11-26-2003, 02:00 AM
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Contributing Editor Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,228
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An Open Letter To Developers From A Pocket PC User
What follows is a letter to the support team for Pocket Informant, which basically thanks them for providing CAB files for easy downloading and installation and a request that all other developers follow suit. I agree completely. There are a number of reasons to have CAB files so you can install files without having to have a desktop around. Just a few reasons include:
� Downloading new apps or reinstalling newer versions over WiFi, GPRS or even a 56K modem when traveling.
� Mac users don't have to put up with installing Virtual PC just to use the ActiveSync installer.
� Many users like keeping CAB files of important programs on storage cards so that in the event of a hard reset, they can quickly get back up and running - though I'd argue a good backup is better as none of your all important data is missing, but I digress.
In addition to the request made in this letter, I'd like to see MS improve CAB handling on Windows Mobile devices in two ways. 1) Ask the user where to install the application. Currently, it assumes RAM. There are third party apps that will allow you to override this, but that would be like having to have a third party app on your desktop to redirect installs to other partitions. 2) Ask the user if they want to keep the CAB file after installing. It currently deletes it, which may be OK most of the time, but more than once I've wished the CAB was there after the install - usually after I've downloaded one over the air and want to transfer the CAB to my desktop when I get back home.
So read the letter and vote in the poll.
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I'm a physician, so a lot are medical. Some of the biggies, medical wise are: <br /><br />Sanford Guide <br />Pepid <br />Skyscape's products <br />ePocrates <br /><br />The problem with the latter three is that they update occasionally and the hardware to do that is only on the PC. Thus, in their current iterations, I see no way around the Virtual PC/have a PC solutions. That's frustrating because AvantGo, for example, will sync up over my Wi-Fi connection directly from the handheld. To me, this is the direction the updating software should be going. Wi-Fi is becoming so much more common that if I could just get the software to look for updates directly from the PPC, it'd be much better. Make sense? Plus, with PDA/phone combos, this doesn't even have to be limited to Wi-Fi. <br /><br />Other software I've had a problem with are games, ranging from Hexacto's stuff to PDAmill's. Tonight I downloaded the Atomic Cannon Pocket demo from Handango and tried to install via .exe through PocketMac. It said it found .cab's and tried to install, but the iPaq couldn't recognize the files it got. I could probably get the developer to send me a CAB if I bought it, but sometimes you want to try the demo first and it just ends up being not worth the hassle. HandyMenu sent me a cab, but it's just a pain, you know. <br /><br />Laridian's PocketBible is a mainstay for me (even from back in the Palm days) and it too required a Virtual PC session. And maybe it's just me but Virtual PC is so slow and such a processor hog that I have to really plan a dedicated time, restart the Mac, then launch VPC only and do my stuff, then get out of it. Even then, it's slow. With my Palm, I could just download a demo, install it and go. Speedy. Even if I can get developers to send me .cab's it's inconvenient. You handle this perfectly. In fact, I downloaded PI 4.6 as a cab directly to my PPC without ever messing with the Mac or VPC. Awesome. If developers would take the cue, it seems to me that direct installation would take off. <br /><br />With whatever influence you do have, I wish you'd lobby for more cabs to be available without special request, either on the site, but perhaps even better through Handango/PocketGear type sites. I mean the mobile Handango site is a joke. I don't think that PI's even there. Too few programs to make it worthwhile. To me, that's the key. <br /><br />Look, I knew when I bought this PPC that it might be inconvenient, so I'm not meaning to whine. It's just a hassle to try out new stuff, so I end up not doing it, and I end up missing my Palm more than I thought I would. Of course, there are just tons more medical things available for the Palm, too, so that's part of my disappointment. <br /><br />I'm not kidding or kissing {up} when I say that PI is really right now just about the only thing exciting me about the PPC.
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<br /><br />Everyone knows I'm a <a href="http://www.ehansberry.com/pages/laridian.html">huge Laridian fan</a> and I'd have to agree with the sentiments above. I'd be less so if I were on the Mac and had to jump through those hoops. Even being a Windows user, more than once I've wanted to buy a Laridian book or download a new/updated program and had to wait until I got home. Come on devs, let us have those CAB files!<br /><br />As a slight aside, :bad-words: if you develop small utility that is basically a single .EXE file, just give us the .EXE, or give us the .EXE as an alternative. I've gone round and round today trying to get one utility on my Pocket PC that is a 15-30K .exe file when expanded that is all wrapped up in some complex button pressing form that interfers with WinZip's download association for .ZIP files for some reason just to get the ActiveSync installer and when you get down to it, the AS installer and the CAB is going to put stuff in the registry, shortcuts where I don't want them, blah blah blah. Full sized apps need installers. Most utilities don't. Stop making this so complex! Needless to say, I'm not going to even bother installing the thing. Ok, rant over. :?
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11-26-2003, 02:06 AM
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Pupil
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 28
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If i could, I would install all of my apps with cab files. If that were possible, my vote would've been different. Nice Letter
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11-26-2003, 02:13 AM
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Philosopher
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 566
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mhskateboarder
If i could, I would install all of my apps with cab files. If that were possible, my vote would've been different. Nice Letter
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Ditto.
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-= Sass =-
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11-26-2003, 02:48 AM
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Pupil
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 45
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To make sure your CAB is not deleted after you installed it you need to mark it as readonly. Works for me.
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11-26-2003, 03:12 AM
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Contributing Editor Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,228
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by altden2002
To make sure your CAB is not deleted after you installed it you need to mark it as readonly. Works for me.
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Yeah, but if I could remember to do that each time, I could remember to make a copy too. There are lots of valid workarounds and great tips for this kind of thing, but the point of a PDA is to simpify things. :-)
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11-26-2003, 04:11 AM
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Thinker
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 319
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I voted 100% CAB.
I use SK CabInstl which is probably what the author alluded to. I only sync at work and I almost always install software at home.
If an app does not include a CAB I run the setup at home on my computer that does have Activesync installed, but without a connection to my device. Then I scrounge my hard drive for the CAB files and guess at which one is ARM and copy it to my SD card. Then I install with SK CanInstl on my device. I always put a copy of the CAB in a specific directory on my PC for future use and keep a copy of the CAB on my SD card for critical apps.
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11-26-2003, 04:13 AM
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Ponderer
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 51
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I'd love to see the CabInstall and Remover applications added to the OS. These are two must have utilities IMHO.
CabInstall can install a CAB anywhere on your device, and you can decide if you want the file deleted by default or not.
Since I got my new Pocket PC 2003 device I have never used the built-in add/remove programs link, and have used Remover instead. Unlike the default add/remove, it doesn't forget about files and leave extra junk on your device after installing and uninstalling lots of applications.
Rather than rely on Microsoft and OEMs to choose what goes in ROM, I'd love it if utilities were available to dump the ROM, add/remove files, and then reflash it. Then we could all get rid of the unnecessry junk we never use (like Pocket MSN, the Pictures viewer, heck, even Pocket Word!) and install truly useful 3rd Party utilities we rely on. I remember reading somewhere that clever folks had built utilities to do this for one of the Pocket PC Phone devices. It's a shame we can't all customize our ROMs.
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11-26-2003, 04:18 AM
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Ponderer
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 103
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Yes, other OS users than just Windows are using ppc's. I wish developers would realise that. 
For us Mac users, we have two options for Activesync reaplacement. Trying to extract cabs from exe files on a mac is dodgy at best. It's the height of annoyance that I don't need my pc anymore....unless I'd like to install something. And why? Is it because of ppc? No, it's because of close-minded developers.
So yes, please, ppc developers, Mac users use your products too. We'd love to support and buy your products, but if you use needless exe's-only, then how can we possibly use and buy your products?
And cheers to those few developers like Pocket Informant who actually realise this.
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11-26-2003, 04:49 AM
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Intellectual
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 187
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There are some problems with cab files installation
some of them have work arounds (like the cab file being deleted after the installation, ...)
some other don't, like the fact that you can't control where the program gets installed, with cab file installation the program always goes to the main memory !
Also for newbies a .cab file is not the best way to install files, we've seen too many people asking about what to do with a cab file (the first thing most newbies do is open it with winzip and then they don't know what to do next)
As a developer we thought about this issue when we started selling our products (PC-exe?, cab?, PPC-exe?, zi pfile ?....etc)
- if we ship .cab files our support line will be flodded by EMails from people asking about what to do ?
- if we ship .zip file with an .exe and a .cab this will even confuse people more (what is this file, and what is that other one ?) and some people might not have any unzipping software (Strange but true)
- if we ship .exe we "might" get EMails from people asking for .cab files and then we can send the .cab file to them. like what happened with our HandyMenu product (read the original message)
So we voted for the 3rd option because we thought this will be the best option for us. (and in fact we only got 2 requests for .cab files so far)
Unlick HAndAnGo some other companies provide different links for .cab/.zip/.exe/... and it's then up to the buyer to choose. However HandAnGo provide developers with the ability to upload one file only
So we still think (from a adeveloper point of view) PC .exe files are the best solution (for now at least)
Just our 2 cents
DinarSoft
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11-26-2003, 04:52 AM
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Pontificator
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,043
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I'm in the 'most of the time I use CAB files' camp. That's for one reason: the odd software won't function correctly with a CAB install, or does not provide a CAB file. Two prominent cases for me are Textmaker and Stowaway keyboard installs. The former comes with 'data1.cab' and such, but no true final package installer for the PPC. It must be installed from a PC, it seems. The Stowaway provides a CAB once unpacked, though it's a bit tricky to grab, but installing this way gets me a 'cannot find language dll' sort of error, and the keyboard refuses to work. Again, must have a PC handy. That stinks, and it's not Microsoft's fault. ThinkOutside/Targus is to blame for never responding to my many complaints about this. I did a Stowaway review, for the Casio version, and was in a lot of contact with a ThinkOutside rep (they invented the thing - Targus is merely a distributor). On the CAB question I got not one word, ever. On everything else the rep was very cooperative.
Otherwise I use CABs, and that's about 98% of my installs. I've found that many 'EXE' files are in fact ZIP or RAR files, and can be unpacked on my iPAQ very easily with any number of softwares. PocketRAR is especially handy.
As for them not disappearing, just mark the file Read Only before use, or check that option in CabInstl, and worry no more; the file will still be there later, for archiving in a card. I like to keep my CABs in RAR archives, as PocketRAR is more stable than Resco Explorer for compressing to very small sizes. Of course, this sort of stuff is not for the novice, who is often confused by even Activesync installation options.
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Gerard Ivan Samija
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