09-22-2003, 05:40 PM
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Editor Emeritus
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,060
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A Pocket PC "No-Buy" List?
I have a friend who uses Pocket PCs to help perform health evaluations in developing countries. He recently told me about a strange situation he encountered:
"Recently, I tried to purchase ten Pocket PCs from Hewlett-Packard Shopping.com. The agent who was helping me asked me casually why I was buying so many, and I responded that I would be using them in a child health program in Kenya. The HP agent told me that everything was fine with the order, and to expect it the next day. The following day, I received a call from HP. The person told me that my order had been denied because it didn�t meet 'industry-wide criteria for proper orders.' I knew that I had more than enough credit on my card to place the order. I asked the agent what was wrong with the order, and she just repeated the aforementioned line. When I asked what the criteria were to which she was referring, there was a long pause then she said, 'I am not at liberty to divulge that information.' I asked to speak to the person�s supervisor who had denied my order, and that supervisor repeated the same language, but would not give me any more information. I asked if the refusal was due to some problem with my credit (although I knew it wasn�t � HP had already put a hold on my card for the purchase). He said it wasn�t. I asked if it had anything to do with how many units I ordered. He said it wasn�t, but would not give me any other information.
I have wondered if my mentioning that I will be visiting a country with known terrorist activities (Kenya) led to the problem. Do you know if this has happened to other people? Is this part of an overly-zealous efforts on the part of the Dept. of Homeland Security? Is there some sort of No-Buy list in use?
Thanks,
Tom Davis, MPH
Senior Program Specialist"
Does anybody have an idea why this would happen? If this does relate to the fact that the Pocket PCs were to be used in Kenya, who actually sets the denial criteria?
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09-22-2003, 06:01 PM
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Pontificator
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,264
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If it is a security measure, seems pretty stupid. A terrorist would just lie about where they were taking them. I am assuming that since next day shipping was an option, they were not being sent directly to Kenya.
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09-22-2003, 06:04 PM
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Intellectual
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 193
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that is bizarre
that is wierd and scary... makes you think there most be some big brother watching things. It is really bad that they wont even tell you why your order is denied.
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09-22-2003, 06:05 PM
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Contributing Editor Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,228
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According to http://www.cs.georgetown.edu/~dennin...port-regs.html - Kenya falls under a category with the following requirements. "Commercial entities and their branches located in these countries or any country listed in this Supplement and designated with one or two asterisks are eligible to receive "recoverable" encryption commodities and software of any key length for internal company proprietary use."
I don't think the 128bit encryption that is included on WM2003 devices is considered "recoverable" since it would take months if not years of brute force to decrypt.
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09-22-2003, 06:15 PM
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5000+ Posts? I Should OWN This Site!
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,133
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Yeah, the encryption thing would be my guess. But there's no way someone should refuse to sell products to someone without telling them WHY. That's just ridiculous. If your friend is really upset, I bet a newspaper reporter or two might be interested in the story. Probably under the angle of "Is Homeland Security Over-Doing It?" But no matter what heading the story goes under, the publicity might make HP either tell your friend what the problem is, or actually sell him the units.
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09-22-2003, 06:22 PM
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Intellectual
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 153
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Biggest possible explanation is they are suspecting credit card fraud.
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09-22-2003, 06:25 PM
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Ponderer
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 93
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Why even bother with buying them from HP?
I bet there are dozens of eCommerce sites out there that would be HAPPY to sell him 10 Pocket PCs! And would not care what he is going to do with them! And at a better price!
Which makes this whole action by HP rather stupid!
:roll:
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09-22-2003, 06:30 PM
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5000+ Posts? I Should OWN This Site!
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,133
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by kamware
I bet there are dozens of eCommerce sites out there that would be HAPPY to sell him 10 Pocket PCs! And would not care what he is going to do with them! And at a better price!
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Yeah, and even better if he buys Axims. 
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09-22-2003, 06:35 PM
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Neophyte
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7
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Lots of possibilities... suspiscion of credit card fraud, HP shopping.com only ships to U.S. (but then again if he's shipping to U.S., what gives?), always a possibility of the big brother thing...
Whatever the reasoning, its weird, freaky and scary all at once when you can't buy something because of where you're going...
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09-22-2003, 06:50 PM
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Thinker
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 338
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While I can't explain exactly what happened, or why, I can share that I had a similar experience in May 2001 when I bought my laptop from Dell. The order seemed to go through... but it was delayed and then I got a cryptic e-mail telling me I needed to call them.
When I called them I was told that my name was matching up with some "list" they had. They asked me a few questions (I can't remember them now) and then the person told me that this was just a mix-up and apologized. I was a little shocked by the way it happened, but even before 9/11, I was of a mindset that I was glad someone was watching over our technology.
My guess is a similar situation is occurring here... that names, or "ultimate destinations" or combinations of other, as yet unknown criteria, lead manufacturers to be a "front line" in some process. I wish we knew more, but if we did, how could the system even be partially effective?
Having worked at a bank, and dealt with all the reporting of "large" currency transactions, et. al., let me assure you all, big brother is watching... and for 99.9% of us it is no problem. For the .01 of us that get "falsely identified" ... be patient, be accomodating, and remember the needs of the common good while everyone works to a amicable solution. For the .09 (or less) of you out there trying to do something illegal, or on the edges of legal, be forever warned, people are trying to catch you, and ultimately will.
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