PalmOne, Facing Declining Sales, Opens Retail Stores

[Ed Hansberry]

<a href="http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&amp;cid=581&amp;e=2&amp;u=/nm/20040507/tc_nm/tech_palmone_dc">http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&amp;cid=581&amp;e=2&amp;u=/nm/20040507/tc_nm/tech_palmone_dc</a><br /><br />"PalmOne Inc., faced with slumping sales of what was once a must-have consumer gadget, is taking the story of handheld computers directly to the public with its own retail stores. Following in the footsteps of electronics makers Apple Computer Inc., Gateway and Sony Corp, PalmOne on Friday unveiled its flagship store in Philadelphia's International Airport. It brings to 11 locations the Milpitas, California-based company has quietly opened since 2002."<br /><br />I suspect they will continue to follow in Gateway's steps and eventually <a href="http://news.com.com/2100-1041_3-5183545.html?tag=nefd_top">close them all</a>. I just cannot fathom that any PDA maker could make a go with retail stores long term. Even Dell is treading very carefully in a retail presence by limiting themselves to kiosks, which basically have product samples of popular items and are manned by personnel that aid the public in ordering Dell equipment online.<br /><br /><a href="http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_story.asp?ID=6794">Palm Infocenter has a bit more information</a> as well as a few photos of the new store.

[Kati Compton]

Yeah... I wouldn't mind seeing a "PDA Store" around here, but focused on just one company? Nah.

[dh]

I would have thought a kiosk type location would work for this kind of thing, especially in a location with plenty of business people. The PHL airport idea they have is good, but a full store and all that overhead will be a killer.

There is already a Staples there selling PDAs. I would rather go somewhere like that where I could compare different types. Of course, I would then look for the lowest price online.

One advantage might be that having just the one brand, the sales people might actually know a bit about the products.

[Kacey Green]

And so begins Palm's official decline...
Just like Gateway

[Steven Cedrone]

Wow! That sounds like a real money maker! :roll:

If anything, a kiosk in the airport might work. Try to get some of those travelers to buy a device and throw in some e-books and some music (or better yet, let them browse Peanut press and download a set number of books)

Ultimately though, this sounds like a failure...

Steve

[Kati Compton]

And so begins Palm's official decline...
Just like Gateway
I think that's what Ed was already saying.

[Pony99CA]

I would have thought a kiosk type location would work for this kind of thing, especially in a location with plenty of business people. The PHL airport idea they have is good, but a full store and all that overhead will be a killer.
That's what I think, too. However, some stores get by selling much lower margin items than PDAs; of course, they sell in much higher volumes, too.

Another alternative is that they are just showcase stores, like Sony runs. I've read that Sony doesn't really expect a lot of people to buy at their stores, but they want a place where people can play with the latest toys.

However, that doesn't seem like it would work for PDAs, either, because PDAs are generally cheaper than the high-end items Sony sells.

Steve

[dh]

If anything, a kiosk in the airport might work. Try to get some of those travelers to buy a device and throw in some e-books and some music (or better yet, let them browse Peanut press and download a set number of books)

Or, along with the books, they could sell movies, already loaded onto SD cards ready to watch on the flight.
The customer will have to buy an adaptor for the power outlet on the plain as well. Heck, we can double the price of the Palm easily with all these add-ons.

[Kacey Green]

And so begins Palm's official decline...
Just like Gateway
I think that's what Ed was already saying.
I know, I was saying that it was bad before, but now it's official just like gateway.

They said "hmm, lets expand our sales scope, instead of building a better product and marketing better"

[Steven Cedrone]

Or, along with the books, they could sell movies, already loaded onto SD cards ready to watch on the flight.
The customer will have to buy an adaptor for the power outlet on the plain as well. Heck, we can double the price of the Palm easily with all these add-ons.

Movies, books, songs, storage cards, WIFI, headphones, battery extenders, power adapters, and ,of course, a nice case as well! All at incredibly high mark-ups!:wink:

Steve

[Kacey Green]

Would there be tax, what with this being an airport and all?

[Pony99CA]

Would there be tax, what with this being an airport and all?
Of course there would be sales tax (in states that have sales tax). Why wouldn't there be?

Steve

[dh]

Would there be tax, what with this being an airport and all?
Of course there would be sales tax (in states that have sales tax). Why wouldn't there be?
Steve
The stores at the airport in Philly are not Duty Free stores. There would be PA tax for sure.

[Kacey Green]

Would there be tax, what with this being an airport and all?
Of course there would be sales tax (in states that have sales tax). Why wouldn't there be?

Steve

I was thinking of duty free

Thanks Pony and dh

[Kati Compton]

To shop at duty free stores (at least at O'Hare), you have to show that you actually have a ticket for an international destination. Either when getting into the International terminal, or when purchasing from Duty Free stores in a domestic terminal (depending on where you go through customs, you might leave from the domestic terminal even if you're going to a foreign location).

And the duty free stores I've seen in O'Hare really only sell perfume, chocolates, and booze.

[Zack Mahdavi]

I think that these stores could be good for PalmOne if they play their cards right. They're trying to follow in Apple's footsteps, and that's why they've created these beautiful looking stores. From the looks of it, the stores look simple and pleasing to the eye. Also, like Apple and unlike Gateway, PalmOne will be stocking their devices for instant gratification.

If they can find good places to sell their devices at, they might get people on the Palm bandwagon. This is what definitely helped Apple.

However, two things to consider:

1) Don't annoy your resellers. This is one thing Apple has done, and things are getting pretty ugly. Some long-time Mac resellers are shutting down their stores or filing class-action lawsuits against Apple. Palm can't afford to get into these kinds of legal disputes at the moment.

2) What Apple sells at their stores brings in a lot of money. Apple profits of its stores, but that's because they are high margin items like software and their computers. PalmOne probably would have to sell in high volume to break even. However, most of their devices go for under $400, so that shouldn't be too terribly hard.

We'll have to wait and see. Gateway made some pretty bad mistakes during its retail career. If PalmOne can be careful and follow Apple's footsteps, it might be onto something good.

[Kacey Green]

To shop at duty free stores (at least at O'Hare), you have to show that you actually have a ticket for an international destination. Either when getting into the International terminal, or when purchasing from Duty Free stores in a domestic terminal (depending on where you go through customs, you might leave from the domestic terminal even if you're going to a foreign location).

And the duty free stores I've seen in O'Hare really only sell perfume, chocolates, and booze.
:hippy: :drool: :drinking:
perfume chocolate booze

[Kacey Green]

I think that these stores could be good for PalmOne if they play their cards right. They're trying to follow in Apple's footsteps, and that's why they've created these beautiful looking stores. From the looks of it, the stores look simple and pleasing to the eye. Also, like Apple and unlike Gateway, PalmOne will be stocking their devices for instant gratification.

If they can find good places to sell their devices at, they might get people on the Palm bandwagon. This is what definitely helped Apple.

However, two things to consider:

1) Don't annoy your resellers. This is one thing Apple has done, and things are getting pretty ugly. Some long-time Mac resellers are shutting down their stores or filing class-action lawsuits against Apple. Palm can't afford to get into these kinds of legal disputes at the moment.

2) What Apple sells at their stores brings in a lot of money. Apple profits of its stores, but that's because they are high margin items like software and their computers. PalmOne probably would have to sell in high volume to break even. However, most of their devices go for under $400, so that shouldn't be too terribly hard.

We'll have to wait and see. Gateway made some pretty bad mistakes during its retail career. If PalmOne can be careful and follow Apple's footsteps, it might be onto something good.
They can do it being ex apple may of them, will they do it? That remains to be seen

[dh]

And the duty free stores I've seen in O'Hare really only sell perfume, chocolates, and booze.
Some duty free shopping areas are great. In the far east are good ones, even London has good deals on electronics and just about everything else. (At least compared to their street prices since the tax is 17.5%).

I do believe that most of the business is still on the booze though. Really good booze ships in Terminals 3 & 4 at LHR.

[ctmagnus]

Yeah... I wouldn't mind seeing a "PDA Store" around here, but focused on just one company? Nah.

The one brick & mortar PDA store I've ever entered had a ~33% markup.

[Pony99CA]

The Palm Valley Fair store is fairly close to me (less than an hour). Maybe I should go there and demonstrate my iPAQ 5550. :rofl:

Steve

[bjornkeizers]

Page 1 guys, read the friggin article.


palmOne's goal with the retail stores is to reach new customers and demographics and build out brand awareness


and


"palmOne retail stores are measured beyond their sales volume," said Kanwal Sharma, director of palmOne retail stores. "They deliver a high-quality brand experience, feature a full portfolio of palmOne products, and help educate customers broadly about what our solutions can do for consumers, media-savvy, mobile professionals, and the always-connected executive."


It's not about pure sales here. No store could survive on one product alone.. This is more about getting the Palm name 'out there' Sure, you and I know what a Palm or a PPC is - but Joe Average doesn't. I could see this working out, even if the stores turn a loss.

If I have family or friends interested in buying a Palm, I'd point them to that store instead of a Staples or whatnot. If I need a Palm, why not buy directly from Palm in the store at a nice discount? They sell palm - they sell accesoiries! No more waiting for that case to arrive!

It's a one stop shop for all your palm needs... Sounds pretty good to me. :D

[Pat Logsdon]

The Palm Valley Fair store is fairly close to me (less than an hour). Maybe I should go there and demonstrate my iPAQ 5550. :rofl:
Now that the paradigm has shifted (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=243663), you could annoy them by asking about their "Pocket PCs". :mrgreen: You could also ask them if you can buy an SD WiFi card. They love that. :wink:

[arnage2]

id like to see albums and movies be released of flash media. It would be nice to maybe rent an extra battery for flight. (i know that in MCO orlando int'l airport, they rent dvds and dvd players, but in chicago o'hare they dont for some odd reason)

Someone would be better off opening a store based on portable devices (mp3 players, laptops, cell phones, and pdas, then just a dedicated pda store)

[surur]

I would certainly enjoy browsing a store dedicated to PDA's, as long as they have a wide range and all the accessories I want or have not even heard of. I spent days wandering around in cell phone stores and computer stores trying to get headphones for my XDA2. It would have been nice going to the local PDA store and choosing from a wide selection. Sometimes I dont want to buy online, as I dont want to wait 2 weeks for my product to arrive. I am also much more likely to spend real money when I can see a product in person, and know what Im getting before I paid for it.

Just because Palm thought of it first, does not mean its a bad idea. However from their description is just sounds like a showcase for their products, and so will get very little traffic.

Surur

[Kacey Green]

The Palm Valley Fair store is fairly close to me (less than an hour). Maybe I should go there and demonstrate my iPAQ 5550. :rofl:

Steve
I'm sorry sir those arn't allowed in here :deal: you'll scare away the customers :agrue: :takethat:

[Kacey Green]

The Palm Valley Fair store is fairly close to me (less than an hour). Maybe I should go there and demonstrate my iPAQ 5550. :rofl:
Now that the paradigm has shifted (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=243663), you could annoy them by asking about their "Pocket PCs". :mrgreen: You could also ask them if you can buy an SD WiFi card. They love that. :wink:
Say to them "Can you get on the internet with that thing?"
"Can I touch it?"
Then ask them a question that makes them feel stupid that they can't answer. When they lie to you point it out and laugh. This can be a fun game for about 15-20min

edit: don't forget to look and act interested or they'll spot you a mile (or a kilometer, what every your favorite meauring sys is a light year I really don't care) away

[Kacey Green]

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees

[Janak Parekh]

Say to them "Can you get on the internet with that thing?"
Actually, most Palms can get on the Internet today -- just not as conveniently as some of the latest Pocket PCs.

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
Will never happen. MS is not in the business of opening stores and has huge distribution channels/deals.

--janak

[dh]

Actually, most Palms can get on the Internet today -- just not as conveniently as some of the latest Pocket PCs.

I had a dial up modem years ago for my Palm Vx. With a 800 number to connect to Earthlink, I could get and send my email from anywhere. I forget what the email program was called but it worked pretty well, better than the standard Inbox on PPC.

Using the T-Mobile HotSpots to get email on my PPC has aways worked well, using WebIS Mail, but sending mail has been a problem all the time. I was going to check out smpt.com but never got around to it.

Clearly, better technology doesn't always mean better results.

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
I must admit, the idea of Dell and HP sharing a store is rather entertaining.

[Janak Parekh]

Actually, most Palms can get on the Internet today -- just not as conveniently as some of the latest Pocket PCs.

I had a dial up modem years ago for my Palm Vx. With a 800 number to connect to Earthlink, I could get and send my email from anywhere. I forget what the email program was called but it worked pretty well, better than the standard Inbox on PPC.
True - I'm being simplistic. Wireless configuration has improved significantly on Palms, as well. I'll take my statement back, but I'll point out that Pocket PC multitasking makes it easier to run multiple Internet-based services at the same time. ;)

--janak

[dh]

Actually, most Palms can get on the Internet today -- just not as conveniently as some of the latest Pocket PCs.

I had a dial up modem years ago for my Palm Vx. With a 800 number to connect to Earthlink, I could get and send my email from anywhere. I forget what the email program was called but it worked pretty well, better than the standard Inbox on PPC.
True - I'm being simplistic. Wireless configuration has improved significantly on Palms, as well. I'll take my statement back, but I'll point out that Pocket PC multitasking makes it easier to run multiple Internet-based services at the same time. ;)

--janak
Agree 100%. My Vx was good for email, but not any other internet functions. The Vx modem was only 14.4kbs if I remember right, not blazing fast by any means. I've not used any of the newer POS devices so I don't know how they would work out.

There have been many times I spent time at the airport, answering emails, chatting with my daughter on AIM, finishing reports and listening to music at the same time. I don't believe any Palms can do this yet.

[Pony99CA]

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
Will never happen. MS is not in the business of opening stores and has huge distribution channels/deals.
While I agree that it's not likely, remember that PalmOne wasn't in the business of opening stores, either, and I assume they also had large distribution channels.

Steve

[Janak Parekh]

While I agree that it's not likely, remember that PalmOne wasn't in the business of opening stores, either, and I assume they also had large distribution channels.
The difference is that MS doesn't need MS-branded stores; every single computer store on the planet sells their stuff, and sells it prominently. PalmOne is looking to create brand awareness via their stores. A MS store would be a liability in essentially every single way.

--janak

[Pony99CA]

While I agree that it's not likely, remember that PalmOne wasn't in the business of opening stores, either, and I assume they also had large distribution channels.
The difference is that MS doesn't need MS-branded stores; every single computer store on the planet sells their stuff, and sells it prominently. PalmOne is looking to create brand awareness via their stores. A MS store would be a liability in essentially every single way.
Yes, stores sell Microsoft software, but how many let you test drive it? For example, people might like to be able to play with Office 2003 to see if they want to upgrade.

In fact, there used to be a Microsoft store (http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/Jun99/microsoftSFpr.asp) at the Metreon in San Francisco. When I went last year, though, I didn't see it, so maybe it's gone.

Steve

[jimski]

OK with the store idea to promote the product, but in an airport? Your audience is very limited and a good number of your potential customers already own or know about PDA's. If you do choose to purchase anything from this store, how convenient will it be to return it if it is just not quite right (try explaining this to airporet security without a boarding pass or do you fly in to exchange your Palm). Most people are in sort of a hurry at the airport, but I will admit that I have walked through the occasional Staples, etc., but assuming that the overhead must be astronomical, I have never purchased anything.

A much better scenario would be a kiosk at a busy shopping mall with a good cross-section of consumers (especially when you are pushing Zires). You still may not sell anything (the merchandise return thing is still iffy), but would get much more exposure.

Just my two cents.

[Don't Panic!]

Everybody seems to be forgeting the price point. PalmOne products tend to cost les than PPC's and PPCPE's. Remember PalmOne has the TREO.

(For fairness sake I must let it be known that I own stock in PalmOne and PalmSource). ;)

Don't Panic!
Bobby

[Kacey Green]

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
Will never happen. MS is not in the business of opening stores and has huge distribution channels/deals.

--janak
I know it wouldn't happen, a software company open a store to sell the work of their parteners to futher their software. But it isn't MS style though they could showcase their own hardware.
Edit: finished reading the post and [childish mode]even though I was joking I was still right[/childish mode] but you were also right, if its closed.

[Racer-X]

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
Will never happen. MS is not in the business of opening stores and has huge distribution channels/deals.

--janak
I know it wouldn't happen, a software company open a store to sell the work of their parteners to futher their software. But it isn't MS style though they could showcase their own hardware.
Edit: finished reading the post and [childish mode]even though I was joking I was still right[/childish mode] but you were also right, if its closed.
Why don't you finish reading the posts before you reply?

[dh]

If you do choose to purchase anything from this store, how convenient will it be to return it if it is just not quite right (try explaining this to airporet security without a boarding pass or do you fly in to exchange your Palm). .
At least the store at Philly airport is outside the secure area so you can easily get to it. Also, because the USAir flights are often screwed up, people will have plenty of time for shopping after missing their connecting flight. (I've spent many unhappy hours and several unscheduled nights there myself).

Your point about returns is a good one though. Many customers will be from out of town. I assume you could return things to Palm in the same way you'd return an on-line purchase.

[adamz]

I remember when the first Apple stores opened near me. There were about 10 or 15 employees in those black apple t-shirts just standing around talking to eachother and waiting for some one to come in. After I walked in, there were a total of two customers there. Of course this all changed after the iPod became popular... now they have less staff and more customers.

[Zack Mahdavi]

I remember when the first Apple stores opened near me. There were about 10 or 15 employees in those black apple t-shirts just standing around talking to eachother and waiting for some one to come in. After I walked in, there were a total of two customers there. Of course this all changed after the iPod became popular... now they have less staff and more customers.

Really, the one in Plano, TX is always busy... I sort of feel sorry for those guys, as it seems they never get a break.. :)

[bdegroodt]

Really, the one in Plano, TX is always busy... I sort of feel sorry for those guys, as it seems they never get a break.. :)

I'd have to second that one. Each Apple store I've been in (NYC, Palo Alto, and Arlington) has always been a busy place.

Contrast that with the Gatway Country stores, and I think the answers to success start to become a little more obvious. Palm can claim it's in the name of branding, but when things get tighter than they are already, they are going to be forced to make some tough decsions (dare I suggest these stores aren't open for more than 3 years?). Branding by a retail kiosk is an incredibly expensive way to build interest in such a low margin product. There's rent, employees, taxes, airports will have concession fees, and on and on. There are wiser ways for Palm to make their product interesting to their potential buyers. But, why should this lesson be learned any better by them. They've dropped so many other balls.

[Kacey Green]

Hey MS could run a store like this featuring all of their liscenseees
Will never happen. MS is not in the business of opening stores and has huge distribution channels/deals.

--janak
I know it wouldn't happen, a software company open a store to sell the work of their parteners to futher their software. But it isn't MS style though they could showcase their own hardware.
Edit: finished reading the post and [childish mode]even though I was joking I was still right[/childish mode] but you were also right, if its closed.
Why don't you finish reading the posts before you reply?
because my PIII 500 (where I do my browsing) doesn't handel IE back and foward very well in xp so if i'm on page 4, it isn't gaurenteed that page 5 will have anything related to a reply on 4, if it nullifes my post i can just delete the whole thing.

[Ed Hansberry]

because my PIII 500 (where I do my browsing) doesn't handel IE back and foward very well in xp so if i'm on page 4, it isn't gaurenteed that page 5 will have anything related to a reply on 4, if it nullifes my post i can just delete the whole thing.
Odd. My PII 366 hanles it just fine. :mrgreen:

This explains why I get post notifications that say "this message no longer exists" when I click on them though. :|

[Aerestis]

would a television commercial not be cheaper? I don't know. It's not the same. But you'd expect it to be effective and less pricey. If they did a reallllyyyy nice looking commcercial that promoted the devices for everyhting they can do, some people would say 'wow, I would love to have one of those.' And they wouldn't even have to go to the air port. So many people I know, who would only listen to mp3's, want a palm. Why? I guess because it looks cool. And I know that if they had the money, they would buy them. I think retail stores will help, but I think other ways, less aggressive ways, would have saved money and had similar results.

[Pony99CA]

If you do choose to purchase anything from this store, how convenient will it be to return it if it is just not quite right (try explaining this to airporet security without a boarding pass or do you fly in to exchange your Palm). .
At least the store at Philly airport is outside the secure area so you can easily get to it.
I don't think that's correct. According to the Palm Infocenter story:

The new Philadelphia flagship store is located in a post security airport terminal.
"Post security" means after you pass through the security checkpoint.

Steve

[dh]

If you do choose to purchase anything from this store, how convenient will it be to return it if it is just not quite right (try explaining this to airporet security without a boarding pass or do you fly in to exchange your Palm). .
At least the store at Philly airport is outside the secure area so you can easily get to it.
I don't think that's correct. According to the Palm Infocenter story:

The new Philadelphia flagship store is located in a post security airport terminal.
"Post security" means after you pass through the security checkpoint.

Steve

Duh! you're quite right. :oops: You do have to go to security to get there. At least it's in a central position where you can get to it from any of the concourses.

I was going to post a map showing the location but it's not shown at PHL.org. THe Staples isn't listed either, maybe that's where Palm is located. The photo at PocketNow looks rather like the PHL Staples front, If that's where it is it's a big store, need a lot of Palms to fill it up.

[twalk]

A few facts posters here are either ignoring or forgetting...

First, there is roughly a 60-65% resale rate for PDAs. This means every time a new PDA is sold, there is a 60-65% chance that the person already owns one. This is an insanely high number considering how small the PDA market is. PalmOne needs to take a few risks to change this.

Second, just like with ipods, most Palms are sold retail. PalmOne can't be happy with how most retail locations are displaying Palms, so...

Lastly, the treo600 now has some real traction. Now notice all the cell phone vendor stores/kiosks...

[Kacey Green]

because my PIII 500 (where I do my browsing) doesn't handel IE back and foward very well in xp so if i'm on page 4, it isn't gaurenteed that page 5 will have anything related to a reply on 4, if it nullifes my post i can just delete the whole thing.
Odd. My PII 366 hanles it just fine. :mrgreen:

This explains why I get post notifications that say "this message no longer exists" when I click on them though. :|
over wirless? with BT in the background?, while serving stuff?

[Janak Parekh]

over wirless? with BT in the background?, while serving stuff?
It should handle it just fine. BT/serving are typically low-processing tasks, even for a PIII 500MHz computer. Chances are you've got lots of other background tasks slowing down your machine.

Now, let's get back on topic, please.

--janak

[Kacey Green]

In my town it would be better for them to do a kiosk at the mall if they find these stores worth the expence to expand thier operations. We have an airport but it woudn't get the sales they are looking for.

[Ed Hansberry]

over wirless? with BT in the background?, while serving stuff?
It should handle it just fine. BT/serving are typically low-processing tasks, even for a PIII 500MHz computer. Chances are you've got lots of other background tasks slowing down your machine.

Now, let's get back on topic, please.
Yes, and stop creating and deleting posts because it does mess up user notifications.

[Lynn]

Humm. Do you think that a web site dedicated entirely to PDA's could succeed?

[Kacey Green]

Lynn a website and a store are entirerly different things. It costs way less to run a site than a store.
and there are quite a few successful PDA only sites that have succeded, this one being more extrodanary in that it is focused on a specific set of PDA and it is still sucessful.

[Pony99CA]

Lynn a website and a store are entirerly different things. It costs way less to run a site than a store.
and there are quite a few successful PDA only sites that have succeded, this one being more extrodanary in that it is focused on a specific set of PDA and it is still sucessful.
It was a joke! (Well, I think it was. :-)) I'm sure Lynn realizes that this site is a PDA-only site. :roll:

You do realize that you don't need to comment on every post, right?

Steve

[Kati Compton]

Actually, I think Lynn meant a *commerical* web site dedicated to PDAs.

www.buyyourpdashere.com or something. ;)

[Ed Hansberry]

Actually, I think Lynn meant a *commerical* web site dedicated to PDAs.

www.buyyourpdashere.com or something. ;)
Hmmm... that one has already gone out of business it seems. :?



:wink:

[Pony99CA]

Actually, I think Lynn meant a *commerical* web site dedicated to PDAs.

www.buyyourpdashere.com or something. ;)
You mean like Data-Nation (http://www.data-nation.com)? (Not to mention Handango or PocketGear.)

However, I thought Lynn was trying to make a point with humor, saying that if PDA-only Web sites could thrive, there could well be a market for PDA-only stores. Maybe Lynn can clarify the point....

Steve

[Jeff from MS]

You guys are making some great points here. There was a Microsoft store in the Metreon, now closed. But basically you are right, it's expensive to operate a store, plus PalmOne is a hardware maker (so it's like walking into a Toyota dealership)...they might have lots of partner accessories and software but there would only be PalmOne and Handspring branded devices available.

We've made a lot of investments in traditional big box retail stores for the Windows Mobile brand, however. I'd be curious to see how many of you have noticed some of that out there and what you thought worked well and what made you go "huh?"

Thanks for all you guys do!

Jeff McKean
Retail Marketing Manager
Mobile and Embedded Devices

[Janak Parekh]

In fact, there used to be a Microsoft store (http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/Jun99/microsoftSFpr.asp) at the Metreon in San Francisco. When I went last year, though, I didn't see it, so maybe it's gone.
D'oh! I stand corrected. :oops: I guess that "never" word is dangerous... I'll stick with "unlikely". ;)

--janak

[Kati Compton]

You guys are making some great points here. There was a Microsoft store in the Metreon, now closed. But basically you are right, it's expensive to operate a store, plus PalmOne is a hardware maker (so it's like walking into a Toyota dealership)...they might have lots of partner accessories and software but there would only be PalmOne and Handspring branded devices available.

We've made a lot of investments in traditional big box retail stores for the Windows Mobile brand, however. I'd be curious to see how many of you have noticed some of that out there and what you thought worked well and what made you go "huh?"


I haven't seen any WM-specific advertising/setups in the nromal brick-and-mortar stores, if that's what you mean.

Something to be aware of - we have several threads on "what's wrong in retail stores" for PDAs. Not that I want to *discourage* Microsoft from supporting them as a venue for PDA sales. In general, for non-power-users, I think they're almost always going to buy from retail stores (my own opinion, YMMV). Power users could go either way.

But Microsoft may have enough clout (and if they don't, I don't know who would) to fix the problems we've noticed. Here's a summary:

Mostly:

1. no power to the units
2. crashed units, employees don't check for need to soft reset
3. broken screens
4. staff that don't know anything about the products, so just point to whatever sells the most regardless of what the particular customer needs.
5. displays that prevent the customer from picking up the units (we want to hold it, see if the button layout works for us, feel the weight, etc... tethers are understandable, but big plastic lock-boxes are counter-productive).
6. only base software installed, no music/movies to show off capabilities, etc.

[Jeff Rutledge]

Mostly:

1. no power to the units
2. crashed units, employees don't check for need to soft reset
3. broken screens
4. staff that don't know anything about the products, so just point to whatever sells the most regardless of what the particular customer needs.
5. displays that prevent the customer from picking up the units (we want to hold it, see if the button layout works for us, feel the weight, etc... tethers are understandable, but big plastic lock-boxes are counter-productive).
6. only base software installed, no music/movies to show off capabilities, etc.

These are excellent! I agree with every one. I couldn't guess a number, but I would think quite a few potential sales have been lost because the products are not displayed properly.

[ctmagnus]

I purchase online without seeing the actual physical product first, before I buy from places like you mention.

[clbsvi]

IMHO: A kiosk store in a high volume area (Mall concourses, airports) seems to work well, for example for cell phones and specialty products such as PPCs. Palm, if smart, could use these as a market research tool, and the franchise owner (kiosk, remember?) could even make $$$ selling both PPC and Palm products in cooperative competition with themselves. Again, IMHO, Palm wizzed away their market dominance by 1. Spinning off the Handspring product line; 2. Never embracing a good Windows type operating sytem; 3. Insufficient RAM and ROM for Windows Media Player type applications; 4. Sticking with/stuck with SD cards vs Compact Flash cards; 5. Slow to adopt reasonably-priced, easily replaceable batteries; and so on.

[Kati Compton]

Sticking with/stuck with SD cards vs Compact Flash cards
I have to admit being tempted to get the Sony UX50 either for myself or my mom at one point, but the Memory Stick is a real deal killer for me. SD is widespread enough at this point that while I prefer CF for the cheapness, it wouldn't prevent me from getting a particular device.