How can I reserve static IP's with XP Internet Connection Sharing?

[Joelacrane]

Hey, whats up? I have a question. I have a small home network, but no DSL or Cable. Dial-up is all that is avalible. I figured out how to share it across my network years ago, and it works fairly well.

Windows XP's Internet Connection Sharing becomes a DHCP server, but that causes problems when my router also wants to be the server. To fix the problem, I have to disable DHCP on my router, and then everything works just fine, except for one thing.

I cannot access my router setup, even if i change the IP to 192.168.1.1, 192.168.0.201, or 192.168.0.256. Every time I want to adjust something on the router, i have to unplug the ICS Server, reset my router to factory, and then reconfigure the entire thing before disable DHCP and plugging my server back in. What a pain, especially when i need to adjust channel numbers and play with encryption options.

Is there a way to configure ICS to reserve a static ip for my router? I've read that you can do it with Windows 98se, Mistake Edition, and 2000, but the instructions (registry hacks) just have no effect in Windows XP, and the article does not claim compatiblilty with XP.

A little help?

Oh, and this is directly related to Windows Mobile. Trust me.

[Cybrid]

What's the physical configuration? A PC gateway with modem, providing an ethernet connection to the router...which then shares to other PC's?
or Modem to router to PC's?

[Joelacrane]

Mom doesn't like ethernet cables running around, so the ICS Server is connected to a router wirelessly. One client is wired, and the other 3 clients are connected wirelessly. All of my computers are running Windows XP, except one that that dual boots Ubuntu Linux.

PCI 56k modem -> ICS Server/Gateway -> Wirelessly connects to -> Router -> All other computers.

As far as I know of, you can't buy standalone 56k modems, so it has to be a computer sharing the connection.

[Cybrid]

PCI 56k modem -> ICS Server/Gateway -> Wirelessly connects to -> Router -> All other computers.
Thats where your problem lies. Basically your router is acting as an AP. As a radio only but not as a router. Ethernet connections need to be in an "arm-like" configuration. Your ISP is the arm...which terminates at the wrist (router) and spreads out to fingers (PC's). I'm assuming the PC ICS Server/Gateway is using bridged connections. (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/networking/expert/crawford_02april22.mspx)
Move your router to the gateway and use a short Ethernet cable...If the box is on top of the server...little or no cable will show...
or
If you have a decent PCI adapter, connect directly to the gateway. See the bridge networks model. The PC will act as router.
or for a real superb job....
NoCatAuth (http://www.wi-fiplanet.com/tutorials/article.php/3286631) which is a linux version...again something I haven't tried.



As far as I know of, you can't buy standalone 56k modems (http://www.google.com/products?q=56k+modem+external&btnG=Search+Products) Young whippersnapper :D This however requires a router capable of serial port connections...Possibly rarer still. 8O

[Joelacrane]

As far as I know of...

See I did say that I wasn't sure! I'm afraid that a dial-up modem would just kinda be a waste of money at this point in time, thanks for pointing it out though.

Your hands and fingers thing makes sense, but I do not understand a couple of things about it. First off, how does it relate to IP addressing? Secondly, I guess I thought that my wireless connection was pretty much the same thing as an Ethernet connection, just, uh... without the cable. How does THAT relate to IP addressing?

I apologize, I'm still pretty new to networking, I've only set up 3 home networks, but the other two were very simple as I didn't have to deal with ICS.

As a young whippersnapper, I humbly seek information.

[Cybrid]

Ok. I'm no expert so this may contain inaccurate, simplistic examples or information. Anyone feel free to correct me.

Simplest way to connect two PC's is with a direct cable but with multiple PC's you'd need too many interconnections...so...they made a hub (looks like a router but just all ports are wired to each other, any data sent is received by all). Problems arise with "what if all the PC's talk all at once?" called a collision.

They built switches and made the PC's talk in short bursts called packets. Imagine a traffic cop directing traffic (cars=packets). The switch gives all the PC's a chance to talk. A packet has a header like an envelope which encapsulates the actual data. The outside of an envelope...must have an address. Who is it for? And what about traffic jams?

To get a PC to address another PC specifically versus all , the PC needs a name "Hey Bob".... Internet Protocol Address is basically a name. www.a nything.com is sent to a domain name registrar server that looks up that record and matches it to a server xxx.xxx.xxx The IP.v4 spec allows 1.1.1.1 to 254.254.254.254 as IP address names. There are ranges (blocks of #'s) that are assigned or bought 192.168.x.x are reserved for private network names.

Since theres a lot of people with PC's...The names get recycled...192.168.1.1 is a very common name. How many Joel's in the phone book?

Routers are like intelligent switches. On the WAN (internet side) they accept a name. Say 10.137.168.32 then on the LAN they assign 192.168.1.2 or 192.168.1.254 (253 #'s). The traffic cop looks at the header and say's "turn left...you'll get there quicker".

Imagine a tree, every place there's a fork... a router,
So a packet heading to 10.201.13.137
goes to router 10 (it oversees range 10.x.x.x that sends it to router 201 (oversees range 10.201.x.x) that routes it to 13 (oversees range 10.201.13.x) to router or PC 137. If router, it renames the header to 192.168.1.100 (your PC)...It's what makes the internet work.

How that's a problem for you. Your router will only accept a name from it's WAN port. Not the LAN port or wireless (wireless=WLAN)...so you could plug the ICS server into the router WAN and have the router work (hide the small cable by having them next to each other)
or

since ICS essentially makes your PC the router, if the PCI WLAN adapter in the ICS gateway PC is powerful enough...skip the router. HTH :?

[Joelacrane]

A lot of that I already knew, but you filled in some gaps for me.

I didn't realize that the WAN port was significantly different. Are you saying that I can plug my router into my ICS server using the WAN port, and It will accept an IP address from ICS and then still assign IP addresses to all of my computers without complaint?

I can't try it now, I have to jet off to work.

I should have just bought a cheap hub and access point, but when I bought the router, I knew nothing about networking. I learned what I know simply by messing with it and asking questions here on PPC Thoughts.

Thanks a ton cybrid, how many times have you totally solved my problems now?

[Cybrid]

Are you saying that I can plug my router into my ICS server using the WAN port, and It will accept an IP address from ICS and then still assign IP addresses to all of my computers without complaint?Yep.

[Joelacrane]

Wow, that is ridiculously simple. I'll try it as soon as i get home.

[Joelacrane]

Ok, i plugged everything in and the router is getting an IP like it should, but i cant use the net or terminal services. File shares dont show either.

[Cybrid]

Ok, i plugged everything in and the router is getting an IP like it should, but i cant use the net or terminal services. File shares dont show either.Try opening port 80 (Web), (Terminal Services) 3389, I'll have to look up the rest.

[Joelacrane]

Ok, I opened up both of those ports and I am now successfully using the internet with one of my clients.

Remote Desktop, however, still does not work. It has to work, because this computer has no physical terminal. In order to save some space I just let it sit by its self. The computer doesn't mind booting without a keyboard or mouse. I use Terminal Services/Remote Desktop to log if I ever need to.

(That was a problem in itself, because you have to password your user account to use Terminal Services, AND you have to log in before Windows starts the TS service. A little registry tweak and now it just logs in automatically.

BTW, this computer is also my little web server. I can log in with the Terminal Services Web client and host a few pictures and things like that. Kinda nifty, but slow over dial-up. Its more for "Lets see if i can do it" than anything else.)

I'll do some reading today to try to figure it out.

[burtcom]

Remote Desktop also has it port or ports that have to be open -- I can't recall what they are, but some google-fu should tell you :)

[Joelacrane]

Well I am really learning about networks this weekend!

Ok, so here is where I am at right now. At the moment I am happily surfing the net from my couch. My ICS Server is plugged into my Router. My router's WAN IP is 192.168.0.170 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0. Over on the LAN side, it is 192.68.0.1 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0. For some reason I thought the subnet mask was supposed to be different.

It seems to be working fine, except that now, my Server acts like it is on a totally different network. Remote Desktop doesnt work, file and print sharing dont work either. This is a problem! How can I bring the two "networks" together?

I have opened the correct port for Remote Desktop and It just isn't working.

Now I COULD do away with the router, buy me a hub and AP and just do it right, but with the possibility of high speed avaliblility looming around the corner, i do not want to waste my hard earned cash (I'd rather buy memory cards for my Axim).

[Cybrid]

Well I am really learning about networks this weekend!

Ok, so here is where I am at right now. At the moment I am happily surfing the net from my couch. My ICS Server is plugged into my Router. My router's WAN IP is 192.168.0.170 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0. Over on the LAN side, it is 192.68.0.1 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0. For some reason I thought the subnet mask was supposed to be different.

It seems to be working fine, except that now, my Server acts like it is on a totally different network. Remote Desktop doesnt work, file and print sharing dont work either. This is a problem! How can I bring the two "networks" together?

I have opened the correct port for Remote Desktop and It just isn't working.

Now I COULD do away with the router, buy me a hub and AP and just do it right, but with the possibility of high speed avaliblility looming around the corner, i do not want to waste my hard earned cash (I'd rather buy memory cards for my Axim).
Is WAN and LAN both 192.168.0.x? It's likely that, your ICS server is also 192.168.0.1 thus the conflict? Make the LAN 192.168.10.x or different.

Technically it is a different network now. Can you ping it?

3389 is the remote desktop port. Google VPN, GRE47...Al Jarvi (http://theillustratednetwork.mvps.org/WM2003/WM2003PPTPVPN.html)...This is uncharted territory for me. You'll need to set it up as if the remote desktop was over internet.

DID you try directly connecting to your ICS servers WLAN adapter?

[Joelacrane]

Yes, both my WAN and LAN are 192.168.0.x. I can change my routers IP address to 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.0.2 (Thats what it is now) and I can only tell my router to assign 192.168.0.x addresses, "x" being the only number I can edit.

I'm not sure what you meant by connecting directly to the WLAN card. I can't really connect to it (Whatever that means) because if both my Ethernet and Wireless adapters are enabled at the same time, the IP address for my Wireless card is <unavalible>. (Which I would assume means 192.168.0.1, or whatever IP the Ethernet card is)

Cybrid, you have been very patient and informative, I really REALLY appriciate all the help you have given my since I joined this forum.

[Cybrid]

Yes, both my WAN and LAN are 192.168.0.x. I can change my routers IP address to 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.0.2 (Thats what it is now) and I can only tell my router to assign 192.168.0.x addresses, "x" being the only number I can edit. The router can actually assign x.x.x.1-254 but you can rename that part of the LAN (x.x.x ) on the router.. What model? I'll look it up. I'll read through it and give you clearer instructions.


I'm not sure what you meant by connecting directly to the WLAN card. I can't really connect to it (Whatever that means) because if both my Ethernet and Wireless adapters are enabled at the same time, the IP address for my Wireless card is <unavalible>. (Which I would assume means 192.168.0.1, or whatever IP the Ethernet card is) Let's start fresh. With your PC acting as a bridge, you don't need a router since the PC is taking part of that workload.
Remember in your original setup, you had gateway -->wirelessly-->router-->other PC's?
What you could do as alternatives physically.
a) what we're doing now
or
b) gateway-->other PC's (may require static ip's) Did you try that before putting a router in the mix? If you did and it didn't work well, then we can skip to the rest.


Once you give the model # of your router, I'll explain how to progress.





Cybrid, you have been very patient and informative, I really REALLY appriciate all the help you have given my since I joined this forum.
Relax, Someday some kid might be asking you for help... :lol:
Make sure you do your best. K?

[Joelacrane]

The router is an old D-link DI-524+ Revision A, Firmware version 1.5, which is the latest.

I never did try option (b), because when I decided to try networking, I bought the router and NICs at the same time. I don't see how it would work, since I can't assign IP addresses myself. Microsoft, I love and hate you.

If you like reading, I asked this question over at www.ninja250.org, its a Ninja 250 forum (I have a bike), and, well, even motorcycle forums have to have admins. :)

http://forums.ninja250.org/viewtopic.php?p=577841#577841

If it looks like too much dont worry about reading it all.

[Cybrid]

Ok. I'm going to go test my theory and report back in a few days. Time permitting, I'll be able to give you a how-to by Sunday.

[Joelacrane]

Ok, some very weird developments. I went to fire up my axim and it didnt want an IP address, so i went into the WLAN utility to renew it, and when I did, it was 192.168.1.5. Huh? I checked my desktop, and it is 192.168.1.3!

Simply changing the router's I.P. to 192.168.1.1 and waiting a few days caused it to flop over to assigning 192.168.1.x IPs.

So then, I boot to Ubuntu Linux to do some... stuff. I decide to try logging into RD with Linux's RD client. I typed in 192.168.0.1, and it couldn't find the server, so i tried "Server" and... it worked!

Strange!

So i boot back to Windows XP and open Explorer. In the address bar i typed "\\Server" and it worked. I brought the share up! The shares didn't want to show up in My Network Places, so i just added them manually.

It even works with "server" in Windows' Remote Desktop client instead of 192.168.0.1 like before. I don't know why, but everything works absolutely flawlessly now.

Thanks Cybrid! Your "plug it into the WAN port" worked, it just took awhile to kick in.

Now if only I could get my FTP server running... :wink:

[Nurhisham Hussein]

Try checking the domain name on the PCs - make sure they're all the same. It's not something that you need to worry about on your Axim though (not that you can change it anyway!).

[Cybrid]

Thanks Cybrid! Your "plug it into the WAN port" worked, it just took awhile to kick in.
Hmmm...That's good news. I think the reason it took some time is that bridging works on the broadcast principle. Basically any message is shouted out, and then the server waits for any PC to answer than logs the MAC address, IP in a file which it later uses to refer directly to that PC. Now that the routing table has updated....and all the machines booted...it came back to normal...sort of...
The reason manually addressing 192.168.0.1 doesn't work is it is now a different network. But server is accessible through the ports that are open. It's the same way internet addresses work except since its the gateway, when the request goes out...It replies.
I'd have to say...with my limited understanding of the simple basics of networking principle...We got real lucky. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Now if only I could get my FTP server running... :wink: I know nuttin' about FTP. You'll need to figure that out without me.

[Cybrid]

I should mention also, that your server is technically accessible through the internet. Since you're on dialup and are not on a static IP, you should be ok...but a decent software Firewall and upto date antivirus, anti-adware, anti spyware set up is now high priority.
When youre DSL line is up, reconfigure
DSL bridge/modem -->router (block WAN side ping/close ports 80,3389)--->Server (undo bridging)/other PC's
Opening ports allows people to look in but it shouldn't affect outgoing or internal traffic to close them.

[Joelacrane]

Your networking knowledge goes far far beyond my own. You were very helpful.

If/when I get DSL, i figured I'd just plug in my modem, change my IP address on my router back to 192.168.0.1, set Server up with a static IP, and then set that IP as a DMZ (De-militarized zone).

Ok, so, I'll install Ad-aware, AVG Free... are there any really good freeware firewalls out there?

Man, I really need to find a good book that explains networking and domain names. I have never fully understood the differences between domain names and workgroups.

Thanks again Cybrid!

[Cybrid]

If/when I get DSL, i figured I'd just plug in my modem, change my IP address on my router back to 192.168.0.1, set Server up with a static IP, and then set that IP as a DMZ (De-militarized zone).

Man, I really need to find a good book that explains networking and domain names. I have never fully understood the differences between domain names and workgroups.

Thanks again Cybrid!Now you're pulling my leg. :lol: Setting a static ip server on the DMZ...You'd get hacked fast. Dunno about workgroups but a Domain Name is easy. Registrars match your server IP to a record and a Domain Name. when you type the name www.google.ca your ISP looks it up in the registrar and then forward the request to the appropriate IP 64.68.82.1 64.68.82.80 . Try Arin Whois or http://www.ip-adress.com/ for some other fun ones.

[Joelacrane]

Haha, ok, bad idea. I wont do that then... Thats a ways off anyway. I think for now we are just going to get an Edge card and a little PCI to PCMCIA adapter, so everything will remain pretty much the same. 50 bucks a month from Cingular, they claim 60-100kbps, thats much better than what we have now.

DSL and cable are still about 8 miles away.