New Pocket PC in Q1 2003?

[Ed Hansberry]

<a href="http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/02/07/10/020710hnmssmartphone.xml">http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/02/07/10/020710hnmssmartphone.xml</a><br /><br />Microsoft has a habit of releasing Pocket PC versions every 18 months, give or take a few. That means one is due around March 2003. And according to that same Smartphone article I just posted about, MS is on time. "Looking ahead, Microsoft plans to release an updated version of the Windows Powered Smartphone software along with an updated version of its Pocket PC software. Scheduled to ship during the first quarter of 2003, both products will be based on a new Windows CE operating system kernel that will ship at the same time, rather than the Windows CE 3.0 kernel that is used in Windows Powered Smartphone 2002 and Pocket PC 2002, Cazzaro said."<br /><br />See that folks? Not Windows CE 3.0. And not CE 4.0 either. This looks like Macallan, also known as Windows CE 5.0!

[entropy1980]

Where do you get that it's not ce 4.0 and that it is ce 5.0? And does this mean that it will include X-Scale optimizations?

[Dave Conger]

Where do you get that it's not ce 4.0 and that it is ce 5.0?

"...both products will be based on a new Windows CE operating system kernel that will ship at the same time..."

CE 4.0 is already shipping.

[Jason Dunn]

Wow - talk about being blind-sided! I wish someone who tell me these things... :roll:

[mookie123]

what's hot in the 5.0 ?

[entropy1980]

Naww i think you guys are jumping to conclusions Microsoft's roadmap doesn't show 5 for a while, and all this article says is that it will be a new kernel different from 3.0.... I think it's 4.... I mean has Microsoft ever shipped anything on time? :D

[Ed Hansberry]

I am not so sure this article is accurate. The more I think about the timelines involved, I suspect anything in 2003 will be based on CE .NET as opposed to them concurrently putting Pocket PC on a beta OS. We'll see. :|

[Ed Hansberry]

Where do you get that it's not ce 4.0 and that it is ce 5.0?

"...both products will be based on a new Windows CE operating system kernel that will ship at the same time..."

CE 4.0 is already shipping.
You are right pdadave. There is no way to take this as meaning CE4. Still.. sounds like a misquote or misstatement. Here is a good writeup of what CE4 has - http://www.pencomputing.com/frames/textblock_ce_net.html - including a mention of Macallan.

http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/02/02/26/020226hnwince.xml though, confirms that CE 5.0/Macallan will ship in 2003.

Now i don't know what to think. 8O Maybe this is for real. :o

[Ed Hansberry]

Ok, here is more. http://www.itworld.com/Comp/2245/020313nonpcwindows/

They are calling Jameson a CE.NET update. Perhaps that is what it is. "Microsoft also plans to release an update to Windows CE .Net by the end of the year, code-named Jameson, which will have added support for IPv6 (Internet Protocol Version 6), SMS (Short Messaging System) and document viewers for additional Microsoft Office applications, Kidd said."

[entropy1980]

My understanding is that Macallan was supossed to be done in late 2003 and not in products till '04 much like .Net is out now but not in devices.... remember product cycles, the Pocket PC team still has to put touches on it (ie GUI) and how can they if Macallan is even finished? I know that 4.0 and later are integrating some Pocket PC features but the GUI and drivers (including a Direct Draw or Open GL port) still would need to be done, so my vote is PPC 2k3 or PPC.net will be 4.0.

[Foo Fighter]

Microsoft is skipping WinCE 4.0 and going right to 5.0 for PocketPC? Riiiiiiight (Dr. Evil voice). :?

What changes can we expect in the next release?

[Hands clasped in prayer] Please say new GUI.....please say new GUI.....please say new GUI. [/prayer] :idea:

[Ed Hansberry]

My understanding is that Macallan was supossed to be done in late 2003 and not in products till '04 much like .Net is out now but not in devices.... remember product cycles, the Pocket PC team still has to put touches on it (ie GUI) and how can they if Macallan is even finished? I know that 4.0 and later are integrating some Pocket PC features but the GUI and drivers (including a Direct Draw or Open GL port) still would need to be done, so my vote is PPC 2k3 or PPC.net will be 4.0.

Remember, Pocket PC 2000 devices shipped 3 months three months before Windows CE did. PPC 2000 went gold to the OEM's in Jan/Feb of 2000, almost 6 months before CE 3.0 shipped. Depends on the priority. They could be developing either Jamison or Macallan with Pocket PC/Smartphone in mind, then go back and clean it up as a pure embedded OS.

[JonnoB]

And the question of the days is.... will the new OS (whatever it is) be optimized for XScale or ARM5+ instruction set? That will make people jump.

[Take1]

Conspricay Theory:

The Pocket PC development department is assembling a critical response team that will, on a moments notice, begin coding the next version of PPC once OS5 has hit the shelves and can be analysed for weaknesses that can be exploited. Intel, the undercover operative arm of this plan, has put ALREADY put chips SPECIFICALLY designed to underprefrom due to hidden code that will 'dissapear' once the proper secret instruction set is transmitted from Bill Gates' PC at MS headquarters using the widely used MS Passport service. When done with precision timing, this will make OS5 look primitive compared to the 400% speed increase that PPC will experience once the elite coders optimize the OS and Bill Gates' instruction set is spread to the most remote corners of the earth via the univerally accepted and trusted Passport portal.

I Can't wait!

[Take1]

Conspricay Theory:

The Pocket PC development department is assembling a critical response team that will, on a moments notice, begin coding the next version of PPC once OS5 has hit the shelves and can be analysed for weaknesses that can be exploited. Intel, the undercover operative arm of this plan, has put ALREADY put chips SPECIFICALLY designed to underprefrom due to hidden code that will 'dissapear' once the proper secret instruction set is transmitted from Bill Gates' PC at MS headquarters using the widely used MS Passport service. When done with precision timing, this will make OS5 look primitive compared to the 400% speed increase that PPC will experience once the elite coders optimize the OS and Bill Gates' instruction set is spread to the most remote corners of the earth via the univerally accepted and trusted Passport portal.

I Can't wait!

I didn't realize I can't change my post! Here it is without the horrible misspelling:

Conspiracy Theory:

The Pocket PC development department is assembling a critical response team that will, on a moments notice, begin coding the next version of PPC once OS5 has hit the shelves and can be analyzed for weaknesses that can be exploited. Intel, the undercover operative arm of this plan, has put ALREADY put chips SPECIFICALLY designed to underpreform due to hidden code that will 'disappear' once the proper secret instruction set is transmitted from Bill Gates' PC at MS headquarters using the widely used MS Passport service. When done with precision timing, this will make OS5 look primitive compared to the 400% speed increase that PPC will experience once the elite coders optimize the OS and Bill Gates' instruction set is spread to the most remote corners of the earth via the universally accepted and trusted Passport portal.

I Can't wait!

[mookie123]

It could be that the 4.0, the CE.net is a total no go by the OEM.

[Marc Zimmermann]

It could be that the 4.0, the CE.net is a total no go by the OEM.

That's not decided upon by the OEMs. Microsoft packages Pocket PC (including the base OS) and they put it on their devices. What's used as the foundation of Pocket PC is Microsoft's decision.

[MacBirdie]

"Phillips said Service Pack 1 for Win CE.Net will be optimized for the Intel x-scale architecture and will also include an Arm Version 5 compiler."

That explains it :)

[Teddy]

I wonder if present devices, plus the new xscale devices will be able to be upgraded to this new version, OS or whatever... :wink:

[Marc Zimmermann]

I wonder if present devices, plus the new xscale devices will be able to be upgraded to this new version, OS or whatever... :wink:

In theory, of course. They all have Flash ROM. It now depends on the OEMs to offer upgrades. There's also a fair chance that the new ROM will be larger than the 32MB available ROM, so that it will be the same as with the Pocket PC 2002 upgrade where some applications went into RAM and some pieces not available.

[Scott R]

"Microsoft also plans to release an update to Windows CE .Net by the end of the year, code-named Jameson, which will have added support for IPv6 (Internet Protocol Version 6), SMS (Short Messaging System) and document viewers for additional Microsoft Office applications, Kidd said."
OK, we've discussed this in the past. Perhaps you can explain it to me again. PPC is the OS plus GUI plus apps. You always said that CE was just the OS. So, what's this about CE.NET including document viewers? That doesn't sound like an OS-level thing to me. :?

Scott

[Ed Hansberry]

OK, we've discussed this in the past. Perhaps you can explain it to me again. PPC is the OS plus GUI plus apps. You always said that CE was just the OS. So, what's this about CE.NET including document viewers? That doesn't sound like an OS-level thing to me. :?
Just like Calculator and Wordpad are not really part of Windows, they always come with Windows. They are mini-apps, not full featured. I doubt the Pocket PC would be using Word and Excel document viewers, but what if one of the viewers was for Project 2000 or PowerPoint? The PPC team may leave those viewers in place for the Pocket PC image.

But people like Casio that build a pure CE based BE-300 device would be able to include simple viewers with their systems if they chose to. Obviously it is an optional component, not really part of the OS itself and companies that built headless embedded devices or UI's for gas pumps would leave this component out.

[Marc Zimmermann]

So, what's this about CE.NET including document viewers?

Well, Microsoft constantly enhances the base OS for developers who want to build their own devices. There's IE, Media Player, Terminal Server Client (to the best of my knowledge) and now document viewers. However, someone who uses Windows CE as the basis for a new device type doesn't need to include any of those apps. They're purely optional as are most other components, such as even display support.

[MaximumPDA]

I could see that releasing an "OS 5" will bring the number game with Palm look even steven to the general consumer. Like Netscape vs. MS in the browser version war. I am sure that my observation is over simplified and smacks of marketing conspiracy.

--Bill