Unlocking an Siemens SX56

[Mitch D]

Does any one know of a way to unlock a sx56 that does not require me to pay someone I don't know for a weblink that might not be legit? I won one on ebay today but it is locked to AT&T...

Thanks in advance

[Pat Logsdon]

Here you go (http://wiki.xda-developers.com/wiki/XDAunlock). Enjoy!

[Mitch D]

Here you go (http://wiki.xda-developers.com/wiki/XDAunlock). Enjoy!

SS? Is there anything you don't know? Thanks for the save... again!

I owe you a beer... :beer:

[JvanEkris]

AFAIK: Unlocking the SIM on a XDA/MDA etc. is a violation of the contractual agreements.....

Jaap

[dh]

AFAIK: Unlocking the SIM on a XDA/MDA etc. is a violation of the contractual agreements.....

Jaap
But remember, he got the phone on E-Bay so does not have any contract for it with ATT.

[JvanEkris]

AFAIK, selling a phone does not void the limitations posed by a contract.......

Jaap

[Pat Logsdon]

I was under the impression that it was NOT illegal to unlock a phone, but some companies would rather you didn't. I've heard that some companies don't have a problem doing it for you, some charge a fee, etc.

There may be a grey area in that some phone companies (via the contract) actually OWN the phone until the contract is up. In that case, the seller shouldn't sell it. In the UK, if the cell phone is a contract cell phone (as opposed to no contract or pre-paid) and has been owned for over 12 months, you can apparently do whatever you want with it, short of reprogramming the IMEI ID code, which is DEFINITELY illegal.

The bottom line seems to be that if it's not a contract phone, or if your contract is up, you can unlock it no matter what the phone company says, as it's YOUR property. Besides, I would imagine that that locking users into one provider for the life of the phone would violate anti-trust laws.

I could be wrong, of course. :mrgreen: Here are the resources I found:

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/3935

http://www.unlockyourgsm.com/faq.htm#11

Oftel (UK) Unlock Policy:
http://www.rddirect.co.uk/nokia_unlock.htm

More UK stuff:
http://www.mobileunlocked.co.uk/legal.htm

[JvanEkris]

Well,

I have tallked to the legal guys of O2-NL (now telfort again) and Orange at the time. They had the impression that it was very illegal to do so, and would not mind to sue anybody who violated their contractual rights.

Basically, the contract (at least the contracts i have seen) that belongs to the phone says that if the phione has a simlock, it may only be removed by the telecom provider, or with written permission of the telecom provider. By agreeing with these terms, it becomes a legally binding restriction of the use of a phone. In theory it is a unlimited restriction which should be obeyed at all time, even after it is sold. It even went so far that dabs.co.uk and expansys.co.uk sold the XDA with the warning that it only could be used on the O2 network. This is as valid for pre-paid as subscriber phones, since it is not bound by the contract itself, but to the product.

In the Netherlands, the judge decided that it was unfair to customer rights and fair trading rights. So it is limited to one year for pre-paid phones and the length of the contract for subscription phones, with a minimum of a year. After this period, the provider has to remove it for free. However, it still has to be done by the provider or at least with consent of the provider.....

Jaap

[Pat Logsdon]

Interesting that it's tied to the phone instead of the contract. Just out of curiosity, are there non-provider retailers in the Netherlands where you can get a phone unlocked? There are many places in the US where you can have this done, and I don't think they have any kind of interaction with the provider who originally sold the phone.

I'm not trying to be combative or argumentative here - it's just interesting to hear how others view this issue. :mrgreen:

[JonnoB]

AFAIK, selling a phone does not void the limitations posed by a contract.......

Jaap

Unless he signed the contract, he under no legal obligation to ATT.

[JvanEkris]

I'm also interested in other peoples opinion :)

There are "shops" that unlock phones. They are run by shady figures that also sell cheap phone accessoires (blinking lights and "real" leather cases) and second hand phones. You can find them on market-squares and the low-end shopping malls. It is all performed under the counter. They advertise in obscure ways, you know what i mean.

There have been some raids by the dutch ecominic crimes squad in these shops. All were out of business permanently afterwards. They get sued big time by the providers (charging around 150 to 200 euro's if people want to unlock it before the end of the contract).

There was a trial case in the Netherlands against such a professional unlocker which became quite famous. He managed to bypass the contract by performing the unlocking before a contract was signed (i don't know how he managed to do that though). He got a fine from the judge anyway, because he violated the EULA (that prohibited reverse engineering) and copyrights of Ericsson by retrieving the unlock code from the ROM. Fine was about 5000 euro's (roughly $5000) and a probation of four years.

This is under current legislation (in contrast with American and English court, judges are only allowed to rule based on current laws, and are not allowed to fill in the blanks themselves). There is an amount of pressure from the comming European legislation on software and content protection. These will give our judges and police more reason to condem these people, based on the fact that they have reengineered the software or removed locks in the software they should not remove themselves.....

Jaap

[JvanEkris]

AFAIK, selling a phone does not void the limitations posed by a contract.......

Jaap

Unless he signed the contract, he under no legal obligation to ATT.Limitations to its use are transferred. It is a limitation to the use of the phone. Selling does not void that part of the obligations of the user towards the selling party.

Jaap

[JonnoB]

Limitations to its use are transferred. It is a limitation to the use of the phone. Selling does not void that part of the obligations of the user towards the selling party.


That is absolutely not true unless there was yet another agreement where 'assignment' was made. ATT may make the subscriber of a SIM agree not to use an unaltered phone on their network with the SIM, but there is absolutely no legal basis whereby an agreement between two people is automatically transferred to another when 'assignment' is not tendered.

[JvanEkris]

Limitations to its use are transferred. It is a limitation to the use of the phone. Selling does not void that part of the obligations of the user towards the selling party.


That is absolutely not true unless there was yet another agreement where 'assignment' was made. ATT may make the subscriber of a SIM agree not to use an unaltered phone on their network with the SIM, but there is absolutely no legal basis whereby an agreement between two people is automatically transferred to another when 'assignment' is not tendered.

5.4 Een simlock mag alleen door O2 worden verwijderd.

Vanaf één jaar nadat je een telefoon van O2 in je bezit hebt, kun je gratis de simlock laten verwijderen. In het eerste jaar kan de simlock ook verwijderd worden, tegen een vast bedrag van € 160,87 incl. BTW.For the people who do not read Dutch or have have access to the whole document: It says that by bying the phone, the customer agrees with the fact that the SIMlock may only be removed by O2. It will cost $160,- in the first year, and nothing after the first year.

Selling a unit does not void the rights of O2 has on this phone, since they have subsidized it. Not with pre-paid phones and not even with discounted subscription phones. The European Comission (resembling the US senate) has decided that it is more than fare that a telecom provider that gives a discount on a phone is allowed to earn their investment back, by forcing him to stay on that network for at least a year....

Jaap

[Pat Logsdon]

Do you have early contract termination fees in addition to the SIM unlock fees?

[JonnoB]

For the people who do not read Dutch or have have access to the whole document: It says that by bying the phone, the customer agrees with the fact that the SIMlock may only be removed by O2. It will cost $160,- in the first year, and nothing after the first year.

Selling a unit does not void the rights of O2 has on this phone, since they have subsidized it. Not with pre-paid phones and not even with discounted subscription phones. The European Comission (resembling the US senate) has decided that it is more than fare that a telecom provider that gives a discount on a phone is allowed to earn their investment back, by forcing him to stay on that network for at least a year....


Well, this is not a Dutch phone. This legal language of your point indicates that in your area of the world, the phone is not sold, but leased... and if that were the case for this person in a US market, it would be illegal to modify something that another has a lien on. But, the phone is private property in this case and if the person wants to smash it to pieces, put it in water, or blank out the firmware, it is the choice of the person who then owns that equipment.

[JvanEkris]

Do you have early contract termination fees in addition to the SIM unlock fees?I don't know really. But i've spoken to a lot of people who bought an XDA, payed the 160 euro's and took the least exxpensive subscription (10 euro's per month, with 20 minutse calling time). So i guess it isn't possible/cheap to terminate a contract early.....

jaap

[JvanEkris]

This language you mention indicates that in your area of the world, the phone is not sold, but leased... and if that were the case here, it would be illegal to modify something that another has a lien on. But, the phone is private property in this case and if the person wants to smash it to pieces, put it in water, or blank out the firmware, it is the choice of the person who then owns that equipment.It is owned by you alright. You may demolish it, drive over it, drown it. Nobody complains, because you legally own it. There is nothing in the contract about not being allowed to destroy it.

However, because telephone companies give you a big discount on the phone, they have the right to put extra demands in their contracts, enabling them to earn their investment back.

By signing the contract people agree with the obligation that the phone may not be used on another network for a certain period of time. That is a legally binding agreement between two parties. Transferring ownership of the phone does not dismiss people from that obligation. From a legal point of view, if you buy my phone from me, i am forced to transfer those legal obligations to you, in order to keep up my end of the contract with my provider. For example: i agreed that a MDA will only be used on the T-Mobile network. If i sell it to you i will have to force you to use it on a T-Mobile network as well, to keep my end of the deal. If you did not, i would violate my contract.....

Jaap

[JonnoB]

By signing the contract people agree with the obligation that the phone may not be used on another network for a certain period of time. That is a legally binding agreement between two parties. Transferring ownership of the phone does not dismiss people from that obligation. From a legal point of view, if you buy my phone from me, i am forced to transfer those legal obligations to you, in order to keep up my end of the contract with my provider. For example: i agreed that a MDA will only be used on the T-Mobile network. If i sell it to you i will have to force you to use it on a T-Mobile network as well, to keep my end of the deal. If you did not, i would violate my contract.....


I agree with your basic premise. The seller of the device may be in breach of contract, but the buyer is not as there is no automatic contract with the new owner. If however, the item is still under lease or subsidized contract, then the lien-holder can put a lien on the hardware. It is similar to the recipient receiving stolen property. If however, the contract has expired (beyond its 1yr contract for example) then there is no more obligation to the new owner.