The Palm Tungsten DOES come with an MP3 Player!

[Jason Dunn]

I'm not trying to bash Palm today, I'm really not, but this is just too ironic to pass up. One of the common criticisms of the Palm Tungsten is that Palm had the foresight to include a headphone jack (good) but no audio playback software (bad). This can be remedied by third party software of course, but it's an often-criticised aspect of the Tungsten. Palm has launched a new promotion that offers a Creative Labs MP3 player with the purchase of a Tungsten...so now Palm can really say "Sure the Tungsten comes with an MP3 player!" :lilangel:<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/TTmp3.02.jpg" /><br /><br />Hmm. Now that I think about it, perhaps this means Microsoft should bundle a copy of Office XP with every Pocket PC so we can work with documents, even if it is on our desktop PC. :lol:

[Janak Parekh]

Hmm. Now that I think about it, perhaps this means Microsoft should bundle a copy of Office XP with every Pocket PC so we can work with documents, even if it is on our desktop PC. :lol:
You know, this is just as brilliant. But before long, they're going to start giving out copies of Office 2000. :P

Actually, Corel made a lot of money out of selling old versions of CorelDRAW back in the old days for cheap...

This truly feels even more satirical than the previous post, btw.

--bdj

p.s. Previous conversation on this topic (and some more detail) is here (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5555&highlight=)...

[huangzhinong]

this post is more funny than the previous thread http://www.bbspot.com/News/2002/11/timekeeper.html[/u]

[Ed Hansberry]

Bwahahahahaahahahhahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Glad to see someone keeping up on the latest from Palm while I am out. :wink:

[xbalance]

I am pretty sure that when I bought my first CE based PPC, the Everex Manager, Microsoft gave me a free version of 98 Plus :lol:

When I bought my Casio E-105 I think I received a natural keyboard.

With my new Dell, I got everything I wanted for half of what I would have paid a few months ago. Life is good. Freebies are for inferior products with poor pricing.

[Jonathon Watkins]

Honestly, you try to spoof Palm and then they go and do something even funnier! :P :lol: You gotta love em! :wink:

[Busdriver]

Where is Foo Fighter when you need him..... :P

[ThomasC22]

Bwahahahahaahahahhahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Glad to see someone keeping up on the latest from Palm while I am out. :wink:

Laughing at palm, what an interesting way to spend your 2000th post ;)

(congratulations btw) :D

Then again, it turns out it may very well not be your 2000th post (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/search.php?search_author=Ed+Hansberry)

[Foo Fighter]

Where is Foo Fighter when you need him..... :P

No, I won't be defending Palm here. The only reason I spoke up on behalf of the Zire is because people keep bashing a product that never was intended for this audience. If you're going to make fun of the Zire, you may as well bash Franklin Paper Organizers while you're at it.

Tungsten on the other hand is fair game, and hunting season is open. I owned a Tungsten, for one month, and ended up sending it back. Yeah, the design is really slick, and form factor is awesome....but Palm just had to ruin my experience by going with a REFLECTIVE display that succumbed to those dreaded dust specs. And frankly there is no way Tungsten is worth $500 now that Dell has reset the color PDA price-scale.

And it turns out that Tungsten sucks at digital audio. The volume isn't loud enough, and apparently there is a bug in ROM that truncates all audio to near mono quality. Palm is working on a fix...they say. But I wonder if this problem really can be fixed. If not, this issue is going to bite Palm in the ass on a much larger scale than the M130 color fiasco.

[JonnoB]

I remember having a 'discussion' with one of my friends.. an admitted Palm fanatic. He was going on and on about why memory was a non-issue. Palm apps were small and MS apps bloated. Sheepishly, I knew that he was kind right. That said however, memory is cheap these days and no matter how small you make an application, files like MP3s don't get smaller on a Palm. One of the problems with Palm trying to do multimedia is still the anemic memory size in most devices.

Of course, the applies to Palm devices that want to be a media tool.... and include a stereo headphone jack.

[Jonathan1]

Why is it that Palm’s only recourse to actually sell models is "gimmicks"?

[ppcsurfr]

Too early for a promo eh?

Not selling well?

More units returned?

But of all "gimmicks"... why bundle something that the unit is supposed to do anyway?

BTW, when I was handed this flier, I almost died laughing... I called up my friend and told him that the new Tugsten T now comes with an MP3 Player... then he asks me... "So the software is out already?" Then I answer... "Software? Who said anything about software?" "It's hardware... a Creative Labs MP3 player." Then all I could hear was laughter... as in rolling on the floor laughing type... the ucontrollable type of laughter...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[ppcsurfr]

Bwahahahahaahahahhahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Glad to see someone keeping up on the latest from Palm while I am out. :wink:

Glad to have made you laugh...

ppcsurfr

[Janak Parekh]

And it turns out that Tungsten sucks at digital audio. The volume isn't loud enough, and apparently there is a bug in ROM that truncates all audio to near mono quality. Palm is working on a fix...they say. But I wonder if this problem really can be fixed. If not, this issue is going to bite Palm in the ass on a much larger scale than the M130 color fiasco.
Ouch. Just checked PIC, yes, there is a problem where high frequences are truncated. I can't believe this. You'd think they'd test the device and bundle an MP3 player.

Foo, are you keeping the Dell so far?

--bdj

[Foo Fighter]

Palm should just bundle the Creative Labs player with a roll of duct tape. It's the only way the convert the Tungsten into a viable MP3 player. :roll:

[ppcsurfr]

Palm should just bundle the Creative Labs player with a roll of duct tape. It's the only way the convert the Tungsten into a viable MP3 player. :roll:

Hey! Isn't duct tape made of the same color?

That way you don't really notice the duct taped Creative Labs MP3 Player right...

Anyway... the inside page of the flier is the real killer... it describes how good the Creative Labs MP3 Player is... something which makes me feel that if ever they get the one for the Palm out... it won't be even half as good... :lol:

[Foo Fighter]

I can't believe this. You'd think they'd test the device and bundle an MP3 player.

You would think so, but this is Palm we're talking about. Just when you think they can't possibly sink any lower, they find a way to surprise us.

Foo, are you keeping the Dell so far?

Of course.

[mookie123]

What takes them so long fixing audio problem? If it is minor problem they should post a patch right now. Audio capability is supposedly one of the "main reason" why the OS 5.0 exist.

..mm...What a strange way to do business.

[Janak Parekh]

What takes them so long fixing audio problem? If it is minor problem they should post a patch right now. Audio capability is supposedly one of the "main reason" why the OS 5.0 exist.
It's weird, isn't it? It seems like it's a problem with the Palm device, not PalmSource's OS. However, what's more worrisome is that it seems that OS5 either doesn't have standardized multimedia API's, or isn't requiring OEM's to use them - see http://www.aerodromesoftware.com/clieusers.html - these are the guys trying to build an Ogg player for the Palm, and they say they need Sony's specs.

I've been beating the standardized sound API drum for a while here. It almost seems OS5, while one step forward, is also two steps back.

Can a (current) Palm developer shed some light? I stopped developing around OS3...

--bdj

[T-Will]

Ok I'm a little confused, why does it also say "Plus, let us pay for your new Palm handheld." Are they buying a Palm handheld for everyone?

[Daniel]

Oh boy, now that is the most pathetic thing I've seen for a while.

I don't know what else to say. All I have is a big "L" held up to my forehead that is going out to Palm right now.

*cough*LOSERS*cough*

Daniel

[Foo Fighter]

However, what's more worrisome is that it seems that OS5 either doesn't have standardized multimedia API's, or isn't requiring OEM's to use them -

Yep. While OS5 does have a standardized multimedia API, Sony continues to use its own system. This means that audio players which run on the Tungsten will not be compatible with Sony's devices. The upcoming Real Player for Tungsten won't work either.

It's interesting. PalmOS has always had the advantage of maintaining a rigidly unified platform where applications work across a whole range of hardware, unlike WinCE/PPC. Now the landscape is shifting. PalmOS is becoming increasingly fragmented, while Pocket PC is evolving into a unified architecture (common processors, APIs, form factors, etc.).

Oh how the tables have turned.

[Janak Parekh]

It's interesting. PalmOS has always had the advantage of maintaining a rigidly unified platform where applications work across a whole range of hardware, unlike WinCE/PPC. Now the landscape is shifting. PalmOS is becoming increasingly fragmented, while Pocket PC is evolving into a unified architecture (common processors, APIs, form factors, etc.).

Oh how the tables have turned.
... and it's going even further, given AlphaSmart's Dana, etc. Palm is envisioning broad differences between their devices. Who knows if they will even stay in the handheld market forever: maybe the Palm OS's niche is in embedded computing devices. I'm not sure, though, that they have carved up that niche any more than Microsoft has.

--bdj

[Gary Garland, Esq.]

5 Reasons I Prefer a Palm to a PocketPC

A Tongue-in-Cheek Peek

by Gary B. Garland, Esq.



Hey, what would a PocketPc site be without a little Palm bashing, right? So in the spirit of fun, (and with that disclaimer), let’s go...



5. I have a friend who is color blind. The bright colors on most PocketPc’s are tough on his vision. The majority of palms are monochromatic.



4. My 146 year old grandfather can’t keep up with the higher speeds of the PocketPc. The palm’s speeds are perfect.



3. I like vintage items. I can put a Palm on my coffee table next to that dinosaur bone (and fossilized piece of last week’s roast beef).



2. Bill Gates doesn’t make a penny off of Palm (as far as I know).



And the number 1 reason I prefer a Palm to a PocketPc?



1. I could lose my PocketPc. Yeah, sure, I could also lose my Palm, but I wouldn’t care!



This article was produced on a Palm. Any spelling mistakes are the fault of said electronic device.

Oh, and now the best reason - the palms play mp3s - that's right, comes with an mp3 player! wow! :evil:

[Foo Fighter]

Wow! And I thought I posted bizarre ramblings. 8O :wink:

[Jonathon Watkins]

....but Palm just had to ruin my experience by going with a REFLECTIVE display that succumbed to those dreaded dust specs.

Oops, it's not FOO-complient. 8O :P

Wow! And I thought I posted bizarre ramblings

You do. :D (But we like it :wink:)

(Post count flying up Foo? :wink:)

[serpico]

I use a palm IIIc currently and have no desire to upgrade to a Tungsten T. At $800 CDN, it has beat ppc pricing and there's no reason to look at a ppc when upgrading. Why is my question would anyone pay for the same thing that Sony has been doing with OS4 and sleeker clothes?

Now reading your posts and watching ppc grow from the days of when I owned a philips nino 300, I know I will be looking into a ppc when upgrading. The new HP ipaq is sweet and cheaper than this. Color makes a big difference and I do miss carrying music, even my nino300 did that! :lol:

[Janak Parekh]

Oops, it's not FOO-complient. 8O :P
Excellent! My term has officially been adopted! :lol: :lol: :lol:

(PDA G, your check is in the mail ;))

Wow! And I thought I posted bizarre ramblings

You do. :D (But we like it :wink:)
Wait... who here doesn't post bizarre ramblings?

--bdj

[Jonathan1]

5 Reasons I Prefer a Palm to a PocketPC

1. I could lose my PocketPc. Yeah, sure, I could also lose my Palm, but I wouldn’t care!



You may have been kidding but its SOOOO true. I spent $500 on my Jornada 568 and it hurts. $99 would still hurt but not nearly as much.

[ppcsurfr]

At the rate they're going... we might even see them bundle a small flashlight... the one that runs on AAA batteries... with a Palm Zire... just to compensate for the lack of a backlight.

:twisted:

[Jonathon Watkins]

Oops, it's not FOO-complient. 8O :P
Excellent! My term has officially been adopted! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Well, it just hits the spot really! :D

(PDA G, your check is in the mail ;))

Cool, I'll use it to get a Zire - I could use an MP3 player and a paperweight. :wink:

Wow! And I thought I posted bizarre ramblings

You do. :D (But we like it :wink:)
Wait... who here doesn't post bizarre ramblings?
--bdj

Pass, no-one I know. :D

[Janak Parekh]

Cool, I'll use it to get a Zire - I could use an MP3 player and a paperweight. :wink:
:lol: :rofl: :lol: :rofl: :lol:

I need to petition Jason to add a smiley dying of laughter. ;)

Pass, no-one I know. :D
Exactly, that's why we hang around here.

--janak

[Jonathon Watkins]

I need to petition Jason to add a smiley dying of laughter. ;)

Agrees - actually - there are a few smilies I would like to see added as well. (Quick divergance, I was going to upload them, but can't seem to post pictures any more - see this thread for details: http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=49284#49284)

Pass, no-one I know. :D
Exactly, that's why we hang around here.

--janak

Is site this the mutual admiration society or what? Now, let me just say “Zire”, just to stay on topic. :wink:

[Janak Parekh]

(Quick divergance, I was going to upload them, but can't seem to post pictures any more - see this thread for details: http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=49284#49284)
That is weird. You should PM Jason about it.

Is site this the mutual admiration society or what? Now, let me just say “Zire”, just to stay on topic. :wink:
Zire! Zire! Zire! :P

Now, it's time for a group hug. :way to go:

--janak

[ppcsurfr]

I think more people would get a Zire if they bundle it with a Solitaire Mag-Lite.

http://www.netgazer.com.ph/~guerrero/ziremaglite.jpg
Disclaimer: This photo is not real... and Palm is not offering this promo... yet? Unlike the MP3 Player bungle which is very, very, very true!

ppcsurfr

[Jonathon Watkins]

I think more people would get a Zire if they bundle it with a Solitaire Mag-Lite.

No, no, NO! :P It's buy a Mag-Lite, get a free Paperweight! :wink:

[Janak Parekh]

I think more people would get a Zire if they bundle it with a Solitaire Mag-Lite.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

If you made this, you should submit it to Ed's competition (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=49715).

--janak

[ppcsurfr]

I think more people would get a Zire if they bundle it with a Solitaire Mag-Lite.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

If you made this, you should submit it to Ed's competition (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=49715).

--janak

Yep... I'll be doing that.

ppcsurfr

[rave]

Ouch. Just checked PIC, yes, there is a problem where high frequences are truncated.
Haven't tried a TT yet, but if this were true, there are two very probable causes of this; one digital and one analog:

* The processor, OS and DAC combo is not capable of sustaining realtime playback of the high sampling rate audio (which is required for high-fidelity). Solution is to downsample.

* The audio amplifiers are inferior and distort at high frequencies. Solution is to apply low-pass filtering.

The effect is the same: muffled sound similar to AM radio broadcasts.

Either way, it would be a sign of poor engineering. Any processor above 100MHz (and a DSP at that) and any audio component, however cheap, should be able to handle hi-fi.

In any case, perhaps the speaker was engineered to just playback the voice notes, in which case I guess it would do just fine as is.

The Sliding Graffiti (tm) is another piece of poor engineering. I had handled a mockup model of it in a local store and I doubt if a real TT has a spring mechanism for the slider. When that thing wears from normal use, the mechanism would be very, very loose and make the TT very difficult to handle. They should have put a spring mechanism in it like in the Nokia 71xx.

[Janak Parekh]

The Sliding Graffiti (tm) is another piece of poor engineering. I had handled a mockup model of it in a local store and I doubt if a real TT has a spring mechanism for the slider. When that thing wears from normal use, the mechanism would be very, very loose and make the TT very difficult to handle. They should have put a spring mechanism in it like in the Nokia 71xx.
Well, not to defend Palm, but they have tested the mechanism a million times. Plus, I don't think they should copy the Nokia 71xx's design; that was known to be one of the flakiest mechanisms in Nokia's history, worse than the 8860. They should just get rid of the hardware graffiti and, at the minimum, adopt the N(R|X)70's design. 8)

--janak