Gaming Is Good For You?

[Janak Parekh]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/2744449.stm' target='_blank'>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/2744449.stm</a><br /><br /></div>"Computer games are good for you, say researchers who studied the complex social interactions in the popular shoot-em-up Counter-Strike."<br /><br />I do have to say that I occasionally enjoy an FPS, and as such it's good to see counterpoints to classical theory on this category of games. Mind you, I still wouldn't get a 5-year-old hooked on it, but games aren't <i>all</i> bad.

[Rirath]

Why oh why does it have to be Counter Strike... "J00 NEWB!! SPTO SHOOTING MEE!!!!11! same team llama!" Couldn't they pick something deeper and/or recent, and more social? Like a RPG?

It was often obvious when teenage boys were playing, he said, because there was much more trashtalk and sexist or homophobic insults flying around. But, said Prof Wright, it was a mistake to think that this meant that gamers were misanthropists.

"The most common emotion when people are playing is laughter," said Prof Wright.

The only reason that people can get away with insulting friends and foes was because they knew them so well, he said.

Heh... homophobic insults... yep, that's CS. And it's obvious this guy's never played an online FPS before. ;) Heck, homophobic could be the title of a fps. As for laughter, of course... it's a game after all... but I have a hard time believing laughter beats swearing. It's usually a mix.

And who on earth says you'll know the fellas on the other end of the line? Geesh... I've trash talked with folks in languages I don't even know and had a great time doing it. I've had sessions of Unreal Tournament 2003 where I've swapped insults with a guy for 2-3 hours straight, and at the end of the match you'd think we were old pals or something. It's all in good fun usually.

As for 5 yr olds... no different hooking them on simple video games than it is hooking them on any other game. My life wouldn't have been complete without games like Donkey Kong and Pac Man and the Atari. But parents, please follow the rating guide. Don't let your 9yr old play the latest blood filled FPS. Even if the violence won't make him blink, he's going to run around shooting the ground, he's going to give everyone else a headache, and we don't feel like babysitting him. Find the game that matches the age level.

[bjornkeizers]

Here's the way it is:

Blaming games is so much easier then taking responsibility.

If a kid in germany goes on a rampage and kills a bunch of people, then of course it's not the school's fault, or the kid's, or the parents, or society as a whole, of course it's the games! That this kid might not even have access to a computer, let alone games is besides the point. Or the fact that someone so mentally unbalanced could go over the edge just nicely without them.

Same thing with the US sniper[s] Everyone was saying it was "obviously" caused by Grand Theft Auto, where one can indeed more or less snipe. But the fact is that these losers lived in a car, and probably did not even know about the existence of this game!

I'll just play my games, and if anyone has a problem with that..

[jet8810]

Bjorn, while I agree to an extent, I do think that video games and violent films contribute to the youth crimes. I am talking about school shootings, and things of the sort. Despite that though, I still beleive that you cannot have censorship in a free society. You cannot stop crime, only prevent some of it, so why take away my freedoms to attempt to acheive something you never can? (kind of like the "drug war".) Yea...that was off topic, but thats ok :).

BTW...are you Bjorn from rockbox?

[TopDog]

I am talking about school shootings, and things of the sort.
The problem, I believe is that the kids have access to weapons... Here in Norway, most kids don't have a clue on how to get a gun, because almost nobody have a gun... therefore, no school shootings in Norway :-)

I've been playing blood-dripping games since DOOM, and haven't had any violent tendenses yet :-)

[whitey]

I wonder why they chose exactly this game....
This is the game that got blamed after the recent school shootout in Germany...

[Kati Compton]

Bjorn, while I agree to an extent, I do think that video games and violent films contribute to the youth crimes. I am talking about school shootings, and things of the sort. Despite that though, I still beleive that you cannot have censorship in a free society. You cannot stop crime, only prevent some of it, so why take away my freedoms to attempt to acheive something you never can? (kind of like the "drug war".) Yea...that was off topic, but thats ok :).

To some extent, people that are going to be violent are going to be violent. Whether it's from games, tv, movies, or even historical events. I'd say actually the biggest problem is current events. One kid does a school shooting, others think it's a good idea. Not that the news shouldn't be reported, but I would say that it's these events that are more the "inspiration" than video games.

[Fzara]

Bah. Some of my comments were rather rude a couple hours ago, so i'm editing my post.

Gaming is definitely a good way to take your mind off things, and to actually relax every couple hours. As for its good for you, anything is good for you if its in moderation. Same with games. Too much of it is not reccomended, but none at all could make you go insane.

Maybe we should have a PPCT gaming tournament thingie with one of the games for the PPC. :)

[bjornkeizers]

I do think that video games and violent films contribute to the youth crimes.

Oh I certainly agree video games have an effect on people; but mostly those that don't know anything about them or people that are already on the edge and could be pushed over it by anything, including videogames.

However, I don't think that video games per se have an effect on crime. Movies.. maybe. Video games.. not in most people. And the people that do go out and commit crimes do so for other reasons; fun, money, respect from others etc etc. not because they've seen it in a video game. Sure, they might copy some of the language or attitude, but that doesn't mean the game is responsible for the end result.

I am talking about school shootings, and things of the sort.

There are millions and millions of gamers everywhere. From africa to the US, from the netherlands to korea.. If video games were responsible for school shootings or things like that, we'd see these on a weekly basis. Why isn't that happening? Because 99 % of the people that play these games are well balanced individuals; people who know that you can't and shouldn't act out these things in real life. I still don't understand how people can see a connection between counterstrike and a school shooting.. if anything, playing CS will teach you that you can be shot dead quite easily, in the blink of an eye. Still want to do it? Inflated ego? Well, you can hardly blame the game for things that are already there or created by forces other then the game. [school, parents, peer pressure, pure stupidity, etc]

so why take away my freedoms to attempt to acheive something you never can?

You mean, do stuff in a game you can't do in the real world? Exactly. I enjoy violent games, and I've been playing them since the earliest days of Doom, Quake, and the good old days of DN3D, Shadow Warrior, Redneck Rampage, etc. Am I a violent person? Far from it. The games had no effect on me whatsoever [except improve my english language skills]

BTW...are you Bjorn from rockbox?

I have no idea what that is, so no. :D

EDIT:

Did a quick search, you mean the open source replacement for the Jukebox firmware project? That's Björn Stenberg [note the dots above the o and the different last name] But as fate would have it, I happen to own a Jukebox Recorder 10 :D ]

[Ekkie Tepsupornchai]

Not that I learn my life lessons from comedians, but I recall Chris Rock once talking about how all the latest violence is being blamed on games, movies, music, etc.

His reaction?

"What happened to the good ole' days, when people did these things just b/c they were crazy?"

...I guess that rationale almost doesn't exist anymore.

[Kati Compton]

You mean, do stuff in a game you can't do in the real world? Exactly. I enjoy violent games, and I've been playing them since the earliest days of Doom, Quake, and the good old days of DN3D, Shadow Warrior, Redneck Rampage, etc. Am I a violent person? Far from it. The games had no effect on me whatsoever [except improve my english language skills]

I agree. I find that violent video games help me reduce stress from work. And it's not like I play games that involve preying on innocents. While I also like Dungeon Keeper, the games I particularly find helpful (DiabloII, Dungeon Siege) are always "kill the bad guys". But in real life I own no weapons and hate guns. The whole point is that it is fantasy.

[KDF9511]

I find that playing a good shoot um up game a good way to releave the stress of a bad day at work. I love to grab a cold beer and load up an online game of Mechwarrior 4 after the kids have gone to bed. I get to blow things up and excersies my mind in other ways and I find it very relaxing. You don't get much of the trash talking while playing MW since the gameplay is moving so quickly. If I try to send a coment while playing I usualy get killed fast so I just keep my fingers on the trigger. :P

[dean_shan]

I think that it is ok to play violent games, if you are mature enough. I think that it is a lie when they say that video games cause violent teen crimes. It depends on the parenting of the child. If the child is not old and/or mature enough to play GTA3 or others then don't buy it for your kid. I think that if a child is old enough to relize that the violence is fake and not real and that they should not do those things in real life then they should be able to play it. My friends and I enjoy a good round of TimeSplitters2 and other games of that nature but we turn it off if there are young children around. The violence is not bad. Who you show it to is.

[Rirath]

Too bad 90% of this conversation went the typical "Does gaming equal crime" route instead of the more interesting topic of online social interaction like the article covers. :? I don't believe the actual article mentions crime or links to crime even once.

[jmarkevich]

Let's be honest. With every school shooting (for example) that I am aware of, the shooters played violent video games. Sometimes to a disturbing degree. Clearly it was an influence.

a + b = c

Only an extremely shallow analysis would consider that anyone is saying it is the ONLY influence.

[Rirath]

Let's be honest. With every school shooting (for example) that I am aware of, the shooters played violent video games. Sometimes to a disturbing degree. Clearly it was an influence.

a + b = c

Only an extremely shallow analysis would consider that anyone is saying it is the ONLY influence.

But to say it's an influence is almost saying that it was part of what caused the shooting, and personally I don't buy that. I mean come on, if a person is going to shoot up a bunch of people do you really think they're going to play scrabble all day? Just because the shooter happened to enjoy violent games, movies, and music suited to his tastes, doesn't mean it caused and/or influenced the shooting in any way.

Besides, girls play violent games, watch violent flicks, and listen to violent music as well. (No, really...) How many female school shooters have you heard about recently?

[dean_shan]

Let's be honest. With every school shooting (for example) that I am aware of, the shooters played violent video games. Sometimes to a disturbing degree. Clearly it was an influence.

a + b = c

Does Liking Basketball+Playing NBA Live=Playing in the NBA. NO!

I agree with Rirath
Just because the shooter happened to enjoy violent games, movies, and music suited to his tastes, doesn't mean it caused and/or influenced the shooting in any way.

[sponge]

I'm currently 15 years old here, and I've been playing these "oh so evil" violent games since Wolfenstein 3D for the SNES - 1992. That's 5 years old. I even played Doom and Doom II, and not once did I have any violent tendancy, ie pretending people I hate were in the game, acting out parts, or even drawing pictures inspired by the game. These people who are involved in the school shootings are ALREADY nuts, at most you could say being obsessed with the games might have helped bring out some violent tendancies in them/

It's like banning alcohol and beer because some people will do stupid things after drinking it.

That NBA comparison is quite truthful too.

[Rirath]

Yeah, but to be fair... SNES didn't allow any good amounts of blood in their games. :wink: Just kidding ya of course.
Was a good time to be a gamer.

[seanturner]

Regarding guns, I think that if you set clear rules for the handling of a gun and take the mystery out of them you will never have a problem.

My father was an avid shooter and I would always to with him to shooting ranges and tournaments. (I even tried a tournament myself but my vision is a little too blurry to be good enough). I have to say the fact that if I wanted to go shooting, all I had to do was ask my dad and we'd set a date. He left guns out in the house but never once did I touch one without him being there.

I grew up knowing not to play with guns. I don't believe guns in and of themselves are evil and they are a sport just like any other. However, I do believe they can be used for bad things. I have never personally shot a living creature with a gun and could never do so. It is my personal belief that hunting is cruel and inhumane, but, it is the hunter pulling the trigger. The gun can't lock up in a blue screen of death like windows can :wink:

[jet8810]

It's like banning alcohol and beer because some people will do stupid things after drinking it.

OH, so true! This is my basic argument supporting the legalization of Marijuana. Yea, that is off-topic, but I could not resist that opportunity. After smoking weed, they argue that people get into more car crashes, do more stupid stuff...ect...so what? No different then alchohol :). /end off-topic rant

[Rirath]

I grew up knowing not to play with guns. I don't believe guns in and of themselves are evil and they are a sport just like any other. However, I do believe they can be used for bad things. I have never personally shot a living creature with a gun and could never do so. It is my personal belief that hunting is cruel and inhumane, but, it is the hunter pulling the trigger. The gun can't lock up in a blue screen of death like windows can :wink:

Ah, but there's all types of guns. It sounds like the guns you speak of are of the sporting type. What about uzis and guns made almost specifically for causing heavy damage, fast? We're not talking trained US soldiers here or anything, we're talking black market street dealings. Now I believe you do get a weapon with a evil intent no different than the brutal weaponry designed to inflict pain and massive wounds before killing that the gladiators used.

As for hunting, all depends on the purpose I guess. I can live with a hunter killing for food or even in some cases to use the animal, but just for the sport of it I'm against. Not that I'd call a hunter wrong for doing so, just not something I'd do.

[Rirath]

It's like banning alcohol and beer because some people will do stupid things after drinking it.

OH, so true! This is my basic argument supporting the legalization of Marijuana. Yea, that is off-topic, but I could not resist that opportunity. After smoking weed, they argue that people get into more car crashes, do more stupid stuff...ect...so what? No different then alchohol :). /end off-topic rant

So maybe I don't want to be the person killed by that idiot. I prey that all drugs stay illegal in the US. The day that changes... ugh. :x The only reason people want it legal is to use it. That's just plain insane, and not the kind of country I want to live in. :roll: I could give you 101 reasons why it's just plain stupid, but I really don't feel there's a point as you obviously don't care.

[seanturner]

I grew up knowing not to play with guns. I don't believe guns in and of themselves are evil and they are a sport just like any other. However, I do believe they can be used for bad things. I have never personally shot a living creature with a gun and could never do so. It is my personal belief that hunting is cruel and inhumane, but, it is the hunter pulling the trigger. The gun can't lock up in a blue screen of death like windows can :wink:

Ah, but there's all types of guns. It sounds like the guns you speak of are of the sporting type. What about uzis and guns made almost specifically for causing heavy damage, fast? We're not talking trained US soldiers here or anything, we're talking black market street dealings. Now I believe you do get a weapon with a evil intent no different than the brutal weaponry designed to inflict pain and massive wounds before killing that the gladiators used.

As for hunting, all depends on the purpose I guess. I can live with a hunter killing for food or even in some cases to use the animal, but just for the sport of it I'm against. Not that I'd call a hunter wrong for doing so, just not something I'd do.

There is no difference though. Its like saying that there a water cooled computer is fundamentally different from an air cooled computer. They do the same thing..

All guns have their individual feels about them. Uzi's are very fun guns to shoot (especially for smaller people like me) because they're heavy and shoot a lite round so there isn't much recoil.

It is also argued that automatic guns have no purpose but to kill, but that is like saying dual processor machines have no business outside of server farms. They are very fun to shoot (albeit very expensive). It's also an art to learn how to do it correctly. Yes, it is more convienient to kill a bunch of people with an automatic weapon, but, that's like saying we should ban overclocking to save power. It has a negligable effect overall.

[Rirath]

It is also argued that automatic guns have no purpose but to kill, but that is like saying dual processor machines have no business outside of server farms. They are very fun to shoot (albeit very expensive). It's also an art to learn how to do it correctly. Yes, it is more convienient to kill a bunch of people with an automatic weapon, but, that's like saying we should ban overclocking to save power. It has a negligable effect overall.

You're comparing a gun, which makes small pieces of lead go really really fast, to a computer? Besides, I never mentioned banning them but I stand by the implied usage is to cause heavy damage, fast. Besides... there IS a huge difference between a water cooled pc and a air cooled pc. :)

[seanturner]

Yes.

My point is simply that there is no logic to many of the gun myths out there today...

Oh, also, as a side note uzi's are legal to own in the US (outside of california) although you do pay around 18 times the cost of the gun in taxes. Personally, I'd rather get 4 or 5 computers for that money.

[jmarkevich]

[quote=jmarkevich]Let's be honest. With every school shooting (for example) that I am aware of, the shooters played violent video games. Sometimes to a disturbing degree. Clearly it was an influence.

a + b = c

Does Liking Basketball+Playing NBA Live=Playing in the NBA. NO!

You're showing your reasoning to be shallow, like I was talking about in the first place.

a+c != b!!!

I'd love to refer you to Peter Coffee's article in PCWeek back in 1999 but they've put the archives behind a subscription-only service...

I don't expect to convince any of you, you've all justified yourselves into playing the games. I sincerely hope none of you have latent sociopathic tendencies...

[seanturner]

Of course it is not hte real thing, but, does reading a book make you the protagonist of the book? No, but it does indulge your imagination.

[Kati Compton]

Let's be honest. With every school shooting (for example) that I am aware of, the shooters played violent video games. Sometimes to a disturbing degree. Clearly it was an influence.

a + b = c

Only an extremely shallow analysis would consider that anyone is saying it is the ONLY influence.

But on the other hand, it might be the other way around. The people that commit school shootings also enjoy violent video games. If they already had the tendency to commit a violent crime, they WOULD likely have the tendency to enjoy violent games. But in that case, it wouldn't mean that playing those games made them any more likely to do it. Just that they were going to do it anyway, but were playing the games as well along the way.

[Kati Compton]

Besides, girls play violent games, watch violent flicks, and listen to violent music as well. (No, really...) How many female school shooters have you heard about recently?

Not recently, but wasn't one of the more famous ones a female? "I Don't Like Mondays" and all that?

[jet8810]

It's like banning alcohol and beer because some people will do stupid things after drinking it.

OH, so true! This is my basic argument supporting the legalization of Marijuana. Yea, that is off-topic, but I could not resist that opportunity. After smoking weed, they argue that people get into more car crashes, do more stupid stuff...ect...so what? No different then alchohol :). /end off-topic rant

So maybe I don't want to be the person killed by that idiot. I prey that all drugs stay illegal in the US. The day that changes... ugh. :x The only reason people want it legal is to use it. That's just plain insane, and not the kind of country I want to live in. :roll: I could give you 101 reasons why it's just plain stupid, but I really don't feel there's a point as you obviously don't care.

Perhaps. My point of view is that the government should legalize marijuana, but make harsh penalities for drunk driving, driving under the influence of marijuana, ect. I am talking 5 years in jail for being caught once harsh. That would help A LOT if you ask me. BUT...the government needs to decide. Either legalize marijuana to balance it out (cocaine and those are HIGHLY addictive, puts them in a different category IMO) or make ALL drugs illegal. The government is contradicting itself currently IMHO. Anyway, if you want to debate this later, email me at [email protected] as I dont think this is relevant to the chat :).

[Ekkie Tepsupornchai]

But on the other hand, it might be the other way around. The people that commit school shootings also enjoy violent video games. If they already had the tendency to commit a violent crime, they WOULD likely have the tendency to enjoy violent games. But in that case, it wouldn't mean that playing those games made them any more likely to do it. Just that they were going to do it anyway, but were playing the games as well along the way.
I couldn't agree more. I certainly don't believe games or the such turn an otherwise "normal" citizen into a killing machine. There was likely already something going on there.

Now the comparison to guns is a whole different matter. With games, we're talking about possible influence to violence whereas guns are a means to commit violence. Without going into the whole "banning guns" debate, I will say a killer will kill with whatever weaponry available, but certainly some weapons allow far greater damage to be inflicted before the person can be stopped/apprehended/etc.

[seanturner]

Now the comparison to guns is a whole different matter. With games, we're talking about possible influence to violence whereas guns are a means to commit violence. Without going into the whole "banning guns" debate, I will say a killer will kill with whatever weaponry available, but certainly some weapons allow far greater damage to be inflicted before the person can be stopped/apprehended/etc.

While this is certainly true of suicidal maniacs, I do believe that they move to stop crime in cases where the criminal has no desire to get himself killed. Statistics show that in states which allow citizens to get permits to carry a concealed handgun, the crime rate is lower. Also, several states that have banned concealed carry have seen an increase in their crime rates. But, this is all a topic for another thread.

[Steven Cedrone]

Time to get back on topic...

Thanks,

Steven Cedrone
Community Moderator