Is USB the Only Computing Standard That Works?

[Jonathon Watkins]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26642' target='_blank'>http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26642</a><br /><br /></div><i>"There's only been one standard in the PC industry that has survived and thrived over the past decade– Universal Serial Bus, good old USB. . . . Openness has lead developers to build everything from flash memory sticks/keys to silly things like a USB-powered toothbrush. At the same time, people have stuck to the standard in a disciplined fashion without breaking it. Compare that to the freewheeling OS Linux crowd with multi-flavored "distributions" and it becomes apparent that a little too much freedom can be a bad thing. Perhaps more importantly, vendors have taken the original standard and extended it beyond USB 2.0 into two different paths. USB On-the-Go shrinks down the connector size and implements low-power features so it is easier to implement USB into portable devices, but the big wave will be to move everything into Wireless USB."</i><br /><br />Controversial? The Inquirer does try. :) But, can you name another surviving and thriving PC standard that has stood the test of time? Perhaps I'm jaded, but one of the more interesting recent hardware changes has been the move to mini USB instead of using proprietary connectors. This has not gone unnoticed. The Consumer Electronics Association are working on a industry-wide common connector for charging and synchronising future mobiles devices and Mini-USB <a href="http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=1479">may well be that future standard</a>. Whenever I travel I currently have to take a rat's nest of connecter and charging cables and anything to reduce that would be appreciated. It would be wonderful to freely interchange cables, connectors and peripherals. Ah, the blessing of standards. Ironically the restrictions they bring can grant consumers greater freedom. At this point should I mention the benefits to Europe of the common GSM mobile telephone standard? ;-) Now, if only someone would set SD as the common media card standard across all mobile devices. . . :grumble:

[deich]

But, can you name another surviving and thriving PC standard that has stood the test of time?

Some people might consider this post "off topic", but since you asked ...

Several standards have faired as well as USB or even better. The great grandaddy is Ethernet, which started out as thick and thin coax, then went to 10 MBPS twisted pair, then 100 MBPS twisted pair with CAT 4 or CAT 5 cable. We will see how successful the higher speed flavors will be.

How about IDE disk drives? They've not been around as long as Ethernet, but they have been around longer than USB, and they are still ubiquitous.

PCI has had a strong run and is still going strong.

DRAM has had many variations on the same basic theam over the years, with only one unsuccsessful branch. (What was that expensive standard that Intel pushed about 4 or 5 years ago? Was it RDRAM?)

PCMCIA, CF, SD, and SDIO are contenders for long-lived standards, even if they aren't quite as popular.

You can even consider the ever-popular PC power supply as a standard for desktop PCs, with it's 5V and 12V outputs.

I'll bet other people can come up with other good examples. (Please do NOT include Sony's memory stick) :devilboy:

[rob_ocelot]

What I find more than a little funny is that the USB standard was first rolled out on the Mac, and the PC industry only grudgingly accepted it as a standard over the next several years.

It's now referred to as a 'successful long-lived PC standard'.

Yeah, only if you bludgeon PC users over the head wtih it for years. :oops:

I've owned both Mac's and PC's and aware of the strengths of both patforms so I'm not biased. ;-)

[mhynek]

There is also the understated wired keyboard and mouse. :D

[ricksfiona]

What I find more than a little funny is that the USB standard was first rolled out on the Mac, and the PC industry only grudgingly accepted it as a standard over the next several years.

It's now referred to as a 'successful long-lived PC standard'.

Actually, I think you are actually talking about Firewire that debuted on the Mac. USB was Intel's choice on the PC platform.

I think USB is way awesome considering what we had to deal with before, though it still needs some decent improvements. If you have a powered hub and a powered device, they should work. You still gotta be careful about unplugging certain USB devices..

However, I think even better is Ethernet. You plug it in all togther, it works and you can mix different generational items and it will still work without a problem. Try doing that with USB...

[Sven Johannsen]

I have had my gripes about USB over the years, things not working, devices being lost, but overall it's been pretty decent. Guess it's a tribute to the standard. Given half a chance OEMs will still try to bastardize a standard just enough that they comply but can cause issues if not used in a homogenous setting.

Apparently the power paragraphs need some work. I have two USB chargeable devices that charge fine if hooked into a PC port, or the OEMs dedicated charger, but refuse to work with any other 'USB' charger. That's my SMT5600 and my Suunto SPOT Watch. Darn them anyway.

[SrSketch]

Yes, I believe Rick is correct. Most sources credit Compaq, IBM, DEC, Intel, Microsoft, NEC, and Northern Telecom with the joint development of USB. I admire Macs, but there is no "Apple" in the foregoing list...

[surur]

CD ROM's is another long-lived standard thats still ubiquitous, has graduated to larger capacities (DVD) but still remains backward compatible.

As a PPC user with USB host I appreciate USB standards, but I still cant plug in a USB scanner to my ppc and expect it to work. Its just because of the OS monopoly of MS that everything apears to work very well. Many more standard drivers e.g such as USB Mass Storage and USB HID would have impressed me much more.

Surur

[allenalb]

it's not like it was an easy-going walk through to park to get USB where it is now. 6 years ago, when i was doing tech support for a certain company with cow boxes, you would be hardpressed to find a usb device that worked in any fashion in which it was supposed to when you connected it. printers were so bad that you could connect them and install the drivers in the wrong order, and the damned things would never work (without hacking the registry and deleting tons of hidden files and whatnot) the above mentioned cow box company even had one model of computer (very low end) that only had USB, and no other ports (not even a single PS2 port) and you could turn it into a brick by accidentally deleting USB from device manager. from that point on, it was uttery useless, because you couldn't even get into the bios.

the moral of this rant is that USB got where it is, thanks to winXP. it was only after the release of winXP that USB actually became user-friendly.

[UCCOFFEE]

can anyone list the product that use STANDARD MINI-USB connector to charge , sync or connect to computer?

I only know :
POCKETPC: sync and charge~ very good
HTC magician
HTC Universal
HTC wizard

Smartphone: sync and charge
all HTC &amp; MOTOROLA smartphone (please confirm)

mobile phone:
most new motorola phones (transfer files only, does not charge)

Camera:
some sony camera
P series, L series etc (transfer files only, does not charge)

keyboard and mouse:
Creative Labs Wireless Desktop 9000 Pro Keyboard and Mouse (charge keyboard &amp; mouse)
IOGEAR’s Bluetooth Mini Mouse

bluetooth headset:
Nextlink Bluespoon AX Bluetooth Headset

GPS:
forgot...

Please help to update this table / list

[hoodmeister]

My Nikon D70 uses mini USB ~ File transfer only though.

[SHC]

My Motorola V3 uses mini-usb as does my Fujifilm S7000 camera.

[PDANEWBIE]

Is Doug on crack?

Why is he spouting on about USB and then comparing it to wireless? That's like me comparing a basket of apples to my friend's Lexus... There should be no comparrison with wireless on this article. Sure he may be making a point as far as "standards" but you could use something else a little more similar to make the distinction....

This whole article is rubbish. I can take or leave USB I have mixed feelings about it when it works it works great but I always have a non USB solution for the time it'll fail (either OS does not support it, drivers don't load rights, USB device does not get recognized, or any other thing I have found to be wrong with USB).

As far as standard technologies I have a simple one -

Floppy.. this has almost been around since PC inception and you don't see people taking a floppy from one computer and saying oh many this PC won't recognize my device... The only downfall I have with floppies besides their size limitation is you leave them on a shelf for 6 months and they magically lose their data :)

[gibson042]

can anyone list the product that use STANDARD MINI-USB connector to charge , sync or connect to computer?
AFAIK, every new compact digital camera uses mini-USB to transfer files (I'm certain that at least the Canon SD series does). I'm also pretty sure that none of them use the port to charge, because their batteries are all greater than 5V (to power flashes), and charging them would be S-L-O-W. Pretty much all non-Apple MP3 players use mini-USB to transfer files and charge (with the exceptions using full-size USB), and it seems like many Bluetooth headsets (and Bluetooth stereo headphones) should use it to charge, though I can't confirm that.

[jimlad]

The MIDI standard for connecting computers to musical instruments has been around for years too.

[beq]

What about the 2 different standards of "Mini USB"? The usual type (5-pin?), and the 4-pin (?). I forget exactly...

[Jonathon Watkins]

What about the 2 different standards of "Mini USB"? The usual type (5-pin?), and the 4-pin (?). I forget exactly...

Both USB mini-A and mini-B use 5 pins. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus)

It's Firewire that has either 4 or 6 pins. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firewire)

[Jonathon Watkins]

There is also the understated wired keyboard and mouse. :D

The 9-pin Din and PS/2 models? An endangered species, as many new PCs don't have the connector ports for them. Last time I looked round the back of my PC, I was using a USB mouse and keyboard...... :wink:

[Jonathon Watkins]

The MIDI standard for connecting computers to musical instruments has been around for years too.

But ubiquitous and thriving? Perhaps not.

[Jonathon Watkins]

However, I think even better is Ethernet. You plug it in all togther, it works and you can mix different generational items and it will still work without a problem. Try doing that with USB...

Yes, that's the one I was thinking of as well. From 'thin-net' 10-base-t to 10/100 PCI cards to Gb switches and 802.11g, Ethernet certainly has adapted and thrived. It certainly can be interesting working with different manufacturers implementations of Ethernet though. :huh: But, the same is equally true about USB. Standards are great - as long as folks stick to them but conversely, as long as it is possible to sensibly extend the standards. Ethernet and USB both allow forward and backward compatibility and you have a good chance of having the device actually working together. :wink:

[alizhan]

What I find more than a little funny is that the USB standard was first rolled out on the Mac, and the PC industry only grudgingly accepted it as a standard over the next several years.

It's now referred to as a 'successful long-lived PC standard'.

Actually, I think you are actually talking about Firewire that debuted on the Mac. USB was Intel's choice on the PC platform.

Apple Desktop Bus. Like USB, but with a slower data rate (1 Mbps vs 12, IIRC), and fewer total devices (16 instead of 256, IIRC). When Intel announced USB way back when, my first thought was: it's about time the PC world caught on to this idea. Then came a three year wait with absolutely no further mention of USB, and then the horror of the first two product generations out the door. Shear cussedness by Intel and Microsoft is the only reason USB survived those early trials. They crammed it down everyone's throats.

Nowadays, the common uses are sorted out pretty well, but it's still distressingly easy to find incompatible device combinations. You're safe only if you stick to the "one size fits none" profiles like Human Interface Device or Mass Storage. Running any custom drivers is still asking for trouble. For examples, look at just about any USB-based HP or Lexmark printer: they break everything else connected to that bus.

And BTW, USB 2.0 "Full Speed" (480 Mbps) was really Intel's answer to FireWire (the original 400 Mbps, not the newer 800 or 1600 versions, which spank USB hard). Apple wouldn't budge on their rather pricey licensing fees to incorporate FireWire, and market pressures were demanding: "we've already got USB; why can't you just make it faster?" In a remarkable display of the market getting what it wants instead of what it needs, Intel did just that. They hurriedly jerry-rigged a higher speed extension of USB, and hustled it out the door as proof that They're Listening to Our Needs (tm). Nevermind that it still wasn't as fast as FireWire (even though the raw data rate was faster), that it still had the same old driver stack, hub transparency, and port motility problems, or that it degraded badly when one mixed different speed devices on the same bus. It sure sounded good on paper. And it wasn't Apple.

Ah, well. At least FireWire finally did make it to the PC. Now that almost no-one cares anymore. :roll:

However, I think even better is Ethernet. You plug it in all togther, it works and you can mix different generational items and it will still work without a problem. Try doing that with USB...

Or the much-vaunted Bluetooth. Many people have tried to convince me that BT is the Second Coming, but I just don't see it. It's the driver quagmire of early USB combined with a substandard and non-scalable wireless networking protocol. I'm supposed to be excited by this why? :?

[k1darkknight]

Okay...a couple multi-quoting post, as my single big, multi-quote post was getting enormous...lol

Camera:
some sony camera
P series, L series etc (transfer files only, does not charge)Sony's actually using an existing standard? (watches the devil ice-skate by) Well...guess it COULD happen, after all!

The only downfall I have with floppies besides their size limitation is you leave them on a shelf for 6 months and they magically lose their data :)Honestly, I think the only reason floppies are still around, is that you need a bootable disk in order to make a bootable CD, with most (if not all) CD burning software. I took my floppy drive out of my system back when I started having problems with (curiously enough) windows (XP) recognizing disks I put in it. Now any time I need a boot disk, I just hook up an old, external USB Zip drive I have laying around...lol

The MIDI standard for connecting computers to musical instruments has been around for years too.Yeah...but that's a highly specialized kind of device...Yamaha's got that particular niche practically cornered...or they started it, and no one bothered coming up with anything that'd compete...though I'm not entirely sure why MIDI hasn't been replaced by USB...

(continues)

[k1darkknight]

However, I think even better is Ethernet. You plug it in all togther, it works and you can mix different generational items and it will still work without a problem. Try doing that with USB...(...) Ethernet and USB both allow forward and backward compatibility and you have a good chance of having the device actually working together. :wink:Yeah, don't most (if not all) USB 1.1 devices work on USB 2.0 ports, and vice-versa?

You're safe only if you stick to the "one size fits none" profiles like Human Interface Device or Mass Storage.I dunno...for game controllers, I don't mind the HID driver, as long as the manufacturer provides their own software for customizing the controls (and wouldn't mind a controller that used analog buttons on the PC, but that's a topic for a different site, I think). And as far as the Mass Storage driver...what else would you need for USB storage devices? Copy/Move/Delete (etc.) from here to there, or there to here. Some special function I'm missing?

(related to the HID mention)
There is also the understated wired keyboard and mouse. :DThe (...) PS/2 models? An endangered species, as many new PCs don't have the connector ports for them. Last time I looked round the back of my PC, I was using a USB mouse and keyboard...... :wink:Don't have PS/2 connectors? I just bought a new motherboard for my next system, and all the ones I even glanced at had PS/2 ports. Actually, I prefer the PS/2-type setup. It's pretty rare anymore, but I've had poorly designed programs f**k up, and disable ALL the USB ports. Kinda tough to shut down a program when your Ctrl-Alt-Del doesn't even reach the OS...

[k1darkknight]

Shear cussedness by Intel and Microsoft is the only reason USB survived those early trials. They crammed it down everyone's throats.
(...)
However, I think even better is Ethernet. (...)
Or the much-vaunted Bluetooth. Many people have tried to convince me that BT is the Second Coming, but I just don't see it. It's the driver quagmire of early USB combined with a substandard and non-scalable wireless networking protocol. I'm supposed to be excited by this why? :?
Well, IF bluetooth ever takes off on PCs (and anything more than connecting to cell phones for PPCs), it will only be for that same "Sheer cussedness" that kept USB going. I tried one of those USB-Bluetooth adapters about a year ago, so I could sync my Axim X50v wirelessly...got it to work ONCE, but never again...gave up, though I still have the adapter around here...somewhere...(shrugs) Ah well, I don't even do that much syncing anyway, since I got a media card reader (which works beautifully with that aforementioned Mass Storage Driver, btw).

Ah, well. At least FireWire finally did make it to the PC.
It did? (looks at the back of my computer, spotting a firewire port) Well whaddaya know? (scratches head) Huh...wonder what it does...