Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition And VGA Resolution

[Janak Parekh]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.pdagold.com/articles/detail.asp?a=184' target='_blank'>http://www.pdagold.com/articles/detail.asp?a=184</a><br /><br /></div><a href="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/articles.php?action=expand,30475">I posted on a neat hack yesterday</a> called SE_VGA that enables "real VGA" unlike SE's default behavior on VGA PDAs, but a few posters were wondering <i>why</i> you'd want something like that. I'll write a bigger article myself one day, but in the meantime, Pavel over at PDAgold wrote up a nice article on exactly how SE handles VGA resolution, complete with lots of screenshots. Microsoft made a conscious choice that may suit regular-end users, but power users may want to seek hacks like SE_VGA to enable more functionality -- especially for PIE's disappointing default behavior.<br /><br /><i>"It is no secret that besides an easy 90-degree rotation of the screen, the main attraction of the latest version of Pocket PC operating system from Microsoft, called Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition, is its support for full VGA resolution (480 x 640 pixels) where supported by hardware. I must say could not wait for VGA devices. Unfortunately, my first encounter with the system was a great disappointment. Surprisingly, it was not Toshiba e800 but HP iPAQ hx4700 that was the first PDA with this feature I could try. If you would like to avoid such a disappointment yourself, I recommend reading this article carefully to find out about all the advantages and disadvantages of the new OS."</i>

[DiGiTYZED]

Good article.

WM2K3 SE is a big disappointment for me too. I was really counting on the VGA thang and it just ain't happening. I liked WM2K3 and MyVGA better. It looked better. In SE everything is too small, especially the input panel. I made a mistake and hit Align Screen in real VGA mode (with SE_VGA) and it was over! There was no way I could successfully align the screen in true 480x640. Forget about it.

I'm starting to think we're not suppose to have 'real VGA mode'. It's not exactly comfortable at all. Good job Microsoft. They made a good decision leaving out real VGA option (I'm not being sarcastic, I'm serious). But the other thing they forgot to leave out was the SE upgrade itself. It's damn near pointless.

I'm ditching VGA in its entirely. I don't see it really happening. They're gonna have to find something else to propel Pocket PCs further. Even on a 7 inch screen I wouldn't care. PDAs better not get bigger than they already are anyway. Screw this, I'm not even gonna get the FlipStart anymore. 1024x600 on a 5.6 inch screen prolly has the same readability as 640x480 on a 4 inch screen if not worse.

To the general user, this is a pointless enthusiast/techie feature and upgrade.

I'm so over VGA and prolly Pocket PCs as well.

[DiGiTYZED]

You know what would really really help right now???

Define Pocket PC and its purpose.

[gorkon280]

The pixel doublign is fine if you can't see to well but that's the minority/ Most users would not know the difference. Us ower users would. Doubling the pixels in a image in PIE? YECH

[davis77]

You know what would really really help right now???

Define Pocket PC and its purpose.



That qoute really struck a cord with me. Thanks for making it DiGiTYZED.

I disagree with you strongly on Mobile 2003 SE. I think it made my E805 look beautiful and with a couple of hacks supplied easily by Tweaks2k2 I can run a couple of key programs that I like in VGA.

But back to your original quoute. I think that the PocketPC does not only what the Palms would do but it is really a PC as well. You can run terminal services, VNC, explore networks, run Music, Video, Do word processing, excel spreadsheets....etc. The list goes on and on. They do everything that a laptop PC does but the limit becomes the size of the screen for me. I really wish it were a little bigger. Keyboard constraints can be gotten around but then you are at the point of wondering if you need a different device.

You touch on something important with your qoute. What do I really want out of my device? I end up trying to do more than it was really intended to do. I would probably benefit from a mid range device between my PPC and my laptop. Some small tablet pc would be good I guess.

[paris]

well cudus to MS for handling VGA the way the did. I can barely read the fonts if they are left to their "true vga size" on sreenshots that are posted on the web, but did you ever sit and think that the pocket pc screen will still be the same size? most of you dont. can you read fonts if you make them 2 times smaller on you pocket pc? you certainly dont. you are gonna tell me that due double pixels you will see them better, yes you will but that does not stop the fact that they are going to be 2 times smaller.

Personally i would not bear font that are smaller than they are on my QVGA pocket pc. I have seen VGA pocket pcs and the thing that they add is more clarity, using a pocket pc in "real" VGA mode will not give you more space to do things but will make people laught at you when you put your pocket pc right at your face to read anything.

[davis77]

using a pocket pc in "real" VGA mode will not give you more space to do things but will make people laught at you when you put your pocket pc right at your face to read anything.

Your comments dont really fit. Your device isnt VGA so you havent had a chance to really work with true VGA and see what it can do. Besides, who really cares about people laughing. (as if it would really happen)

For one thing everything is bright and clear except smaller. Browsing the web at 480x640 is a totally different experience. It really is cool that way. Try to mimic that in QVGA. You simply cant unless you buy an account with Thunderhawk and then its still not the same.

Many other things in true VGA are nice. Reading EBooks is a totally different experience. Sure everything is smaller but then when you make the font larger it is totally nice. Everthing is bright and clear except for the font. You end up with more clarity and more text on the screen.

Until you try it you really cant judge it. Thats why the MyVGA program drew such a big following. It was way nicer than QVGA for SOME things.
Not all.

Having the ability to use both just makes the whole device nicer. Until you try it you just wont know.

[davis77]

To really get a visual example of the differences check out this set of displays posted in this article: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2047

[paris]

Davis as i said i have played with VGA pocket pcs so i can judge it!!! the toshiba.

If you use it in "true" VGA mode its not usable enought, everything is too small. Howeve if you use it with SE the everything changes and as i said cudos to MS who handled it that way.

Certainly is better at VGA, but not in the so called "real" vga mode. In SE you simply read everything with more clarity and the base fonts are better left at the same sine as QVGA pocket pcs. HOWEVER it adds a lot since developers can play with smaller fonts to make the user interface more smart using more detail and small fonts where apropriate, but not aplication wide since i would make everything too small to read.

Also using terminal services for examle is better, however you are not gonna use it alwyas in "true" VGA mode, but you would want to zoom to be able to read things without torturing you eyes.

[paris]

To really get a visual example of the differences check out this set of displays posted in this article: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2047

nope, thats your mistake mate :) take those screenshots put them in photoshop and size them exactly how they yould appear on a 4'' display. they dont look that big do they? :) would you still prefer to use the "real" VGA mode? or the MS way? :) I prefer the MS way, if you still prefer the true vga mode then cudos to your eyes :D hehe

[davis77]

To really get a visual example of the differences check out this set of displays posted in this article: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2047

nope, thats your mistake mate :) take those screenshots put them in photoshop and size them exactly how they yould appear on a 4'' display. they dont look that big do they? :) would you still prefer to use the "real" VGA mode? or the MS way? :) I prefer the MS way, if you still prefer the true vga mode then cudos to your eyes :D hehe


As I said earlier: "Having the ability to use both just makes the whole device nicer. "

Thats your mistake mate.

I use SE for most things and True VGA for some things. If you have to use Photoshop to be able to tell what its like then you obviously dont have a device to see what it is really like... mate. :-)

The ability to use QVGA, SE or Real VGA is a true bonus. You find the best thing for what you need to do at the time. I never want to use butt ugly QVGA any more. I usually use SE and then True VGA for web browsing or long periods of reading.

[Sully]

Maybe these new VGA machines will really shine on the next installment of PPC OS. That is if the OEM's release it for them. :D

[paris]

davis77 as i said 2 times before i have played with VGA based pockets in both SE and "true vga mode" . The fact that i am trying to point our is that people see those big screenshots on the web from vga pocket pcs and they think that they will see all that on the pocket pc and it will be briliant. They forget that those shots shown on the web are not 4'' sized but double that size. VGA is a good thing but when used properly, and ms did it properly.

[Kevin C. Tofel]

davis77 as i said 2 times before i have played with VGA based pockets in both SE and "true vga mode" . The fact that i am trying to point our is that people see those big screenshots on the web from vga pocket pcs and they think that they will see all that on the pocket pc and it will be briliant. They forget that those shots shown on the web are not 4'' sized but double that size. VGA is a good thing but when used properly, and ms did it properly.

You raise a valid point, but I was in a rush to get the screenshots out there to illustrate the basic differences...I didn't have time at work to resize to "actual size".

Keep in mind however, that I set the system font setting was in the middle of the 5 settings. I did this for a specific reason: this gives people the basic ability to see the difference in SE and SE_VGA and still allows for 2 font "bump ups" (or down for the eagle-eyed!)

If I can find the time, I'll see if I can resize to a true 4" display....

Thanks,
KCT

[davis77]

davis77 as i said 2 times before i have played with VGA based pockets in both SE and "true vga mode" . The fact that i am trying to point our is that people see those big screenshots on the web from vga pocket pcs and they think that they will see all that on the pocket pc and it will be briliant. They forget that those shots shown on the web are not 4'' sized but double that size. VGA is a good thing but when used properly, and ms did it properly.

You raise a valid point, but I was in a rush to get the screenshots out there to illustrate the basic differences...I didn't have time at work to resize to "actual size".

Keep in mind however, that I set the system font setting was in the middle of the 5 settings. I did this for a specific reason: this gives people the basic ability to see the difference in SE and SE_VGA and still allows for 2 font "bump ups" (or down for the eagle-eyed!)

If I can find the time, I'll see if I can resize to a true 4" display....

Thanks,
KCT


Kevin,

I think your screenshots did a wonderful job of highlighting the clarity differences and the amount of information you could get onto the display.
I think most people realized that the screenshots were blown up versions that would show the amount of information you could see under VGA. You really isolated and showed the differences well which was why I linked to your article.

Again, to me there is no perfect solution when you are limited to a 4" dispaly but having the flexibility to use either SE or VGA helps to cover all bases alot better.

[Jonathon Watkins]

If I can find the time, I'll see if I can resize to a true 4" display....

Cheers Kevin, that would be usefull. 8)

A nice roundup of 2003SE with some very usefull screenshots.

In the end, one man's meat is another man's poison? At least the PPC can be hacked with great apps like SE_VGA, so you get *exactly* the view you were looking for.

[Janak Parekh]

davis77 as i said 2 times before i have played with VGA based pockets in both SE and "true vga mode" . The fact that i am trying to point our is that people see those big screenshots on the web from vga pocket pcs and they think that they will see all that on the pocket pc and it will be briliant.
I have to agree with davis77 -- it is brilliant. I hold the e805 slightly closer to me when in the small VGA mode, and it's very useable. The biggest problem with the small VGA mode is tapping on the smaller controls, more than readability.

That said, it's not for everyone, but I would like some choice so that the VGA mode can really accomodate everyone.

--janak

[Stake]

The biggest problem with the small VGA mode is tapping on the smaller controls, more than readability.

Now here's a thought...would the tapping problems due be slightly mitigated by the inclusion of a touchpad used as a mouse? Obviously, on the 4705 only...

[Prevost]

To really get a visual example of the differences check out this set of displays posted in this article: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2047
If those photos were at natural scale, they would yield an image of difficult reading.

I still think real VGA won't be readable, I must see it working fine to convince me of anything else. And following the article, it's clear to me that smoothness of fonts isn't a big improvement either, at least not so as to make someone go on this reason into expensive devices.

What (on my personal needs I mean) I see that could render better thanks to VGA is RepliGo and CAD for PocketPC's software. And even on this cases any clarity advantage would be marginal, not necessarily paying up for purchase cost of the device itself.

[davis77]

To really get a visual example of the differences check out this set of displays posted in this article: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2047
If those photos were at natural scale, they would yield an image of difficult reading.



If that amount of information were on the screen it truly might make for difficult reading. The thing the images points out is how much clearer things can look and how much more information you can fit onto the screen. More is definitly not better. Having the ability to taylor it is what makes it really nice. By putting it into VGA mode and then adjusting the fonts to be more comfortable you find you get more information in a more comfortable manner. MobiPocket is a good example for me. I comfortably see about twice as much information on it when running in VGA mode and all of the font is clearer and brighter.


I still think real VGA won't be readable, I must see it working fine to convince me of anything else.



If you get the chance to try it then you can see why MyVGA had such a huge cult following and now why so many people welcome SE_VGA with open arms. Its not for all of your PDA needs but when doing alot of reading intensive stuff or web browsing it definitly gives your device another dimension of usability.

at least not so as to make someone go on this reason into expensive devices.

For me having a VGA device is nice but not the only thing that justified the $600 price tag. Having the newer PXA363 processor with USB ability as well as 160Meg of usable ram and both a CF slot and an SD slot were other things that justified the $600 purchase. After having the 160 meg of ram available I cant even imagine trying to have my pda limited to 64meg anymore.

VGA is nice but not the only selling feature of the Toshiba E805 or the new Ipaq 4700.

[WillyG]

It might sound irellevant, but does running in "real VGA" mode affect batterylife?

[Kevin C. Tofel]

If I can find the time, I'll see if I can resize to a true 4" display....


I've done a quick resize on the Today screen shots to roughly simulate a 4" Toshiba screen. The actual display is brighter and clearer....reduction of the image size (using MS Paint...all I have at the moment! :wink: ) introduced some degredation of the image. The point is again to illustrate roughly what the font SIZE would look like in SE_VGA, i.e.: to help the reader answer the question "Can I read it?".

The shots are on my original link here (http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid2=1127&mode=&order=0&thold=0).

Thanks and I hope this helps.....
KCT

[paris]

many thanks for that Kevin, at least this shows people how small font sizes can be in true vga mode which makes them not readable enought. However in a smart combination of small and normal fonts developers will make miricles.

[christy]

I used to have the 5555 until it turned to ash in a fire, I was happy with it ,however it has been discontinued. The choice now appears to be between the 6315 and the 4705. I like the idea of the phone in the 6315 but I dont't know the difference between the windows 2003 moble and the windows 2003 premium does anyone know ?

[Janak Parekh]

many thanks for that Kevin, at least this shows people how small font sizes can be in true vga mode which makes them not readable enought.
I don't agree entirely -- my desktop LCD stays farther away from my eyes than my e805, and I find the one to the right readable when I keep my eyes at the normal "Pocket PC" distance to the screen.

However in a smart combination of small and normal fonts developers will make miricles.
Of course.

--janak

[Kathy_Harris]

I am *ALWAYS* in VGA mode with MyVGA. While my eyes can stand it, I will continue to use the device that way. BTW, I read about 1-2 books a week on it in full VGA very small font size :)

My boyfriend, on the other hand, can't read anything on it for the life of him.

I'm just glad I have the option to make myself blind :wink: in order to make more use of the PDA (especially in excel and Pocket Informant).

[Kevin C. Tofel]

I am *ALWAYS* in VGA mode with MyVGA. While my eyes can stand it, I will continue to use the device that way. BTW, I read about 1-2 books a week on it in full VGA very small font size :)

My boyfriend, on the other hand, can't read anything on it for the life of him.


And this is the point that so many folks are missing......it's a personal choice. I don't think anyone can say that one VGA method is better than another.....that's up to each individual (and their eyes!!) :wink:

[Prevost]

many thanks for that Kevin, at least this shows people how small font sizes can be in true vga mode which makes them not readable enought.
I don't agree entirely -- my desktop LCD stays farther away from my eyes than my e805, and I find the one to the right readable when I keep my eyes at the normal "Pocket PC" distance to the screen.

However in a smart combination of small and normal fonts developers will make miricles.
Of course.

--janak
Hey Janak, i have heard you are eagle sighted...:D

BTW, the functionality of adjusting font size to make different uses of screen's resolution is built in Palms since the TT. And, in the smallest setting (not as small as in PPC I guess since screen size is not up to VGA) it is tiresome.

Could we say then that PPC is catching now Palm in this regard? :devilboy: ...

[davis77]

Could we say then that PPC is catching now Palm in this regard? :devilboy: ...


Certainly....as soon as you can name the "VGA" Palm device it is supposed to be catching. :twisted:


:wink:

[Janak Parekh]

I used to have the 5555 until it turned to ash in a fire, I was happy with it ,however it has been discontinued. The choice now appears to be between the 6315 and the 4705. I like the idea of the phone in the 6315 but I dont't know the difference between the windows 2003 moble and the windows 2003 premium does anyone know ?
I'm not sure as to what you're referring to here. Most of the new iPAQs are running WM2003SE (not sure if it's Pro or Premium, I'm assuming all but the lowest would be Premium). The 6315 is running WM2003 (presumably Premium). As a result, it lacks on-the-fly screen rotation and a few other enhancements.

--janak

[DiGiTYZED]

You dudes and dudettes are totally missing the point.

Anyway... If you think about it, what's the point of going 480x640/640x480? Let's say for web browsing; we web developers do not design for VGA monitors anymore. 1024x768 is the minimum supported now. The PDAs are still only truly capable of browsing a WAP enabled site, because 640x480/VGA-like sites don't really exist. So what now, designers are going to start designing for VGA displays again because PDAs can do VGA now? Not!

Think about when you use to do a fresh install of Win 95, 98 or NT and you fired up the browser looking for the video drivers and such. Didn't that suck? Cramming all the content on the page into that lil' ass 640x480 screen.

I don't know about you people, but I don't wanna go through that type of web browsing again. Where the banner took up a third of the entire screen. No thank you.

If you wanna get gassed about VGA then go ahead. Remember a PDA has the capabilities of eBooks and web browsing, but that's not its core purpose. Especially not at that font size. I'm positive your eye doctor will not recommend it. If so, then my textbooks wouldn't be so friggin big and heavy.

And why pay $300 - $400 extra for a device that just now reached a screen resolution that the desktop already reached a decade ago and in the same token do it worse.

Sorry folks, this is VGA. It's not gonna get much better than this no matter how much you play with the font size or fix the double sized images.

[scmok]

My forever interest is to have VGA monitor output so that the PDA can replace a notebook computer as a presentation tool. But seems my interest is so far off from any of you. Why ?

Is it nice to go for a presentation without a computer? Most presentation are powerpoint slides with a few bullet point. It doesn't require high resolution. Two years ago, a CF card for VGA output costed $200+ and used a driver that slowed down the PDA to a crawl. But now it comes free if a VGA monitor connector is present. Why nobody pursue along this direction?

[Janak Parekh]

Is it nice to go for a presentation without a computer? Most presentation are powerpoint slides with a few bullet point. It doesn't require high resolution. Two years ago, a CF card for VGA output costed $200+ and used a driver that slowed down the PDA to a crawl. But now it comes free if a VGA monitor connector is present. Why nobody pursue along this direction?
In my case, my presentations are rarely just Powerpoint, and they're a lot more interactive. I got the VGA adapter for my e805, but haven't used it yet. :|

--janak

[davis77]

My forever interest is to have VGA monitor output so that the PDA can replace a notebook computer as a presentation tool. But seems my interest is so far off from any of you. Why ?




Because nobody cares enough about anything I say in order for me to do a presentation. :cry:

[Prevost]

If I can find the time, I'll see if I can resize to a true 4" display....


I've done a quick resize on the Today screen shots to roughly simulate a 4" Toshiba screen. The actual display is brighter and clearer....reduction of the image size (using MS Paint...all I have at the moment! :wink: ) introduced some degredation of the image. The point is again to illustrate roughly what the font SIZE would look like in SE_VGA, i.e.: to help the reader answer the question "Can I read it?".

The shots are on my original link here (http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid2=1127&mode=&order=0&thold=0).

Thanks and I hope this helps.....
KCT
Unfortunately, I cannot adjust my monitor screen size into what's needed to see the screenshots in its intended 4" size; the most I could "shrink" them was into about 5" (1024x768 pixels display)

Even at this size, it is obvious that VGA is not readable. Also consider that surrounding lightning conditions cause reflections in the PDA screen and all this will make viewing more difficult.

[Janak Parekh]

Even at this size, it is obvious that VGA is not readable.
You can't draw that conclusion from looking at the screenshots on a monitor. You typically hold a PDA closer to your eyes than a regular screen. It's quite readable for me. It may be a bit uncomfortable for you, and you might not want it even if it is readable, but I think you'd be surprised.

--janak

[Kati Compton]

Even at this size, it is obvious that VGA is not readable.
You can't draw that conclusion from looking at the screenshots on a monitor. You typically hold a PDA closer to your eyes than a regular screen. It's quite readable for me. It may be a bit uncomfortable for you, and you might not want it even if it is readable, but I think you'd be surprised.
I was able to read the fonts on Janak's PPC, though personally, I would adjust the font a little bigger. ;)

There's a lot of "wrong way" "right way" arguments going on here about how VGA should be implemented. I'm not sure that there is a perfectly right answer.

For text-based applications that let you resize the font (Today screen, readers, etc) I would suggest that running in VGA mode and upsizing the font to where it's comfortable would be ideal. Running in VGA mode, fonts don't HAVE to be small. So in *those* cases, saying "It makes everything too small" isn't a valid complaint. I mean, look at the pictures of the eBook from the link in this thread. Even if I were reading with a larger font than was shown there, I'd want to get all the crispness I could, and it looks like regular SE mode doesn't provide that.

However, there are areas where you *can't* "upsize" the font or graphical elements. Such as some games, the start menu, etc. It's *those* things that would be uncomfortable in VGA mode for some users (myself included). It would be ideal if there were more flexibility to change the "zoom" factor of basically everything, but I'm afraid it would make programming way more complex than it should be. :(

Really, I think a lot of people would be happy if you could choose on a per-program basis if it should be true VGA or SE, and then have 2-3 different sized start bars (small, med, large) that you can use to make the today screen look better in true VGA mode. Have the default font be big enough that no one would complain about it being too small, and then the people that want to shrink the fonts can do so.

It's not that the pro-VGA people are trying to take away big fonts from the pro-SE people. ;)

[Prevost]

Janak and Kati: probably I left to say something I should. When I say "VGA is not readable" I mean using the PPC in VGA mode, what I understand as 640x480 rendering the same amount of info it would in a desktop monitor that size (obviously, no longer available commercially - could I call it "WYSIWYG mode"???) I hope now I made myself clearer... :oops:

I agree with you in that VGA resolution will not only improve text and detail, but also will allow us to find an "sweet point" where both the amount of info displayed, clarity, and text size, are ideal FOR EACH USER. In my case, this would be desirable since it would be an improvement over my current 320x320 Palm resolution that in some cases (RepliGo) looks as not being enough for certain image details. I would also set menu bars to whichever size is the optimal for me no matter this will result to be its size in current 240x320 screens.

But, again, VGA is looking right now as an "extra" for which you have to pay a "premium" that won't cover for its usefulness in some cases. Remember that not all people need, or can make use of, certain capabilities like Bluetooth, WiFi, and dual expansion slots.

[Janak Parekh]

Janak and Kati: probably I left to say something I should. When I say "VGA is not readable" I mean using the PPC in VGA mode, what I understand as 640x480 rendering the same amount of info it would in a desktop monitor that size (obviously, no longer available commercially - could I call it "WYSIWYG mode"???) I hope now I made myself clearer... :oops:
Yes, that's what I'm referring to. That is, take everything on a 240x320 Pocket PC and make it roughly half. It's surprisingly readable.

I agree with you in that VGA resolution will not only improve text and detail, but also will allow us to find an "sweet point" where both the amount of info displayed, clarity, and text size, are ideal FOR EACH USER.
Well, SE may be an acceptable compromise for many people. The controls are the same size as the original Pocket PC, and yet the fonts are sharp so that you can scale them down a little. I personally prefer high resolutions (I run a 1600x1200 LCD screen at both home and work, for example). Like Kati, I'd like it somewhere between SE and VGA.

In my case, this would be desirable since it would be an improvement over my current 320x320 Palm resolution that in some cases (RepliGo) looks as not being enough for certain image details. I would also set menu bars to whichever size is the optimal for me no matter this will result to be its size in current 240x320 screens.
Well, SE mode will give you comfortable-sized UI controls and RepliGo, etc. remain very sharp. ;) My bigger gripe is with the design decisions made in PIE more than other SE applications.

But, again, VGA is looking right now as an "extra" for which you have to pay a "premium" that won't cover for its usefulness in some cases.
I think you'll slowly see everyone transition to VGA, but it'll take some time.

--janak

[davis77]

Even at this size, it is obvious that VGA is not readable.
You can't draw that conclusion from looking at the screenshots on a monitor. You typically hold a PDA closer to your eyes than a regular screen. It's quite readable for me. It may be a bit uncomfortable for you, and you might not want it even if it is readable, but I think you'd be surprised.

--janak

Janak is absolutely correct. I find it very readable. It is also much clearer in VGA mode so that helps the readablity greatly.

[Prevost]

Even at this size, it is obvious that VGA is not readable.
You can't draw that conclusion from looking at the screenshots on a monitor. You typically hold a PDA closer to your eyes than a regular screen. It's quite readable for me. It may be a bit uncomfortable for you, and you might not want it even if it is readable, but I think you'd be surprised.

--janak

Janak is absolutely correct. I find it very readable. It is also much clearer in VGA mode so that helps the readablity greatly.
If so, then I must think that a 4" screen will MAKE a difference compared to 3.6" screens :cry: I like Loox 720...