Buttons Or No Buttons?

[Jon Westfall]

<p><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/ppct/auto/1239212310.usr7.jpg" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /></p><p>My Matrix Pro Smartphone has 2, my Touch Pro has 1, and my T-Mobile Dash has none. What am I referring to? Hardware buttons that can be mapped to different features on a device (as opposed to those which are fixed in function, such as keyboards, power buttons, softkeys, etc..). Five years ago, it was pretty common to have 3-4 buttons on a device that the user could map to. Now you're lucky if you get one. While in many ways better touchscreen response or a full keyboard has reduced some of the need for these buttons, there are times I just wish I had a few more. So what's your opinion - more hardware buttons or is 0 the magic number?</p><p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarynlgh/3235077127/" target="_blank"><em>picture source</em></a></p>

[mr_yellow]

I miss my buttons (have an iphone now)...

Part of my WM reinstall is always to install hbutton from xda-devs... excellent tool to map several shortcuts to a single button.

I found i really only needed 2 at the max.. any more and I'd forget what was where.

The best (or worst) of hardkey remapping I had was when I had an old palm PDA and had remapped all 4 hardkeys to 3-4 apps each. short press, long press, double press, triple press...

Those were the days....

HButton - PocketPC Button Enhancer (http://hbutton.dyndns.org)

[superrrguy]

I don't like this move to all touch devices.

I thought MS was moving towards one handed devices and combining the Pro and Standard version of WinMo.

Now that the iPhone is king, everyone is trying to copy it. The iPhone is pretty great but most iPhone users would have bought what ever decent device Apple put out. Also at $200 there's no reason to come up with half witted versions for $300+. Plus another couple of bucks for expanding the memory. It's a joke.

MS and everyone are now adding swipes and flicks for the sake of swiping and flicking and MS device partners are taking away d-pads and buttons.

Let me say this again. Everyone that wants an iPhone has one. It's $200 with contract. It's a steal! Stop copying it and come up with your own intuitive system that doesn't need to be reset 12 times a day and does not lag for no reason.

I'm using an AT&T Tilt with a Hyperdragon ROM from September. All the newer ROMs have an updated version of PocketIE and it sucks! I like having buttons and I like setting them for long holds and double presses. I like the d-pad and single handed operation. The Tilt even has a jog wheel and two button on the side. By mapping them to the left & right soft keys I can do almost everything with one hand. Not only do I want buttons, but I wish double push and holding would be program specific so holding the Internet button would open up favorites and double pressing would go to the home page.

The default AT&T dialer is a joke and the buttons are too small. Also, most of the time I tap the screen one place and it highlights another part of the screen. Why the hell do they still have a useless tiny keyboard? The new honeycomb launcher is painful on the eyes. Half the time swiping cause the tap hold menu to pop up. Let's take away all the buttons and keep the same non responsive touch screen that was made to be used with a stylus. Also, what the hell is wrong with a stylus? No one has trouble with it on the DS?

I vote to keep buttons and d-pads but make the screens responsive enough for touch as well.

[Bob Anderson]

For all the buttons my XV6800 has, I can honestly say half of them could disappear and I wouldn't miss them. I rarely use the IE or Messages shortcut buttons, the "speak command" button or the wireless button. I do, however, use the phone on-hook/off-hook, windows key and "OK" button a lot.

I find myself poking options on the screen more and more. I don't know - is it because I started using these devices when there weren't as many buttons? Or am I just old fashioned and think I have to 'click' an icon on a screen to do something?

My vote goes to investing more in the user interface, making it easier to select things and making it faster with no delays or hesitations.

[Phillip Dyson]

The decrease of hardware buttons and the increase in multi-touch and other such gestures does seem to put the "one-handed operation" in jeapardy.

Can you browse efficiently on a device if the only way to zoom in and out is through multi-touch?

[Jason Dunn]

Coming from the Windows Mobile Standard world like I do, I really like buttons - namely, mapping applications to speed dial functions. I really like being able to press and hold the number nine to start the task manager, number five to start Windows Live search, etc. Having to do everything via navigation isn't efficient.

[superrrguy]

I also have WinMo Standard 6.1 on an old 3125 Str Trk and I really like it.

Everything on WinMo Pro seams like it requires an extra tap or two.

WinMo Standard 6.1 is way underrated.

One app that comes to mind is Google Maps. They've made the on screen icons for Pro larger but for some reason I always have to tap and tap and tap.

Don't take away the d-pads!

[Janak Parekh]

The decrease of hardware buttons and the increase in multi-touch and other such gestures does seem to put the "one-handed operation" in jeapardy. Why? That's only true if such gestures are required. On the iPhone, they're not.

Can you browse efficiently on a device if the only way to zoom in and out is through multi-touch? I almost never zoom using the "pinch" maneuver. Apple (and Palm, and I presume Opera) added a "double-tap" which zooms to the column you're tapping on.

In general, I preferred buttons on WM, but I did notice end-users were very inconsistent in button use, especially on WM Pro devices with the touch screen. Many of them would tap the screen instead of, say, scrolling using the d-pad between buttons on the dialog and clicking the middle to "hit" the button.

--janak

[Eriq Cook]

I miss buttons as well. Touch-screen is nice, but it's a balance between touch-screen and physical keyboard buttons that makes a perfect device IMO. I got so used to grabbing my smartphone and "feeling" for an application button I wanted to start. Now I have to take time to carefully look at the screen with most newer devices.

Don't manufacturers realize that some people like keyboards and buttons still? That will never go away--I hope!

[doogald]

Let me say this again. Everyone that wants an iPhone has one.

Except for me; my two year contract is up in December, and I don't feel like paying a fee to break it.

WinMo Standard 6.1 is way underrated.

It must be ten times better than Windows Mobile 6.0 Lame Edition then, which cannot search calendars(!), cannot set a category for calendar items(!!), cannot set, say, a 20 minutes alarm for an event(!!!), has a completely lame browser, has no copy/cut/paste. Etc.

What one finds beautiful another finds ugly.

[Phillip Dyson]

I almost never zoom using the "pinch" maneuver. Apple (and Palm, and I presume Opera) added a "double-tap" which zooms to the column you're tapping on.


That's a relief. That's been on my mind since I've seen people do the pinch.

[Adam Krebs]

I really, honestly like my iPhone, even though I hate nearly every decision Apple has made, ever. And I constantly find myself wishing for more buttons, for media player functions and text messaging especially. The Pre looks good because it's got a slide-out keyboard that stays hidden when you don't need it; why can't more manufacturers follow this path?

[superrrguy]

Except for me; my two year contract is up in December, and I don't feel like paying a fee to break it.

Understood, but are you going to buy some other touch screen device just because it also has swipes and flicks?

It must be ten times better than Windows Mobile 6.0 Lame Edition then, which cannot search calendars(!), cannot set a category for calendar items(!!), cannot set, say, a 20 minutes alarm for an event(!!!), has a completely lame browser, has no copy/cut/paste. Etc.

What one finds beautiful another finds ugly.

6.1 is not great but it not as bad as 5.0/6.0 and deserves a mention when deciding which platform to go with. I don't even hear WinMo as an option in my circles anymore. M$ has changed the name so many times, consumers I talk to don't know what it is at all. It's hard to say how much better it is since I thought 6.0 was the same as 5.0 which was pretty bad. All my friends jumped ship at 5.0.

6.1 added threaded messaging and filtering in most pim apps. More importantly since this is a buttons thread, there are hotkeys for most functions like reply, forward, mark as read, etc. 6.1 Standard also added copy/cut/paste although it's by by choosing menu after menu, after menu but it works. I use 3rd party apps for tasks, notes, and search. Thanks Microsoft. Pocket IE works great for mobile sites. I even use it on my Pro device for most browsing.

Anyway, I was just trying to say I like d-pads. I like jog wheels. I like having some app buttons.

[Jon Westfall]

I really, honestly like my iPhone, even though I hate nearly every decision Apple has made, ever.

Wow, amidst the discussion on buttons, an interesting insight into Apple. Their products are alluring even when one dislikes the company. Whatever else people may say, I suppose this is a nod to their designers and engineers (rather than their leaders).

Great feedback everyone - I have a love/hate relationship with buttons. When I've taken the time to map them out just right, I love them. The rest of the time, they simply take up space.

Best button mod I ever saw, come to think of it, was SmartSKeys on my K-JAM, turning the softkeys into long-press action buttons for start and close. In a time before dedicated Start menu buttons...

[eagle63]

So the Touch Pro has a "home" and "back" button right? I assume those buttons are really only applicable to TouchFlo 3D. So if you disable TF3D you can't remap those buttons to, say, the start button and close button? That's lame. I assume you could with 3rd party software.... ?

[Phillip Dyson]

So the Touch Pro has a "home" and "back" button right? I assume those buttons are really only applicable to TouchFlo 3D. So if you disable TF3D you can't remap those buttons to, say, the start button and close button? That's lame. I assume you could with 3rd party software.... ?

The "home" button would probably map to the required "Windows" button for WM6.5. I don't remember if a back button is required by Microsoft.

[doogald]

Understood, but are you going to buy some other touch screen device just because it also has swipes and flicks?

Since I use Macs, since I have a Mobile Me account, since AT&T is the only company with a 3G signal at my house - it just makes more sense for me to go with an iPhone. (Because my current phone is with Verizon and they do not like WiFi for some reason, that will be an additional bonus while at home - I can do data over WiFi much of the time that I cannot now.)

I will say that I am much happier with WM when I discovered NuevaSync and realized that I could keep the phone updated with current info over the air rather than syncing with the Mac. I just could not get any Mac syncing app to work reliably. The "Missing Sync" is aptly named, at least in my case (many people have good luck with it - I simply never did.)

As for the original question, even back in the Pocket PC days I was happy to have hardware buttons, and I do use the few that I have in WM Standard. I think in WM's case that they are important, so long as their inclusion does not make usability awkward.

[marlof]

I want buttons, and I want a lot of them. Ever since I used a Treo I've fallen for the formfactor of a nice screen with a qwerty keyboard on the front. The Palm Pre looks to be a nice solution: one handed typing, but still a large screen. Hmmmm.....

[Reid Kistler]

Find that I miss the Application Buttons more than expected.
For example: on the Axim, pressing the Calendar Button turns the device on & navigates to PI's Calendar screen.

Find myself pressing either the Home or Phone (talk) buttons on the Fuze, expecting SOMETHING to happen - then sighing & finding the Power Button....:(

[Curiosity]

A few years ago, I saw an ad for a digital music player. I commented that I didn't think it would work if there was a device that can do music as well as a number of other features (PDA's). That device I dismissed was the Ipod. I learned that I am not the typical user. As I help my family and my wife's family with gadgets, I find that they are the typical users. Simplicity which stems from convenience is the key. So when I say that I really want mappable buttons and a dpad, I figure that it's not what most people want. While I wish AT&T will have my ideal device (I am in the market to replace my old 8125), I'm figuring that they will be moving away from my ideal device to one that everyone else wants. So I'll have to compromise or pay double to triple of a subsidized phone to get what I want.

[Janak Parekh]

That's a relief. That's been on my mind since I've seen people do the pinch. A surprising number of people don't know about double-tap, and even those who do seem to be enthralled with the concept of pinching and continue to do that. ;)

In general, the iPhone is eminently one-handable. I can typically turn on, unlock, and launch the phone or ipod apps without even looking. (Of course, at that point I must look.)

--janak

[UCCOFFEE]

it's getting worse.... no buttons is just a NO for WM PRO!!! !
if I want minimal buttons , i ll get a iphone!!!!
if I want more buttons, i ll get a RIM or a WM standard.

I wont get a WM with 0 buttons, I still remember when I upgrade my Jam to Jamin , just becos of the 2 extra buttons! I got a diamond now becos I want to have 3.5G , but I still think it's not as good as my jamin becos the diamond 's lag of hardware buttons.

Diamond 2 is coming out with even less buttons and NO navigation pad!

Maybe should get a ASUS WM next time or change to a iphone ....
WM Pro with no navigation pad and no customizable hardware buttons is just not for me.

[Menneisyys]

[QUOTE=superrrguy;705714]I'm using an AT&T Tilt with a Hyperdragon ROM from September. All the newer ROMs have an updated version of PocketIE and it sucks!

You mean IEM6 alpha? Just tell the cooker not to put IEM6 in it. (It indeed sucks - see my dedicated article if interested: http://forums.thoughtsmedia.com/f323/full-roundup-browsing-web-windows-mobile-just-like-iphone-incl-iem6-review-91980.html .)

I wish double push and holding would be program specific so holding the Internet button would open up favorites and double pressing would go to the home page.

Use an IEM plug-in with button hold functionality - IIRC, both PIEPlus and MultiIE are capable of this. (Also see my dedicated reviews & comparisons - there, I've elaborated on this q too.)


I vote to keep buttons and d-pads but make the screens responsive enough for touch as well.


I'm afraid you'll need to wait for capacitive screens to arrive - resistive screens are a real pain in the back; they're the sole reason I've switched to using the (capacitive) iPhone 3G for casual Web browsing.

[Menneisyys]

I really miss buttons and, even more, decent D-pads on the newer devices. For example, the Toshiba TG01 would be an excellent gaming machine (very fast, 3G hardware acceleration etc) with a D-pad and some additional buttons.

Too bad most legacy WinMo games are based on the existence of the D-pad and only vewy few, new titles can be controlled with touch (for example, Gameloft's Prince of Persia HD). The situation is different on the iPhone, where every game/emulator has been created keeping touch-only in mind, using the accelerometer and/or on-screen tap areas/buttons. Legacy games on WinMo doesn't have this (either).

[superrrguy]

[QUOTE=superrrguy;705714]

You mean IEM6 alpha? Just tell the cooker not to put IEM6 in it. (It indeed sucks - see my dedicated article if interested: http://forums.thoughtsmedia.com/f323/full-roundup-browsing-web-windows-mobile-just-like-iphone-incl-iem6-review-91980.html .)


Use an IEM plug-in with button hold functionality - IIRC, both PIEPlus and MultiIE are capable of this. (Also see my dedicated reviews & comparisons - there, I've elaborated on this q too.)


I'm afraid you'll need to wait for capacitive screens to arrive - resistive screens are a real pain in the back; they're the sole reason I've switched to using the (capacitive) iPhone 3G for casual Web browsing.


Thanks for the info!

I didn't know I could set PIE specific buttons with PIEPlus or MultiIE.