e800 OS Q

[mikecr]

Hello
I put my E805 away for a couple weeks, and the battery drained to nothing. I don't really understand why the battery drains at a relatively high rate when not in use.

Anyway, when I pluggged it into it's base station, the thing went back through original screen cal and started up as it was when I originally purchased it. Gone was all the things I had set and installed. Resco explorer, Claunch, PocketTV, SpreadCE, others I had paid for(I don't even remember them all).

I can't always have it in a charged state. Is there a way to prevent this in the future?
I have a CF micro drive installed(4GB). Can I somehow change the OS to grab all from this hard drive?
Can the OS run from a hard drive?
Thanks

[Kevin C. Tofel]

Few thoughts:

1. Even when your Toshiba (or any other WM device for that matter) is powered off, it isn't truly "off". It's actually in a very low power "stand by" mode which allows you to press the power button for an instant on state. Some people set their CPU speed to 100Mhz each night in an effort to minimize the power drain overnight.

2. Since the Toshiba is one of the few devices that does not have a backup battery, the device will reset back to the factory settings in the event of a full power loss. Most handhelds use a watch battery or some other type of backup power source for this situation, but unfortunately as you found out the hard way, the Tosh does not!

3. Unfortunately, the OS has to reside on board in the unit's ROM. You can't yet "boot" into Windows Mobile from a CF hard drive. Keep in mind also that CF cards (ESPECIALLY those with moving parts like a microdrive) eat up power quickly. You may want to check the power setting to see if you have the "Provide CF with power when suspended" box checked....if so, I would uncheck it because that will cause your battery to drain quicker even when the unit is off.

Your best bet is obviously not to let the power run down completely. Other options include keeping a second battery charged or using some other power source to maintain a battery charge. I now keep an iSun solar charger with me wherever I go.

I would also recommend backing up your important data or at the very least, storing it in the Flash ROM included with the Tosh. Flash ROM doesn't need power to maintain your data.

Hope this helps!
KCT

[mikecr]

Thanks Kevin
It explains alot.
I gotta say, I can't see much of a future for these Pocket PCs. Could you imagine a laptop's future if you had to format the drive & reinstall the OS whenever it's battery died(which in this case, happens while not even turned on)?

Due Palms do this as well?

I'm just not up on things like I should be I guess.
My use is strictly in the field(literally), running ballistic software.
Since power is drained in a shelf state, It looks like I need to be able to connect previously charged batteries on location(Unless there is a way to stop the drain).
I bought the hardrive & installed everything I could to it, to prevent a loss of setup from battery changes in the field. My bad. :(
So now it seems I need a form of DOS resident in flash, and an OS on my hardrive. Else I need to drop this for the smallest laptop I can find.

Is there a way to do that?

[Pat Logsdon]

I gotta say, I can't see much of a future for these Pocket PCs.
We'll have to agree to disagree on that. ;) These devices can do quite a bit, in an incredibly small form factor. Unfortunately, you need power for many of those features. Would you be willing to wait two minutes for your Pocket PC to boot every time you wanted to check an appointment? They're meant to be easily and quickly accessible, and as time has progressed, they've gotten more powerful. Most PPCs can last for a regular workday with normal usage. The problem you're running into is that they're really meant to be cradled at night to recharge. They can't do that if they're sitting on a shelf.

Could you imagine a laptop's future if you had to format the drive & reinstall the OS whenever it's battery died(which in this case, happens while not even turned on)?
Apples and oranges. ;) A laptop's "job" is different than a pocket pc, and it uses a different kind of memory. In order to allow instant-on capability, the memory in a Pocket PC needs a trickle of power.

Due Palms do this as well?
Yes. It used to be that Palms could last longer because they weren't as powerful/robust as Pocket PCs. They did one thing (PIM functions) very well, and that was about it. In the last few years, Palm has added features and functionality to bring their devices to parity with Pocket PCs (at least, that's what they've TRIED to do. ;)). The result is that they have essentially the same hardware (Xscale processor, same memory, etc.) and similar functionality - thus, similar battery life.

Since power is drained in a shelf state, It looks like I need to be able to connect previously charged batteries on location(Unless there is a way to stop the drain).
The only way to stop the drain is to provide power. Is it not possible to plug the cradle in while the Toshiba is in storage?

I bought the hardrive & installed everything I could to it, to prevent a loss of setup from battery changes in the field. My bad. :(
So now it seems I need a form of DOS resident in flash, and an OS on my hardrive.
One thing you can do is buy a copy of Sprite backup, (http://www.handango.com/brainstore//PlatformProductDetail.jsp?siteId=311&jid=B919FEBF3X8B72652FDD5C7XDA4XDCC3&platformId=2&productType=2&productId=34628&sectionId=0&catalog=30) and then save your backup to ROM storage on the device, or directly to your microdrive. That way, you can restore your device to its previous state within a few minutes. If you absolutely can't get power to the device while it's in storage, you could use a battery plugged into the serial port. When the device runs out of internal battery power, it should switch to the external battery. Seidio sells a 9v emergency power charger (http://www.seidioonline.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SEI2DC1) for $20.

Good luck! :mrgreen:

[Fishie]

Urm, sprite backup is rebranded and resident in the e800rom and you DONT have to reainstall the OS after a hard reset.

I have my doubts about the validity of this guys claims.

BTW if ya have a 4gig microdrive in there turn of the option to provide power to the CF slot when not in use.

[Janak Parekh]

I put my E805 away for a couple weeks, and the battery drained to nothing. I don't really understand why the battery drains at a relatively high rate when not in use.
In addition to the other comments, are you running WM2003 First Edition or Second Edition? I found that, after my Second Edition ROM update, the standby time on my e805 increased dramatically. Why, I have no clue.

--janak

[mikecr]

1st, Thanks alot for the help everyone.

I don't know what version of OS is running in it. How would I find out?

Would a backup of some type have prevented the loss of my desktop, Icons, startup programs, resolution, backgrounds, etc? Can that backup reside in the hard drive?

Your right about Laptops being apples & oranges. I would be in bad shape waiting for a laptop to startup all the time as well. My battery life is fine in the field. Good for a week of my use. But it seems good for a week whether I use it or not. I have checked a block somewhere to stop power to the CF when not in use, and I run the processor at the slowest speed.

[Fishie]

1st, Thanks alot for the help everyone.

I don't know what version of OS is running in it. How would I find out?

Would a backup of some type have prevented the loss of my desktop, Icons, startup programs, resolution, backgrounds, etc? Can that backup reside in the hard drive?

Your right about Laptops being apples & oranges. I would be in bad shape waiting for a laptop to startup all the time as well. My battery life is fine in the field. Good for a week of my use. But it seems good for a week whether I use it or not. I have checked a block somewhere to stop power to the CF when not in use, and I run the processor at the slowest speed.

Yes the backup can reside on the microdrive(or CF or SD card if ya have one at hand)its a program that resides in its rom, just make a backup using that program and whenever you have had a hard reset you can run the old backup after the initial startup and have your Toshiba exactly the way it was before.

[Janak Parekh]

I don't know what version of OS is running in it. How would I find out?
Go to Start => Settings => System => About. If it says "Microsoft Pocket PC Version 4.20.0", it's WM2003 First Edition. If it says "Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition Version 4.21.1088", well, then it's obvious. ;) You can download the SE update from Toshiba's website. Note that doing a firmware upgrade will cause you to have to do a hard reset on the device and reinstall everything, but there are numerous improvements. With SE, my standby time is probably 4-5 times better. 8O Either Toshiba made some changes to their power management, or I didn't install some buggy program that I had on before.

--janak

[yankeejeep]

I hate to say it, but I think most of us have learned the importance of regular backups by a situation just like this. We're so used to the hard drive world of desktops and notebooks that it doesn't sink in that the PPC is all memory until the memory gets cleared. I do a full backup to a memory card at least once a month and again before installing most software, just in case. The backup that comes with the e80x has saved my device more than once by recovering a good system backup from my CF card when all else has failed. Certainly easier than reinstalling a ton of apps, which I can't do when I'm on the road, anyway. It has also taught me to keep copies of critical documents on one of the memory cards.

You might also want to keep a copy of the Flash ROM drive on a memory card. I learned that the hard way, too.

[mikecr]

Thanks all.
I'm going to install the WM2 update, and backup as much as I can regularly.

[newst]

One more point. You can leave the E-800 in the charging cradle for indefinate periods without risking damage to the LI battery-which is what I do if I'm traveling without it.