Palm To Buy Handspring [Archive] - Thoughts Media Forums

View Full Version : Palm To Buy Handspring

Ed Hansberry

06-04-2003, 01:03 PM

<a href="http://www.bargainpda.com/default.asp?newsID=1407&showComments=true">http://www.bargainpda.com/default.asp?newsID=1407&showComments=true</a> "In a shocking announcement this morning, Palm has acquired Handspring. Handspring has been fighting for survival and Palm has been trying to keep a step ahead of Sony. Now they'll fight together, the deal will be finalized this fall. The Palm board also gave the final approval for the PalmSource spin-off." Actually, the board has approved the purchase of Handspring, it hasn't happened yet. According to <a href="http://money.cnn.com/2003/06/04/news/companies/palm/">this CNNMoney report</a>, the deal won't happen until this fall and will be after PalmSource has been spun off. The spin off was also approved late yesterday. <img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/hansberry/2003/20030604-palmhandspring.jpg" /> Shown are Ed Colligan, Handspring president and COO; Todd Bradley, Palm Solutions Group president and CEO; and Jeff Hawkins, Handspring founder, chairman and chief product officer. This will leave two PalmOS vendors in the consumer/business market, Palm and Sony. Jeff Hawkins, the original founder of Palm and often called the father of the modern day PDA, will become the Chief Technology Officer for the merged company. Hawkins left Palm several years ago to start Handpring. Ed Colligan, Handspring's President and Chief Operating Officer will lead the smartphone division of Palm Solutions. Donna Dubinsky, Handspring's Chief Executive Officer, will join the merged company's board. Both Palm and Handspring have been meandering around for the past few years losing share to both Pocket PC rivals and PalmOS licensee Sony. Perhaps this will allow them to solidify their base. Palm and Handspring often competed with each other aggressively on price, doing little to gain marketshare but doing much to cut margins. There are more details in the joint <a href="http://pressroom.palm.com/InvestorRelations/PubNewsStory.aspx?partner=Mzg0TlRFMU1BPT1QJFkEQUALSTO&product=MzgwU1ZJPVAkWQEQUALSTOEQUALSTO&storyId=88696">Palm/Handspring press release</a>.

Brad Adrian

06-04-2003, 01:30 PM

The deal calls for Handspring stock owners to get 0.09 Palm shares for every Handspring share owned. I guess I don't understand the "exchange rate" here, because that seems to put a very high price tag on the Palm stock.

If I were a Handspring stock owner, I'd rather have cash anyway.

trachy

06-04-2003, 01:41 PM

Talk about things coming full circle. Handspring was started by a couple of Palm execs who left the company because they were sick of the direction it was headed. Now they're right back where they started.

Ivan

06-04-2003, 02:04 PM

Is it April 1 already? 8O

In my opinion, very little was gained by Palm stockholders with this deal... HS was out of the (unconnected) PDA business, pushing into a (slowly becoming) crowded smartphone market. Although I have not seen the new Treo 600, that could be something. :|

06-04-2003, 02:15 PM

This doesn't look like a way for success for Palm and Handspring.

It seems to me that it is so hard to make money in the handheld business that both Palm and HS needed to be purchased by companies with other products (profitable ones).

HS being bought by Apple could have worked. A Palm deal does not impress me at all.

Mike Temporale

06-04-2003, 02:42 PM

HS being bought by Apple could have worked. A Palm deal does not impress me at all.

I agree. Apple would have been much better. The more I think about this, the only thing that Handspring has to offer Palm is there work on SmartPhones. Which hasn't done that well. Apple, on the other hand could have got an entry PDA and SmartPhone out of the deal.

I wonder if Palm will drop the Handspring name, and re-brand all the products as Palm?

whydidnt

06-04-2003, 02:58 PM

Palm and Handspring often competed with each other aggressively on price, doing little to gain marketshare but doing much to cut margins.

I think this is the REAL reason for the Purchase. Palm simply wanted to eliminate a potential competitor. If they gain a leg up in the SmartPhone market so be it. Palm has always wanted to get into Wireless, but has yet to be able to develop any sort of product that many users want. Handspring does have relationships with Sprint and T-Mobile to deliver cell phones...

Whydidnt

06-04-2003, 03:06 PM

prediction...

in 24 months we see the following headline:

"sony buys palm springs".

cheers,
pt

Jason Dunn

06-04-2003, 03:29 PM

Janak Parekh

06-04-2003, 03:55 PM

Pony99CA

06-04-2003, 04:05 PM

What I find interesting is that there's now only two companies making Palm OS PDAs: Palm and Sony.
Not entirely true. PalmSource has the phone licensees (Samsung, Kyocera), there's Garmin, the gaming one, and a bunch of other more specialty licenses. Having said that, yes, I'm not sure that this consolidation will help grow the market either.

Yes, I pointed this out in another forum, too, but you beat me to it here (what a shock :lol:). Granted, Kyocera, Samsung, Garmin, et al don't have the market share of Palm and Sony, but should they not be counted?

Here's a story on Reuter's (http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=J3GR1QR3ISM54CRBAEOCFEY?type=technologyNews&storyID=2876083) about this.

Steve

Ed Hansberry

06-04-2003, 04:08 PM

Pony99CA

06-04-2003, 04:19 PM

There are 2 significant Palm players - Palm and Sony.
I'll agree with that, but that's not what you said in the story (or what Jason said).

This will leave two PalmOS vendors in the consumer/business market, Palm and Sony.
Say what you mean, mean what you say; you know how many nitpickers there are here. :-)

Steve

reidme

06-04-2003, 04:21 PM

I find it amusing that this PPC forum often discusses Palm news (and tries to put a negative spin on it.) You don't see Palm forums obsessing about PPCs.

Foo Fighter

06-04-2003, 04:23 PM

What I find interesting is that there's now only two companies making Palm OS PDAs: Palm and Sony. Granted, both are big and doing well, but I wonder if through the sheer number of OEMs the Pocket PC has, ground won't continue to be made?

I had a similar thought. The now limited choice among PalmOS vendors could hurt PalmOS adoption in the corporate space. This may be a feather in the cap for Pocket PC, especially when you have Dell playing the scene...and they are strongly entrenched in the hearts and minds of IT departments the world over.

Foo Fighter

06-04-2003, 04:26 PM

I think the biggest mistake to come out of this merger was naming Jeff Hawkins CTO. He'll run the hardware group into the ground in no time.

Prepare for a new wave of sucktacular and boring products from Palm SG. :roll:

Ed Hansberry

06-04-2003, 04:27 PM

reidme

06-04-2003, 04:31 PM

I find it amusing that this PPC forum often discusses Palm news (and tries to put a negative spin on it.) You don't see Palm forums obsessing about PPCs.
That's 'cause we aren't a boring news site. We look at the competition and have our "daily news, views, rants and raves." :D

Definitely not boring, thats why I read it every day. And I certainly don't mind being amused!

Jason Dunn

06-04-2003, 04:32 PM

Granted, Kyocera, Samsung, Garmin, et al don't have the market share of Palm and Sony, but should they not be counted?

I forgot. I'm sorry.

huangzhinong

06-04-2003, 04:52 PM

I find it amusing that this PPC forum often discusses Palm news (and tries to put a negative spin on it.) You don't see Palm forums obsessing about PPCs.
That's 'cause we aren't a boring news site. We look at the competition and have our "daily news, views, rants and raves." :D

Another reason is most PPC users used to be palm users. PPC users know palm very well but a lot of palm users have no idea how PPC works.

T-Will

06-04-2003, 05:39 PM

Is it April 1 already? 8O

I had the same thought... :? If it was Apple buying Palm then I would know for sure that I went through a time warp and it was actually April 1st.

kettle

06-04-2003, 05:47 PM

As a long time SPRINT PCS subscriber I'm not too worried about Palm shelving Handspring's phone/pda designes cause' there are so many other players in the market making SPRINT PCS phones... oh wait I'm screwed.

scrinch

06-04-2003, 07:02 PM

Here's a link (http://www.treocentral.com/content/Stories/229-1.htm) to a photo of the new Treo 600 from Treocentral. Looks like a mini Hitachi G1000. Hasn't the knock on the G1000 been its size?

Handspring has said that the GSM/GPRS version would be the first released (2003Q3), but this unit is CDMA and shown at a Sprint Users Forum this week in Dallas.

frauen1

06-04-2003, 07:39 PM

The now limited choice among PalmOS vendors could hurt PalmOS adoption in the corporate space. This may be a feather in the cap for Pocket PC, especially when you have Dell playing the scene...and they are strongly entrenched in the hearts and minds of IT departments the world over.

I disagree with this point. Sony really hasn't shown any interest in the enterprise market. Their strategy is very consumer-oriented. Palm is the only PalmOS vendor who has any real traction in the enterprise. Now enterprise seems to have more interest in converged devices, and a Palm-branded smart phone (Treo) could be the path that the Tungsten W started up.

(Of course, the real competition here is Java-enabled smartphones in the states and especially Symbian devices (read: Nokia) in Europe. Neither Handspring or Orange/Microsoft have had much success in these markets at this point, but don't count either of those out yet, it's still too soon.)

AndrewLubinus89

06-04-2003, 07:57 PM

Three cheers for ppct! I love reading ppct every day even though I don't even have a ppc! I would love to get one (no $$$ :? ) but I still read it every day because of your wide coverage of news. I have a visor edge though but anyways,.....nice,

cdunphy

06-04-2003, 08:02 PM

Yes, I pointed this out in another forum, too, but you beat me to it here (what a shock :lol:). Granted, Kyocera, Samsung, Garmin, et al don't have the market share of Palm and Sony, but should they not be counted?
Too small IMHO. THose companies don't appear on any marketshare reports. Anyone being crammed down into the "other" line just isn't a significant player.

There are 2 significant Palm players - Palm and Sony.

Uhm, Ed - I hate to break it to you - but other than HP and Dell, ALL the Pocket PC licensees are DEEP into the "other" line on market share reports as well.

There are a lot of Pocket PC licensees, true. But very few of them are doing anything interesting other than cranking out clones. Hell - a lot of them are even using the same reference designs with just different plastic wrapped around them. <yawn>

Here is the current roster of "announced" Palm OS licensees:

+ Aceeca - Devices for the industrial and measurement market.

+ Acer - Very nifty devices for China, Asia, and Europe.

+ AlphaSmart - A cross between a laptop and a PDA, for the educational market.

+ Fossil - The worlds first full PDA-in-a-watch. On sale THIS month.

+ Garmin - The worlds first integrated GPS / PDA. Extremely cool device. On sale "soon"... (Garmin is the Id Software of the hardware world... "It is done when it is done...")

+ GSL - Doing a cool camera phone / PDA for asia and europe.

+ Handspring - Makes arguably the best converged phone / pda devices anywhere.

+ HuneTec / WebLink Wireless - Doing a small wireless messaging device that is surprisingly cool.

+ Kyocera - Cool clamshell PalmOS smartphones.

+ Legend - PDA's for China.

+ Palm SG - The worlds #1 (by far) handheld maker.

+ Samsung - Amazingly cool phones. The i500 is the first PDA / phone combo anywhere that actually looks and feels like a regular cell phone in your hand. The size is amazing.

+ Sony - Arguably the world's most inovative consumer electronics company.

+ Symbol - The world leader in industrial handhelds.

+ TapWave - This company is going to turn the gaming world on its ear...

Notice - not a clone maker in the bunch. Every PalmOS licensee is innovating, and exploring new markets, form factors, and functionality.

This is a night-and-day difference from the Pocket PC world.

- chris

Fzara

06-04-2003, 08:26 PM

This is HUGE.

FOO!?! WHERE ARE YOU!? Did you not make a prediction that in 2003, HS will be bought by Palm Solutions Group!?

This is definitely big. I wonder what the effect will be for Palm.

Ed Hansberry

06-04-2003, 08:37 PM

There are 2 significant Palm players - Palm and Sony.

Uhm, Ed - I hate to break it to you - but other than HP and Dell, ALL the Pocket PC licensees are DEEP into the "other" line on market share reports as well.
Toshiba is not in "other," at least not in any of the reports I've seen in the past 6 quarters.

But if you want to throw down a long list of names :roll: Pocket PC and Smartphone can do that too.
Siemens
Zayo
Alaska Cove
Casio
Viewsonic
Packard Bell
NEC
Acer
Yakuma
MyPal
Fujitsu Siemens
Eten
MiTAC
Legend
Samsung
Orange

Yes, some of these are clonish in their featureset, which has both positive and negative sides. I know when I buy any Pocket PC, it has a SIP, can play music, can do voice recording, email, etc. Palm has, IMHO, gone from a feature set that was too limited to a dizzying array of features that causes confusion.

Ask someone casually knowledgeable about Pocket PCs which one they should buy that can do voice recording, play music and has Excel. They will go "any of them."

Ask that to a casual Palm user. They will go "No clue. you need to go to the store and look at the features."

heov

06-04-2003, 08:54 PM

what do smartphones have to do with ppcs? I was under the impression they were just wince variants, like hpc2k. Can smartphones2k2s run the same software as ppc w/o recompiling? just curious.

reidme

06-04-2003, 09:00 PM

But if you want to throw down a long list of names :roll:

Don't roll your eyes Ed, you started it... :wink:

Thinkingman

06-04-2003, 09:33 PM

I remember him making that prediction to! When you said that i remember the posts and the arguing that was going around.
I own HS stock, mmm , wonder how i am going to fair in the deal. :roll:
I like what was said, " Songy buys palm springs" hahaha, that is funny and cool:)

Thinkingman

06-04-2003, 09:43 PM

I personally dont like palm os. i used it once and dont think i will ever use it again. we will see when it comes to the merger if it will pay off.
If apple would have bought HS that would have been highly interesting.
Hopefully, we will see a good combination of improved flexibility on pda's and pda/phones.

Jonathon Watkins

06-04-2003, 10:54 PM

Granted, Kyocera, Samsung, Garmin, et al don't have the market share of Palm and Sony, but should they not be counted?

I forgot. I'm sorry.

We forgive you Jason. :wink:

Yup - we all remeber Foo's prediction. Any more Foo? :twisted:

Jonathon Watkins

06-04-2003, 10:55 PM

Three cheers for ppct! I love reading ppct every day even though I don't even have a ppc! I would love to get one (no $$$ :? ) but I still read it every day because of your wide coverage of news

Yup - same here - I started here more for the news & views, PDA's came second. Not anymore though. 8)

spursdude

06-05-2003, 12:55 AM

So is cdunphy really a PalmSource employee?

And I had just the same reaction that this was some sort of prank...

cdunphy

06-05-2003, 01:04 AM

So is cdunphy really a PalmSource employee?

And I had just the same reaction that this was some sort of prank...

I am indeed VERY real.... :-)

PS - Jeff Kirvin of Writing on Your Palm (www.writingonyourpalm.net) had been a Pocket PC convert for most of this past year. But he has switched back to PalmOS and a Zire 71: http://www.writingonyourpalm.net/column030505.htm

This is a great article from someone who is an expert in both PalmOS and PocketPC, and I think Jeff has always been fair and balanced in both his praise and criticism. Check it out - I'd love to hear any thoughts.

pro_worm

06-05-2003, 02:56 AM

I find it amusing that this PPC forum often discusses Palm news (and tries to put a negative spin on it.) You don't see Palm forums obsessing about PPCs.

It is because Palm users - and this is arguable - lack brains.

:mrgreen: nothing personal

beq

06-05-2003, 02:57 AM

I'm a PPC user but I gotta say I appreciate your points cdunphy, they offer additional context so I can appreciate a more balanced bigger picture :) (Not that I'm taking "sides" -- we're all in this together as gadget junkies).

I also realize anything that's a unique advantage can always be regarded as a liability if you just switch your viewpoint 180deg (hence Ed's "locked-down standardized hardware spec is a GOOD thing") :mrgreen: Both are right I suppose...

But I agree let's not count Smartphone...

Pony99CA

06-05-2003, 03:00 AM

what do smartphones have to do with ppcs? I was under the impression they were just wince variants, like hpc2k. Can smartphones2k2s run the same software as ppc w/o recompiling?
Well, a "smart phone" (not a proper noun) just means a phone that can act as more than a phone. Examples include Palm, Windows CE and Symbian devices. In particular, devices running the Pocket PC Phone Edition would be considered smart phones, and they do run Pocket PC software as is.

The Smartphone (http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/smartphone/default.asp) (proper noun) is Microsoft's phone-based smart phone. It will not run Pocket PC software for a variety of reasons (such as different screen sizes and programming APIs, I think).

Steve

Pony99CA

06-05-2003, 03:06 AM

Jeff Kirvin of Writing on Your Palm (www.writingonyourpalm.net) had been a Pocket PC convert for most of this past year. But he has switched back to PalmOS and a Zire 71: http://www.writingonyourpalm.net/column030505.htm

You're leaving out an important fact, though. To wit:

I'm still in the Pocket PC camp, as well. I use the Pocket PC Phone Edition as my phone. Let's try to keep the chants of "Traitor" to a minimum for a change.

So he's using both devices.

Steve

TawnerX

06-05-2003, 03:07 AM

Deslock

06-05-2003, 06:12 AM

I find it amusing that this PPC forum often discusses Palm news (and tries to put a negative spin on it.) You don't see Palm forums obsessing about PPCs.
Yeah, ppcthoughts has always been (at least) as anti-Palm as it is pro-PPC. It's stupid, but it's part of the site's charm.
So is cdunphy really a PalmSource employee?

I am indeed VERY real.... :-)

Nice to see people stepping in here with some even-handed posts... though diffusing the usually-outrageous-rants this soon means the thread won't be nearly as amusing... :mrgreen:

He also picked up V35 right before Z71, what makes you think he won't picked up h2200 in a couple of weeks?
Good question... he'd be giving up the Z71's camera, more vibrant screen (assuming the 2200 has the same screen as the 1910) and the instantaneousness of PalmOS (all things he wrote positively about). But he hasn't found an ebook reader he likes for PalmOS5, the Z71's volume is a little weak, and he has problems with Graffiti2.

Maybe we should start a poll... Will the large screen, dual slots, and faster CPU of the 2200 win him back?

Abba Zabba

06-05-2003, 06:36 AM

Another reason is most PPC users used to be palm users. PPC users know palm very well but a lot of palm users have no idea how PPC works.

Preach it brother :!:

I really don't think this will spur any new debate about the Palm group. They're all just dying off one be one. :boohoo:

Abba Zabba

06-05-2003, 06:38 AM

And to put an end to the debate about Apple coming out with it's own PDA... it won't happen. I read somewhere that they aren't planing on coming out with their own device.

I would like to see what they would come out with if they did make their own device. What would it include :?:

Steven Cedrone

06-06-2003, 03:48 AM

Thread cleaned up...

Please STAY on topic...

Steven Cedrone
Community Moderator