Poor HP business decisions [Archive]

dlangton

08-02-2004, 11:28 PM

I LOVE all my HP products. Of course, I haven't purchased anything they've made in the past two years. I have a Jornada 567/w accessories, an hp deskjet 990cxi, an hp deskjet 350cbi, and an hp colorado tape drive. All excellent products.

Too bad they no longer make anything I'd purchase.

ctmagnus

08-03-2004, 12:05 AM

Discontinuation of expansion pack-capable models, particularly since (it's rumoured that) HP has stated that they would support them for at least one model beyond the 5000 series

lack of WM2003SE upgrade for current models

rpommier

08-03-2004, 01:04 AM

Here's one...

My 2210 is about to go out of warranty. I've had the side grips replaced 5 times. I asked, "What do I do when I'm out of warranty and need more?" I was told I have to purchase after that.

I don't think its fair because its a known defect that they haven't addressed, they need to come up with another solution.

I am also displeased with the decision not to give me an option to upgrade to WM2003SE. I could see if there was a successor to my 2210, but there isn't. The closest thing is the 4700 and it's not meant as a 2210 replacement.

This could be THE mistake that knocks HP off as top Pocket PC dog. Sooner or later every company makes a mistake and this line of PPC's is HP's. Hopefully they can recover from this mess.

rz1700 - outclassed by 1900 series
rx3700 - who knows, it'll have to bring alot to eclips the 4000 & 2200
hz4700 - good machine but the price of a decent notebook

dmacburry2003

08-03-2004, 01:08 AM

It seems that HP has suddenly made a lot of poor decisions...sort of like the opposite of postitive competition. It's almost like all of the sudden they wanted you to hate them.

Before, it was Dell/Toshiba and others making the bad decisions. Now, Dell had some of the cheapest PPC's out there with the most goodies in them and Toshiba released the first WM2003SE update. HP, on the other hand, had been going just fine until they announced no SE upgrades and put a wanna-be low-end PPC out on the market that reminds me of...hmm...I can not think of something to compare it too :lol:
But just about 300$$ for a dinky little box? Come on, HP, what happened to the PPC empire?

I always said I was going to go with HP, but now its not seeming that way. I always thought they would make good, decent, well-built, low-priced products (PPC's in particular :wink: ). Instead, they have started making junk and jacking the prices UP. Its terrible.

Oh well, see ya later HP.

BTW I ordered my new precious Axim X30...but it has not arrived yet :? Stupid shipping.

rpommier

08-03-2004, 02:16 AM

BTW I ordered my new precious Axim X30...but it has not arrived yet :? Stupid shipping.

I've been fighting not to do that... My father just replaced his 3955 with an Axim too, it's sooo sweet. BUT! no CF or VGA.

I'm going to try and hold off for an Axim with VGA, it'll probably be the best priced device out there. If they get one out I'll have to forgo the CF I guess.

joeladams

08-03-2004, 10:22 AM

RE: 3207208028
FR: jamie_ayres

Joe,

I have received your comments from our customer satisfaction group. I
understand that you have purchased an iPAQ 2215 and a 3 year extended warranty
but are concerned about the lack of any future software updates for this unit.

The warranty that you purchased only covers hardware related failures. This
model of iPAQ is no longer being manufactured so new software updates will not
continue to be provided. Even if an OS upgrade were available, the 2215 is not
capable of being upgraded to the newer operating systems due to the limited
memory available in the unit.

If you have any other questions, please let me know.

Thank you,

Jamie
HP Services

This will be my last HP! The 2215 has more memory than one of the new models. Less than one year of ownership, and it's now an orphan!

Never again, HP!!

juni

08-03-2004, 10:41 AM

Yes, a strange message since the HP2210 has more memory than their latest low-end device which is running SE. So you are being lied to...

rpommier

08-03-2004, 11:55 AM

The more I read of this stuff the less I like it...

First I read the 2210 has an end of life of 2005, then I read it's no longer being manufactured.

I really wish Palm didn't have such abismal selection of software, I have so much invested in Pocket PC software there's no way I can switch.

So much for my long standing tradition of purchasing HP products. This policy and their current line of products really make that choice easy.

iPAQ_ace

08-03-2004, 03:03 PM

:grumble: Not offering WM2003 SE upgrades for our beloved current iPAQ's.

Not offering WM2003 SE upgrades for the NEWLY released H6300 series - the Moto MPx is looking good as my converged device (when it gets released with WM2003 SE).

What's up with the rz1700 series? IMO - this is the worst iPAQ ever created. I'd go back to my H3150 before going to this model.

What happened to all that creativity with model designs? The hx4700 is the only one that I am really finding somewhat appealing at this moment.

Kati Compton

08-03-2004, 03:26 PM

Yes, a strange message since the HP2210 has more memory than their latest low-end device which is running SE. So you are being lied to...
I would suggest replying and quoting the 2210 specs and the specs of the low-end SE device, and say "I appreciate your response, but I do not believe that the amount of memory in the 2210 prevents an upgrade to the latest OS, since the newest low-end ipaq with *less* memory comes with the latest OS."

pdaided

08-03-2004, 08:40 PM

Two Issues-

1. They never should have bought Compaq. It caused more headache than help for everyone from stockholders to customers. They were on track to surpass Ipaq easily in a short period of time in my opinion.

2- The recent success of the 1900 series Ipaq was tainted by the fact that IT WAS NOT THEIR DESIGN. This heavily affects margins and profit I'm sure therefore they have sacrificed style and customer satisfaction so that they could implement a similar design that they own into the new lineup.

I'll end here since they just called me back to my doctor's appt... I just love wireless surfing on my 4355 aka 568 retro Ipaq.

pdaided

Kati Compton

08-06-2004, 01:46 AM

HP yesterday issued a statement on their forums as to why they "can't" provide an upgrade to WM2003SE for the "old" devices.

http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/bizsupport/questionanswer.do?threadId=655775

Pony99CA gave a pretty good rebuttal there, but I added one more bit:

3. Many software developers are focusing their efforts on the next release of their applications, as opposed to devising a retro-fit for existing versions. If HP added Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition to its pre-June 2004 launched products some applications would not function in landscape mode properly, and therefore providing no customer value.
So... if an application doesn't work on 2003SE PPCs produced before June of 2004, wouldn't that mean it wouldn't work on a 2003SE produced after then as well? If this were a valid argument, that would mean that no 2003SE devices should be produced because there might be applications that won't work on them.

It's arguments like this and the ROM size one that make the consumers upset with HP. If HP said "We don't think we'd make enough money for it to be worth the trouble", at least we'd know they were being honest (though I'm sure some would argue whether or not HP was right in that assertion).

But with these arguments, HP just seems to be making hollow excuses unbefitting of a grown-up corporation.

sunni

08-08-2004, 12:09 AM

My 2210 is about to go out of warranty. I've had the side grips replaced 5 times. I asked, "What do I do when I'm out of warranty and need more?" I was told I have to purchase after that.

I don't think its fair because its a known defect that they haven't addressed, they need to come up with another solution.

I am also displeased with the decision not to give me an option to upgrade to WM2003SE. I could see if there was a successor to my 2210, but there isn't. The closest thing is the 4700 and it's not meant as a 2210 replacement.

I totally agree, I have also had memory issues with my 2210 since day one!

I would like to upgrade from my 2210 but not sure where to go without spending 500+ dollars.

zoomer777

08-10-2004, 08:28 PM

What is that horrid 1715 device? WHO is actually buying them? Why would anyone buy it? You can still find the 1945, a much MUCH finer device for under 200!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone here mentioned that the 19XX series was not "their own design"....who's design is it? Are you saying Compaq made this design, then when HP purchased Compaq...etc?

The 19XX is one of the best PPC's designs ever, and I have owned a very large amount of these devices. Slim the baby up (a little less in width that is), and add phone capabilities, and you would have a SLICK PPC phone form-factor.

BTW, what's up with the 6315 and the snap on keyboard? Seriously...who wants to carry both that BIG PPC Phone, and a snap on keyboard? You might as well just bring a full size keyboard (like the great STOWAWAY Wireless Infrared Unit) that is only a little bit larger in size! The PPC world is still catching up to the Treo600 (my little baby! - but gosh PalmOS is weak!).

belinus

08-11-2004, 01:33 AM

I definitely have bought my first and last iPaq (2215).

My major complaint is the warranty, or lack thereof. As I posted in another thread, I had a pressure crack on my LCD screen and called Technical Support. I explicitly asked "Is this covered under the warranty and will involve no cost to me?" to which the tech said "Yes". When HP receives the 2215, I get a call saying that I need to pay them $180 to get it fixed.

Naturally I went off on the guy who hastily told me he will escalate the call. I told him he had better because my escalation involves filing several consumer complaints with state Attorney Generals. I am not sure about the one in HP's home state, but mine nailed PayPal to the wall for me so he knows how to whack these guys. A few days later I got an e-mail from "Mission Control" stating that they were paying the fee for me and that screen issues are never covered under warranty. Had they not done this, I would have contacted my state Attorney General.

I looked into warranty upgrade options and found one but it would still not cover this type of damage. In comparison, Dell offers their Complete Care warrantry upgrade ($39 to add it) and covers all types of accidental damage.

Also, the 2003SE lie is the final nail in the coffin. I'm telling people to get an Axim x30 now.

ironguy

08-11-2004, 08:19 AM

Remember, Dell isn't offering a 2003SE either.

belinus

08-11-2004, 08:22 AM

Yeah, but I knew that when I was choosing between the Axim x5 and the iPaq 2215. The upgrade HP was going to give us was what sold me.

At least with the x3/x I could have gotten Complete Care and been in the same boat upgradewise.

ironguy

08-11-2004, 08:30 AM

I don't recall seeing anywhere that HP said there would be a SE upgrade for the 2215.

Good luck with your Dell. Now if they would just come out with a VGA version.

Ripper014

08-11-2004, 09:41 PM

Not that I know anything... but the Hp2200 upgraded with VGA and built-in Wifi would have been something I would want to buy. Of course they would have to improve the graphic acceleration... oh more ram is always good too...

The best part about this... I could use all my current accessories... my upgrade costs would be minimized... You wonder sometimes if companies even think about standardizing things within their own designs... you would think not only cheaper for the customer but for the manufacturer as well.

Zoot

08-13-2004, 11:39 AM

I cannot thank HP enough for making the business decision that I'd be satisfied with WPA rather than having full SE on my 6-month-old 4150. Don't tell me that I don't have enough memory; I can live with some ROM spilling over into RAM or losing my 2Mb ipaq filestore (yeah, what'll I do with a whole 2Mb?!).

I'd happily have the ROM and ditch the MSN bits I don't use so that I could have a better (less crap, actually) PIE browser and landscape without 3rd party tools and without resetting.

If I'm honest, I was never going to run out and get one of the new devices. The non-release of SE hasn't changed that - but I wouldn't go HP again as I do feel let-down. I came from having had a 3630 and I enjoyed the ride from PPC2000 to 2002 and all the ROM support. I would've put linux on that but the battery has finally croaked :)

I'd be tempted to keep my eye on the HTC devices coming along, XDA3/4 models especially. If they can get the size down, who knows?

I wasn't going to go for a ROM update on my 4150 until it threw a wobbler last weekend. I can say that the 1.10 update is nicer but HP could make me soooo happy by changing their mind and delivering WM2003SE for my device - it would make all the difference. I don't expect a WM2004/5 for my device so I don't think I'm either being unreasonable nor unrealistic.

So come on HP, pull your finger out :)

belinus

08-13-2004, 10:47 PM

Good luck with your Dell. Now if they would just come out with a VGA version.

According to Dell, the x5 and x30 both have QVGA TFT screens.

http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/compare.aspx/pda?c=us&cs=2231&l=en&s=eep

Wiggster

08-13-2004, 11:04 PM

Good luck with your Dell. Now if they would just come out with a VGA version.

According to Dell, the x5 and x30 both have QVGA TFT screens.

So, you're reaffirming that they aren't coming out with VGA screens any time soon?

ignar

08-13-2004, 11:05 PM

belinus

08-13-2004, 11:27 PM

So, you're reaffirming that they aren't coming out with VGA screens any time soon?

QVGA works fine. If you need higher resolutions, you need a laptop, not a hand-held.

Wiggster

08-13-2004, 11:30 PM

So, you're reaffirming that they aren't coming out with VGA screens any time soon?

QVGA works fine. If you need higher resolutions, you need a laptop, not a hand-held.

160x160 worked fine with the old Palms, too. It isn't a matter of NEEDING better resolution, or a faster processor, or more features, but they're nice to have. I was just wondering why you quoted someone saying that Dell has no VGA devices coming out with proof that the current devices don't have VGA. :?

I think QVGA still has a lot of life left in the PDA market. We'll see how VGA gets adopted when more devices are available with it.

belinus

08-14-2004, 12:03 AM

160x160 worked fine with the old Palms, too. It isn't a matter of NEEDING better resolution, or a faster processor, or more features, but they're nice to have. I was just wondering why you quoted someone saying that Dell has no VGA devices coming out with proof that the current devices don't have VGA. :?

I think QVGA still has a lot of life left in the PDA market. We'll see how VGA gets adopted when more devices are available with it.

Because VGA is more of an umbrella standard. If you were being technical, then you want a device doing only 640x480x256.

rpommier

08-14-2004, 01:04 AM

So, you're reaffirming that they aren't coming out with VGA screens any time soon?

QVGA works fine. If you need higher resolutions, you need a laptop, not a hand-held.

Never thought of it that way...

I was planning on holding out for VGA resolution but got pissed enough with HP to sell my 2210 and purchase an Axim X30 Mid.

I'm also not buying WM2003SE is a marginal update. Even without the VGA I've noticed a couple of tweaks that say otherwise.

- Font sizing
- Landscape (a click away with PocketPlus)
- The new recent program list on the start menu
- Macro support for transcriber

Those are the ones that made the purchase right for me. I really thought I was going to miss my CF slot, but the wireless freedom of the Axim are indispensible to me after only a day and a half of use, I have a Siemens S56 w/Bluetooth.

Even without VGA WM2003SE is a sweet update.

Ripper014

08-14-2004, 01:14 AM

So, you're reaffirming that they aren't coming out with VGA screens any time soon?

QVGA works fine. If you need higher resolutions, you need a laptop, not a hand-held.

I disagree... the PPC has gotten to the point that I have been able to use it effectively for my work. And I find it a big plus to know that I always have my data with me. The only thing that is really lacking for me is the use of spreadsheets... and having a VGA screen will make it a lot easier to manage for me.

I for one have been waiting a long time for this update in technology.

Kati Compton

08-14-2004, 03:39 AM

Personally, I'm looking forward to VGA for better HTML/PDF (work-related) and eBook reading.

KimVette

08-14-2004, 08:58 PM

Because VGA is more of an umbrella standard. If you were being technical, then you want a device doing only 640x480x256.

Well, two can play the semantics game. Technically VGA = either 320x240x8bits, or 640x480x4bits. 640x480x8bits was originally considered to be a super VGA mode.

;)

bookemdano

08-14-2004, 11:46 PM

As more of a political error- CEO Carly Fiorina's lobbying for accelerated outsourcing.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/02/17/EDGGO50R3R1.DTL

KimVette

08-14-2004, 11:58 PM

As more of a political error- CEO Carly Fiorina's lobbying for accelerated outsourcing.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/02/17/EDGGO50R3R1.DTL

I don't think anyone at all is upset about outsourcing - it's WHERE Fiorina is pushing the outsourcing that is the issue. She's outsourcing outside of the domestic market, and that is by moral and ethical standards treason, plain and simple. I'm sure that if she were outsourcing domestically there would be no issue at all.

I'd love to see Carly's job outsourced to India. I only wish that "article" were real and not satire.