Where are the VGA phones?

[gibson042]

Way back on December 29 of last year, Janak asked about our crazy technology predictions for 2005 (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=35969). I predicted... well, the HTC Universal.
My crazy prediction should be obvious from my sig... a Pocket PC Phone Edition with integrated multi-band GSM, WiFi, Bluetooth 1.2, and a VGA resolution screen. My guess is that the first one out will be produced by HTC, and will share the form factor of the Blue Angel (including slide-out keyboard). It will have both camera and cameraless versions, depending upon the carrier and model number (which will include "MDA IV" and at least a dozen others :drinking::silly:), and either a 416 or 520 MHz PXA27x processor. Within one to three months after its announcement, one to three other companies will announce products with similar features.
Sure, I was wrong about the form factor, and no cameraless models have been announced (yet), and T-Mobile's "MDA IV" has been renamed to "MDA Pro" since its announcement (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=37238), but I basically nailed it. Except for the last part :?. The Universal was announced way back on February 2, and the only other potential competition (by which I mean another Wi-Fi/Bluetooth/VGA phone... heck, even another VGA phone) is the speculative Galaxy, also from HTC! Where are all the VGA phones?!? There hasn't been so much as a peep from Motorola, BenQ, Asus, or anyone else as far as I know! What happened?

[Duncan]

The Universal was announced way back on February 2, and the only other potential competition (by which I mean another Wi-Fi/Bluetooth/VGA phone... heck, even another VGA phone) is the speculative Galaxy, also from HTC!

I would imagine that the HTC Galaxy is what became the HTC Wizard.

Where are all the VGA phones?!? There hasn't been so much as a peep from Motorola, BenQ, Asus, or anyone else as far as I know! What happened?

I wouldn't worry - as you know, HTC make the majority of PPCs for just about everyone - and they have been very good at keeping things quiet recently...

[Paragon]

Where are all the VGA phones?!? There hasn't been so much as a peep from Motorola, BenQ, Asus, or anyone else as far as I know! What happened?

Other than the Universal most converged devices are using a 2.8" screen. I personally can't imagine using VGA on a 2.8" screen. Plus just the fact of having 240x320 on a 2.8" screen results in a much tighter looking resolution without the need of VGA. I think as well there would be some negative power and memory issues that tag along with VGA screens that would complicate issuse on Phones. Given that I wouldn't be surprised to see limited use of VGA on phone for the next while.

Dave

[gibson042]

Well, the current crop of VGA non-phones has basically the same battery life as the QVGA (with the same amount of RAM), so I don't think that's an issue. And 2.8" QVGA might look good, but even a 4.0" VGA screen offers a linear DPI that's 40% better; the Universal will have a 3.7" screen if I remember correctly, and the FSC Loox VGA models have 3.6" screens. Now, I'm willing to accept that I'm in the minority of an already small group, but I still think that someone would be willing to vie with HTC for the "most powerful phone" crown. Motorola tried something like that with the MPx (although they did fail miserably), and BenQ and Asus both offer their own mediocre PPC phones. Maybe I have my facts wrong and HTC is building the BenQ and Asus models, or maybe everyone unquestioningly accepts their dominance of this particular market. I guess I didn't anticipate HTC's competition just giving up.

[surur]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/09/samsung_300dpi_lcd/

http://www.samsung.com/Products/TFTLCD/News/images/040809.jpg
Samsung preps 2.6in VGA LCD
By Tony Smith
Published Monday 9th August 2004 10:33 GMT
Samsung will next quarter begin mass production of a 640 x 480 LCD screen that measures a mere 2.6in (6.5cm) diagonally.

Initially aimed at PDAs - both the Palm OS and Windows Mobile 2003 for Pocket PCs Second Edition enable VGA displays - the new panel will ultimately be pitched at smart-phone makers.

The tiny transflective display provides a resolution of almost 300dpi (dots per inch). That compares with a typical notebook display resolution of around 100dpi. The screen provides a 200:1 contrast ratio and a brightness rating of 150cd/m².

The Samsung panel uses amorphous silicon - the non-crystalline form of silicon - to fab the tiny thin-film transistors used to switch the screen's pixels on and off.

The South Korean giant said the panel will go into mass production in December. ®

There is also a 2.2 inch VGA LCD available from Casio.

http://www.i4u.com/images/casio_vga_display_highest_resolution.jpg
http://www.i4u.com/article2157.html

Surur

[gibson042]

Thanks, that is somewhat heartening. But note that both of those articles are nearly a year old, and there is still only the Universal for an actually announced product (well, four or five products, but they're all Universals and not competition). Before this year is out, we'll be able to purchase and use a VGA phone... an HTC Universal. Not one other has even been announced, let alone released.

[Paragon]

Well, the current crop of VGA non-phones has basically the same battery life as the QVGA (with the same amount of RAM), so I don't think that's an issue.

If you consider that a VGA screen contains 4 times the data that a QVGA screen, that means more RAM is needed, right?!

I didn't point all the issues out meaning that it would never happen, just that maybe some of them are the reason why it hasn't happened yet....lately I've had a few people credit me for saying things I haven't ;)

[surur]

Phones always lag behind PDA's. I don't think we will see many phones having VGA screens until we see most PDA's having them.

Surur

[Janak Parekh]

Phones always lag behind PDA's. I don't think we will see many phones having VGA screens until we see most PDA's having them.
The other reason, of course, is battery life. While the small VGA screens do exist, I'm not sure they'd give great battery life with the small batteries on the Magician/Wizard-sized devices... at least not yet. The Universal is large enough, hopefully, to accomodate a battery to match.

--janak

[SteveHoward999]

If we see the suggested doubling of battery life form WM 5 then vga phones will be more realistic propositions.

I don't want a 2.6 inch vga screen though - I have 4 inch VGA now and enjoy the amount of information I can get on it and still easily read ... I would have to reduce that for legibility of it were a screen that is essentially 1/2 scale.

But then I don't want a camera in either my phone or my PDA either ...


But if I had to choose a PDA/Phone/Camera, the HTC Universal might just be the chappy for me. But certainly nothing that has less than 3.5/4 inch VGA screen.


Hmmmmmm - I did read once that 4 inch SVGA should be possible now ..... I could be swayed into compromising somewhat for a machine that offers that :-)

--

[surur]

http://pr.fujitsu.com/jp/news/2003/10/31-1b.jpg

http://pr.fujitsu.com/jp/news/2003/10/31-1c.jpg

Fujitsu Labs Unveils Prototype of Compact PDA with 4-inch SVGA Display
November 7, 2003 (TOKYO) -- Fujitsu Laboratories Ltd announced that it built a prototype wireless LAN-capable compact personal digital assistant (PDA) featuring a 4-inch SVGA LCD display with a resolution of 800 x 600 pixels.

Fujitsu Laboratories' prototype PDA with SVGA display
It has 802.11b wireless LAN, Bluetooth and infrared communication capabilities so that it can access directly to a LAN or virtual private network (VPN) without using any communication tool. It enables users to access PCs inside the office or home from outside, and to use data remotely.

As a compact-size PDA, it is the world's first to have a 4-inch SVGA display and capability of browsing contents for a PC, according to the company.

http://www.mobilemediajapan.com/readnews.asp?newsid=2283

This would be the kind of device that would keep me from going for a convergent solution like the HTC universal. I wonder if Fujitsu Siemens is listening.

Surur

[MitchellO]

I am sooooo looking forward to the Universal. It has the two things that I wish my Mini had: VGA and WiFI.

[gibson042]

It seems that nobody else knows either, which to be honest is a confidence booster for me. Candidates for the lack of devices include shorter battery life (mitigated by WM5), the related higher RAM requirement (also mitigated by WM5, and 128 MB will definitely be enough since there are new high-end models with half that), and the hardware lag for Phone Edition devices. The last is probably the most likely, but it seems like that lag should be shrinking, since the ever-imminent "death of the non-connected PDA" would eliminate it entirely. All of the companies I mentioned have the same access to Windows Mobile 5.0 that HTC has, and yet they still hold back. Maybe they consider it too big a risk, or maybe they just lack the expertise. I expect the Universal to be a smashing success, and perhaps after that we'll see some competition. HTC has earned that success, though, and they've also earned all the money they'll make from it. Maybe my question is answered by my own preferences, which would have me buying the HTC even over less expensive competitors. At least the future looks good, if a bit monochromatic.