, that one does not have to slide out, and can easily dial phone numbers with one hand, even without looking at the touch screen to see where the numbers are.

Although I am a T-Mobile customer, long out of contract, eligible for an upgrade, and long overdue for a change in phone, from the slow clunky and bulky MDA, I am not interested in the G1.

Although WM has a lot of problems, I already have a lot of WM apps (both for smartphone and touch screen-my previous phone was a SMT5600), and there are many apps available, far more than for the very new G1, and still pretty new Apple Mobile. (In the future, of course, those OSs will probably have many more apps available than now.)

So for now, still planning to get a new WM phone. Getting very frustrated with T-Mobile about that though, as they have not introduced a new WM phone in over a year, and have none with 3G, although they have been rolling out their 3G network. (Perhaps the agreement with Google was not to bring out any WM phones for a while, to make the G1 their premier smartphone.)

I'm thinking now of just buying one of the new WM keyboard-based smartphones (although interestingly, they now come with touch screen as well), such as Samsung Epix, HP IPAQ 910, or Treo Pro, unlocked, and forget for now this waiting for T-Mobile to come out with a phone I want.

(If anyone could compare the three models I mentioned, I would find that interesting.)

I don't think WM is dead yet, but I hope they are getting a wake-up call, and work seriously on improving the OS.

I sure hope they improve ActiveStync! That has always been so buggy, without an update for years!
 
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  #5  
Old 12-30-2008, 04:21 AM
Pony99CA
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I sure hope they improve ActiveStync! That has always been so buggy, without an update for years!
I wouldn't count on one. Microsoft probably wants you to move to Vista and use Windows Mobile Device Center. (Did you wonder when they added file syncing to WM 6 Standard, but only if you were on Vista using WMDC?)

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  #6  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:25 AM
Rocco Augusto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pony99CA View Post
I just don't understand comments like that. I haven't used Windows Mobile Professional, but I use an iPAQ hx2795 WM 5 Pocket PC and a Motorola Q9m WM 6 STandard device every day. I don't see that much different in terms of usability. In fact, I think if you married the Q9m form factor (with its great keyboard) with WM Professional, you'd have a great device.
Windows Mobile touch screen devices are so much more convoluted then they need to be. Microsoft did the right thing when they created the Standard platform and created a device that was usable with one hand. The same cannot be said for the Professional version. The Professional version is riddled with things like tiny "OK", a Start menu, and other aspects of a Desktop computer which are jammed into a device with a 3.5in screen at most. It just doesn't work and needs to be redesigned from the ground up, user interface wise, to make it more user friendly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pony99CA View Post
But will that excitement wear off? Remember, Windows Mobile has been around in some PDA form for 10 years now, and the Pocket PC as we more or less know it today since 2001. So, yeah, I'm sure some of the bloom is off the rose.
With the way Google is churning out updates I wouldn't expect to see the excitement wearing off anytime soon. The T-Mobile G1 has only been out for a few months and in January Google has plans to release an exciting new ROM which is part of their "Cupcake" branch. The new ROM includes things such as an on-screen keyboard and other features users are craving such as Stereo Bluetooth, video recording, updated and faster web browser and a lot more.

The feature set coming out in the Cupcake update is amazing for only a few months time work. Granted the above features have been a part of Windows Mobile for years, but how long did it take Microsoft to get around to putting those features in? Also when Microsoft did add those features, were you able to get an official ROM from your carrier and update your device while still keeping your data... or even update your device with an official ROM at all without buying a new device?! Better yet has Microsoft ever been known to release such a major update to their mobile operating system less than 6 months from the release of the previous OS?

This is why Google will continue to excite people with the Android platform. They quickly push out updates in a few months where it would usually take Microsoft over a year to push out a similar update with such a large feature set.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pony99CA View Post
The use of flash memory for storage in WM 5 so you wouldn't lose all of your data when your battery died was an insignificant change? The support of newer screen sizes from the 176x220 original Smartphone didn't matter? Adding Office Mobile to WM 6 didn't matter?
It is not that those update didn't matter it is more of the fact that those updates were just band-aids on a much larger problem. One of the largest problems being how long it takes for any major updates to come out of Redmond. How long have we been hearing about Windows Mobile 7 or "Photon"? It has been years and we still have over a year to go.

If Windows Mobile 7 turns out to be the mythical beast we hear about in rumors floating around the Interwebs, then there is no doubt that Windows Mobile 7 will be a HUGE update to the Windows Mobile platform... but will it still be relevant when you have the competition turning out updates faster than Microsoft can spit? Are we going to have to wait several years after the release of Windows Mobile 7 until we see Windows Mobile 8? Are we going to be able to update old devices? Will updating still require a complete destruction of the information on my device?

These are all serious questions that I feel Microsoft ignores that need to be addressed if Microsoft wants to continue to compete in this arena.
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Last edited by Rocco Augusto; 12-30-2008 at 06:35 AM..
 
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  #7  
Old 12-30-2008, 09:06 AM
David Tucker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by me View Post
Hi Rocco,
I hope though, that the trend is not all towards these "all-touch" phones, in other words, everyone trying to make Iphone wannabes. The Iphone is apparently quite good at what it does, from what I've heard, and I doubt any of its imitators (including G1) come close.
The G1 is not a touch screen only device and Android can support many hardware configurations.
 
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  #8  
Old 12-30-2008, 06:44 PM
Craig Horlacher
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AndroidThoughts.com anyone?
 
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  #9  
Old 12-30-2008, 09:13 PM
Damion Chaplin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
The Professional version is riddled with things like tiny "OK", a Start menu, and other aspects of a Desktop computer which are jammed into a device with a 3.5in screen at most. It just doesn't work and needs to be redesigned from the ground up, user interface wise, to make it more user friendly.
Actually, it does just work. It may be a little annoying to have a tiny OK button, but it does work and you get used to it. I mean thousands (millions?) of people use it every day. Could it be more user-friendly? Sure. Could it be more iPhone-like (since that's what we're really talking about here)? Again, sure. Do I personally care whether people mistake my phone for an iPhone? Definitely not. Do I need a dumbed-down interface for my phone? Again, definitely not. Windows Mobile works for me and for many many other people every day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
The feature set coming out in the Cupcake update is amazing for only a few months time work. Granted the above features have been a part of Windows Mobile for years, but how long did it take Microsoft to get around to putting those features in?
You know, I've seen this argument a lot, usually referring to Apple's release of updates. And I'll use the same comeback here: Sure, MS took a while to add those features, but seeing as how WM has been on the market for some time, I personally think that Apple and Google had absolutely ZERO excuse for not including these features in their phones in the first place. Who cares about frequent updates if they're just adding features everyone else's phone already does?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Also when Microsoft did add those features, were you able to get an official ROM from your carrier and update your device while still keeping your data... or even update your device with an official ROM at all without buying a new device?! Better yet has Microsoft ever been known to release such a major update to their mobile operating system less than 6 months from the release of the previous OS?.
Another argument I've heard before. And I will counter with: "How many average users will care about upgrading their phone?" How many people do you know that are still using the same original phone they got in the 90's? A lot. So maybe you're not talking about the average user. Power users like you and me know that if we want a WM phone that's upgradeable, we need to buy an HTC-made phone and visit XDA developers. Could Microsoft improve in that department? Definitely, but I don't believe it's a deal-breaker in the real world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
This is why Google will continue to excite people with the Android platform. They quickly push out updates in a few months where it would usually take Microsoft over a year to push out a similar update with such a large feature set.
Again, we're talking about updates that should have been in there in the first place (really, stereo bluetooth?). Show me Android actually innovating instead of playing catch-up and I'll gladly revisit this conversation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Are we going to have to wait several years after the release of Windows Mobile 7 until we see Windows Mobile 8?
Who cares? if WM7 is all it's cracked up to be, we won't be looking ahead to WM8. How many happy Vista users are actually looking ahead to Win7? Very few. And before you say it, how may happy Vista users there are at all is a different question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
Are we going to be able to update old devices? Will updating still require a complete destruction of the information on my device?
Again, only power users like you and me care about this sort of thing. And even I don't care so much. Apple users will just buy a new iPhone like they would any other new iPod that hits the market.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocco Augusto View Post
These are all serious questions that I feel Microsoft ignores that need to be addressed if Microsoft wants to continue to compete in this arena.
Let me be clear here: I'm not disagreeing that MS needs to get off its collective butt if it wants to compete against the G1 and iPhone. I just don't think the reasons you state are concerns of the public-at-large. WM6 could technically be 'fixed' by skinning the entire OS (similar to TouchFlo, but more).

Could WM be made more useable to the masses? Sure. I think, however, that MS would be smart to market WM devices to power-users only and forget about luring people away from the iPhone (or G1). Most people who use an iPhone have never used another smartphone in their life to compare it to. Their main competitor should be the Blackberry, not the iPhone. Windows Mobile units are devices meant for serious computing, not texting and playing MP3s and they should be marketed as such (IMO).
 
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:52 AM
Rocco Augusto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Actually, it does just work. It may be a little annoying to have a tiny OK button, but it does work and you get used to it.
The argument can be made that if you have to "get used to it" then it doesn't really work at all.

I've used Windows Mobile devices for years and I love the platform but as a user I shouldn't have to sit around and wait until I get use to something, especially with a company that has the resources as Microsoft. The only reason I kept my Android device and didn't move back to a Windows Mobile device right away was because the user interface just plain worked and I didn't have to get use to anything. Everything in the user interface worked the way I would have expected it to work and was incredibly intuitive. That is all I'm asking for here from Microsoft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Who cares about frequent updates if they're just adding features everyone else's phone already does?
The updates aren't just filled with features that everyone else has though. The Cupcake update includes an updated browser with a new javascript engine, reportedly speeding up the already very speedy browser, something that us WM users are still waiting for. Instead we get an updated version of IE6 that we can only add to our devices by downloading illegally. Yes a lot of the features should have been included there in launch but the point is companies such as Apple and Google are pushing these features out in weeks and months time when Microsoft is taking years upon years time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Another argument I've heard before. And I will counter with: "How many average users will care about upgrading their phone?"
You're right, average users don't care about upgrading their handsets which is why companies such as Google and Apple are pushing the updates out to their users so they will have the latest ROMs on their devices. This is something we have been wishing Microsoft would do for years. There is no reason why we should have to track down "cooked" versions of ROMs to get the latest software on our devices with the latest bug fixes and god fordib security fixes. The average user and the power user should never have to worry about upgrading our devices just like we should never have to worry about manually downloading and installing updates on our Desktop computers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Show me Android actually innovating instead of playing catch-up and I'll gladly revisit this conversation.
Android started innovating when they released an open source mobile operating system that allowed anyone to download the source code and poke around in it and put that OS on any device you can get it on to. You already have crafty people porting Android over to the Nokia Internet tablet series of devices and even the Sprint HTC Touch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Again, only power users like you and me care about this sort of thing. And even I don't care so much. Apple users will just buy a new iPhone like they would any other new iPod that hits the market.
I'm completely positive that everyone who has ever performed an update on a Windows Mobile device, power user or not, has cared that once that update was completed they had to reinstall all of their programs, files, sync settings, etc. Lets not forget all the angry customers I had to personally deal with who would come into my old Cingular store and compalin that they now lost all of the pictures and videos of their kids that they didn't backup because they had no idea their devices would be wipped. The way Microsoft currently handles updates is stupid and cannot be defended.

If you're going to wipe someones device, at least give them the software to back up their ActiveSync settings, a list of installed programs, images, videos, and paid for and downloaded ringtones which users are never happy about when they lose since those ringtones cost $2USD a pop. Remember, these aren't power users and they cannot be expected to do this themselves

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damion Chaplin View Post
Who cares? if WM7 is all it's cracked up to be, we won't be looking ahead to WM8.
Businesses will care. When it comes time to update your devices, now that the iPhone supports Exchange and the Cupcake version of Android is rumored to have Exchange support as well, as a business owner are you going to buy the device that will only be updated once every 1-2 years and require you to buy new hardware to receive the updates or are you going to purchase devices that are updated every few months where you won't have to buy a new device to use the latest software features to help your business be more productive?

While I'm not a fan of the iPhone, it is now more cost effective to own a iPhone then it is a Windows Mobile device as a business user.

I love Windows Mobile. I really do. I've loved Windows Mobile for years. At the same time though for years we have all been watching Microsoft just coasting by with each Windows Mobile release. Windows Mobile Standard 6.1 Standard was a step in the right direction with the sliding panels homescreen, but what about Windows Mobile 6.1 Pro? Why wasn't the same care and user interface changes implemented there to bring the platforms closer together?

Microsoft has always treated Windows Mobile as a second rate product and if they put in a fraction of the time into making Windows Mobile better as they have in making the Desktop version of Windows better with Windows 7, than WM would be an unstoppable force.

Quote:
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how may happy Vista users there are at all is a different question.
I'm a happy Vista user though I'm really looking forward to Windows 7.
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