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View Full Version : Where Should Microsoft Focus Their Efforts?


Jason Dunn
11-30-2004, 04:00 PM
As I mentioned yesterday, I'm heading down to Mobius this week, and it's always a good opportunity to meet with people at Microsoft and talk about the current and future state of the platform. I was thinking about the feedback I want to give them, and the way the Pocket PC works today, and I realized that my desire for improvement is focused more about improvement of current features rather than all-new features.<br /><br />For instance, now that we have VGA screens and VGA video support with WMP 10 Mobile, two of my big "missing pieces" have been addressed. Other than better hardware (which is in the hands of the OEMs) my wish-list is now focused almost entirely on seeing current features/apps honed and enhanced, rather than brand-new features/apps, with things like:<br /><br />- Better memory management on the device (cache size limit in PIE, etc.)<br />- Better reminder notification windows (I want to see the location of my appointment)<br />- Improved VGA GUI (I want to see smaller fonts EVERYWHERE on the device, not just in the data list window)<br />- ActiveSync (where to even start...?)<br /><br />Do you feel the same way? Answer the survey and give me some feedback.

doc
11-30-2004, 04:07 PM
I think ActiveSync should be the number one feature they should be improving. Nothing grates on my nerves more about PPC then ActiveSync failing to do what it's supposed to do. ie: doubled up entries, failed connections, disconnect reconnect. Yeah, they all have work arounds but why not just fix it?

Gen-M
11-30-2004, 04:12 PM
Upgrade the Office applications to guarantee round-trip.

andydempsey
11-30-2004, 04:16 PM
Office apps. It's a pain in the arse having to zip a document just to retain formatting when ussing my PPC to transfer it from one machine to another.

JvanEkris
11-30-2004, 04:16 PM
- Better reminder notification windows (I want to see the location of my appointment)Jason,

How about showing them when they are needed?

My old Nino was guaranteed to make enough noise to resemble a scrambling jetfighter when i had an appointment. Currently i cannot rely on these reminders. I see reminders pop-up when i turn on the device. When the device is turned off, i do not get a reminder to go to the next meeting. This issue has been on the list since mid-2000, so i guess that after 3 1/3 years somebody must have been able to think of a solution. I have tried even WM2003SE, but the problem is still present.....

Another is that since the same OS update the possibility of having reminders for tasks go off on another time than 8:00AM is gone! Very impractical if i have to be warned to perform a task at 17:00. The desktop allows it, but the PDA does not take that into account.......

Jaap

Perry Reed
11-30-2004, 04:18 PM
The single best thing they could do, IMHO, is add HTML email support to the Inbox.

Jason Dunn
11-30-2004, 04:20 PM
I have tried even WM2003SE, but the problem is still present...

And what's odd about that is that I have no problems with reminders triggering - I get all my appointments (when I was using my X30 at least). The problem, and why this is SO difficult for Microsoft to nail down, is that it seems to be dependent on some interaction between Microsoft code and OEM hardware + OEM code. :? But, sure, I'll bring it up again. ;-) I think Microsoft needs to "sandbox" their alarms more - create a system whereby the OEM tweaks CANNOT interfere with the core OS function of triggering a reminder.

dlangton
11-30-2004, 04:24 PM
Where Microsoft really needs improvement is in the low level memory management - where hardware drivers, SIP methods, and Today screen plugins live.

Actually, Microsoft doesn't need to add features to any of their OS's. I don't need new features, I just want the OS to work better. That's why I prefer Win 2k to Win XP.

palmsolo
11-30-2004, 04:26 PM
Jason,

I'll be at Mobius as well this week and have a list of things I would like to see improved, but I will share one with you now since this is one of my biggest pet peeves.

I want the ability to press a button or make a shortcut stroke on the screen that will hide the top and bottom taskbar in any application. For example, while I am work in Word and typing away in landscape mode I only want to see a blank white display while I type on my Bluetooth keyboard. Many times there is no need for the top or bottom taskbars. I can get this in Internet Explorer now with PIEPlus, but I want to see it in the OS and available in every included Microsoft application.

Jon Westfall
11-30-2004, 04:36 PM
1. Activesync needs fixed!
2. Improve reliability of all features.
3. Fix pesky bugs (we all know these)

there are my top 3 wishes.

on another note, i'm on a lab pc and saw the frontpage w/ ads for the first time in a long time. not only did I see an ad for my camera (the dx7590), but also was amazed at how much I'd gotten used to seeing it subscriber-oriented (i.e. no ads / sidebar / customized!)

gorkon280
11-30-2004, 04:39 PM
The single best thing they could do, IMHO, is add HTML email support to the Inbox.

Why? So we could read our spam? There are more things wrong then that. HTML mail should burn in a firey pyre. I hate it.

They should do in this order:

ACTIVESYNC! Make the thing SyncML complient. Unfortunately, they'd also have to fix pocket outlook and other apps.

Work better with others....Microsoft, here's your chance....there are a ton of Mac wielding Palm users that have about had it with Palmone and palmsource. Bring on REAL SyncML support.

Enforce a standard dock connector acress the line. I am tired of rebuying cables, chargers and what not. That should be the only standard except for the processor and the like. The form could be any form so long as the connectors are the same.

Bring back a clamshell form factor....

Also, work on selling Pocket PC's OS as it's own unit. That is, start treating us PPC users like you already do regular Windows users. Do something to let is run the latest OS on older devices if we so choose. You DO not know better then we do. Treat us with some respect instead of like you'd treat a grandma.

alabij
11-30-2004, 04:41 PM
The Windows Mobile OS and the Windows CE core need a complete overhaul to make the existing features work uniformly. MS needs to have a focus. Microsofts biggest flaw is that they refuse to be personal with their customers. They don't listen.

Some of the issues might be trivial but they are still significant.

For example.
While listenning to audio via WMP, if I'm typing text with the onscreen keyboard and tap on a suggested word it stops the music. This has been evident since PPC2002.

Also with PPC2002PE, if I was listenning to music and got a call the music would stop but would automatically resume after I hung up. With WM2003 even though you set WMP to continueit doesn't.

I would love the ability to increase the inbox and messenger fonts without using a 3rd party tweak.

On the issue of messenger, it sucks, definitely needs more features.

Back to WMP, why can't it be locally installed, in terms of upgrades. I want WMP 10 but can't get it unless HP feels they wont spend too much.

Megaperfect
11-30-2004, 04:51 PM
I would like to see a different OS. Like, Linux is a choice for the PC. Someone might or will develop one to replace the existing one, without any corruption to the PPC. We have different choices on the PC level, why not the PPC?
I am irrated that I am stuck with certain features like MS's Active Sync &amp; MS's Outlook. I, and a lot of people, enjoy using the Firefox, Sunbird &amp; Thunderbird on their PC. Or, maybe, the Sun Microsystem's suite. I would love to sync up with the Mozilla Suite. Don't get me wrong, I work and play with a Desktop replacement Laptop with different OS's and programs. I do see the PPC getting to the level of replacing the Laptop in years to come. Because, we all love to hold a lot of features and power in our hands in a small size. 8)

To go along w/the Active Sync's problems, make it able to sync with the above programs. We have common ground on how to get or send email any where in the world. Why not work with our many different programs. I have programs made in Japan with Japanese, that, work fine on my PPC using english.
Just throwing my thoughts around.
Megaperfect
_____________________________
Equipment: Toshiba e775, 512mb SD, 512mb CF working w/HP7160us Laptop

bdegroodt
11-30-2004, 04:51 PM
I second the HTML in email. We use it often for internal communications and I never see what I should.

Beyond that, please add an "Open Reminder" feature (like in Outlook) for appointment reminders. It's really silly that I should have to dismiss a reminder, go to the calendar, and click on the appointment to see my notes (phone number for the appointment, addresses etc).

Fix Office apps. They are pretty weak/limited.

Open up Activesync to support more cross-platform/device syncronization.

Finally, keep the unit OFF when it's looking for email. I shouldn't have to waste battery on a lit screen while a function that has nothing to do with a screen performs.

TheWhiteRabbit
11-30-2004, 04:57 PM
I've been a Microsoft handheld owner since the very beginning. I have, as well as most of you have also, seen the OS grow into a real OS with some very useful features. In order to consider this a mature OS, I think that MS should focus on wrapping up some of the loose ends.

Specifically:
- PIE still needs a lot of help. It still isn't a true roadworthy browser without a bunch of add ins.
- The Pocket Office apps need true bi-directional compatibility. I want to be able to move a doc from my home computer to my PPC, do some work on it and then move it to my work computer and keep all the formating.
- Mail needs a bunch of help. WebIS Mail is on the right track, but needs speed increases.
- BETTER FILE MGMT!!! See Resco File Explorer for example. Hell, license it from RESCO and eliminate the MS app.
- Same goes for the PIM. License Pocket Informant and be done with it.
- Put SQL Server CE in the ROM!!!!
- Better resolution handling on the VGA models. i.e. font sizes, desktop size etc... Make it look more like a desktop I'm use to instead of a TV remote control.
- Give me the option of full screen in all the embedded apps!!!! Those bars are such a waste of critical space when focused on one app.

OK, there is my short list. Hope this helps.

Jereboam
11-30-2004, 04:57 PM
More flexibility. There are so many things that are bunged into the OS ROM image that I never use or have third-party replacements for...if I could selectively get rid of the ones I don't need it would be heaven.

Other than that, yes, Activesync (from scratch rewrite preferably, with a new team who you force to actually use Activesync on a daily basis so they GET it) and a robust, full-featured email app would be top of my list. With VGA screens and ever-more powerful hardware, the days of deeming cut-down apps acceptable for PDA users are numbered. We want "optimised" applications, not crippled.

J'bm

emuelle1
11-30-2004, 05:09 PM
My wish list:

-better retention of document formatting in Pocket Word. I don't care if I can see the formatting on the Pocket PC, but I'd like to be able to carry formatting from one computer to another.
-Active Sync: I agree with above: Where to start? How about better ability to sync between computers. I'm sure I'm not the only person who likes to sync at home and at work and occasionally with my laptop. There is a free program called Pocket Multi Sync, but I've found that it doesn't do what I need it to. Also, though two computers can be synced, only one email account can. Why not both home and work? I'm sure there's a way to do it.
- Better connectivity between Office/Outlook applications. Turn an email into an appointment or task like you can in the desktop Outlook.

and finally

-more options for viewing and sorting email and tasks. Why not the ability to group tasks by due date AND priority? How about a "due in the next seven days" view also?

Just my two cents. If you get an ear, that's what I'd like you to put in it. Thanks.

P.S., if you can really get them on the edge of their seat, ask if they can release and End User update for Pocket PC 2002 for those of us who's wives don't understand the need to upgrade from an older Ipaq 3765 at a cost of several hundred dollars.

MultiMatt
11-30-2004, 05:10 PM
I originally posted the following on my site's forum, but it bears repeating here, even though it's been discussed so many times, I feel like I'm beating a dead horse:
One thing that bugs the heck out of me, and has ever since I've owned a Pocket PC, is issues with Reminders and ActiveSync.
Here's an example of what I'm referring to:

This morning, I'm at my desk, and my device is cradled. 8am rolls around, and two Reminders go off - one for a birthday that is today, another for an anniversary on Monday.
Since I am at my PC, I responded to the Reminders via Outlook. For the birthday Reminder, I chose Remind me in 8 hours, and for the Anniversary, I chose Remind me in 1 day.

And here's the part that aggravates me - about 50% of the time, when I do that, the reminder will properly synchronize and the Reminder dialog box on the Pocket PC will disappear. This morning, it was a case of "the other 50% of the time". The Reminders just sat there on my device screen, oblivious to the changes on the PC.
It's VERY frustrating!
If I know that I'll be out and about when I want that Reminder to go off again, I can go through the same motions via the device (Remind me for this one in 8 hours, and for this one in 1 day), but
a.) that's a pain in the butt, and
b.) sometimes I choose a "Remind me in" time on the PC that is not available on the Pocket PC, so I can't have the Reminder go off at the time I wanted...

Don't get me started on the different options for reminders on the PC vs. the Pocket PC! Here is an illustration of the disparity between the two devices, and their options for a Reminder:
http://pocketpclouisville.com/images/disparity.PNG

And the same thing goes for simply dismissing a Reminder. Sometimes I can dismiss it (either via the device or on the PC) when my Pocket PC is cradled, and both will dismiss together just fine. But over 50% of the time, that does not happen, and it's simply aggravating!

It's not like this is 3rd party software or something!

Matt

emuelle1
11-30-2004, 05:13 PM
I agree with MultiMatt about reminders. Why do I have to shut off a reminder in three different places: The Pocket PC, my home computer, and my work computer? Why can't I just dismiss it once and have it sync across all three?

mr_Ray
11-30-2004, 05:22 PM
-MOST IMPORTANT - A useful (ie expanded) verion of the .NET CF. There's way way too much basic stuff missing to make it useful. I want to be able to pick up VB/C# and write (for example) a today plug-in that reads my mail and then sets an alarm. Currently this would end up 95% native code anyway, so why bother with the CF in the first place?
I'm waiting here ready to support and expand your mobile platform if you stop making things hard for me!

-Here's one we haven't heard of in a while... :wink:
STOP USING RAM AS SYSTEM STORAGE!

-Again another vote for a better activestink.
In the new Activesync completely remove document conversions. We already know better Office Apps are on the way, so make them use native MSOffice files, and send the PXL format to the depths of hell where it belongs.

-A way for users to add/remove/update apps from the OS install. What's the point of the likes of WMP, MS Reader, etc being in ROM when it only stays that way for 5 dayss until a new version is released, and you can't just overwrite the old version?

-While you're at it, implement that for the whole OS, to free us from the tyranny of evil OEMs.

-Work on improving the way that different apps that take over button functions work together. IF I switch out of (for example) WMP and go into another app that uses the hardware buttons, then go back to WMP, often the buttons won't work until I close and restart WMP. Since they don't provide a close button :wink: doing so is difficult without eg wisbar.

-Let me change the alarm time for All Day events!

capo
11-30-2004, 05:28 PM
I second some previous comments:
activesync is in need of attention. It's a resource hog on my laptop and is anything but bulletproof. I'd like to sync with something other than Outlook for the same reasons, but I don't realisitically expect MS to support Mozilla over their own products. Here's a hint - Outlook and Activesync are a bloated mess. Rebuild them from the ground up.

It would be nice to be able to upgrade the PPC OS in the same way I upgrade my desktop Windows. I have hardware I like - why is it necessary to choose between new features and fixes or a new PPC?

One more thing I'd like to see is broader voice control. I've been playing with MS Voice Command lately and I'm surprised at how well it works. I'd like to be able to make calendar appointments while I'm otherwise occupied (like driving) maybe have my PPC read my email or an ebook...

That's my wish list, Santa. Thanks for listening.

ddwire
11-30-2004, 05:38 PM
I want a generic rom image built to a hardware spec similar to windows. That will cure the upgrade problems, one can load the new rom if they wish like upgrading from win98 to win XP on a desk top.

I still have not figured out what has improved since my first Nino312. Sure they added support for color, but most every thing else we do today we could do then or at least with the Nino 510.

I had a full excel program, ebook reader, mp3 player, vidieo player, compact flash slot etc.

foebea
11-30-2004, 06:05 PM
I would like to see DirectXCE.

Remember what happened to desktop computers when DirectX came out?

johncruise
11-30-2004, 06:06 PM
I agree with most of what the people says here when they wanted to add those nice features in but MS really needs to brush up on all their bugs first before they keep on adding new features. Otherwise, they'll be adding more features-with-bugs and that is not really improving Pocket PC in general.

Sven Johannsen
11-30-2004, 06:23 PM
--Let me change the alarm time for All Day events!

And Tasks!

Fix AS. Let us sync to where we want, not just main ram. Let the device act as a Flash card reader, independent of AS. Make some use of context menus, such as left click and drag into AS--convert, Right click and drag--don't convert.

Get the OS stuff, registry, PIM DBs, patches, out of RAM.

whydidnt
11-30-2004, 06:30 PM
I'd really like to see improvements in:

1. ActiveSync - Why the heck can't I have a "partnership" with more than 2 computers? Why can't I sync mail with more than one computer? Why can't I sync things such as documents with data stored on a memory card?

2. Real VGA support, not the crummy high DPI we have today. The native application, desktop, etc. should offer true 640 x 480 experience.

3. Click-thru event reminders. It's crazy I have to dismiss a reminder, then go find the event that triggered it in the PIM to act upon it.

4. Improve the PIM apps to be more like the desktop. Tasks should support reminders at any time. It's crazy that 75% of people who use a PPC find the need to add a replacement PIM app such as Agenda Fusion or Pocket Informant.

5. Fix the memory management issues. Give us a real close button and elimate the memory leaks. Active Sync is the worst offender I've seen here.

6. I'd love to see a HAL added so they could deliver OS upgrades without having to involve the OEMS and their specific hardware drivers, but I doubt that will happen for a variety of reasons, including OS bloat and OEM objections.

7. Better support for built in keyboards. We're starting to see more devices with a thumbboard built in. It would be nice if the OS made it easy for the keyboards and navigation buttons to work without having a need to pull the stylus. Palm has done a fabulous job with this on their Treo line.

For the most part you can see I'm not looking for new features so much as I am improvements in the things WMSE already does.

CESkins
11-30-2004, 06:31 PM
1. Personally I would like to see MS add back features they removed from the prior versions of the OS that were working fine. I would like to see the option for repeating alarms added back. Ability to set a task appointment time other than 8 AM. You can if you use AF/PI on the PocketPC but if the task is created on the desktop, you are always stuck with an 8 AM alarm.
2. I would also like to see more fields available for data synchronization for tasks and appointments. If MS is afraid that too many fields of data would bog down the memory with large databases, just give the user the choice of which fields to sync at the level of ActiveSync.
3. Improved reliability of alarms
4. Either license Meeting Mute (http://www.pocketconepts.com) or build-in similar functionality into the OS
5. Better syncing between multiple desktops (why can't I have different accounts in the e-mail app for each computer I sync with so that the e-mail is kept separate and I can sync with the inbox on multiple computers)
6. Scrollbars that don't waste so much real estate. I look at the screen for Palm OS apps and lament that even with lower screen resolutions, they manage to pack almost the same amount of info (if not more onto their screens). The OS waste very little space on scrollbars amongst other things. Like others have stated, we should be able to go to full screen mode in any app.
7. Faster USB sync...ActiveSync never quite achieves true USB sync rates. Why?

I could go on and on but I will stop here. MS needs to improve on the features that already exist rather than taking away good features and adding bug-laden ones. They also need to realize that a PDA screen is not a desktop monitor...the interface needs to be designed to maximally optimize use of that space with no wasted elements and bars (menu/task/icon) that can quickly be hidden and re-called.

Perry Reed
11-30-2004, 06:54 PM
The single best thing they could do, IMHO, is add HTML email support to the Inbox.

Why? So we could read our spam? There are more things wrong then that. HTML mail should burn in a firey pyre. I hate it.

Personally, I have good spam filters and rarely see any spam. So while you might hate HTML email, others like myself find it very useful.

In addition to my actual email, much of which arrives to my laptop in HTML form, I also use IntraVnews to store my RSS feeds in Outlook as well (very similar to Newsgator) and that way I can use Outlook to read most of my daily information in one place.

If my Pocket PC supported the HTML email, I could read all of that information more easily on the go.

Perry Reed
11-30-2004, 06:57 PM
We want "optimised" applications, not crippled.

That, I think, says it all! It's clear from everyone responses that many of us consider the Pocket PC more of a PC replacement than a PC companion, as Microsoft does. But either way, better applications would help us. I really don't see a truly functional pocket version of Word cutting into the sales of the real thing, or sales of laptops. And if it did, why not simply sell a version of Microsoft Office for Pocket PCs, with fully functionally equivalent versions of the applications, for a price commensurate with that functionality.

Kati Compton
11-30-2004, 07:18 PM
My suggestions are to improve what's there, but some of the suggestions may seem like "new features"....

Make GUI more VGA-friendly
---------------------------------
- make titlebars, menu font size, slider bars, etc, user-configurable
- fix PIE to not pixel-double
- make PIE more capable given that there's VGA (like adding tabs/multiple windows)
- have Excel and other apps work well in VGA w/o needing a VGA hack

Make apps more functional
-------------------------------
- round-trip Word/Excel office documents
- Pocket PowerPoint round-tripping would be great
- Fix "all day" appointments to be all day even if you change timezones, instead of having them span multiple days

Make memory management more sophisticated
-------------------------------------------------------
- Better handling of temporary internet files (and easy way to flush it out)
- Close means close
- Able to (seamlessly and without effort) keep all data in ROM or a flash card instead of RAM, with the possible exception of today plug-in programs. Primarily, My Documents should be able to be in ROM, as should contacts/etc.
- If ROM support above is created, add a program to erase ROM (ie, if sensitive info in contact list, etc, but have to send the device in for service or are selling it and upgrading)

JLittle1
11-30-2004, 07:47 PM
Dispite all the gains PPCs have made over Palm based devices they are still less intuitive to use. Two features I miss from my old Palm are:

/ shortcuts
Name &amp; Number Lookups (for appointments)

Reasons I stick with the PPC:

Outlook Integration
Office Integration
Better email support

Deslock
11-30-2004, 08:02 PM
Top 10 Add a real memory manager that lets you actually see what’s using memory and lets you free it up
Fix whatever causes PPC to sporadically behave sluggishly (sometimes Start Menu comes up right away and sometimes it takes a couple seconds)
Add a task switcher (and closer)
Fix alarms
Fix ActiveSync
Change PIE’s rendering engine so that it doesn’t scale images on VGA devices (or at least add an option to disable this)
Add standard web browser features (view source, save, save image, Java, better CSS support, tabbed browsing/multiple windows)
Add the ability to make Excel’s grid 1 pixel thick instead of 2
Add the ability to change the footer and header size on VGA devices
Support native office documents

Gator5000e
11-30-2004, 08:08 PM
ActiveSync needs improving. Whenever it crashes adn abruptly disconnects my Axim, I have to reboot the entire computer to be able to reconnect, especially with Bluetooth. Also, in Inbox, I would like an option to select all messages for whatever purposes, deletion, etc.

Finally, as I did not see a similar question posed re Smartphones on SmartphoneThoughts, I would like to see support for Word documents added, a similar request for Inbox that I mentioned above (a select all option while in Inbox for easier deletion) and an option to change font size in IE on Smartphones as some fonts are pretty small and hard to read for us older guys.

lkawamot
11-30-2004, 08:31 PM
1. Reliable Alarms -- what good is a PDA if we can't rely on the alarms?

2. Full Screen mode -- the top and bottom bars take up too much of the screen space.

3. ActiveSync, allow sync-ing with categories as well as specify which device contains the subset of data and which contains the superset. -- I'd like to be able to NOT sync my personal events to my work desktop, but at the same time, be able to sync ALL of my work desktop info to my iPAQ. Meanwhile, be able to sync ALL of my iPAQ info onto my home desktop with ALL of my info on my home desktop and my laptop. I'll gladly categorize my data as personal, work, general to accomplish this.

4. Improve HWR -- my Newton still kicks my iPAQ's butt on HWR... accuracy, speed, and shortcut strokes (scribble out, new page, shapes, drag off to "clipboard")

5. Better BT support -- Advanced Audio, Headset, HID etc...

6. Enhance Voice Command to accept more commands.

7. Develop an "Intelliget Assistant" similar to the Newton... maybe tie it in closely to Voice Command. It would be nice to be able to scribble in an "assistant" interface something like "Remind me to meet Mr Jones on Friday at 3pm" which would result in a new meeting set up with Mr Jones, with a reminder set at my default alarm time before Friday, 3pm... even better if I can say it to my iPAQ via Voice Command.

Overall, I'd say that MS should focus on fixing/improving what they currently have. Make it more RELIABLE... I can't believe that I can't count on my iPAQ's alarms/reminders...

AFTER that, MS should focus on making the OS more of an assistant and not a handheld desktop environment... I shouldn't have to click through a whole slew of menus and icons to look up information I need. It would be nice if the OS was active and tried to predict what I needed, when I needed and have the information ready for me.

I want to be able to say something such as "December Budget" and have the OS present me a list of objects (notes, meetings, spreadsheets, etc) related to the December Budget.

If it wasn't for the easier sync process, and portable form factor (though it's nice having a larger screen space to scribble on), I'd probably ditch my iPAQ and go back to my Newton.

disconnected
11-30-2004, 08:40 PM
Since there was no option for "all of the above", I chose improve existing features.

I agree with what's been mentioned already, especially --
Improve VGA support
Improve PIE -- true VGA, open link in new window, etc.
Improve memory management (including no RAM system storage)

I'd also like to see some improvement in Microsoft reader -- speed it up, make it true VGA.

This may be somewhat off-topic, but my most urgent request isn't exactly a PPC development issue; I wish they'd try to do something about DRM. I know it's a necessary evil, but there must be a better way. Current DRM mostly harms honest consumers, and seems to be preventing the growth of the ebook business, in particular.

clayton jr
11-30-2004, 08:57 PM
I'm a fairly new PPC user, but I too feel there is much room for improvement without resorting to third-party fixes -

- Persistent battery display somewhere, on the task bar or elsewhere.
- More useful PIMs, specifically the available views in the Calendar app. (The "week" view is just colored blocks. On a VGA device, I should see text in those blocks).
- On-device control over themes, colors, fonts
- More button-assignment options. (Why can't I assign a push-and-hold second function to a hardware button?)
- "Close" should mean close as mentioned countless times already.
- Better file explorer, with a directory "up" button like PocketPlus implements, and the ability to see the entire file name.
- Built-in PDF support, even if it's just Adobe Reader pre-installed.
- Built-in printing support.
- Change the language of "connect". It makes no sense to connect either to "Work" or to "Internet". Maybe "Office LAN" and "Internet," but "Work"? Pet peeve, I guess.
- Ability to run in true VGA without a hack, and toggle it on the fly.
- OS-wide support for built-in graphics accelerators like the one in the x50v.

SteveHoward999
11-30-2004, 09:26 PM
The single best thing they could do, IMHO, is add HTML email support to the Inbox.


The single best thing that they can do with email is leave html support OUT as far as I am concerned. I am so GLAD we can finally kill all that filthy SPAM without having to look at it in Outlook Express with SP2.

Not that I mind pictures of naked women you understand, but I prefer to choose when to see them ...

Plus, more realistically, HTML email opens up a whole other kettle of security issues that I am happy to leave out of my PDA.

dochall
11-30-2004, 09:33 PM
I'd really like to see improvements in:

1. ActiveSync - Why the heck can't I have a "partnership" with more than 2 computers? Why can't I sync mail with more than one computer? Why can't I sync things such as documents with data stored on a memory card?

2. Real VGA support, not the crummy high DPI we have today. The native application, desktop, etc. should offer true 640 x 480 experience.

3. Click-thru event reminders. It's crazy I have to dismiss a reminder, then go find the event that triggered it in the PIM to act upon it.



:clap: :clap: :clap:

I agree witll all of these three but click-thru on event reminders has just started to really bug me.

but

- Buy WebIS - throw money at Alex and let him continue to develop PI at the same rate as he currently does.
- Buy Softmaker - Rename planmaker and text maker to...oh I don't know...how about something linke Pocket Excel 2004 and Pocket Word 2004.

- Persuade HP to give you their printing app and put it into the OS.

- Support HTML mail and let us store mail elsewhere even if the db stays on the device - I have at least 2mb taken up by mail. Actually have a chat with Alex as you've just bought WebIS.

- Turn PIE into a decent browsing experience. That's the one I don't think you can fix by buying a company unless they would be willing to throw money at Opera to get a pocket pc version.

surur
11-30-2004, 09:42 PM
I voted for new features.

1) As some-one said - get rid of the registry. Life was much better in windows 3.1 with human readable .ini files.

2) Ram just for execution. Put the synchronised folder in flash rom

3) Make power loss like a soft-reset. No losing everything hard reset when your battery goes flat.

4) not just improve, but emphasise stylus free navigation. I like how the OK button has been added to many new pocketpc phones. The interface however still clearly indicates that a stylus would be better. The "start menu" doesn't really make much sense. And whats the point of having it only cover one small side of the screen?

5) More emphasis on media playing functionality. This specifically included having dedicated purpose buttons for play, forward, rewind and stop.

6) How about hiring some-one to think of "nice touches" e.g a clock screen saver, battery monitor etc. The little things that are not mega important, and doesn't take much coding, but make you fall in love with a device. (think apple)

7) let bluetooth work properly, and make the profiles updatable, so anyone can write them. Im thinking specifically of the A2DP profile, the HID profile and the handsfree/headset profile.

Thats probably enough for now. Should keep them busy for the next 10 years :)

Surur

JvanEkris
11-30-2004, 09:52 PM
ActiveSync needs improving. Whenever it crashes adn abruptly disconnects my Axim, I have to reboot the entire computer to be able to reconnect, especially with Bluetooth.Although i support this point, i found out that making Activesync look for a device and then try again usually works....


Jaap

twalk
11-30-2004, 10:34 PM
I'm going to propose something radical here...

I'd like to see MS ditch the PPC platform.

Now before everyone gets angry, let me flesh this out a bit.

Practically everything everyone is complaining about on the PPC works correctly on XP. I think that most everyone would agree that if PPC had all the capabilities of XP, then it would be by far the best platform.

A stripped, low resource optimized, flash drive optimized, touch screen enabled version of XP shouldn't take more than 1 year to make and test. MS already has all the parts, and they work well. Stripped versions of Word, Excel, Outlook, IE, etc. shouldn't take more than a year to make and test either.

I just got a 1G flash drive for $52 last friday. Why couldn't 4G hold most/all the programs? Add 512M ram (use some as a ram drive), and one of the super low cost/low power x86 processors Intel &amp; AMD are currently working on.

By the end of next year, I should be able to have a PPC sized device with the full power of a PC for &lt;$1000. Why should I settle for an underpowered PPC instead?

But this will only happen if MS wants it too happen...

To be blunt, I've completely given up trying to make Palms/PPCs/Symbian devices fill tasks that PCs do. (If I wanted just a PIM, I'd throw away the PDA and just use a cell phone... Since I've gotten my Fujitsu P1120, I've rarely carried a PDA.) The devices are much more than powerful enough, but there is always something that is missing or doesn't work right. It seems now that it will be much less work for MS to bring down XP to the PDA level than it will be for them to bring up PPC to the PC level.

surur
11-30-2004, 10:58 PM
I'm going to propose something radical here...

I'd like to see MS ditch the PPC platform.
.
.
To be blunt, I've completely given up trying to make Palms/PPCs/Symbian devices fill tasks that PCs do. (If I wanted just a PIM, I'd throw away the PDA and just use a cell phone... Since I've gotten my Fujitsu P1120, I've rarely carried a PDA.) The devices are much more than powerful enough, but there is always something that is missing or doesn't work right. It seems now that it will be much less work for MS to bring down XP to the PDA level than it will be for them to bring up PPC to the PC level.

True in some ways, but your life will end up being a series of unending frustrations, when all the software you want to use, while theoretically and actually installable, would be horribly unoptimised for the small screen, lack of keyboard/stylus, and the power options.

Surur

foebea
11-30-2004, 11:00 PM
These devices need more system ram.

Until today this has never been an issue for me, but today I got the bluetooth headphones. These things take so much ram that it has problems streaming for many intensive programs such as gilbertPDA, darxide, betaplayer and others. The critical difference here is only about a 7 meg shortage, so can be addressed by uninstalling a lot of programs and hardware drivers, but if there were more RAM to work with this would not be an issue.

- iPaq 2215 - 64 megs ram

Perry Reed
11-30-2004, 11:06 PM
I'm going to propose something radical here...

I'd like to see MS ditch the PPC platform.

Now before everyone gets angry, let me flesh this out a bit.

Practically everything everyone is complaining about on the PPC works correctly on XP. I think that most everyone would agree that if PPC had all the capabilities of XP, then it would be by far the best platform.

A stripped, low resource optimized, flash drive optimized, touch screen enabled version of XP shouldn't take more than 1 year to make and test. MS already has all the parts, and they work well. Stripped versions of Word, Excel, Outlook, IE, etc. shouldn't take more than a year to make and test either.

I think this is actually pretty do-able. In fact, I'd take it a step further. We've already seen Microsoft introduce a new user experience onto XP with the Media Center Edition (and to a lesser extent with Tablet PC). Why not port the Pocket PC interface to XP as well? Simply make it another user experience that properly written applications could take advantage of.

While they're at it, I'd create more as well. How about a kid-friendly experience that uses big, fun icons and images for navigation, and also includes filtering to keep the kids away from non-kid-appropriate stuff? How about a simplified desktop version for newbies or non-techies?

I think there are a lot of possibilities there.

JvanEkris
11-30-2004, 11:32 PM
Practically everything everyone is complaining about on the PPC works correctly on XP. I think that most everyone would agree that if PPC had all the capabilities of XP, then it would be by far the best platform.There already is and it is called OQO........
To be blunt, I've completely given up trying to make Palms/PPCs/Symbian devices fill tasks that PCs do. (If I wanted just a PIM, I'd throw away the PDA and just use a cell phone... Since I've gotten my Fujitsu P1120, I've rarely carried a PDA.) The devices are much more than powerful enough, but there is always something that is missing or doesn't work right. It seems now that it will be much less work for MS to bring down XP to the PDA level than it will be for them to bring up PPC to the PC level.I agree on this point partially. I think that Microsoft should focus on making a real mobile device that is less a mini-laptop replacement and more of a small device that supports you in vital functions in a smart way wherever you go.

This means moving away from providing full-featured versions of word (reading them would be fine, and round-trip compatibility, but editting embedded spreadsheets is way beyond what somebody on the move probably needs) and introducing software that provides easy but extremely easy to use applications would probably be more preferred.

For example a good application to take notes in a meeting would be very nice. This is something where a small (non-intrusive) device like a PocketPC is in a perfect position. It should be very easy to use and not distract you from your meeting (something a laptop probably would do).



Jaap

zcmc1066
11-30-2004, 11:53 PM
The single best thing they could do, IMHO, is add HTML email support to the Inbox.

Activsynch needs to be fixed to suportthis

zcmc1066
12-01-2004, 12:13 AM
I want a generic rom image built to a hardware spec similar to windows. That will cure the upgrade problems, one can load the new rom if they wish like upgrading from win98 to win XP on a desk top.

I still have not figured out what has improved since my first Nino312. Sure they added support for color, but most every thing else we do today we could do then or at least with the Nino 510.

I had a full excel program, ebook reader, mp3 player, vidieo player, compact flash slot etc.


Great Idea!!

Ed Hansberry
12-01-2004, 12:50 AM
WOW! So far 68% are more interested in making existing stuff better than new features. Cool! That is where I voted too. :)

Mr. PPC
12-01-2004, 12:54 AM
I think the PDA should be a simple base design. What I am talking about is removing the built in apps and providing a base PDA. One that really doesn't do anything until you buy applications for it.

Example:

You buy latest iPAQ 9000; has built in bluetooth, wifi, vga, storage (SD or whatever we are using at this point), microphone, speaker, headset plug (with mic support), possibly GSM/CDMA support and Infrared (consumer grade)

The PDA has an OS installed, but that is all. You could include drivers for all the hardware already in the OS or developers could include them, not sure which would be better - probably built in (not in ROM, loaded by user). No apps that use any of the hardware are included, this area belongs to developers.

You could still have multiple hardware designs as some people may only want the basics. Others may want the ability to make their PDA into anything they can think of.

At this point, the user goes out and buys the apps that do what HE/SHE WANTS with their device. If they want to make the PDA into a glorified remote, they can. If they want a PIM that supports WiFi and bluetooth, they can. If they want a portable media player, they buy the apps for that. The device would only do what the apps make it do, nothing inbuilt wasting resources/space etc.

I hate the fact that there are apps installed on my device that I don't use (either because they are inferior to everything else or I just don't use it). It still takes up space and resources on my device, even though I don't want it.

I think this is a better design for the PDA. Let us pick what we want our PDA's to do. I believe this would open up the PDA market to a whole new world of possibilities. Imagine, buying a PDA with a 6" screen and being able to use it as a PIM, remote , media player. One device supporting MULTIPLE uses. How about making the 6" screened PDA into a game machine now, but in a year you decide to convert it to a media player. Just uninstall the gaming apps and install the media player ones. All this without having extra apps taking up space, resources etc. It would be a true media player, not a PIM/media player

A truely dedicated device!

twalk
12-01-2004, 01:22 AM
Practically everything everyone is complaining about on the PPC works correctly on XP. I think that most everyone would agree that if PPC had all the capabilities of XP, then it would be by far the best platform.There already is and it is called OQO........
To be blunt, I've completely given up trying to make Palms/PPCs/Symbian devices fill tasks that PCs do. (If I wanted just a PIM, I'd throw away the PDA and just use a cell phone... Since I've gotten my Fujitsu P1120, I've rarely carried a PDA.) The devices are much more than powerful enough, but there is always something that is missing or doesn't work right. It seems now that it will be much less work for MS to bring down XP to the PDA level than it will be for them to bring up PPC to the PC level.I agree on this point partially. I think that Microsoft should focus on making a real mobile device that is less a mini-laptop replacement and more of a small device that supports you in vital functions in a smart way wherever you go.

This means moving away from providing full-featured versions of word (reading them would be fine, and round-trip compatibility, but editting embedded spreadsheets is way beyond what somebody on the move probably needs) and introducing software that provides easy but extremely easy to use applications would probably be more preferred.

For example a good application to take notes in a meeting would be very nice. This is something where a small (non-intrusive) device like a PocketPC is in a perfect position. It should be very easy to use and not distract you from your meeting (something a laptop probably would do).


The OQO is bigger than a PPC, and it's version of XP isn't optimized enough. While it's much more useful than a PPC, no one is going to confuse the two.

Why ask for cut down software? That's what's causing many of the problems to begin with. It's hard and long to build up apps to be everything that everyone wants. MS and others already have the apps for XP. Porting these apps to PPC is extremely difficult, while porting these to a x86 handheld running XP would be easy. (If you really want cut down apps, those also already exist on XP...)

I look forward to the day that I can buy a small handheld and use it as my only computer (w/ docking station). I think that a x86 handheld would get us there a lot quicker and with a lot less compromises.

surur
12-01-2004, 01:27 AM
I hate the fact that there are apps installed on my device that I don't use (either because they are inferior to everything else or I just don't use it). It still takes up space and resources on my device, even though I don't want it.

A truely dedicated device!

With handheld devices, unlike desktop computers, its the formfactor which makes a device dedicated or not. If you dont have good buttons you cant play games well. Ditto if you have no analog joy stick. If you have no play and stop buttons you wont be a dedicated media player. If you dont have a good lens you cant be used as a good camera.

Software helps, but software cant make up for very poor form factors.

I also believe people complain about the built-in apps. Arnt these very small (in the few Kb range) and are only run when you want to use them. I dont think they use up much resources at all, and people are free to ignore them. Microsoft certainly has, as they have not updated them for years.

Surur

Deslock
12-01-2004, 01:59 AM
I hate the fact that there are apps installed on my device that I don't use (either because they are inferior to everything else or I just don't use it). It still takes up space and resources on my device, even though I don't want it.

I think this is a better design for the PDA. Let us pick what we want our PDA's to do. I believe this would open up the PDA market to a whole new world of possibilities. Imagine, buying a PDA with a 6" screen and being able to use it as a PIM, remote , media player. One device supporting MULTIPLE uses. How about making the 6" screened PDA into a game machine now, but in a year you decide to convert it to a media player. Just uninstall the gaming apps and install the media player ones. All this without having extra apps taking up space, resources etc. It would be a true media player, not a PIM/media player

A truely dedicated device!
PPC already does that, it just does it very badly (because it's buggy and inefficient). It shouldn't need to load as much stuff into memory as it does and it should do a better job clearing out memory after you close an app. But that's how Win32 works, so we're stuck with it. Beyond that, the only inefficiency related to pre-installed apps is a little extra ROM being used up, but who cares? That's a non-issue compared to resource requirements for all the crap PPC runs. The solution is to make the underlying OS more efficient and reliable.

I think many people are being unrealistic: you can't squeeze XP into a 4-6 ounce device (and wont be able to do so in the next 3+ years). But there are XP solutions on a handheld. They weigh 15-25 ounces and have crappy performance and a 1.5-3 hour battery life. IMHO, you're better off with a 30-50 ounce subnotebook (one of the Panasonic Toughbooks has a GHz CPU, 7 hour battery life, 10.4"-XGA screen, and weighs 2.1 pounds).

As far as an streamlined flavor of XP for handhelds goes, forget it. That's more-or-less what WinCE is... a version of Win32 optimized for handhelds. Because it's based on Win32, it's fairly easy to develop for (and port Windows apps to). But you can't have actual XP-compatibility without a faster CPU and bigger battery than what we're used to in a PPC.

I personally would like to see Microsoft ditch Win32 altogether, but that's another discussion.

Mark Johnson
12-01-2004, 03:58 AM
- Improved VGA GUI (I want to see smaller fonts EVERYWHERE on the device, not just in the data list window)


Yes PLEASE!

While they're at it, PLEASE fix Pocket Word so it will "obey" the default zoom level for ALL file types, not just when opening .psw format. (Save foo.rtf and then open at it will open at 100% zoom even if you've set some other as the Settings / Options / Default Zoom Level For Typing. Arrugh! With VGA resolution default zoom of 100% is far larger than I need, but unless I want to downgrade my docs from .rtf to .psw (which won't roundtrip properly) I'm forced to triple-tap to get each doc to 75% zoom.

Also, for every release of Pocket Word, it has ALWAYS FAILED to apply a font size to all selected text. If you have a document with some text at 8-point and some at 10-point, then "select all" and choose a font size, your command will be IGNORED. How can this never have gotten fixed?!?

Mark Johnson
12-01-2004, 04:25 AM
While my rant juices are flowing:

The "scroll wheel" on PPC's is VASTLY inferior to the "Jog Dial" as trademarked and implemented by Sony.

PPC scroll wheels only "increment" once per "down stroke" (as with a down arrow on a keyboard) not "multiple increments" and, even better, an increasing number of increments with increased downstroke speed (as with the Microsoft Scroll Mouse.)

Simply put, the navigation on PPC's is horrible. There are very very few functions you can reliably use one-handed. This is partly an "inherent problem" to small devices, but could be greatly improved if:

1) Microsoft licesensed the Sony Jog Dial as used on the Clie and Vaio products.

2) Microsoft just implemented it and refused to pay a royalty. (They probably would be in perfectly safe legal waters since the "Jog Dial" is not significantly different from other "continuous scrolling" navigation technologies.

3) Replace it with a "virtual/touchpad" scroll-wheel kind of technology. I would recommend they NOT try the Synaptics touchpad like on the hx4700 (four-way navigation is conceptually nice, but practically twitchy) but INSTEAD simply work with the manufacturer of the thumbprint scanner (like on the high-end iPaqs) to make it able to pull "double-duty" for this. So when the device is first turned on, the scanner is used to authenticate, but after that, it automatically interfaces to any active application's use of the vertical scroll bar.

Wake up Microsoft! There is NO CHANCE people will ditch their iPods for PPC's when you can navigate the iPod one-handed but the PPC makes you grab the stylus. The PPC should be/would be a natural iPod killer if navigating a playlist was anywhere near to being as simple as it is on an iPod. (Or a Rio Carbon for that matter, which I own and uses a true scroll wheel as well.)

A "virtual thumbwheel" in the fingerprint scanner would match the iPod, Rio Carbon, etc. capabilities quite nicely. Or, for that matter, a small "touch-strip" on the right side of the unit. (Come on Microsoft, just ask Synaptics to make a "touchpad" that is half an inch long and a tenth of an inch wide and glue it on the right side of a PPC in the lab.)

Give us something that makes one-handed navigation a realistic option!

twalk
12-01-2004, 06:23 AM
I think many people are being unrealistic: you can't squeeze XP into a 4-6 ounce device (and wont be able to do so in the next 3+ years). But there are XP solutions on a handheld. They weigh 15-25 ounces and have crappy performance and a 1.5-3 hour battery life. IMHO, you're better off with a 30-50 ounce subnotebook (one of the Panasonic Toughbooks has a GHz CPU, 7 hour battery life, 10.4"-XGA screen, and weighs 2.1 pounds).

The reason that there isn't a x86 4-6 oz handheld yet isn't because it isn't possible, but because the big 2 (Intel &amp; MS) haven't done any work towards it.

That's changing.

Intel and AMD will reasonably soon have out super low cost, low power, and small space x86 chips. They want the smartphone market, and feel that using the x86 isa will give them the advantage over ARM. PDAs will then just come along for the ride. These chips should be ready well before the end of next year.

As for MS &amp; XP, all it takes is MS deciding to do it. XP can be made to run fairly lean and mean just by tweeking many of it's settings and turning off unneeded services. If MS would put some effort into it, XP could probably run about as well as WM on that size of device.

The issue really isn't the hardware (PPC hardware is about the same as PC hardware), but it's an issue of if MS is willing to change the software.

As far as an streamlined flavor of XP for handhelds goes, forget it. That's more-or-less what WinCE is... a version of Win32 optimized for handhelds. Because it's based on Win32, it's fairly easy to develop for (and port Windows apps to). But you can't have actual XP-compatibility without a faster CPU and bigger battery than what we're used to in a PPC.

WinCE is really crippled compared to XP. Porting things to CE isn't just a recompile. Also keep in mind that XP comes from NT, which used to run well on PCs with only 64M of ram and 200Mhz processors. With just changing a few settings, you can get XP to run OK on a 128M system. How much better would it run if MS actually worked at it?

To be more blunt, why can linux handhelds run a pretty complete version of linux, but MS OS handhelds can't run XP?

Darius Wey
12-01-2004, 09:36 AM
I voted on the second option. We all think Pocket PCs are great because they do what we want it to. However, it could be better. Office needs a revamp. So too does Pocket IE and ActiveSync. File Explorer desperately needs some work too. I think if efforts are focused on improving WM's already-rich feature set, the WM OS will be one excellent platform in the future!

Deslock
12-01-2004, 12:52 PM
I think many people are being unrealistic: you can't squeeze XP into a 4-6 ounce device (and wont be able to do so in the next 3+ years). But there are XP solutions on a handheld. They weigh 15-25 ounces and have crappy performance and a 1.5-3 hour battery life. IMHO, you're better off with a 30-50 ounce subnotebook (one of the Panasonic Toughbooks has a GHz CPU, 7 hour battery life, 10.4"-XGA screen, and weighs 2.1 pounds).

The reason that there isn't a x86 4-6 oz handheld yet isn't because it isn't possible, but because the big 2 (Intel &amp; MS) haven't done any work towards it.

That's changing.

Intel and AMD will reasonably soon have out super low cost, low power, and small space x86 chips. They want the smartphone market, and feel that using the x86 isa will give them the advantage over ARM. PDAs will then just come along for the ride. These chips should be ready well before the end of next year.

As for MS &amp; XP, all it takes is MS deciding to do it. XP can be made to run fairly lean and mean just by tweeking many of it's settings and turning off unneeded services. If MS would put some effort into it, XP could probably run about as well as WM on that size of device.

The issue really isn't the hardware (PPC hardware is about the same as PC hardware), but it's an issue of if MS is willing to change the software.
Uhuh. And if the big 3 hadn't conspired to prevent fuel economy from improving, we'd have 100 MPG SUVs by now (actually, that theory at least has a couple elements of truth, even though it really comes down to cost).

Anyway, the reality is that Intel has spent a lot of time and resources tweaking CPUs to consume less power (Xscale, Centrino, etc). As they continue to make progress, we may see an XP-compatible OS in 4-6 ounce devices (that are actually usable and have a decent battery life), but as I wrote, it wont be for 3+ years (and if/when it happens, Microsoft will undoubtedly have a new desktop OS with more resource requirements). Microsoft, for their part, has continuously tweaked CE/PPC to be more efficient. But without a total redesign, CE/PPC will never get significantly more efficient because it is based on Win32.

As far as an streamlined flavor of XP for handhelds goes, forget it. That's more-or-less what WinCE is... a version of Win32 optimized for handhelds. Because it's based on Win32, it's fairly easy to develop for (and port Windows apps to). But you can't have actual XP-compatibility without a faster CPU and bigger battery than what we're used to in a PPC.

WinCE is really crippled compared to XP. Porting things to CE isn't just a recompile. Also keep in mind that XP comes from NT, which used to run well on PCs with only 64M of ram and 200Mhz processors. With just changing a few settings, you can get XP to run OK on a 128M system. How much better would it run if MS actually worked at it?
Sure NT ran at 200 MHz, but not all 200 MHz CPUs are equal, especially when you're comparing mobile CPUs to desktop/server CPUs (even today's 416 MHz Xscale is slower in many ways than the 206 MHz StrongARM from years ago). Also, NT didn't have the graphics, multimedia, or USB features we've seen on 2k AND XP. Just as early version of CE didn't have the any of that functionality like PPC does (as well as wireless). BTW, CE originally ran - albeit badly - at 40 MHz with 4 MB RAM.

You can get XP to run OK on a 128M system, but not if you plan to do anything serious with it (photoshop, some games, even multi-tabbed web browsing can use up a lot of resources). You can get CE/PPC to run OK on 16M (or even less), but not if you plan to do a lot of multitasking or use more memory-intensive programs (even PIE, with its limited feature-set, is a memory hog).

I never said porting to CE was as simple as a recompile, but there are many similarities that make it easier to port from XP to CE than from XP to other OSs. Read this:

Title: Inside Microsoft Windows CE
Author: John Murray
Publisher: Microsoft Press
Date: September 1998
ISBN: 1572318546

(most of the following is from a post I made here a long time ago, but it applies here)
The book discusses the early days of Microsoft's attempts at embedded OSs. It covers varies projects (Pegasus, Winpad, Pulsar, etc...) as well as Microsoft's internal rivalry and competition.

Microsoft initially tried to port NT but the port was too big and they rewrote the kernal. So, CE has its own code base, but it was not redesigned from the ground up; it was considered a smaller version of Windows by the developers. They often talked about the misconception that CE was Win95 ported. However, that was mostly by users who thoght that because of the similar GUI. Under the surface, CE shared many design elements of other Win32 OSs. The biggest differences are that the code is tweaked to run on limited hardware and it's more componentized. But design-wise is very much like NT, mainly due to Microsoft's decision to use Win32 APIs:
CE uses a multithreaded Win32 system, with the same file formats as NT and the same process and thread model as NT (but CE is limited to 32 processes... there is no limit to number of threads within processes) *2004 note: I dunno if they've since increased the process limit*
CE uses Win32 APIs... versions of Word, Excel, IE as we all know were included (but many components were left out). This decision was made to speed development. As of the book's publishing (6 years ago), 1500 Win32 API functions were used in CE. I dunno what that number is today.
The CE registry uses Win32 registry APIs.
CE uses standard Microsoft programming interfaces such as COM (including Active X), MFC, and ATL.
CE uses the same virtual memory model as other Win32 systems
With the above choices came various advantages and disadvantages... but as you can see, CE's design was derived from NT. Even though it's bloated for a handheld OS, you're not going to be able to come close to its efficiency with an XP-compatible OS.

To be more blunt, why can linux handhelds run a pretty complete version of linux, but MS OS handhelds can't run XP?
Like CE/PPC, Mobile Linux has fewer features than desktop flavors of the OS. But it's not as stripped-down as CE/PPC because Linux is significantly more efficient than Windows.

twalk
12-01-2004, 07:20 PM
Anyway, the reality is that Intel has spent a lot of time and resources tweaking CPUs to consume less power (Xscale, Centrino, etc). As they continue to make progress, we may see an XP-compatible OS in 4-6 ounce devices (that are actually usable and have a decent battery life), but as I wrote, it wont be for 3+ years (and if/when it happens, Microsoft will undoubtedly have a new desktop OS with more resource requirements). Microsoft, for their part, has continuously tweaked CE/PPC to be more efficient. But without a total redesign, CE/PPC will never get significantly more efficient because it is based on Win32.

You really need to keep up. The top Intel management has *never* liked Xscale. They and AMD are targeting the smartphone market with x86 chips. (ie, smaller devices than PDAs...) This will happen a lot soon than 3+ years...

Heck, if someone were to offer me enough money, I'd design a x86 handheld. It would weight a little bit more (8 oz or so), be slightly bigger than a x50v and probably use a crusoe chip.

Give me the parts that Intel &amp; AMD will have out in the next year, and an optimized version of XP, and I'll get you a 6 oz x50v sized x86 PDA out by the middle of '96.

But like I said several times before, this all depends on MS... (The biggest issue is removing all the unneeded HD access, which would quickly burn out a flash drive.)

I'm not going to take the time to respond to the rest of this. If you want to believe that it's nearly impossible, fine. But I'm not kidding when I said that I could build it (including the software), and if I can, there are a lot of other people who also can.

Deslock
12-01-2004, 09:26 PM
Anyway, the reality is that Intel has spent a lot of time and resources tweaking CPUs to consume less power (Xscale, Centrino, etc). As they continue to make progress, we may see an XP-compatible OS in 4-6 ounce devices (that are actually usable and have a decent battery life), but as I wrote, it wont be for 3+ years (and if/when it happens, Microsoft will undoubtedly have a new desktop OS with more resource requirements). Microsoft, for their part, has continuously tweaked CE/PPC to be more efficient. But without a total redesign, CE/PPC will never get significantly more efficient because it is based on Win32.

You really need to keep up. The top Intel management has *never* liked Xscale. They and AMD are targeting the smartphone market with x86 chips. (ie, smaller devices than PDAs...) This will happen a lot soon than 3+ years...

Heck, if someone were to offer me enough money, I'd design a x86 handheld. It would weight a little bit more (8 oz or so), be slightly bigger than a x50v and probably use a crusoe chip.

Give me the parts that Intel &amp; AMD will have out in the next year, and an optimized version of XP, and I'll get you a 6 oz x50v sized x86 PDA out by the middle of '96.

But like I said several times before, this all depends on MS... (The biggest issue is removing all the unneeded HD access, which would quickly burn out a flash drive.)

I'm not going to take the time to respond to the rest of this. If you want to believe that it's nearly impossible, fine. But I'm not kidding when I said that I could build it (including the software), and if I can, there are a lot of other people who also can.
There are plenty of us waiting to buy something like that... if they could build it for a reasonable amount of cash, they would. Currently, there are some Crusoe-based solutions, but they cost much more than consumer-grade Palm/PPCs and they weigh a lot more:
http://www.handtops.com/show/compare

As far as the chips coming out next year, x86 chip does not necessarily mean XP compatible OS. If by "optimized version of XP", you mean something that will maintain compatibility with all existing Windows software as well as BT, USB, and wifi support, then it's not gonna happen in a 6 ounce device next year. Sure, there are x86 CPU-based portable devices coming soon (http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,116119,00.asp), but even if you use a CF-sized hdd instead of a 1.8", you'll need a bigger battery (you could use a 4GB CF flash card, but getting one with reasonable write-times will probably still be a bit too pricey). My wild-ass guess would be 10+ watt-hour or more to get 3+ hours of battery life with light-moderate use in a device like this (for purposes of comparison, X50v = 4.1 watt-hour, hx4700 = 6.6 watt-hour). With advances in CPU, OLED, and hdd technology, maybe we'll get it down to 10 ounces next year and 8 the year after. But 6 ounces aint gonna happen until at least the year after that... not with a device that provides decent performance and battery life, anyway.

tsapiano
12-01-2004, 11:26 PM
1) As a previous poster mentioned, a more complete version of the .NET CF burned into the unit's ROM. There are a lot of simple things that require us to go back to native code and that negates many of the advantages of using the framework.

2) Improved handling of WiFi cards - allow us to order our preferred networks in a specified priority (including the ability to place ad-hoc devices above infrastructure networks without having to resort to ad-hoc only). Also, it would be very welcome to be able to set IP settings on a per SSID basis (so we don't need to manually switch back and forth between DHCP and static addresses). Finnally, allow me to specify whether I want it to (a) automatically select and connect to networks or (b) allow me to specify a network I want to connect to (and do not connect to any other networks until I turn this mode off).

3) Smarter handling of network cards - if I try to do something that needs internet access and my radios are turned off, procedurally try to find the cheapest access (naturally with an option to disable this feature if desired). That is, if I have inbuilt 802.11 support and a CDMA 1X card turn on WiFi and look for a network. If one is found, use it - if not, then switch off WiFi and dial out with the CDMA card. If they want to be really smart, have it check WiFi periodically while using CDMA and as long as I don't have any persistant connections active then switch over to the free networks when available. It's not a huge thing, as this can be done manually well enough - however if I just want to quickly get my email it's a bit annoying to have to tap all those buttons.

3) Inbuilt USB Host driver with (at the very least) HID and Mass-storage-class drivers built into the OS so vendors can provide this functionality uncrippled. By making this part of the OS it also provides a standard way to write the class drivers so that third-parties can produce them and know they will work with all PocketPCs (regardless if USB is built-in or added via a CF card).

4) Proper task switcher and the ability to manually close programs. Every OEM provides this anyway, so they might as well make a standardized mechanism to do this at the OS level.

5) Work on making the little things more elegant and efficient to work with. As several posters have mentioned, while the Newton may have been primitive by today's standards it had a lot of UI design elements that have yet to be matched by modern equipment. We are using a device with a small screen so it needs an interface that is designed to work within those confines rather than trying to emmulate the desktop look and feel.

6) Tweak the multitasking engine so that it is more responsive to user inputs when under heavy load. Naturally a small processor like these units are using has limited resources, but the OS should always give precidence to the UI elements over background processing. I don't care if how much a program is starving for cycles, if it is slowing down the response time of the UI it can wait. It's too easy for an out of control program to slow the UI to a crawl so that I can't easily abort the malfunctioning program.

7) Allow Pocket Outlook to be configured to periodically check email when the device is in it's sleep state. That is, at a predefined time wake up (but leave the LCD off), turn on WiFi, check for email and then turn back off. If there are new messages simply beep once and turn on the notification LED so I know they are there. Also, when checking while the machine is awake don't use that obtrusive bubble to tell me every time - only notify me when there are new messages and do it in a much more passive way (ie the icon on the title bar is fine without the bubble).

8 ) As pretty much everyone else has said, do a total teardown of Activesync and produce a version that works better. Add full support for it in the .NET CF on the PocketPC end and the .NET framework on the host computer end of things.

uzetaab
12-02-2004, 02:42 AM
1) An OS that can be upgraded without hardware supplier intervention.

2)fix activesync!

3)fix alarms!

Darius Wey
12-02-2004, 03:50 AM
1) An OS that can be upgraded without hardware supplier intervention.

This may not appear anytime soon due to the issues with HAL. Pocket PCs are very different to PCs at the moment. :|

andyclap
12-03-2004, 05:12 PM
You've really hit a nerve with this article - witness the amount of effort everybody has taken to detail their pet peeves, I agree with 99% of eveything said, and am quite impressed with some of the more left-field ideas (scroll strip on the right hand side sounds neat!)

But the single biggest, most important thing MS could do to improve the PPC platform is listen to user feedback. It's as if they have no idea that their OS is seriously flawed, or what people want from devices using it.

I could go on with my list of issues, until I'm blue in the face, but I know I would be wasting my efforts. IMHO Microsoft do not give a damn about my views - PPC is sold to hardware manufacturers, not end users. Hardware manufacturers are naturally only interested in unit sales which, sad though it is to say, are often driven by whizzy new features in new models that the consumer can immediately grasp, rather than enhancements and bugfixes to existing features that may only apparent to an existing user; "Runs WindowsMedia 10" unfortunately will sell more devices than "PIE now is multi-tabbed and has a proper DOM" or "PocketWord is finally compatible with Word" or indeed "ActiveSync/Outlook will now no longer screw up your life with missed appointments and missing contacts". Perhaps they think that if they did fix the problems, it'd be tantamount to admitting that there were serious issues with the older models, people would immediately stop buying them, and they'd be left with a ton of dead stock.

redraiduzz
12-03-2004, 06:24 PM
Better reminder options for sure, PARTICULARLY the snooze alarms!
How difficult can it be to change that little template? And if you have MS Office 2003 or Outlook 2002, which has options for as much as half a day, it's impossible to correctly sync task and calendar reminders!

MS has made the Outlook reminders on the desktop great! Don't know why they can't improve that first and foremost.

Having said that, some more features could/should be added to both Excel and PocketWord.

HTML should be added to e-mail, and PIE could be greatly enhanced.

Also, you should be able to get all items for connections out of the registry, so as to be able to export and import from device to device accordingly without having to recreate connection settings each time!

Ratel10mm
12-03-2004, 07:26 PM
Well, my request is simple enough. I would like everything that you all have asked for. But more than that, I'd really like a manual from MS. All this cool stuff I read about you guys doing sounds great, but I (and I suspect a lot of other MSMobile power user wannabe's) could really do with some assistance here. I mean, this site is great, and every time I've asked a question, someone's been kind enough to give me an answer that works. But why can't I just look up the answer anywhere myself?
For e.g. I can connect to many wifi hotspots, but I can't see a d*mn thing! PIE says it can't connect to the site (ANY site!! :evil: ), and I have no idea how to see the network I've connected to in order to browse it. I wouldn't of course if it were someone's unlocked wifi network. But all the same, I'd like to know that my unit's working correctly, not sit here wondering what I have to do to get through the hub. (TSC maybe? But then I'm not even geeky enough to know how to use that!) And why can I cut &amp; past shortcuts in Activesync explorer that then a. Show up on my device, and b. WORK!!!!! But I can't do the same on the device itself?
Basically, the Ipaq manual is fine for the MOST basic stuff, but I want to know how to really USE my 5550! :cry:
Come on MS - make MSM work like Windows! :twak: :soapbox:

ipaqgeek
12-04-2004, 07:43 AM
My 2 cents, This is what they need to do:

Have then write a WinCE USB wrapper that allows people to use WinXP USB drivers with WinCE devices.

That way manufacturers won't have to write WinCE drivers for their peripherals, and all peripherals would work with WinCE devices!

ipaqgeek
12-04-2004, 07:59 AM
Okay, let me add one more thing. There are too many to mention, and I agree with so much that has already been said. What I want to say though is for the consumers, and to keep manufacturers from ripping us off. That is:

Standardize expansion port formats. Tell manufacturers that they cannot call it a PocketPC if they put their own funky proprietary slot in there. For example, Sony can't put their crappy memory schtick in there and call it a PocketPC. I'm so sick of the proliferation of expansion formats - it's all about greed so you have to buy thier add-ons. Keep it down to something like : CF, SDIO, MMC, and a standard USB attachment cable. Nothing more.

nategesner
12-04-2004, 08:01 AM
I agree most issues could be resolved by simply fixing the existing software. Reminders, Activesink, MS Reader, Pocket Internet Horror, etc. MS should look at replacing the PIM with Pocket Informant and saving us the headache. MS Reader is atrocious and beaten hands down by free versions of iSilo3, as is WMP by programs like BetaPlayer. Oh, and why do I have to download a freeware program just to skin my title bar and be able to close applications?

Word Completion is another function that's broke but nobody seems to mention. Why can't I edit the dictionary? It always suggests obscure words I NEVER use and refuses to learn words I use 30 times a day, or move more-often-used words to the top of the list. Give me the option to edit the dictionary or load my own so I can truly accelerate input by tailoring it to my work (military) language.

True 640 x 480 and better use of the screen space is a must-have improvement.

Squid
12-07-2004, 02:50 PM
I have taken a long time in getting through all of this and enjoyed the read, and all of the input. I would agree with most everyone's offered opinions to the original post. I used to use my 3650 as a travel alarm when I was on the road. I wouldn't do that now. It's suicide. Just simple stuff like reminders needs to work flawlessly. Pretty much the reason they were brought into existance.

Having said that, and looking over the posts from others... Why can't I buy a cradle that allows me to connect my iPaq to a monitor and USB ports to connect other accessories? I saw the OQO device mentioned. Why? Couldn't the PPC in its current incarnation be "souped up" a little to provide the same thing? Only better, no wait time for the thing to boot. No issues with the display. Better battery life. I am just curious. Seems like it wouldn't be to far of a stretch. IF manufacturers would get visionary again. Why do they continue to provide such a small amount of onboard memory? I mean the questions along these lines could go on ad nauseam.

I think that the biggest thing that MS/Intel/HP/Dell/etc could do is listen to the people that bought the product. Dream a little. And use the friggin products! I can't believe that the people at MS are using these, not getting frustrated, and/or interested in getting all of these issues resolved.

Regards,

Squid