Are you gonna buy a new HP again?

[Derek]

So, by now, we all know about the big poop-up by HP for not releasing WM2003SE and not letting the customer choose wether to update or not. Question is, are you gonna buy a new HP again?

I'm really interested in this because my opinion was always that HP was the best brand to get when you wanted a PDA, and want to know if someone USED to share this thought.

[sracer]

Yes, I will buy another HP provided they offer a device that I want. I love my 2215 and it is by far the best PDA I've owned yet.

I made my purchase decision based on what it could do at the time of purchase...and not on some chance that an upgrade might be available.

I've had the 2215 for a year and it has exceeded my expectations. If HP produces a device that packs in even more functionality (built-in WiFi, dual slots, onboard VGA-out port) I'd be all over it.

[FortimirCE]

sracer is EXACTLY right.

No manufacturer is OBLIGATED to provide firmware/OS upgrades unless specifically stated. You should make purchases decided on how they are at TIME OF PURCHSE.

Now, it's a different story if tech support specifically told you that you would be getting WM2003SE.

But non-the-less, an issue like this would not make me stop buying HP products. They obviously had a reason, whether it is stupid or not.


I have a Cassiopeia E-125 that is running PocketPC2000. I remember when PocketPC2002 was released, I never got an upgrade. I was disappointed, but guess what. Installed Pocket Facelift, and moved on with my life. And my E-125 still has full functionality, and it is FAR past it's life-expectancy. I never said I would stop buying Casio products because they didn't give me an OS update.

[dean_shan]

I've never bought from them becasue I like having a scroll wheel.

[timmer]

I havent voted because I am still undecided. I will wait and see the reviews of the new VGA devices coming out. I will probably get the Asus A730 or Loox 720 but I havent discounted the IPaq 4700 completely yet.

I'll wait and see some benchmark results between them first. The 4700 will win, but it will have to be by a large margin for me to consider it.

[blumma]

I received my IPAQ as a gift. However, I don't think I would replace the one I have with another Ipaq.

[Sven Johannsen]

I am voting yes, because I certainly am not precluding HP because they aren't offering an upgrade this time. Wasn't anything wrong with my Jornadas or 2215, or 4155. Nobody ever promised me an upgrade, just support, and that has been stellar. I'm not impressed with the new line-up, however.

I'd have to disagree that it "Now, it's a different story if tech support specifically told you that you would be getting WM2003SE." If it was written down, I would agree, but getting this from a tech support person or a Circuit City sales guy, doesn't cut it. You could make promises your company didn't support; they still wouldn't support them and you'd get fired. I don't think I've ever seen any PPC OEM issue a blanket "we will" policy.

[whatsnext?]

i am undecided. yes i agree that when i purchased my 4155 that i did not expect an upgrade. that is life. yeah it would be great and cool.

on the other side, that recently HP has been having a lot of problems with its computers, period.

on the other other side, HP seems to have the best support of mobile devices and seems to have the best ppc's anyway. Dell's PPCs seem really cheaply manufactured to me and yes i have held one.

on the other other other side, Some people think that the new ipaqs look really cheaply built.

(for the last time)on the other other other other side :D most of HPs stuff is pretty solidly built.

[Kati Compton]

I'd have to disagree that it "Now, it's a different story if tech support specifically told you that you would be getting WM2003SE." If it was written down, I would agree, but getting this from a tech support person or a Circuit City sales guy, doesn't cut it. You could make promises your company didn't support; they still wouldn't support them and you'd get fired. I don't think I've ever seen any PPC OEM issue a blanket "we will" policy.
Depends - could be HP told their sales staff it'd be available. And at any rate, it sounded like it happened to several people, and wasn't an isolated incident.

[christak]

I don't see buying anything HP currently has shown on its horizon -- I have a 2210 and am quite pleased with it. At this moment, I'm pretty much in an anti-HP frame of mind because of (IMHO) their arrogant attitude, lack of responsiveness to customer concerns, and really lackluster offerings in the PDA area right now (I'll admit the 4700 is somewhat interesting... but it would have to be smaller to be a "real" player for me.) I voted "no"... could my decision be changed? maybe... but, HP needs to get back "in touch" with its users before I'll buy HP again. :(

[Sven Johannsen]

Depends - could be HP told their sales staff it'd be available. And at any rate, it sounded like it happened to several people, and wasn't an isolated incident.

I think that would be odd. Seems like the vendor's sales staff and tech support are always the last to know ;)

[collegea]

I am going to keep my HPIpaq 4150 for another couple of years if it still works well. I've already owned it for 6 months and it has performed quite well. I'm under no illusions. I know that HP like most US Corporations just cares about profits and couldn't care less about anything else. That's Ok. Consumers can play the same game if they are smart. I paid $390 for my IPAQ 4150. HP will wait till I die before I buy another IPAQ. My Palm Zire 72 is real good. I won't switch so quick unless I need too. This is just to let you know HP where things are at.

Power To The HUMAN!

[JD Silver]

Currently I am in love with the form factor of my iPaq 4150. The new iPaqs look too much like a brick for my taste. In the past, I've liked the iPaq series, and the service offered. My next purchase will not be until WM 2005 appears, and I will wait to see if HP is improving their customer relations, or not.

Unfortunately, this the second time I've been hung out to dry. My past PDA was a Toshiba e740, which I ditched to get WM 2003. That being said, I think my next purchase will be mostly based upon features, size and speed, rather than the manufacturer. By next year, I'll be looking for a VGA unit.

JD

[Sven Johannsen]

Unfortunately, this the second time I've been hung out to dry. My past PDA was a Toshiba e740, which I ditched to get WM 2003.

Gee, that history seems to have been lost on that bru-ha-ha on the HP thread where HP is being villified and Toshiba deified. A lot of us have said it, buy it for what it does, not for what it might do. Your e470 didn't get any worse, nor did my X5, 4415 or 2215. Something better just came out. Actually that is even kind of debatable this time.

[pootp]

When I buy hardware, I like to know that it has good longevity for my usage and that the manufacturer is committed to providing new updates and new features through software upgrades. I'm not the type of person who buys a new PDA every year, and every piece of equipment I use, I make sure that I am using it for at least 4 or 5 years before I replace it. I like the sense of using a piece of equipment to it's fullest.

I do buy electronics for the features that are sold as they are released, but I like to know that my device has the potential to get better (for free!). I'm disappointed at HP. I wouldn't totally avoid them the next time I buy a PDA, but like anything, they aren't winning me over with this decision but I'll be open to considering alternative offerings from other companies as well.

I'm likely going to skip buying a device wih WM2003SE and wait a while till the next major release of WM comes out. Anyone know when that is?

[jimski]

Well I already pre-ordered a 4700 :D , so the answer is "yes". When it eventually arrives, I will try it out for a day or two and decide it it will be a keeper.

I never bothered to upgrade my 5450 to WM2003 as I didn't see the added value, so the lack of WM2003SE availability does not bother me in the least. My device has been very, very stable (no hard reset in more than 12 months) and that is a good thing.

I considered the 5500 (128MB) but there was not enough of a difference to sway me. The 2210 was also almost a winner (form factor-dual slot) but the lack of built-in WiFi was a turnoff.

I hope that the 4700 will meet my needs, but if not my decision to look elsewhere will not be based on a manufacturer's policy of offering/not offering OS upgrades. If all devices were stable "right out of the box", I would buy a new one every 6 months and never bother with a ROM update again.

[Pony99CA]

Unfortunately, this the second time I've been hung out to dry. My past PDA was a Toshiba e740, which I ditched to get WM 2003.
Gee, that history seems to have been lost on that bru-ha-ha on the HP thread where HP is being villified and Toshiba deified.
Actually, it wasn't, because I mentioned it there. I said that a lot of people still won't buy Toshiba Pocket PCs because they had a bad habit of orphaning fairly recent Pocket PCs. I also said that they seem to have learned their lesson, as evidenced by their free WM 2K3 SE upgrades for the e400 and e800.

Finally, I said that maybe HP would learn the hard way what Toshiba learned.

Steve

[Pony99CA]

When I buy hardware, I like to know that it has good longevity for my usage and that the manufacturer is committed to providing new updates and new features through software upgrades. I'm not the type of person who buys a new PDA every year, and every piece of equipment I use, I make sure that I am using it for at least 4 or 5 years before I replace it. I like the sense of using a piece of equipment to it's fullest.
I agree. I wonder if the "buy it for what it does now" people would buy a PC that they didn't think would be able to run Windows XP Service Pack 2.

Yes, I know that Pocket PCs, being embedded devices that require ROM builds to upgrade, aren't exactly the same as Windows PCs, and expecting upgrades forever would be unreasonable. That's why I suggested a reasonable compromise -- one OS upgrade for a Pocket PC. You can see my reasons at my Web site (http://thoughts.svpocketpc.com#THOUGHT_OS_UPGRADE_POLICY).

I do buy electronics for the features that are sold as they are released, but I like to know that my device has the potential to get better (for free!). I'm disappointed at HP. I wouldn't totally avoid them the next time I buy a PDA, but like anything, they aren't winning me over with this decision but I'll be open to considering alternative offerings from other companies as well.
That's my feeling, too. I was already going to consider Pocket PCs by other companies after HP abandoned sleeves (I own an iPAQ 5550, so I have a vested interest in sleeve support :-)). Now, their refusal to provide OS upgrades for existing iPAQs -- after having done so in the past (with the exception of the 1900 series) -- will make me consider other Pocket PCs even more.

However, as I can't absolutely say that I won't buy another iPAQ, and there's no "Maybe" answer, I had to vote "Yes". The chances have gone from about 99% down to about 50%, though.

Steve

[Derek]

Okay, now here comes my answer, no.

Why? I Purchased my iPAQ 2210 because I thought HP was a good brand, because they made quality products and had good customer-support. In my eyes, the 2210 looked as a high-end model, with everything screwed on and up-to-date. When I bought my 2210 one month after it's release, I thought it would last for a few years, like the 38xx series. Now, just 1 year later after it's introduction, HP forced me to have an old iPAQ and somehow forces me to buy a new one to have the latest and the greatest. I don't say i'll never buy an HP again, I will just skip this new line-up, and maybe the one after that, until they figure out that screwing your customer isn't the best move to make people buy a new iPAQ.

Hopefully, the Toshiba e830 will soon be mine.

[ironguy]

Derek, why did you buy a 2215? Was it because you were going to upgrade it to WM2003SE or because it is a nice PPC with a lot of great features? HP still supports the 2215 and will continue to do so for quite a while. Your quote:

"Now, just 1 year later after it's introduction, HP forced me to have an old iPAQ and somehow forces me to buy a new one to have the latest and the greatest. "

makes me ask, "How are they forcing you to buy a new one?" ANYTHING in the tech world that is a year old is almost obsolete compared to new items. If you want to keep up with the latest and greatest then you will have to buy new. The tech world advances so quickly that upgrades become almost an impossibility. There is nothing your 2215 can't do that the 4700 can do (with the help of a WiFI card and some software). No it doesn't have a VGA screen, but it was also several hundred bucks cheaper.

I will continue to buy HP products for some of the reasons you named.

I Purchased my iPAQ 2210 because I thought HP was a good brand, because they made quality products and had good customer-support.

HP is a good brand, they do make quality products, and they do have good customer support.

[ChristopherTD]

I will consider another HP. As far as I am concerned the WM2003SE issue is a storm in a teacup. For non-VGA devices there is nothing compelling there, and I am not at all concerned that it won't be available for my 5550.

[Pony99CA]

I will consider another HP. As far as I am concerned the WM2003SE issue is a storm in a teacup. For non-VGA devices there is nothing compelling there, and I am not at all concerned that it won't be available for my 5550.
Nothing compelling for you, perhaps. I personally find this the most compelling upgrade of them all, even without VGA.

The on-the-fly landscape switch is one of the biggest features ever, I think, and the single-column Pocket IE view will make browsing Web sites much more comfortable.

I never bothered upgrading before, instead buying a new Pocket PC, but I'd seriously consider upgrading my 5550 to SE -- especially since HP won't be producing another sleeve-compatible iPAQ.

With no sleeve-compatible models and an apparent no-upgrade policy for future units (they have already said an SE upgrade for the 6315 isn't likely), I see very little value in choosing HP over other Pocket PC manufacturers. ASUS, Toshiba, Dell and Fujitsu-Siemens will now get a lot more consideration from me when I choose my next Pocket PC.

Steve

[makezizz]

I didn't vote because my answer would have been Maybe.

In the past I've had great experiences with HP products in general and all of my PPCs so far have been Ipaqs. When HP and Compaw merged, I was happy because HP was a company that I trusted and I loved my Compaq Ipaq.

When I purchased my current PPC, a 2210, I compared it to the other products on the market and one of the reasons I chose it over the other ones was that it came from a company I trusted. I'd pay more for a product that came from a company I trusted, than a product with similar specs from a company that I didn't trust.

With HP's recent actions, that trust is gone. Now price will probably be the main determining factor for me. With HP's current lackluster offerings I wouldn't buy an HP today if I was replacing my 2210. I might next year if they come out with a superior product at a decent price, but I won't be bumping them ahead of everyone else based on trust anymore.

[rpvdb]

Voted "no" because I'm seriously angry about my new 2210 not getting a WM2003SE upgrade. I prefer making safer investments. HP has seriously damaged their reputation in my opinion.

[jwick]

Whether or not they release software will not be a deciding factor. It will be based on the device itself. If it is worth it I will buy it.

[rpommier]

I'm out also, I'm buying an Axim x30. I lose a CF slot but maintain Bluetooth and gain WiFi.

I know Dell isn't any better with the WM2000SE upgrades, but $251 is hard to beat.

[Constant Caffeine]

I'm undecided. It will all depend on what new features future models have on them. More importantly, it will depend if those new features are needed. I would of like to had SE for my h4155. I use Excel a lot and it would of came in handy. Just as well, my foldable keyboard would not of worked with it. *sigh*

[Steven Cedrone]

Well, I wouldn't be so silly as to completely rule them out because of the upgrade "decision" (or disaster, depends on how you look at it). I do know, however, where I stand with regards to both the unit I have now and any future units I purchase. They will simply never be upgraded (and if they do offer an upgrade, (and I'm not just talking about HP) it will be a "bonus"). The things HP has going in it's favor are build quality, (up until now - don't jump up and scream about the "display issue" of the Jornada 5xx series or the grips on the 22xx series, I lived through both and to me they were not that big a deal) and I also think HP still has very good support. At times support seems to be lacking, but overall, I think it is very good...

One thing is certain: HP will have to work very hard to get my money as brand recognition isn't all that it used to be...

Steve

[rpommier]

(up until now - don't jump up and scream about the "display issue" of the Jornada 5xx series or the grips on the 22xx series, I lived through both and to me they were not that big a deal)
Steve

They were a big deal to me because it was never properly addressed. I sent mine back and they slapped the same grips on there. I've been through 4 pairs of them. If I hold on to my 2210 longer eventually I'll end up paying for them out of pocket, they just don't last.

I could purchase, the one's from Pocket PC Techs, but why should I pay $40 for to solve the problem? I'm not going to bash them, but I'm going to pass on this batch of Ipaqs.

[hashemc]

I too would not go so far as to say I would never buy again from hp but their new line is completely uninspired. The sad fact may be that hp doesn't want to offer upgrades for current models because there would be no reason to buy one from their new line.

:bad-words:

[belinus]

I voted "no" because of their warranty. I had my LCD develop a pressure crack on the LCD panel and, after I explicitly ask the technician "Is this covered?" and receive an affirmative, I get a call that I need to shell out $180 to get it fixed. I had them escalate it and "Mission Control" waived the fee (could be good customer service because they messed up in telling me, or the threat of Attorney General who laid wasste to PayPal for me... you decided why). I looked deeper and found that there is no way to even upgrade coverage like Dell has for their Axims.

The final nail in the coffin is the 2003SE Upgrade lie. I specifically chose my 2215 based on this and now I find out HP back peddled on it.

If HP is going to treat me well up until they get my money and then act like they never want it again, so be it. They won't get my money again.

[ftlum]

With HP not offering OS upgrades, I'm going to take price into consideration first. Who wants to spend $650 for something that is plunging head-on into obsolesence? I want my money to last a bit longer. I think not offering the OS upgrade was a real mistake for HP in the long run. Alienating your customers is not smart. Casio screwed me on the E-100 with their "update offer" and I've not bought a single Casio product since. Not one.

For my next PPC, I will consider Dell (they're generally less expensive, though they haven't won me over with their lack of upgrades either... but at least I won't have spent a lot on an unupgradable unit). And if Asus or Toshiba can get better 3rd party support, they'll be serious contenders too.

[rpommier]

I'm with you on that ftlum. Dell did renig, but then again an Axim will only set you back $251. There are no HP's running WM2003SE that can touch it right now. Unless the 3000 series is a shocker, but with built-in cameras I doubt they'll be under $300.

[christak]

With HP not offering OS upgrades, I'm going to take price into consideration first. Who wants to spend $650 for something that is plunging head-on into obsolesence? I want my money to last a bit longer. I think not offering the OS upgrade was a real mistake for HP in the long run. Alienating your customers is not smart. ...

For my next PPC, I will consider Dell ... at least I won't have spent a lot on an unupgradable unit). And if Asus or Toshiba can get better 3rd party support, they'll be serious contenders too.

I agree completely...

8)