Bad tech support. Really bad.

[Vincent M Ferrari]

I know this is a bit long, but the experience here is pretty disheartening. I would like to be able to use it, but of course, there's a glitch in getting the WiFi working (wouldn't be the first time; there's a flood of people on the forums in various places who have had no luck getting an H555 to connect to their WiFi router)...

So here, unedited, is my conversation with an HP Tech who seemed much more interested in playing with my router than fixing my iPaq:

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:20 PM] -- Vinay K
Hello Vincent Ferrari, Thank you for contacting HP and for your interest in our Instant Support program. My name is Vinay and I see you have a question with your iPAQ. I'm going to take a few moments to review the information of your iPAQ and will message you back, right here, very soon. Please add this page to your Favorites in case you get disconnected or close your browser so you may come back to this conversation.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:21 PM] -- Vinay K
Did you try any troubleshooting steps?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:22 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
I've been troubleshooting since I got it on Tuesday night. I've even done the ROM update from the download page and hard reset twice.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:23 PM] -- Vinay K
Please remove and reinsert the battery.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:23 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Did that.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:24 PM] -- Vinay K
Have you enabled WEP on both the iPAQ and the Router?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:25 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Nope. I turned it off to make sure that wasn't the problem.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:27 PM] -- Vinay K
OK, please enable 64 bit encryption on the Router and the iPAQ. Enable Broad Cast SSID on the Router and Shared key .

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:29 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Shared Keys are not an option in my router. Should I do a 64 bit and then just add a key? Also my router always broadcasts the SSID, there's no way to turn it off.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:30 PM] -- Vinay K
Yes, that should be ok.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:31 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Ok. Wep is enabled.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:33 PM] -- Vinay K
Now, try if it works.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:40 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
No good, and it's not listed on my router's mac addresses. The amber light is blinking slowly, and I have an X by the two arrows in the titlebar.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:41 PM] -- Vinay K
Please enable MAC filtering.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:43 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Can I ask why?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:46 PM] -- Vinay K
That would enable us to isolate where the issue is.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:51 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Before we start isolating problems, can I ask you a question? Why when I run either Cinrond's PocketWinc or Cambridge's vxIPConfig, do I not see an IP at all for the USB wifi adapter? None of that has anything to do with the router because I've already specified all the information in the configuration settings (including giving the iPaq an IP)

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:53 PM] -- Vinay K
OK, when you ping the iPAQ you are not able to get the iPAQ MAC address?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:56 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
I can't ping it because it doesn't have an IP address and doesn't show up in the client list of my router.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:57 PM] -- Vinay K
Ok, Please tap Start, Settings, System, Asset Viewer, Wireless. Do you see your MAC address here?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 7:59 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
yes I do

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:00 PM] -- Vinay K
Please go thorough the below document. It will give you the detail.

(SENDS ME A DOCUMENT ON HOW TO SETUP WIFI ON AN H5555)

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:00 PM] -- Vinay K
WLAN on an iPAQ Pocket PC 2003.doc

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:05 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
I did all this already. It still does not explain why I am not getting an IP reading for the USB adapter EVEN THOUGH I HAVE MANUALLY ASSIGNED ONE TO IT.

I understand how to set up the WLAN. I did everything in this document, and now something is not working properly. So far all we've done is turn on WEP and MAC filtering, but that's done nothing to address the problem of whether or not an IP I've given the unit has been assigned to the USB WiFi adapter.

Can we please address that before we tinker with my router anymore?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:07 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
In fact, all we've accomplished is giving my laptop fits and now it won't connect to my damn router.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:08 PM] -- Vinay K
I am sorry Vincent, these things should have helped us in getting the MAC address. Please give me a moment. I will check on this real quick.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:09 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
I can get the MAC address from the asset viewer. When I open a program that tells me my IP, I get 0.0.0.0 even though I've assigned one.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:10 PM] -- Vinay K
What type of router you are having?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:12 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
USR 8011. Just so you know, I'm turning off the wep so I can get my wife back online and she can go back to work.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:14 PM] -- Vinay K
Thank you. Have you updated firmware on the router?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:15 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
The latest version is 2.0, which is what I have on there.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:23 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
But Vinay, the problem is the iPaq itself is not reading the IP I assign in the configuration settings, and that has nothing to do with the router at all. It has a static IP, dns servers, and a gateway all listed, and none of it is translating for whatever reason.

I could have no router hooked up and looking at the config should at least tell me what IP the handheld is using. Instead I get 0.0.0.0

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:24 PM] -- Vinay K
Ok, I suggest that the best option for us now is to send the unit in for service.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:25 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Ok. Can I get an RMA from you?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:27 PM] -- Vinay K
Please call our voice support on 1-800-652-6672 and our voice technician will setup a repair for you.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:29 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
So there's nothing left we can do with the machine (since we didn't really do anything with it, only changed settings on my router)?

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:32 PM] -- Vinay K
Only I wanted to check those things as already a hard reset and ROM update was done on the iPAQ. One more thing we can try is resetting the Router performing a hard reset on the iPAQ once again and see if it works.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:33 PM] -- Vincent Ferrari
Done that.

Jeez. Okay, I'll get it serviced.

[ Thu, Jan 1, 2004 8:35 PM] -- Vinay K
oK, Thank you.



Absolutely no help. I went outside his script and completely lost him. Of all the techs I've dealt with, he was seriously the worst. This is not a good omen if this is the kind of tech support I'm going to deal with as long as I have an iPaq.

Just so you don't think I was unduly impatient, in the instant support area you can fill in some details about your support request. Almost every single question he asked me that was related to the iPaq was answered by my introduction at the beginning of the session.

If only he read it.

I don't know what to do now. Is it worth sending this thing back to get another or should I just live with my Axim x5? I've heard all kinds of issues with DHCP, which I use quite frequently, and the idea of fiddling with the settings everytime I go to my parents' house is not appealing...

I think I'm going to give my friend back his toy and move on. It just wasn't meant to be :(

[stikfish]

They definitely always seem to try to place blame on the other guy...I'm impressed tho that you found an online support page or link. I've been out to the hp website quite a few times and not found that much help. Is that something specific to their newer products?

[shawnc]

WOW! This is REALLY bad. I just got my wireless working yesterday on my 4155 with very little difficulty. I'm just curious, do you currently have the Axim working with your network? Not that that matters, I was just wondering since I was considering going that route before I purchased my 4155.

[Vincent M Ferrari]

That's what's absolutely maddening about it. My router works great for my Axim and my laptop. It literally took two seconds to get running. This guy did nothing to address the Pocket PC at all. In fact, contrary to what everyone on the internet says, he was telling me to enable MAC filtering and WEP!

Why try to isolate the router as the problem by making it harder to connect to it?!?!

UGH!

I'm going to bring home a router from work to fiddle with over the weekend before I send the damn thing in for servicing. At least I didn't jump the gun and get rid of my X5 yet. The only PPC I've ever really loved is still the most reliable I've ever owned.

[rugerx]

I read about half the tech support transcript, sorry I am lazy.


Try a hard reset?

[PoweriPaq]

Read the transcript, he already did a hard reset.

vincenzosi, may I suggest calling HP Tech support again and get another person before sending it in? Sending it in takes awhile for you to get it back and usually, what I do, call again would get a better more inclined tech person.

Good luck.

I read about half the tech support transcript, sorry I am lazy.


Try a hard reset?

[robfogle]

I would also suggest that you try calling back and requesting a diffrent tech. If you dont get any kind of solution with in the first few minuets ask to speak to a manager and don't let them talk you out of it. I had a similular problem with my wife's laptop connecting in at a reliable speed over wifi. Once I got to a manager and an engineer was assigned the problem was resolved in 20 min. You need to make sure that you let the manager know the problems that you were having with the first line support techs.

I had a similuar problem with my 5555 after doing one of the wifi updates. The way that I fixed the problem was to do a hardreset then install the bios firmware update.

Good luck

[mrkablooey]

At least you got to talk to someone. I sent an email to Sprite Software and they never responded. :roll:

[rugerx]

OK I read the entire transcript.

:wink:

Take or send it back, get a replacement unit.
Enabling WEP and mac address filtering is not going to solve your problem.
Support definitely has a script.

Let us know how it pans out.

[Vincent M Ferrari]

Okay, so part of my plan in dealing with this problem was to try the 5555 at my parents house because I just bought my dad (myself really, if you consider I bought it for him for me to use when I'm there) a new Netgear router.

I turned on my PPC and guess what?

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

Anyway, the iPaq got an ip direct from the DHCP on the router and connected to the internet in literally one second. I hardly know what to say right now, but it all works and it FLIES!

So I took the router, which I will now be using at home, and will get my dad (lol) a new one for his house and ditch the old USR modem. Apparently updated firmware wasn't enough, the router just isn't compatible!

Life is now officially good as I will be playing with my new toy for the rest of the weekend, hopelessly lost in the bliss of the only Pocket PC I thought I would never afford ;-)

As always, you guys are the best, and hopefully you share my sense of accomplishment right now! :clap: :clap: :clap:

[Kati Compton]

Interesting that it *was* a router issue...

[Janak Parekh]

Interesting that it *was* a router issue...
There are quite a few little router incompatibilities across brands, in my experience. :( Especially if you do things like WEP.

--janak

[mrkablooey]

Interesting that it *was* a router issue...

:soapbox: --> :twak: --> :microwave:

;)

[Vincent M Ferrari]

See Kati, at first I felt bad for ragging on the guy for being obsessed with my router, but in reality would having me enable Mac Filtering and WEP have isolated that? It would have exacerbated it! Making it harder to connect to the router doesn't isolate the router as the problem.

That was my point to him. He never even thought that it might be a router incompatibility, that was my idea, and jackin' my dad's router was my idea. He could've suggested it though. I never would've thought my eclectic mix of 802.11b equipment which was working could have incompatibilities with other equipment.

Either way, who cares. It's all academic now, and the bad tech is all in the past. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go set up my fourth and final PPC :-)

[pressenda1844]

What USR router did you have? I'm trying to get my axim (Symbol card on WM2003) to connect to a USR 8054 without any success.

[dmy]

Interesting that it *was* a router issue...

But was it....

I think not....

On his original router, our intrepid WiFi'er was trying to use a static IP address... not really the norm these days, but it should be perfectly acceptable.

On the new Netgear router, he's using DHCP.... more typical these days, and from what I saw of the symptomology, underlies the issue he was having.

The question becomes, when vincenzosi assgned the static address, did he specifically TURN OFF dhcp (or auto-configuation of the IP address). If not, that was his original problem.... if so, it appears that the 4155 was ignoring the fact that he turned it off. If I were a betting man (and I am.... but only when playng Craps in vegas) I'd say that either DHCP wasn't disabled, or that disabling it had no effect.

YMMV

D.

[ctmagnus]

I had that VinayK person on TS once. Didn't solve my problem either. ;)

[maikii]

HP has moved their customer service department to India, as have other companies. In order to save money by paying smaller wages, they have cut jobs in the US, and decreased the level of service.

[Jacob]

Yup, and companies are starting to do the same with software development.

Now, can you imagine what's going to happen when the coding of the software apps is as good as this kind of service? :bangin:

[maikii]

Yup, and companies are starting to do the same with software development.

Now, can you imagine what's going to happen when the coding of the software apps is as good as this kind of service? :bangin:

Well, there are some very good engineering universities in India, and they have turned out some of the world's top engineers. In fact, many of the software engineers in the US are Indian immigrants.

But for customer service or tech support---that really should be in the country where the customer is. Yes, they speak English in India, but it is a very different English than spoken here, and even with the "accent reduction" classes they sometimes give them, misunderstandings occur frequently.

In any case, it's bad for American workers. If the trend towards "outsourcing" continues, everyone might end up being out of a job here, or earning salaries as low as in India or China, to compete with workers there. Then--who will have money to buy things here? What will that do for these businesses--if American consumers cannot afford to buy their products?

Well--getting too OT. Sorry.