Clarification on Difference between SD and MMC cards....

[fk1team]

I want to expand memory RAM on my xda - so have been looking at buying a SD or MMC card for the slot.

My understanding is that SD cards don't allow u to play mp3s downloaded form internet as it has some type of sw protection/security on it, whereas MMC cards are basically the same but withough the protection.

Can someone clear this up for me as I want to dl mp3s to play on my xda.

One further point - are there better (e.g. higher compression without to much loss in sonic quality) file types to use on xda rather than mp3 - if so what sw do I need to make them on my home PC and play them on xda

thanks

[Brad Adrian]

You can certainly use SD cards to play MP3s. They simply support additional security features of some applications that MMcs do not.

Many people prefer the MP3 format. However, if space is a consideration, converting files to Windows Media format results in smaller file sizes. Most programs for copying/converting music files, like Music Match Jukebox, allow you to convert to MP3 or Windows Media.

[fk1team]

thanks - 128MB SD card from dabs.com it it then...

==========================================
128MB Secure Digital (SD)
Take more pictures with your digital camera. Fit more E-Books on your PDA or carry more music on your MP3 Player with this massive 128mb SD Expansion Card.
£59.00 (£69.32)==========================================

[griph]

thanks - 128MB SD card from dabs.com it it then...

==========================================
128MB Secure Digital (SD)
Take more pictures with your digital camera. Fit more E-Books on your PDA or carry more music on your MP3 Player with this massive 128mb SD Expansion Card.
£59.00 (£69.32)==========================================

I have just bought a 128mB MMC from Expansys at £55.90 inc VAT and Special Delivery. I already had a 128mB SD card. I have used both to play MP3's though I do not download these from the internet.
I used the SD card with the Ipaq 3870 and had a lot of problems with freezes etc. A MMC however always seemed to behave better. Is there any difference in their performance that would explain why that it. I now use both in the XDA and have yet to see any difference in performance though it is early days for the 128 MMC.

[Eciton]

Never make reliability comments based on an iPAQ 3800 series :D. The problems with its SD/MMC slot are well known.

SD is faster than MMC, and has a lock switch, which can be useful in certain circumstances. I personally haven't noticed any difference between MMC and SD on my XDA, but in other future devices, as well as desktop card readers, there is a great potential speed difference. Given the negligible price difference, the only reason why you'd go for an MMC is for backward compatibility with any MMC-only devices you may already have. Oh, and MMCs have slightly more available free space on them due to the latent security features on SD - but on a 128MB card this is less than 1%.

HTH

Oh yes, and eXpansys are currently the cheapest in the UK IIRC.

[Ekkie Tepsupornchai]

Keep in mind that 256MB SD cards (and higher) are at least 4x faster than 128MB SD cards.

The 128MB SD cards are not much faster than the MMCs.

[Monty Gibson]

Also, too, let's not forget that this year *rumored* that SD cards will be into the gigabytes as far as storage is concerned. Is anyone using the SoftWinter Storage Tools Application?

[griph]

Never make reliability comments based on an iPAQ 3800 series :D. The problems with its SD/MMC slot are well known.

SD is faster than MMC, and has a lock switch, which can be useful in certain circumstances. I personally haven't noticed any difference between MMC and SD on my XDA, but in other future devices, as well as desktop card readers, there is a great potential speed difference. Given the negligible price difference, the only reason why you'd go for an MMC is for backward compatibility with any MMC-only devices you may already have. Oh, and MMCs have slightly more available free space on them due to the latent security features on SD - but on a 128MB card this is less than 1%.

HTH

Oh yes, and eXpansys are currently the cheapest in the UK IIRC.

I don't see what is wrong with voicing that I had problems with SD on my 3870 whilst not experiencing problems with MMS - I didn't mention any product by name - and for me one was a problem and the other wasn't - regardless of whether it was machine or card that was at fault. I haven't noticed any down side from going to the MMC - I still use the SD but only for MP3's - the MMC I use for essential memory expansion.

Whilst on the subject of memory - as soon as the warranty on this expires I shall be ordering an upgrade to RAM - has anyone else found anyone cheaper in this respect than going through Expansys - bearing in mind my location?

[Kati Compton]

Never make reliability comments based on an iPAQ 3800 series :D. The problems with its SD/MMC slot are well known.

I don't see what is wrong with voicing that I had problems with SD on my 3870 whilst not experiencing problems with MMS - I didn't mention any product by name - and for me one was a problem and the other wasn't - regardless of whether it was machine or card that was at fault.

I don't think you were being chastised for your comments, I think that Eciton was just pointing out that the 3800 series is known to have trouble with SD cards, whereas other PPCs it's less of an issue. So your PPCPE probably won't have any trouble, regardless of whether or not the 3870 did.

[Eciton]

Never make reliability comments based on an iPAQ 3800 series :D. The problems with its SD/MMC slot are well known.

SD is faster than MMC, and has a lock switch, which can be useful in certain circumstances. I personally haven't noticed any difference between MMC and SD on my XDA, but in other future devices, as well as desktop card readers, there is a great potential speed difference. Given the negligible price difference, the only reason why you'd go for an MMC is for backward compatibility with any MMC-only devices you may already have. Oh, and MMCs have slightly more available free space on them due to the latent security features on SD - but on a 128MB card this is less than 1%.

HTH

Oh yes, and eXpansys are currently the cheapest in the UK IIRC.

I don't see what is wrong with voicing that I had problems with SD on my 3870 whilst not experiencing problems with MMS - I didn't mention any product by name - and for me one was a problem and the other wasn't - regardless of whether it was machine or card that was at fault. I haven't noticed any down side from going to the MMC - I still use the SD but only for MP3's - the MMC I use for essential memory expansion.

Whilst on the subject of memory - as soon as the warranty on this expires I shall be ordering an upgrade to RAM - has anyone else found anyone cheaper in this respect than going through Expansys - bearing in mind my location?

I didn't mean to imply that you were wrong or anything - only that many users have experienced problems with SD cards disappearing, wiping, losing data and generally dying on the 3800 series, while also skipping in WMP. MMC, as you've noticed, has none of these reliability problems on the 3800. But, this is not a problem with SD, merely the iPAQ, and on other machines SD is not only just as reliable, but also faster for future applications.

With regard to the memory upgrade - eXpansys are charging about ten quid more for the 64MB upgrade than PPCTechs themselves. This makes it pretty reasonable in terms of pricing considering the international shipping you would have to pay to the states. AFAIK eXpansys are the only guys in the UK doing the upgrade. One good thing about the 32MB is that it's taught me to keep my device cleaner and not mess around with so many inessential apps. I'm managing to get by with 32, and I'll probably move to a new device in around six months, so I'm not sure it'll be worth the investment in a RAM upgrade for me personally.

[Eciton]

Ah kati42, you got in there before me :)

[Kati Compton]

Ah kati42, you got in there before me :)

The power of being a Pocket PC Oracle...

[griph]

I didn't mean to imply that you were wrong or anything - only that many users have experienced problems with SD cards disappearing, wiping, losing data and generally dying on the 3800 series, while also skipping in WMP. MMC, as you've noticed, has none of these reliability problems on the 3800. But, this is not a problem with SD, merely the iPAQ, and on other machines SD is not only just as reliable, but also faster for future applications.

Sorry - I'm just a tad sensitive at the moment! :-( I must have missed much of the discussion regarding the problems with SD on the 3800 series - living under a rock or something [sfx:twighlight zone theme plays in background] :-) Thanks for clarifying things! I am glad that I wasn't the only one having problems with SD's - it was driving me mad at the time.

With regard to the memory upgrade - eXpansys are charging about ten quid more for the 64MB upgrade than PPCTechs themselves. This makes it pretty reasonable in terms of pricing considering the international shipping you would have to pay to the states. AFAIK eXpansys are the only guys in the UK doing the upgrade. One good thing about the 32MB is that it's taught me to keep my device cleaner and not mess around with so many inessential apps. I'm managing to get by with 32, and I'll probably move to a new device in around six months, so I'm not sure it'll be worth the investment in a RAM upgrade for me personally.

Yeah - I must admit that the $80 shipping for direct PPCTechs service was kind of putting me off - but on seeing Expansys' offer, I am *really* tempted to go for it. In the past I have had a Sharp 7000, Psion Classic, Psion 3a/512, Psion3a/2mB, Psion 3c, Psion 5, Palm V, iPaq 3650, 3870 and now O2 XDA - that is 10 PDA's!!! (excluding faulty ones) - OK that's over a long period, but recently I've come to the conclusion that, when taking into account the accessories with all these, there is a *huge* cost of even trying to keep ahead - I can't keep it up.

I've decided that (having been delighted by the XDA overall - even better when O2 manage to get the ROM upgrade out) I am going to stay with it until someone brings out a substantial MAJOR pda improvement before I upgrade to a new machine. Therefore I will probably go with the RAM upgrade - it was difficult going from 32 - 64 and then back to 32mB!.

[griph]

Ah kati42, you got in there before me :)

The power of being a Pocket PC Oracle...

8) Thanks both. 'nuff said.

[griph]

I don't think you were being chastised for your comments, I think that Eciton was just pointing out that the 3800 series is known to have trouble with SD cards, whereas other PPCs it's less of an issue. So your PPCPE probably won't have any trouble, regardless of whether or not the 3870 did.

You're right kati42! I appreciate the advice. Thanks. :D

[Eciton]

The XDA is the PDA i'm most happy with - its screen, build quality and stability are just miles ahead of my iPAQ, and the Palms before tha couldn't compete on features. If anything, I'm sticking to 32MB as a kind of experiment in lifestyle frugality :)

Make sure you let us know how the memory upgrade goes!

Not a problem about the SD thing - that was one of the issues the ipaqpetition was aiming to resolve; I wonder how that thing's going on?

Anyway, getting OT now, so ta-ra for now folks ;)

[wth]

I had an SD card and managed to loose it from my xda, not sure how but the card often unlatched when I had it in my pocket. Replaced it with an MMC card as I tried one and found that dues to its slightly thinner size it didn't stick out of the XDA's rounded bottom as much.

Might be worth considering seems I found the MMC slightly cheaper than SD and haven't noticed any speed differences

[Ekkie Tepsupornchai]

Might be worth considering seems I found the MMC slightly cheaper than SD and haven't noticed any speed differences
At 128MB or below, there is virtually zero speed difference.

At 256MB or above, SD is at least 4x faster. Having owned a MMC cards (28MB / 32MB / 64MB) and SD cards (128MB / 256MB), I can certainly vouche for the speed improvements.

[griph]

The XDA is the PDA i'm most happy with - its screen, build quality and stability are just miles ahead of my iPAQ
I must admit that I am also impressed with the XDA for the reasons you give, but also for the fact that it is such a good looking PDA too!
Make sure you let us know how the memory upgrade goes!

I will do - but the earliest that will be is November 03 when the warranty expires. I definitely intend to do it though I haven't seen many comments from posters here on how it went in the past - I am sure there is a discussion thread somewhere that I have just not seen yet - any pointers anyone?

[kneofyte]

Hi guys,

I was wondering about the cosmetic features of using a SD or a MMC card in a T-Mobile pocket pc phone. Do these cards stick out of the SD slot at the bottom of the phone way too much? Can someone who is using these memory expansion cards give me an idea as to how much it projects out? I was thinking about using the Hagiwara 512 MB SD card.
Thanks

[griph]

Hi guys,

I was wondering about the cosmetic features of using a SD or a MMC card in a T-Mobile pocket pc phone. Do these cards stick out of the SD slot at the bottom of the phone way too much? Can someone who is using these memory expansion cards give me an idea as to how much it projects out? I was thinking about using the Hagiwara 512 MB SD card.
Thanks

The MM Card on my O2XDA does not stick out beyond the bottom of the unit when viewed from the front. As the slot in formed in the base of the unit which curves from front to back - you can see the edge of the card from behind the unit, thereby allowing you to press the edge of the card into the slot to release it - it being fitted with a puish-push lock-release mechanism. The T Mobile should be the same.

[kneofyte]

Thanks griph on the info on MM Cards cosmetic look. Anybody with an SD card here in their T-Mobile ppc. Can anyone describe how they fit into the SD slot. And do all the sizes remain consistent with the size of memory..like would a 512 MB chip be bigger in length when compared to a 256 MB chip.
Thanks.

[Pony99CA]

And do all the sizes remain consistent with the size of memory..like would a 512 MB chip be bigger in length when compared to a 256 MB chip.

The SD card format is both a physical and electrical standard, so the size of the card will be the same no matter how much memory it has. For example, my new 256 MB SD card is exactly the same size as my older 128 MB SD card.

The bigger question is just how much memory you can pack into a given space. As CF cards are physically larger than SD cards, CF cards will probably always support larger memory sizes than SD cards (or at least support a given memory size sooner).

Steve

[kneofyte]

Thanks Steve for the info. But I am still worried about how the SD card fits into the SD slot in the T-Mobile pocketpc. Does it go all the way in or it protrudes out?
Thanks all for your help.

[kneofyte]

I found the answer to the question I was posing. All credit to fk1team for the picture.
http://www.scottishgolfsociety.com/images/sd.jpg
I appreciate all your help.