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  #1  
Old 03-04-2012, 07:00 PM
Michael Knutson
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Default Ten (10) Windows 8 Advantages Over iPad

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://blog.laptopmag.com/10-ways-windows-8-beats-the-ipad?slide=1' target='_blank'>http://blog.laptopmag.com/10-ways-w...he-ipad?slide=1</a><br /><br /></div><p><em>"Windows 8 is now available for anyone to download, and it already shows a ton of potential. In fact, Microsoft&rsquo;s bold new OS, which reminds us a lot of Windows Phone, outshines the iPad in some key areas. Granted, there were things we didn&rsquo;t like in our Windows 8 Consumer Preview&ndash; &mdash; and the iPad 3 or iPad HD is just around the corner&ndash; &mdash; but there&rsquo;s no question that Apple will soon have a real fight on its hands. Here are the top 10 ways Windows 8 is better than the iPad right now."</em></p><p><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/lpt/auto/1330884559.usr17748.jpg" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /></p><p>A bit of an apples vs oranges comparison here: how about hardware vs hardware, and/or software vs software? Anyway, many of the touted features of Windows 8 will be solid, and will appeal to users looking for more tablet-like behavior from their mainstream computing devices. Whether there will be push-back from users on the major changes is yet to be determined. Much of the criticism that I've heard and read over the last few years regarding Windows vs iOS is that "traditional" users don't want tablet features, so it'll be interesting to follow the next iteration of Windows and its acceptance. I've already heard major griping on the removal (or displacement) of the start button ...</p><p>&nbsp;</p>
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  #2  
Old 03-05-2012, 03:13 AM
Macguy59
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Having played with it on my MBA I can say I generally like it. The few niggles I have are no way clear way to kill a running app, the way too large address bar in IE and I think the UI in the Mail app is fubar. It shouldn't have taken me 10 min of playing with it to figure out how to create a new email. (The button for it disappears when in folder view or account view). IMO that button needs to be sticky unless you are already in reply/create mode. Lack of consistency in how apps behave versus the home screen. On the home screen I can 2 finger swipe to move among the pages of tiles horizontally but on the USA Today app that won't work. You have to either use the anchor arrows or physically drag the horizontal scroll bar to advance to the next news section. I find IE to be pretty fast but no plugin support is a killer and will prevent me from using this Preview more often. Big improvement over the developer build I used.
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Old 03-05-2012, 12:30 PM
AndyMulhearn
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Default Metro UI Fail

I suspect that the prospect of an upgrade to Windows 8 would be the change that pushes my wife from her current Windows laptop to an Apple. Windows 7 is a lovely stable OS. There are some odd quirks about it but on the whole I don't mind using it.Well not too much.

Windows 8 and the Metro UI, on the other hand, is just a match made in hell. I used it for five minutes on friday night and spent all but 10 seconds of that time trying to work out how to go from IE back to the desktop and failed miserably. No command keys worked and there were no visual cues in the UI to help me out, so in the trashcan it went.

Contrast this with the way Apple are grafting iOS UI components in to Lion and the upcoming Mountain Lion and the contrast is way too extreme
 
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Old 03-05-2012, 04:11 PM
Sven Johannsen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyMulhearn View Post
Contrast this with the way Apple are grafting iOS UI components in to Lion and the upcoming Mountain Lion and the contrast is way too extreme
I'm assuming you have Macs, iPads or iPhones in the house. Hate to think you based your dismissal on 5 minutes of play with a beta OS against an OS you've never used. That said, if you are familiar with both OSX and iOS, wouldn't a merge of them seem relatively natural? Opposed to say a Windows Phonei-ish interface on a Windows OS, if you have no experience with Windows Phone? It is interesting that many of the current treatments of Win8 forget to mention that it reatins essentially everything you had with Windows 7, and adds the new desktop Metro interface and apps. Admittedly it does take a little getting used to, but so did Win3, 95, 7, as there were enough UI changes that needed a bit of learning. Sometimes a little efort will actually pay off.

Oh, BTW, its Beta. Amazing how many people expect to load it and run it with no issues at all. I can tell you there is a significant change between the Developer Preview and the Consumer Preview. I expect changes when RC comes out. Not philosophy changes, but certainly usability tweaks.
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Old 03-05-2012, 04:26 PM
AndyMulhearn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sven Johannsen View Post
I'm assuming you have Macs, iPads or iPhones in the house. Hate to think you based your dismissal on 5 minutes of play with a beta OS against an OS you've never used.
I spend all day working with Windows 7, the rest of the time I use iOS and OSX. I also seem to have touched a raw nerve if your snide remark about an OS I've never used is anything to go by.
Quote:
That said, if you are familiar with both OSX and iOS, wouldn't a merge of them seem relatively natural? Opposed to say a Windows Phonei-ish interface on a Windows OS, if you have no experience with Windows Phone? It is interesting that many of the current treatments of Win8 forget to mention that it reatins essentially everything you had with Windows 7, and adds the new desktop Metro interface and apps. Admittedly it does take a little getting used to, but so did Win3, 95, 7, as there were enough UI changes that needed a bit of learning. Sometimes a little efort will actually pay off.
Except that in the case of iOS and OSX, the merge is more gradual. First time you log into Lion you get the familiar OSX look and feel and the ability to turn on iOS style features as you go. First time you log into Windows 8 you get full-on Metro. With tiles that look like you should single click but need double click and old favourites like alt-tab that no longer work.

Perhaps Microsoft want to get to convergence ahead of Apple this time which would be a mistake because they're throwing away the good work they did with Windows 7 after Vista.

Quote:
Oh, BTW, its Beta. Amazing how many people expect to load it and run it with no issues at all. I can tell you there is a significant change between the Developer Preview and the Consumer Preview. I expect changes when RC comes out. Not philosophy changes, but certainly usability tweaks.
I don't expect it to be perfect but I also don't expect to be left stuck in IE with no hints about how to get out of it....
 
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Old 03-05-2012, 08:48 PM
Sven Johannsen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyMulhearn View Post
I spend all day working with Windows 7, the rest of the time I use iOS and OSX. I also seem to have touched a raw nerve if your snide remark about an OS I've never used is anything to go by
You are right, that was snarky. But you spent a whole 5 minutes in 8. Not sure I would say that allowed for an even reasonable eval against something I assumed you used day to day.

Quote:
Except that in the case of iOS and OSX, the merge is more gradual. First time you log into Lion you get the familiar OSX look and feel and the ability to turn on iOS style features as you go. First time you log into Windows 8 you get full-on Metro. With tiles that look like you should single click but need double click and old favourites like alt-tab that no longer work.
Might have been a better approach to let folks pick and choose, but when the Metro interface essentially replaces the Start Menu, not sure how you would work that. I would actually like to see an option of which interface to boot into, as I have some issue with Metro on dual 24" monitor setup. Love it on my tablet though. Laptop I'm wishy washy.

BTW, not in front of an 8 machine right now, but I used alt-tab just fine. Maybe it was just in desktop. App switching in Metro just takes a short intro and works fairly well.

Do you need to double click in metro? Don't recall that. As a matter of fact it seemed like I launched apps periodically when I intended to just scroll.


Quote:
Perhaps Microsoft want to get to convergence ahead of Apple this time which would be a mistake because they're throwing away the good work they did with Windows 7 after Vista
Not sure that is true. Best I can tell the majority of Win 7 is still there, you just get to it a bit differently, and have the additional option of Metro when that is appropriate.


Quote:
I don't expect it to be perfect but I also don't expect to be left stuck in IE with no hints about how to get out of it....
Assuming youare talking about the Metro IE, you 'get out of it' like every metro app, swipe in from the right for charms, or in from the left to task switch. You actually don't get out of it. If the legacy desktop were open, it would be in the app rotation. That's basic functionality of the metro concept. When the Mac concept first came out the question was, how the heck do you eject a disk? Drag it to the trash??? you're kidding. So dismissing a whole concept because you spent 5 minutes with it and a couple of things weren't intuitive seems a bit predisposed to disliking it.

The new thing is a significant departure from the current interface, and I really don't know how well it will go over. Lots of folks are resistant to any change, and they tend to complain the loudest. There is a trend towards more mobile computing though (read tablet, rather than ultrabook), and the Metro concept does lend itself well to that. One consistant complaint of iOS and Android tablets surrounds the things you can't do without a full OS, OSX or Windows. This is seemingly MSs approach to answering that need. No way you could just slap a touch UI on Windows. To many programs would take too much work. In reality Windows (7) works just fine as a slate (tablet), as long as you accepted the pen as your mouse. Somehow that was 'wrong'. I figure it will take a little learning and patience, because this isn't iOS or Android, or OSX or Windows for that matter. That's the point though, isn't it.
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Old 03-21-2012, 06:44 PM
Michael Knutson
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After playing with W8 in a VM for a couple weeks, I'm ambivalent at best. I can take or leave the Metro UI, and using W8's "desktop," I may as well still be W7 (I like W7). W8 feels incomplete right now, and I understand that it is a beta, but without having it running on a touchscreen system, running it on a ThinkPad is not very satisfying - to me. I am updating it regularly (as updates appear), and hope that additional functionality is added incrementally, and doesn't require a complete re-install. I still long for a Windows tablet, where I can run "business" (read: full MS Office) apps, so I'm hopeful.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:32 AM
Sven Johannsen
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Originally Posted by Michael Knutson View Post
I still long for a Windows tablet, where I can run "business" (read: full MS Office) apps, so I'm hopeful.
You can do that now, and will continue to be able to do that with Win8, as long as you opt for the non-arm version. By now I mean Windows 7 on a Samsung series 7 slate. Check one out at a MS store, and make them find you a stylus. Or use it with a keyboard and mouse. That's how the stores have it set up. I really don't see many folks trying to use Word or Excel, one handed while holding the slate in one hand.

On Win8 it appears that what you see is probably what you get, a metro Start screen, with metro apps, but a Win7 like environment which will work much like what you have today. Using the metro start concept takes a bit of getting used to on a laptop, but it isn't bad once you get it. Using a touch screen with just metro is much like an iPad (or a Windows Phone). The real unknown is going to be those ARM tablets that have just Metro, no Win7ish option, and MS has said something about office for that environment. Not sure what that is going to mean, but I really expect some sort of Metrofied Office subset, not the whole enchilada. Again, if you had full office, you likely be using it in a docked, desktop, mode.

In the full Win8 slate what I would really like to see is a Metro version of Office that has been fingerfriendlyized, but naturally contains a subset of features that accesses the exact same files as in the Win7 file system. For instance I would have one PIM store that I can access via metro apps one handed with fingers, but the same data is accessible via Outlook when I am docked and have a keyboard and mouse available. Same with Word. Touch friendly cut, copy, paste, light editing in Metro, on the same file I can do wonders with in Word, in the 'Win7' desktop. That's what I'm hoping for.
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