My Digital Wall Audio Conundrum: Powered or Non-Powered Speakers?

[Jason Dunn]

<p>My <a href="http://www.digitalhomethoughts.com/news/show/89831/i-m-doing-a-digital-wall-upgrade-suggestions-welcome.html" target="_blank">digital wall project</a> continues, inch by inch, but I've run into a bit of a snag: I'm having a hard time deciding on which type of audio implementation would be the best fit. As a refresher, here's how the wall looks today (the electrician hasn't come yet):</p><p><img border="1" height="402" src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/dht/auto/1214882527.usr1.jpg" width="600" /></p><p>The question is, what's the best audio solution? The LG plasma TV I picked looks gorgeous hanging on a wall, so I didn't entertain the notion of putting one of those surround-sound bars on the bottom for more than a nanosecond - that would just look hideous. I briefly pondered trying to get a 5.1 system set up, but that didn't last long: having to hack into my ceiling for the rear channels would be messy, and since this isn't the primary movie-watching location in my house, it's overkill. There's also the question of where to put the centre channel. So I settled on a 2.1 system, which will be much easier to wire. Ah, wires! I want no wires to be visible when looking at this wall, so I have to be smart about how I position the speakers.</p><p>I also have to take into account two audio sources: the <a href="http://www.digitalhomethoughts.com/news/show/90094/dell-launches-studio-hybrid-desktops.html" target="_blank">Dell Studio Hybrid Desktop</a> that I ordered a few days ago, which will play DVDs and videos off the network, and the Roku networked media player, which will be the primary source for music. Why not do everything through one player? The Roku is incredibly reliable, simple, and very fast to get going. The thought of powering up a computer, and turning on a plasma TV just to play some music strikes me as incredibly inefficient. So two audio sources it is.<MORE /></p><p>The question then is what's the best 2.1 system for my needs? Two choices immediately sprang to mind: choice one is a set of powered <a href="http://audioengineusa.com/store/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=&amp;products_id=77&amp;osCsid=aa83395158ab303026a25b47c5b545c6" target="_blank">Audioengine A5 speakers</a>, <a href="http://www.digitalhomethoughts.com/news/show/31342/the-sweet-sound-of-audioengine-a5-speakers.html" target="_blank">which I really liked</a> and I know would do a great job. I'd likely pair them with a sub-woofer (maybe the <a href="http://audioengineusa.com/store/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=&amp;products_id=81&amp;osCsid=bc800e743f1b2146c4a921df2180710e" target="_blank">Audioengine AS8</a>), and because the A5's have two inputs, they'll work for my needs. One issue is that the A5's have one input on the back, and one on the top. I think I can get around the problem of having a cable sticking out the top by getting an L-shaped cable, something that would connect to the top then go immediately flat. Any suggestions for something like that? I've seen them, and I have a short version, so I just need to track one down that's long enough. Having to run power to the speaker won't be much of a problem because I'll be putting the A5 speaker with the amp in it on the right side, which will be the location of the conduit - so I'll just have to get a panel to either run power directly off of, or a connection to the conduit so I can drop the power cable down to the bottom port. Both the Roku and the Dell desktop will be on the right side of the wall, so I won't have to worry about running more than one cable to the left side of the wall.</p><p>The second choice would be to get a set of <a href="http://www.orbaudio.com" target="_blank">Orb Audio speakers</a>. Orb speakers sound great, and are very small - the size appealed to me because the A5's are going to stand out on the wall due to their size. Unfortunately, because the Orb Audio speakers aren't powered, that means I'd need to get an amp - and we all know how big your average amp is: huge. I thought I'd heard about small amps designed for connecting to a PC that are essentially external sound cards designed to run non-powered speakers, but I haven't been able to find anything in my searches. What I really want is a sub-woofer that has a built-in amp to power speakers - any suggestions on that front?</p><p>Ultimately I'm leaning pretty strongly toward the Audioengine A5 speakers - since 90% of the audio being played will be music, I think they'll deliver better overall sound than the Orb Audio speakers, and with the A5's I have less complexity because I don't need an amp. I haven't made any final decisions yet though, so I welcome any suggestions the Digital Home Thoughts community might have.</p><p><strong>UPDATE:</strong> The digital wall project is complete. <a href="http://www.digitalhomethoughts.com/news/show/93858/the-digital-wall-project-an-epic-tale.html" target="_blank">Read all about it!</a></p><p><em>Jason Dunn owns and operates <a href="http://www.thoughtsmedia.com" target="_blank">Thoughts Media Inc.</a>, a company dedicated to creating the best in online communities. He enjoys <a href="http://photos.jasondunn.com/" target="_blank">photography</a>, mobile devices, <a href="http://www.jasondunn.com" target="_blank">blogging</a>, digital media content creation/editing, and pretty much all technology. He lives in Calgary, Alberta, Canada with his lovely wife, and his sometimes obedient dog. He's really hoping this digital wall project turns out as nice as it looks in his head.</em></p>

[mrozema]

Jason,
I don't know if this is too low power for the Orb speakers, but here's a very small power amplifier from Extron. Easy to hide and only does exactly what you want it to. That is, power a set of speakers.

http://www.extron.com/product/product.aspx?id=mpa122&subtype=110

[timmy]

These might be expensive, but they sound really sweet and are small (if that's one of your parameters). I have listened to them in a store and was impressed!

http://www.bang-olufsen.com/page.asp?id=38

http://www.bang-olufsen.com/page.asp?id=41

B&O's are active speakers, with the amp placed inside the speaker.

When it comes to cables, go for hollow baseboards (I think the name is).

Something like this (all in Swedish but you get the idea):

http://www.kanallisten.com/listig_funktion.htm

[Jason Dunn]

I don't know if this is too low power for the Orb speakers, but here's a very small power amplifier from Extron.

Thanks - man, that's ugly! :eek: At least I know there's something out there that does what I want...

[Jason Dunn]

These might be expensive, but they sound really sweet and are small (if that's one of your parameters). I have listened to them in a store and was impressed!

Hehe...thanks for the suggestion, but the day I spend money on B&O's overpriced stuff is the day someone should smack me over the head with a shovel because I must have too much money. :rolleyes: Those speakers are $3200 - that's more than I paid for the 50" plasma TV that's going to hang on the wall. There are no speakers that size on the planet worth $3200. :)

When it comes to cables, go for hollow baseboards (I think the name is).

We're already ripping up the drywall to wire in the TV/audio wiring, so I don't need to go the baseboard route thankfully...

[waverlyn]

How about the Mackie MR8?

http://www.mackie.com/products/studiomonitors/index.html

w.

[The Yaz]

Jason,

SInce you are going to be cutting into the wallboard already, I would suggest opening your speaker search to in-wall spaekers. Four years ago we remodeled our living room and installed four of them (2+2). I even was able to mount the wires to a connection panel in the wall for easy connection behind the wall unit.

I found this website http://www.outdoorspeakerdepot.com/in-ceiling-in-wall-speakers.html

Its caters to Canadian and European customers (What's their problem with the USA!). The neat thing on their site is that they have in-wall subwoofers.

It might be a neat option if you could make it work...

I know my wife appreciated the elimination of the wires as well!

Steve

[bcre8v2]

"The Yaz" has a really good point regarding in-the-wall speakers.

Another option is to create a "box and shelf" effect within the walls that you're opening.

Since most walls are roughly 3" (7.5 cm) thick /wide, you can created an embedded shelf between studs that will support lighter weight speakers such as the Bose, etc. The speaker connections can be flush against the inside part of the compartment.

This embedded shelf doesn't need to be much bigger than 14" x 14" on each side of the plasma display. It will also give you extra room for knick-knacks (sp?) or flower vases (hint: spousal approval factor taken into consideration).

Something along these lines:
http://www.ronhazelton.com/howto/recessed_shelves.htm

[Jason Dunn]

How about the Mackie MR8?

Mackie definitely makes some great stuff, although I haven't heard their MR8 speakers. I had a hard time finding the prices on them - looks like they're $250 per speaker, so it would run me $500 for a pair. Not too bad, but nearly double what I'd pay for the Audioengine A5's. The MR8's are designed more to be studio reference monitors as well - the inputs are balanced XLR, TRS and unbalanced RCA inputs. Ultimately I need to get down to two 3.5mm jacks (or maybe one RCA and one 3.5mm), so I'd need to use a couple of adaptors. I'm not even sure if I can get XLR inputs down to 3.5mm or RCA...

So I don't think these would be a good fit. Thanks though!

[Jason Dunn]

SInce you are going to be cutting into the wallboard already, I would suggest opening your speaker search to in-wall spaekers.

Thanks for the suggestion, but what I didn't mention is that this it my outside wall, and in Calgary the temperature in the winter can easily get down to -50 Celsius with wind chill. Cutting 8-10" into my outer wall would lose me a lot of insulation...so that was off the table pretty quick. I love the idea of in-wall speakers, but I think I'd have to have built my wall specifically for that back when the house was being built.

[Jason Dunn]

Another option is to create a "box and shelf" effect within the walls that you're opening.

It's a neat idea, but I think I'll have same problem with losing my insulation, right? That's the tough part - we'll be moving a bit of the insulation around to run the conduit, but ultimately putting most of it back and re-sealing the vapour barrier.

And remember I'm going to have shelves on either side, kind of like this:

<IMG SRC="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/dht/auto/1214883320.usr1.jpg">

[timmy]

Hm, when you showed the picture of the shelves, I came to think about these Bose speakers:

http://www.bose.ca/controller?event=VIEW_PRODUCT_PAGE_EVENT&product=am5_virtuallyinvisible_index

Wouldn't they blend in perfectly in a shelf like that?

[mrozema]

Cutting 8-10" into my outer wall would lose me a lot of insulation...so that was off the table pretty quick.

***long quote trimmed by mod JD***

Not to mention that you don't have 8-10" in a 2x6 studded wall.

[mrozema]

Thanks - man, that's ugly! :eek: At least I know there's something out there that does what I want...

It sure isn't pretty and I don't think its meant to be put on display. Its there to do a job and be hidden away.

[leslietroyer]

I have four Niles 650 inwall for my living room - movies and music. I really like them. Three are on outside walls I haven't noticed cold problem, but it is fairly mild here in Seattle. The one inside wall -- I stuffed insulation above and below, worked great. When listining to 60's-70's cd's the kids yell at me to turn it down -- so they can pump out the volume (wife can here it turning into the driveway ~ 500' away.

I put in custom 6" cherry baseboards, with a wireway routed in the back. For the inwall I just cut a 2x3" hole at the bottom of the drywall, used a fiberglass fishrod to pull the wires up from the base board & Screwed the drywall back in place. No need to refinish because the baseboards cover everything up.

I put JBL's in the kitchen ceiling -- they don't sound nearly as good as the Niles..

[Jason Dunn]

The digital wall project is finished!

http://www.digitalhomethoughts.com/news/show/93858/