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View Full Version : Which P/PC is right for me.. hey, that rhymes!


M@
05-29-2003, 09:38 PM
I am currently looking to buy a P/PC and because of my primary reason for buying it is a little exotic, no article or review has enough specific information.

I need, or rather, I want a device which is:

-- Good for Music -(Stereo Headphone Jack, but more importantly: No hiss V.I.P.)
-- Has Word/Excel - Don't all P/PC's have that though?
-- Enough battery life for a respectable amoung usage (bear in mind I won't be using it the whole time) from London to Cornwall, (300 miles journey, roughly 5 to 8 hours depending on the ever increasing traffic)
-- Fairly inexpensive, but isn't that on everyone's agenda?
-- Some scope for memory upgrade, SD is fine.

The device does not, however, need to have:

-- A particually brilliant screen, but it would be nice to have a good screen
-- Bluetooth, or other wireless networking (I simply do not need it)
-- Light, it has to be able to be held, but it will be used more of a miniture lap-top than a palm-top.
-- Security, a password is good enough for me.
-- Weight? So long as I can hold it...
-- Extra Software


I think that's about it. It would be really helpful if you gave me a bit of advice, I'd rather enter this market with a bit of background information so I won't get swolled up too easily by the large corporations.

etalianstallion
05-29-2003, 09:58 PM
I would recommend the Dell Axim X5 basic model along with an extended battery (additional).

It has a brilliant screen, good battery life, is reasonably priced, has both CF and SD slots.

Dell has a coupon right now (93FC28188FCD) that will take $30 off of $350 for the Dell Home Store. Keep in mind that the coupon expires today.

Dell Axim Basic - $199
3400 Battery - $99
Kingston 256MB Compactflash Card (item 691272-4) - $48.14 (there is a $20 rebate available for this--make sure you print out the rebate before you purchase)

The total comes to $296.14 (after coupon and rebate), shipping should be free, possibly no tax depending on where you are located.

Just my 2 cents....

etalianstallion
05-29-2003, 10:12 PM
Oops, sorry, I didn't even think to look to see where you are located. It may be that this would only be good for order in the US.

In case you can place this order, I would recommend taking the SD instead of the CF since no rebates are required.

Sandisk 256MB SD Memory (item A0074419) - $56

Anyone know how the international orders work with Dell?

M@
05-29-2003, 10:21 PM
Anyone know how the international orders work with Dell?
Slowly, I'd imagine if you count of Royal Mail.

I was looking at Toshiba's e330, seemed to fit most requirements, although I did notice a lack of praise about the screen on many websites supporting the device...maybe I'm just looking too closely.

I have a personal hate of Dell, although this keyboard works properly despite the pointlessly positioned E in the middle of the logo: Dell computers are not, in general, very popular in my mind...please remember, Audio quality is paramount.

Again, thankyou for you help

dh
05-29-2003, 10:40 PM
I have the Axim and use it for both music and movies. Obviously the quality of sound is going to depend on the headphones you use and the parameters of the music file.

I tend to use 128KBS OGG files which gives super sound quality.

The Axim also has excellent battery life and , like all PPCs comes with Pocket versions of Word and Excel. Be warned, these are pretty sucky and if you do a lot of wordprocessing you will want to invest in Textmaker which is much much better.

To give you an idea of battery life, we live in the south of New Jersey and often drive to New Hampshire, about 6 hours door to door. Last time my daughter watched three full movies which kept her quiet most of the trip. Battery life is better still with music cos you can turn off the screen.

Don't worry about not liking Dell, the Axim (like most if not all PPCs) comes from China so it must be good. :D

M@
05-29-2003, 10:45 PM
Very very tempting...

But, I want to research as much as possible: Toshibas have always impressed with me with their laptops, I guess Pocket PC Toshibas would be good? Or I could be wrong.

etalianstallion
05-29-2003, 11:03 PM
I would select the Dell over the Toshiba just for the screen itself. I would recommend that you go to a local store to see the difference between the transflective and the reflective screens.

Audio quality for me has been good. I output it directly to a pair of Altec Lansing speakers and I can't really tell the difference between that and playing MP3's from my PC. Then again, that could just be saying 1 of 3 things: either my hearing is not too good, I have mediocre speakers, or I have a mediocre sound card. Then again, I'm not a true audiophile.

The Dell has great battery life which I find hard to beat with the Toshiba PPC's. That, and if you get the 3400 battery, man, you can go for quite a while playing music.

Toshiba does make some good products. I was deciding between the E740 and the Axim X5 at the time of purchase since both were comparable in price (the E740 required rebates). The screen just didn't do it for me when I saw it in the store, and I heard many stories about how the back-up battery doesn't really work as it should. I do see some improvements in the new E750/E755, but given the price range, I can't blow that kind of cash on a PPC right now.

I prefer CF over SD (at least for now) simply because once you go past the 512MB mark, SD is much more costly than CF. I'm sure that the prices will even out soon, but until then, it's CF for me.

Hope you find the right PPC to suit your needs. :)

M@
05-29-2003, 11:10 PM
In the UK an Axim 5 (the lower spec one) - £187
e330 (from Amazon) - £199.99

Which is very, very good considering what it is. But is the £12 less worth the weight it entails?

etalianstallion
05-29-2003, 11:27 PM
Yes, the Toshiba is definitely thinner than the Dell, but then you only have a SD slot (as opposed to SD and CF). You will have a reflective rather than a transflective screen, and worst of all, no removable battery.

The reflective screens will use up your battery life quicker than a transflective screen will, although you can always leave the screen off if you are just playing music. The battery in the Toshiba is only 1000 mAH as opposed to the Dell's 1400 mAH (and the optional 3400 mAH).

M@
05-29-2003, 11:31 PM
It seems then, Dell it is! :)

But! I have one last question..

Do I go for Low Spec Dell or the High Spec one?

Hmm I think Low Spec is best, plus BIG-MOTHER-OF-ALL Battery or reasonable card.

This may sound big brother like, but: Which Dell, you decide.

etalianstallion
05-29-2003, 11:37 PM
Based on what you are going to be using your PPC for, I think the low-end Axim will suffice. I would recommend that you also get the USB cradle--it looks cool. Plus you can charge both your Axim and the extra battery at the same time.

PetiteFlower
05-30-2003, 01:16 AM
I have the Basic; I sometimes wish I'd gotten the Advanced but for the extra memory, not the extra processing power which I haven't felt the need for yet. If you don't think you'll be installing a ton of extra applications, then the Basic with a storage card will be good for you. But DEFINITELY get the cradle if you're getting an extra battery; otherwise there won't be a way for you to charge the extra battery when it's not connected to the Axim!

Pony99CA
05-30-2003, 01:39 AM
please remember, Audio quality is paramount.
If that's really the case, I think you'd be better off with an iPAQ. The iPAQs (with the exception of the 5450; I don't know about the 1910) have been known for their audio quality and volume.

Until you stressed audio, I probably would have recommended the Dell, too, but I think you'd be best served with an iPAQ 3950. It has good audio, a 1400 mah battery (although it's not removable) and perhaps the best screen available.

The lack of a removable battery isn't quite as bad as it sounds. If you find you need more battery life, you can buy the Compact Flash Expansion Pack Plus. Not only will you get a CF sleeve, but a secondary -- and removable -- battery. That will likely cost another $100, but you can always buy it later.

Steve

PetiteFlower
05-30-2003, 03:09 AM
The only problem with that suggestion is the $400 price difference!

The built in speaker on the Axim is pretty crappy, but if you're using headphones or hooking it up to your car stereo, it will sound fine.

spursdude
05-30-2003, 05:35 AM
The only problem with that suggestion is the $400 price difference!
3955 is $350 (at Amazon), the CF+ sleeve is $100 - any extra memory bought cancels out between the Axim and the iPaq. So $450 for the iPaq bundle, where as the Axim Advanced is $325.

I see a $125 difference....

M@
05-30-2003, 08:19 AM
Although the sound quality is paramount, it doesn't have to be the best: if you consider I will be going at 60 MPH along old Cornish roads for some of the time that I will be using it...

M@
05-30-2003, 08:38 AM
What I mean by that is..sound has to be good but not perfect, similarlly screen doesn't need to be perfect: just good.

Also it has to be fairly solid: not to be shaken apart by a lot of travel.. :?

M@
05-30-2003, 11:51 AM
Just following up on something that has been said:

- Do I need the cradle to charge the battery? Or can the DC Power In suffice?

Pony99CA
05-30-2003, 01:56 PM
The only problem with that suggestion is the $400 price difference!
3955 is $350 (at Amazon), the CF+ sleeve is $100 - any extra memory bought cancels out between the Axim and the iPaq. So $450 for the iPaq bundle, where as the Axim Advanced is $325.

I see a $125 difference....
And, if you don't need the CF+ sleeve, the difference is only $25.

However, I think the comparison was being made with the cheaper Dell, so the price difference would be greater than that.

Steve

Pony99CA
05-30-2003, 01:58 PM
What I mean by that is..sound has to be good but not perfect, similarlly screen doesn't need to be perfect: just good.
There's no worry about "perfect sound" in any PDA (or any audio system, for that matter). I really doubt that any PDA has an audiophile-quality audio section. :-)

Steve

M@
05-30-2003, 02:22 PM
You've convinced me.

Dell.

I will probably buy the lower spec one with a 64 MB card. Any last words of warning/advice?

etalianstallion
05-30-2003, 04:09 PM
You can charge the Dell with the power supply it comes with, but only the battery that is used in the unit itself. The cradle would allow you to charge both the battery in the Axim and a spare battery. Otherwise you would have to swap out the batteries to charge them. If you are not buying a second battery, then it's not a big deal.

If you want to use it in your car, you can always get a cassette adapter or an AM/FM tranmitter for your PPC.

M@
05-30-2003, 04:20 PM
Well, the main reason I want an MP3 player for the car is to cope with the diversity of taste of music between my family and I...

Basically to stop arguments on the already long drive!

Crystal Eitle
05-30-2003, 04:21 PM
I will probably buy the lower spec one with a 64 MB card. Any last words of warning/advice?

Mmm. It might be worth it to get the higher spec one. The extra memory alone would be worth it. You think you're only going to use your Pocket PC for playing music, but once you get it, you might really fall in love with it. Then you'll be wanting to use it for EVERYTHING, and the extra internal memory would mean you could load a lot of programs in there.

On the other hand, the Axim does have a CF slot, and Compact Flash memory is cheap. So maybe it isn't such a concern.

I guess my advice is to go with what your budget allows.

Jeff Rutledge
05-30-2003, 04:32 PM
I totally agree with Crystal.

I started with a 64MB card and filled it up very quickly. So I got a 128MB, then a 2nd 128MB. Now I have a 256MB which seems to be enough...for now.

I'd get the largest memory card you can afford.

M@
05-30-2003, 09:19 PM
Thankyou so much for your advice/help. I'll try and remember to let you know when I get it hehe..

Thanks again

nosmohtac
05-30-2003, 10:35 PM
Thankyou so much for your advice/help. I'll try and remember to let you know when I get it hehe..

Thanks again

Let me add my $.02.

I have an ipaq 3970 and I love it, but I was going to buy a dell. The only reason I didn't buy a dell was because I like using mine as a universal remote, which the Dell did not sound suitable for.

With that said, I would definitely go for the high end Dell if your budget allows. 32MB of RAM is sufficient most of the time, but once you start personalizing your device with different themes, and your favorite programs. you'd be suprised how quickly that 32MB becomes about 16MB of readily accessible RAM.

I store most of my programs on an SD card, but even then most programs write information to the registry for add/remove function, and other things (I am not a programmer, nor do I understand this fully).

Lastly, if you follow the previous recommendation to get the cradle, which I would also recommend, you just cut the price difference between the 2 by another $20 US.
The Units look and feel identical (I have had a chance to play with both), but for the price difference I think you are way ahead to go with the advanced model.

M@
05-31-2003, 11:07 AM
Thankyou so much for your advice/help. I'll try and remember to let you know when I get it hehe..

Thanks again

Let me add my $.02.

I have an ipaq 3970 and I love it, but I was going to buy a dell. The only reason I didn't buy a dell was because I like using mine as a universal remote, which the Dell did not sound suitable for.

With that said, I would definitely go for the high end Dell if your budget allows. 32MB of RAM is sufficient most of the time, but once you start personalizing your device with different themes, and your favorite programs. you'd be suprised how quickly that 32MB becomes about 16MB of readily accessible RAM.

I store most of my programs on an SD card, but even then most programs write information to the registry for add/remove function, and other things (I am not a programmer, nor do I understand this fully).

Lastly, if you follow the previous recommendation to get the cradle, which I would also recommend, you just cut the price difference between the 2 by another $20 US.
The Units look and feel identical (I have had a chance to play with both), but for the price difference I think you are way ahead to go with the advanced model.

I see what you mean, to put that in real money (for my benefit)

Cost of Standard Model = £187
Cost of Performance Model = £234

Difference = £47

Cost of Cradle = £29.38

So therefore, roughly, I pay £17.62 extra for the extra memory...

Putting it back in green notes for your benefit, £17.62 = $29.03


Damn America's inexpensive products.

M@
05-31-2003, 11:11 AM
Cheapest on the Net for iPAQ 3970 - £349.99
List Price for Dell Axim 5 Advanced - £187

Difference £162.99

That's nearly double: Plus, I don't have enough remote controls to make it worth while.

Sony Remote for Stereo
Freeview Remote for TV

and, well, that's about it. Not worth £162.99.

Scott R
05-31-2003, 03:31 PM
The main reason I'd recommend going for the higher-end model would be for the larger Flash ROM which would mean a greater likelihood of being able to PPC 2003 (and hopefully whatever version comes after that). Considering the rumors of a PPC 2003 release on 6/23, though, I'd probably recommend waiting till then before you did anything.

Scott

Pony99CA
05-31-2003, 05:35 PM
The main reason I'd recommend going for the higher-end model would be for the larger Flash ROM which would mean a greater likelihood of being able to PPC 2003 (and hopefully whatever version comes after that).
Some of the newer Pocket PCs coming out sound like they might only have 32 MB ROM and run Pocket PC 2003. Now that may mean no user-accessible flash ROM, or Microsoft may make Professional and Premium packages like they did for Pocket PC 2002, but I suspect there will be a 32 MB version.

Steve

Scott R
05-31-2003, 05:38 PM
Some of the newer Pocket PCs coming out sound like they might only have 32 MB ROM and run Pocket PC 2003. Now that may mean no user-accessible flash ROM, or Microsoft may make Professional and Premium packages like they did for Pocket PC 2002, but I suspect there will be a 32 MB version.I believe you are right, and of all of the PPC manufacturers out there, I'd put my money on the American ones (Dell and HP) supporting upgrades since they're more apt to be dealing with enterprise customers. All that said, I personally would leave nothing to chance.

Scott

M@
05-31-2003, 10:35 PM
Well there are two definate things which will happen when P/PC 2003 comes out

- Prices for P/PC 2002 devices will fall, dramatically (or at least seem less hehe compared to newer devices)
- Prices for P/PC 2003 devices will be outrageous. (or at least seem more compared to older devices)

I get the feeling that I'm repeating repeating myself.

But one thing which isn't certain is the actual usefulness of P/PC 2003.

For instance, I spent a good few years saying "I didn't want Windows XP" and how I thought it was pointless and how I was "happy" with 2000.

Then I got XP.

2000 is a very bad O/S.

But considering the Usage/Lack-of-Usage of this device, I may simply buy the Dell for Patient People.

Bringing me to my next question:

What is Dell Standard like for watching movies, I heard someone mention their daughter watching films on one.. How lossy is it? How battery consuming is it? Is it worth me spending extra on memory to make it less lossy?

Thanks

dh
05-31-2003, 10:48 PM
What is Dell Standard like for watching movies, I heard someone mention their daughter watching films on one.. How lossy is it? How battery consuming is it? Is it worth me spending extra on memory to make it less lossy?

Movies play really well on the 400MHz Dell. I have not tried anyother PPC, I'm sure they play pretty much as well.
If you encode a full movie in DivX format it takes up about 200MB so you need at least a 256MB storage card. I use a 1GB CF card and keep movies (2 or 3 at a time) my music and e-books on it.

I even use watch movies on my Axim at home sometimes. Great for watching in bed, you don't have your wife yelling at you to turn off the TV. I also read my e-books in bed too. Again it's great in that you don''t need to have the light on and disturb anyone.

If you ever get stuck at an airport for any length of time, having your books, movies and music with you in one small package is fantastic. (Even doing boring things like finishing a report or answering work email is better if you can listen to U2 at the same time :lol: )

Oh and as I mentioned before, with the standard battery we got through three movies before the low battery warning. That was with the screen pretty bright in the daytime. I don't remember if the Axim had just been charged or used for a while before the trip.

M@
05-31-2003, 10:56 PM
What is Dell Standard like for watching movies, I heard someone mention their daughter watching films on one.. How lossy is it? How battery consuming is it? Is it worth me spending extra on memory to make it less lossy?

Movies play really well on the 400MHz Dell. I have not tried anyother PPC, I'm sure they play pretty much as well.
If you encode a full movie in DivX format it takes up about 200MB so you need at least a 256MB storage card. I use a 1GB CF card and keep movies (2 or 3 at a time) my music and e-books on it.

I even use watch movies on my Axim at home sometimes. Great for watching in bed, you don't have your wife yelling at you to turn off the TV. I also read my e-books in bed too. Again it's great in that you don''t need to have the light on and disturb anyone.

If you ever get stuck at an airport for any length of time, having your books, movies and music with you in one small package is fantastic. (Even doing boring things like finishing a report or answering work email is better if you can listen to U2 at the same time :lol: )

Oh and as I mentioned before, with the standard battery we got through three movies before the low battery warning. That was with the screen pretty bright in the daytime. I don't remember if the Axim had just been charged or used for a while before the trip.

Well! I am quite proud, today I compressed a DivX file (~ 42 mins) down to 64 MB whilst keeping it 'fairly' watchable. Shame I've seen that particular file beyond the point of entertainment.

No it isn't anything obsene.

Tis a compilation of special effects me and friends have created... very very humorous to make, you don't quite get the same appreciation watching it without humorous commentry from us.

Well that is perfect, I'll be in the back seat of a fairly comfortable car very very frequently being transported back and forth from Cornwall... yes there is a Car Power Socket in the back- VERY handy, odd I only noticed it today!

Speaking of which, there doesn't seem to be a power adaptor on the Dell website but, like I do, I researched a little on the internet (Sod America, God Bless Google!- I don't mean that in a literal sense, honest) and found a few power adaptor claiming to be Dell Axim compatable.

Claiming.

nosmohtac
06-01-2003, 12:18 AM
The main reason I'd recommend going for the higher-end model would be for the larger Flash ROM which would mean a greater likelihood of being able to PPC 2003
Scott

I almost forgot about that. That is really the main reason I went with a 3970 ipaq over the 3955. but after seeing the post on the front page about TinyWin98 (http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS2426241007.html?foo=Development%20suite%20embeds%20Windows%2098%20in%2016MB%20Flash%2005-27) only taking up 16MB, suddenly I am not so concerned about this any more. With the current OS taking up about 22-26 MB, they can make a lot of improvements and still keep it under 32MB.

I've been seeing a lot of new devices coming out with only 32MB of ROM. Maybe MS will make the improvements to the OS, and let people choose which of the appz they want on their device. For example, if you don't use Window Media player, because you use .ogg files, then you shouldn't have to have that app taking up space in ROM.

I know this is off topic from the thread, but I would like to see a core OS in ROM and let each user decide which apps he wants and use the available ROM space as safe storage like many of the pocket pc's out there already do.

Scott R
06-01-2003, 04:13 AM
...but after seeing the post on the front page about TinyWin98 (http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS2426241007.html?foo=Development%20suite%20embeds%20Windows%2098%20in%2016MB%20Flash%2005-27) only taking up 16MB, suddenly I am not so concerned about this any more. With the current OS taking up about 22-26 MB, they can make a lot of improvements and still keep it under 32MB.Yes, but isn't TinyWin98 made by some other company? There are plenty of great programmers capable of making highly efficient code, but MS has not historically been known for this.

Maybe MS will make the improvements to the OS, and let people choose which of the appz they want on their device. For example, if you don't use Window Media player, because you use .ogg files, then you shouldn't have to have that app taking up space in ROM.

I know this is off topic from the thread, but I would like to see a core OS in ROM and let each user decide which apps he wants and use the available ROM space as safe storage like many of the pocket pc's out there already do.I wondered about this when the "special" version of PPC 2002 came out for the iPaq. I remember thinking, why can't someone choose to have a dictionary for Pocket Word over having Transcriber, for instance. I hope you're right and they move in this direction. I really can't think of any reason why this shouldn't be possible. I think of it along the lines of choosing the "Custom" option when you're installing MS Office on a desktop. For that matter, I think it would be great for people to be able to yank out certain parts of the "standard" PPC OS on a brand new PPC. Some people may not want Pocket Word or Excel at all and would rather use that part of their flash ROM for other stuff.

Scott

M@
06-01-2003, 09:11 AM
There doesn't seem to be a power adaptor on the Dell website but, like I do, I researched a little on the internet (Sod America, God Bless Google!- I don't mean that in a literal sense, honest) and found a few power adaptor claiming to be Dell Axim compatable.

Claiming.


Also, now I am not too worried about battery power so long as there's a car adaptor possible... any changes in model reccomendations?

nosmohtac
06-01-2003, 11:42 PM
M@ :

I still highly recommend the advanced Axim.
I have several coworkers who weren't interested in pda's at all, and they took my suggestion and bought DEll's. A couple of these bought the low end ones thinking that would be enough. Now, they are having so much fun with them they want to bump up to the high end one.

Like I said earlier, The price difference is not that great if you were going to buy the basic one and add a cradle to it, If you want to save a few more dollars, and don't mind a slightly used unit, there have been some good deals on dell's in the buy and sell forum on this site.


Scott R :

I agree with you entirely,
Although tinywin98 was developed by another company, it still show the potential to cram a powerful OS into a tiny space.
This has often been my complaint about laptops and now tablet PC's....No instant on. Put the OS on a large Flash ROM chip.

M@
06-02-2003, 05:01 PM
Thank you all for your help and advice. Especially etalianstallion, dh and Pony99CA your comments have really helped my decision.

etalianstallion
06-02-2003, 05:50 PM
No problem--glad to help. 8)