Do we really need bluetooth in a PPC ?

[maximus]

Do we really need bluetooth in a PPC ?

I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall. Suppose you are accompanying your girlfriend/spouse to a mall, and she decided to go into a Vidal Sasoon and get her hair fixed (reshaped, recoloured, toned, tonic treated, etc.) ... you can just say "sure hon, go ahead", and get your PPC out, start surfing the net, etc.

Buy why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Personally, I say, scrap the bluetooth, and replace it with a GSM/GPRS card. hence you can just plugin your SIM card, and voila, it is a mobilephone and a PPC.

[marlof]

I've used a Pocket PC / GSM combination (the HP Jornada 928; somewhat like the T-Mobile Phone Edition) and I didn't like it that much. I found out that I'm a two device person. I like my mobile phone to be small (and definitely not the size of my Pocket PC). Next to that, adding GSM / GPRS and an antenna will make the Pocket PC somewhat bigger than without the GSM / GPRS and only Bluetooth. Also it will be more expensive. But even if I would have liked the combo, I'd still would have liked a Bluetooth chip inside of it. Think about a nice wireless Bluetooth headset to go with your Pocket PC / GSM combination....

[Vincent M Ferrari]

Buy why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Just a question, and I mean this without being hostile...

Do you carry your PPC more places than you carry your phone? And do you carry your PPC at times when you don't carry your phone?

I for one don't, therefore the combination works beautifully for me.

[Eitel]

I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall.

I wish I had a mall with a WiFi hot spots near. Unfortunately, if I want to do the same I need to have my T68i with me to be able to surf the net with my PPC. The nice thing is that I don't need a hot spot. I can connect from anywhere my phone has signal.

[bobkatt]

Buy why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Well both Bluetooth and 802.11b are wireless but they are both for 2 different purposes. Bluetooth is for accessories like keyboards, mouses, and headphones as an example. 802.11b is for wireless communications to your desktop or to a network as an example.

This is why Bluetooth has a shorter range and slower connect rate.
End of the day, Bluetooth is 1/10th the cost to implement therefore manufacturers like using Bluetooth for the wireless accessories.

Hope this clarifies the difference.

Bob

[WyattEarp]

Do we really need bluetooth in a PPC ?

I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall. Suppose you are accompanying your girlfriend/spouse to a mall, and she decided to go into a Vidal Sasoon and get her hair fixed (reshaped, recoloured, toned, tonic treated, etc.) ... you can just say "sure hon, go ahead", and get your PPC out, start surfing the net, etc.

Buy why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Personally, I say, scrap the bluetooth, and replace it with a GSM/GPRS card. hence you can just plugin your SIM card, and voila, it is a mobilephone and a PPC.

To answer your question, Yes. While WiFi is nice and more powerful, most of us don't have the Wifi "hotspots" in malls, coffee shops, etc. that companies have promised. So the only other way outside of buying a GSM/GPRS card is to use a Bluethooth equipped phone and PDA together. This is also more practical for some because this is mainly a two-device world in which we live, which leaves you with nothing extra to buy.
Let's be real how many people really want to pay for a second online connection that costs the same or more than in their own home when their phone can do it for a much cheaper rate. I know I don't. My T68i and 3975 are always with me, online anytime, anyplace.

It would be nice to have an all-in-one solution that fits every need but for now their isn't. So until then everyone must follow their own path to wireless utopia. Happy surfing. :D

[bobkatt]

Let's be real how many people really want to pay for a second online connection that costs the same or more than in their own home when their phone can do it for a much cheaper rate. I know I don't. My T68i and 3975 are always with me, online anytime, anyplace.

The only problem with connecting through bluetooth to a cellular phone and then connecting to the interent is speed. 802.11b provide speed that is managable for internet and web browsing. GSM/GPRS is still miles behind right now in most places. 802.11 is upwards of 10 times or more in speed over Bluetooth.

About cost? Most places that provide a hotspot charge based on time like $3 - $6/hour instead of so many cents per megabyte which can easily add up to being more expensive when surfing the web.

Bob

[PetiteFlower]

I would LOVE to have a BT keyboard for my BT enabled PDA....

If I had a BT-enabled PDA that is....

[bobkatt]

You do not require Bluetooth to have wireless keyboard.
Go to www.pocketop.net or go to www.han-d-solutions.com/pocketop.htm to read an excellent review.

Bob

[phanprod]

The way I seem to be understanding this whole bluetooth / wifi issue is this; Your PDA is connected to the internet via some WiFi network. All is well and good. The email is flowing, the web is at hand. But you want to add a keyboard, and maybe grab some pics off a digital camera without swapping memory cards... - so you go bluetooth with that. Now, you've got both working at once in a configuration that makes sense in a ppc device, right? I mean, sure... there are countless other reasons - such as bluetooth to cell phone, WiFi hotspots, etc... but isn't the first kinda like the simple way to use both?

This is just an observation of the accounts on this board. I don't have anything that's bluetooth. I have a WiFi compact flash card, and I'd love to someday get into the wireless keyboard end of life. Would make things easier, to say the least. But, I've only got a measly iPaq 3955 with no built in WiFi OR Bluetooth, so I'm outta luck UNLESS I buy a Bluetooth card, as well. But then I need a dual CF sleeve, because I don't want to lose my 128 sd stick.

Basically, I wish I had both. More to play with. However, I'll keep my cellphone seperate. Personal preferance.

[jimski]

Do we really need bluetooth in a PPC ?

Absolutely!


I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall. Suppose you are accompanying your girlfriend/spouse to a mall, and she decided to go into a Vidal Sasoon and get her hair fixed (reshaped, recoloured, toned, tonic treated, etc.) ... you can just say "sure hon, go ahead", and get your PPC out, start surfing the net, etc.

Better hope the hairdresser works quick. I get about 45/60 minutes of uptime when browsing continuously using WiFi. Bluetooth gets me 2-3 hours.


But why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Because it gives you MORE flexibility. I don't carry my PPC everywhere, but my cell phone never leaves my side.


Personally, I say, scrap the bluetooth, and replace it with a GSM/GPRS card. hence you can just plugin your SIM card, and voila, it is a mobilephone and a PPC.

Let's be serious. I can't wait to see you at the mall, fumbling for your plug in headset while your PPC is ringing. Phones are for talking (not for reading mail or making appointments) and a PPC is for everything else.

You need to ready more about Bluetooth. What is currently available is only the very tip of the iceberg. Look for your next car to have Bluetooth built in so that every enabled phone is an instant hands free unit. And that trip to the mall. Soon you will walk into the mall to have your Bluetooth enabled device greeted by, "Welcome back Mr. Smith. Check out the sale at XYZ Audio today. All CD's 25% off with this electronic coupon.

Just give Bluetooth a chance.

[PetiteFlower]

I am well aware of the existence of IR keyboards. They have limitations that BT does not. IR transmission is easily interfered with, the 2 IR ports have to be lined up just so to get it to work. Having BT means I could even use a desktop keyboard on my PDA if I wanted to! But mainly that I wouldn't have to worry so much about the positioning of the keyboard relative to the PDA.

I don't really like what I've heard about the pockettop keyboard anyway, I've read that the keys are a bit small and the layout is a little wonky. I might end up getting it anyway since I need a keyboard that doesn't use the serial port(since I have to use to serial port to connect to my cell phone to get online)...but I am going to wait and see if a better alternative presents itself.

[bobkatt]

Did you get a chance to read the review at
www.han-d-solutions.com/pocketop.htm

It's excellent. Kind of biased since I wrote it. :lol:

Bob

[ozgurgt]

well the topic has such a short range

there are alot ppc sold out there...how mant of them has access to wifi enabled mall and starbucks??may be less 1/100000(around the world)

how can manufacturers change products for a % like this

[Pony99CA]

Did you get a chance to read the review at
www.han-d-solutions.com/pocketop.htm

It's excellent. Kind of biased since I wrote it. :lol:
I'm glad you pointed that out this time, because I was going to comment that calling your own review "excellent" was a bit self-serving, especially when you didn't mention that you wrote it the first time. :-)

Steve

[Pony99CA]

Do we really need bluetooth in a PPC ?

I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall. Suppose you are accompanying your girlfriend/spouse to a mall, and she decided to go into a Vidal Sasoon and get her hair fixed (reshaped, recoloured, toned, tonic treated, etc.) ... you can just say "sure hon, go ahead", and get your PPC out, start surfing the net, etc.

Buy why bluetooth ? Why do I want to carry 2 things at the same time (a PPC, and a mobilephone) ?

Personally, I say, scrap the bluetooth, and replace it with a GSM/GPRS card. hence you can just plugin your SIM card, and voila, it is a mobilephone and a PPC.
If you haven't gotten the point yet :-) Bluetooth isn't just for Internet connectivity. It's for Personal Area Networking -- connecting many devices without cables.

Besides connecting to cell phones, keyboards and so on, you can also use it to beam data to other Bluetooth devices without the range constraints of IR. GPS units are coming out with Bluetooth support, too, as are hard disks.

Steve

[Ekkie Tepsupornchai]

I can understand the need of 802.11b in a PPC. Coz it is fun to be able to connect the PPC, let say, in a mall. Suppose you are accompanying your girlfriend/spouse to a mall, and she decided to go into a Vidal Sasoon and get her hair fixed (reshaped, recoloured, toned, tonic treated, etc.) ... you can just say "sure hon, go ahead", and get your PPC out, start surfing the net, etc.
Better hope the hairdresser works quick. I get about 45/60 minutes of uptime when browsing continuously using WiFi. Bluetooth gets me 2-3 hours.
BINGO!! Also if you travel frequently and want to ActiveSync wirelessly, WiFi is not the most convenient choice since you need to have either an ethernet hub+WAP or a WiFi router. You can do WiFi in ad-hoc mode, but it's high maintenance (if a connection is broken for any reason, both machines need to be recycled... try doing this all day everytime you turn your PPC off and back on), you can't connect to the internet through AS and leveraging ICS via ad-hoc is not trivial either, and as mentioned, it's a WiFi is far more taxing on the batteries compared to WiFi. IR is often more convenient in this circumstance and BT is even better!!

I'd even venture to say that for my usage, I rely more on BT than on WiFi.

If you haven't gotten the point yet :) Bluetooth isn't just for Internet connectivity. It's for Personal Area Networking -- connecting many devices without cables.

Besides connecting to cell phones, keyboards and so on, you can also use it to beam data to other Bluetooth devices without the range constraints of IR. GPS units are coming out with Bluetooth support, too, as are hard disks.
Exactly. I don't think of BT as a competing wireless networking standard as much as I see it as a wireless replacement for serial cables. It's basically a much better version of IR.

[PetiteFlower]

Exactly. I don't think of BT as a competing wireless networking standard as much as I see it as a wireless replacement for serial cables. It's basically a much better version of IR.

See this is what I'm most excited about. The area under my desk is a scary and probably dangerous nest of cables that I would LOVE to be able to get rid of! I have a wireless keyboard and mouse, but they STILL need cables because the transmission on whatever kind of signal they use is really weak. But wouldn't it be great to be able to plug one of those little BT dongles into one of the rear USB ports on my PC, and have that enable my computer to talk to my keyboard, mouse, printer, webcam, speakers, PDA cradle, maybe even my monitor? I think it would be awesome to be able to have a power cord coming out of my computer and nothing else. We're obviously not there yet, but the next computer I buy(in another 5 years since I just got this one!) I hope will be able to do this.

[bobkatt]

Well in 5 years there probably be no cables to the accessories cause there probably will not be any physical accessories.

Everything like the keyboard, mouse etc. . . will be virtual.
http://www.e-insite.net/index.asp?layout=article&articleid=CA245121

If not, then voice command or maybe all headset driven.

Bob

[PetiteFlower]

I have one word to say to that--Ew. Typing on the table? I don't think so. Just because it can be done doesn't mean that everyone will want to do it.

Besides, I'd love to see someone invent a VIRTUAL printer.

My comments about the usefulness of BT stand :)

[bobkatt]

Actually there was a virtual fax machine.
It was like a Monocular which received the fax and you looked into a viewfinder to see the fax.

In regards to a virtual printer. This is in the works too.
It's more like a thick cardboard with a flexible screen where you will recieve your daily newspaper on. These screens will become thinner and cheaper to manufacture eventually allowing you to print on these and give away without having to pay huge sums of money.
No moving parts and no ink to worry about.

5 years may not be enough time for this one but we will see this eventually.

Bob

[Pony99CA]

I have one word to say to that--Ew. Typing on the table? I don't think so. Just because it can be done doesn't mean that everyone will want to do it.

I agree with you. The tactile feedback of that "keyboard" would be horrible, and I suspect the ergonomics would be bad as well.

Besides, I'd love to see someone invent a VIRTUAL printer.

A virtual Web cam or hard disk would be tricky, too. :-)

Steve

[Pony99CA]

Well in 5 years there probably be no cables to the accessories cause there probably will not be any physical accessories.

Everything like the keyboard, mouse etc. . . will be virtual.
http://www.e-insite.net/index.asp?layout=article&articleid=CA245121

If not, then voice command or maybe all headset driven.

I doubt voice commands will ever be more than a niche market. In an open office setting, voice commands would be horrible. Even at home, if you're watching TV or listening to the radio, voice would be distracting.

What you really need is direct neural input (preferably inductive, not via an implant :-)).

Steve

[bobkatt]

A virtual Web cam or hard disk would be tricky, too

Hmmm.. not sure where you are going with this virtual web cam. :-)
You mean no physical camera but images are still sent to someone else through the internet? Maybe you mean we can project light and see an image without a solid surface to project it on?

How about the Screen you are viewing your internet on also becomes the camera and sends your picture to the other end?

In regards to a virtual hard drive, we have this already in the form of cache memory within Windows. :-) well OK this may not quality in this context. The other possibility is information stored within a crystalline structure. How's that for virtual?

hmmmmmmmm. [/quote]

[Pony99CA]

A virtual Web cam or hard disk would be tricky, too
Hmmm.. not sure where you are going with this virtual web cam. :-)
You mean no physical camera but images are still sent to someone else through the internet? Maybe you mean we can project light and see an image without a solid surface to project it on?

How about the Screen you are viewing your internet on also becomes the camera and sends your picture to the other end?

That's not really virtual, of course. It would just be a combined display and video camera. That's almost no different than having a built-in camera (like the Sony Clies).

In regards to a virtual hard drive, we have this already in the form of cache memory within Windows. :-) well OK this may not quality in this context. The other possibility is information stored within a crystalline structure. How's that for virtual?
Those still don't meet your original criterion of not having any physical devices. RAM memory and crystal storage are still physical devices. They may be integrated into some other device, thus eliminating the need for Bluetooth, but they are certainly real devices.

I suppose you can argue there aren't any physical accessories, because all of the functionality is included in the device. However, that implies that there won't ever be a need to expand the device beyond what is included, which history has always proven wrong; people always want more. :-)

In any case, Bluetooth still could fill a need now.

Steve

[bobkatt]

In any case, Bluetooth still could fill a need now

Totally agree.

In regards to a crystal being a physical device too I agree.
I will leave you with this one.
There are 3D barcodes.

What if a laser created this same 3D bar code on a surface and then another laser reads this 3d laser drawn image to extract the encoded data? Would this be a virtual form of storage then> :lol: 8O :D

Bob

[maximus]

Prepare to be assimilated. Resistance is futile. :wink: