Need Virtualization Recommendation

[Phillip Dyson]

Hey all,
I just recently purchased a new HP laptop running Vista 64 Home Premium.

The problem is that I need to install my companies VPN software but I discovered that it doesn't support 64 Vista.

IT Support recommended that I try a 32 bit Virtual Machine to install the software into. Can anyone recommend a solution for this. I'm not looking to spend a ton of money, but I will pay for the solution if I need to.

thank

[doogald]

Boy, for something as one-use as this, I think that I'd try Sun's Virtual Box (http://www.virtualbox.org/) first, to see if that works well. I have a Mac, and I really like it on Mac OS compared with Parallels (and I am so wishing I didn't upgrade Parallels to 4.0), but I think that would be a great start anyway. Otherwise, I have always liked VMWare on Windows boxes myself (though I've been pure Mac for two plus years, so perhaps that has changed.)

[Jason Dunn]

Try Microsoft Virtual PC:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/

It's free. :)

[Phillip Dyson]

Thanks for both of your quick replies and suggestions.

@Jason, MS is the first place I looked, but I was only able to find a beta for Windows 7. I'm currently running Vista 64. Do you think I should still give it a try?

Also, do I need to purchase a full license of the OS that I want in the VM, or will it come with it.

[doogald]

You do need a license for the OS running in the VM. And, for the record, VirtualBox is also free.

[doogald]

... though I could also suggest that you try the 32 bit RC Windows 7 download in a VM, as you can get it without paying and it will run until next year. By then perhaps your VPN software will work in 64 bit Vista and you won't need the VPN?

[Jason Dunn]

MS is the first place I looked, but I was only able to find a beta for Windows 7. I'm currently running Vista 64. Do you think I should still give it a try?

That's really weird that their Virtual PC page assumes that everyone is running Windows 7. Bizarre. I'd say to give it a try - Vista and Windows 7 are very close in terms of code, so it should work.

Also, do I need to purchase a full license of the OS that I want in the VM, or will it come with it.

You need to have a license to run it - it's not a way of getting a free operating system. As someone else said, try the 32-bit version of Windows 7 - maybe your VPN software will work with that?

Or maybe it's worth it to buy a copy of Vista 32-bit and wipe out your 64-bit install. You'd lose access to some RAM (I presume your laptop has 4 GB?) but at least it would all work properly.

It really sucks how developers are dragging their asses getting 64-bit support out the door. Drives me nuts!

[Phillip Dyson]

I just discovered an old copy of Windows 2000. Perhaps I'll install that then put an XP Pro upgrade on top of that. Can I upgrade an OS inside of a virtualization?

[doogald]

I just discovered an old copy of Windows 2000. Perhaps I'll install that then put an XP Pro upgrade on top of that. Can I upgrade an OS inside of a virtualization?

Technically, yes. IIRC, Microsoft was playing games about licensing virtualized installs when Vista was first released, but I think removed that (if I recall correctly, only Ultimate was licensed to run in a VM when Vista was first released). XP never had any such restrictions. Technically, so far as the install of Windows is concerned, it will have no idea that it is running inside a virtual machine, and so long as you have activations available for the XP license, you will be all set that way. Legally, if that license of Win2000 is not legally available to install, you should not be installing it, but I'd be pretty secure in the fact that Microsoft will not be auditing you for valid licensing. (I'm pretty certain that Windows licensing works in such a manner that if you purchase a computer with a license of Windows, that OEM license in restricted to that piece of hardware - it cannot be transferred to another computer, unlike a copy of Windows purchased at retail, which may be transferred. Again, I wouldn't worry too much about it myself. And, of course, you cannot legally run the same copy of Win2000 in two different instances.)

[Phillip Dyson]

Thanks for the information. I tried to install Win2K and it kept failing on copying the Win2k.sys file. I finally bought the bullet and purchased a copy of Vista 32 home basic from NewEgg. Although based on what you said above I hope it will allow me to install it in VM when it arrives.

MS need not worry about me, I'm not trying to short circuit any licensing restrictions.

I did try an XP Home license just to make sure my VirtualBox install was okay and it installed just fine. Once that worked I deleted the VM since the license is on another machine.

On another note, the whole process seem relatively easy. It got me thinking about other OS's. Maybe I'll venture back to try a linux distro again. Maybe.

[doogald]

Thanks for the information. I tried to install Win2K and it kept failing on copying the Win2k.sys file. I finally bought the bullet and purchased a copy of Vista 32 home basic from NewEgg. Although based on what you said above I hope it will allow me to install it in VM when it arrives.

Again, that restriction was in EULA only. The install itself cannot tell that it is in a VM. And I am 100% certain that Microsoft removed that restriction anyway.

(Here (http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_licensing.asp) is a note from 2006 that discusses the virtualization licensing issues. And here (http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2008/01/microsoft-relents-vista-virtualization-ban-lifted.ars) is an article that suggests that Microsoft changed the policy and now allows home basic to be installed within a VM.)

On another note, the whole process seem relatively easy. It got me thinking about other OS's. Maybe I'll venture back to try a linux distro again. Maybe.

One warning about a Linux install (at least in my experience) is that there are certain drivers that all of the VMs provide that allow a certain communication and ease of use with the host system, and my experience with Ubuntu was that there was a pain-in-the-neck set of terminal commands you needed to run to get the drivers installed in Ubuntu. If you do go that route, let me know and I'll see if I can find those instructions.

[Phillip Dyson]

I successfully able to install Vista 32 Home Basic in VirtualBox. It seems to work just fine. I even have internet access.

I am for some reason not able to see the other computers on my network though. How am I able to get files into my VM?

Is there someway to setup a common space or folder between my VM and the host machine?

[doogald]

I successfully able to install Vista 32 Home Basic in VirtualBox. It seems to work just fine. I even have internet access.

I am for some reason not able to see the other computers on my network though. How am I able to get files into my VM?

Is there someway to setup a common space or folder between my VM and the host machine?

One way is to go shut down the VM and go into settings and change the network "attached to:" from the default "NAT" to "Bridged Adapter" (and then make sure that it connects to the proper network adapter - i.e., ethernet or wireless). When you restart your machine will be on the same LAN segment rather than sitting behind the equivalent of a NAT router (the default).

The other way is to go into "Shared Folders" and add a shared folder (on the host machine) that the VM can connect to - it will see it as a network shared folder inside the VM.

[Phillip Dyson]

I assume the shared folder on the host machine will be visible to everyone on the network. I would have expected that there was some way to configure common space between a host machine and the VMs running on it.

[doogald]

I assume the shared folder on the host machine will be visible to everyone on the network. I would have expected that there was some way to configure common space between a host machine and the VMs running on it.

No, if you use the shared folders setting it is private between the host and the VM. So you can create a folder on the host, set up the shared access, and then, even though it uses networking features of Windows (or Linux) to access the shared space, it does not require setting up sharing in the typical way on the host, and does not expose that folder to the network (if, of course, your machine is configured that way.)

But you did ask about seeing other computers on the network, so I gave you both options.

[Phillip Dyson]

I created a folder on my host c drive then added it as a shared folder in my VM. I still can't see it. Do I have to change the network adapter as well?

So far the adapter is still NAT and I don't seem to be able to get visibilty to the shared folder. Should I be seeing the host machine in the network window? At the moment I only see the VM.

Also, Is there a way to have the VM display in full screen?

thanks

[doogald]

First, you need to install the Guest Additions for these things to work. If it is not already installed, with the VM running Vista, go to the "Devices" menu and choose "Install Guest Additions". That will mount a CD image within the VM (which has an autorun.inf file, so if you have autorun disabled you'll need to manually start the app on the CD image) and install the drivers, etc., from the setup. You'll have to reboot the VM.

On a Mac, there are visual modes called "Full Screen" and "Seamless Mode" (you can read about them in the help file). I'd guess that the Windows version has the same options, but I'm really not sure.

[Phillip Dyson]

I installed the Additions and now see the "Seemless" option. It sounds cool. I'll check it out later.

I still can't get to the shared folder. I tried the help file and it didn't seem to ... uh help.

I created a older on my host. c:\vm-share
Then configured it under Devices>>Shared Folders.

The help file says to map a drive through Networks but I can only see my VM under Network. I still can't see my Host machine.

[doogald]

From the FAQ (http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/User_FAQ):

Windows Shared Folders
I cannot see my newly created shared folder under "My Network Places". Under Windows 2000 they're visible, but not under Windows XP / Windows Vista. This is because of the standard settings of these two.

To get it working the way it was, just do the following steps:

Open the Explorer
In the menu go to "Tools" and select "Folder Options"
Under tab "General" activate "Use Windows classic folders"
Now the "Entire Network" as well as the shared folder entries are visible again.

Of course, this seems to be a problem on Windows7 guests, which has removed Windows Classic Folders . . .

Also, this is from the help file:

In a Windows guest, starting with VirtualBox 1.5.0, shared folders are
browseable and are therefore visible in Windows Explorer. So, to attach the
host’s shared folder to your Windows guest, open Windows Explorer and look
for it under “My Networking Places” -> “Entire Network” -> “VirtualBox Shared
Folders”. By right-clicking on a shared folder and selecting “Map network drive”
from the menu that pops up, you can assign a drive letter to that shared folder.
Alternatively, on the Windows command line, use the following:

net use x: \\vboxsvr\sharename

While vboxsvr is a fixed name (note that vboxsrv would also work), replace
“x:“ with the drive letter that you want to use for the share, and sharename
with the share name specified with VBoxManage.

And I can confirm that this works perfectly from a command line in a Win7 Guest. (And, just to reinforce it, you use the "vboxsvr" as the computer name, not the name of your Windows host.)

[Phillip Dyson]

Just an update on my VM travels.
I have successfully gotten my VM to recongnize the shared folder on my host. The icon at the bottom even flickers when there is activity.

However, I don't know how I can access the folder from within the VM.