Should Compaq recall the 3800 series iPAQs?

[Jason Dunn]

<a href="http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=f142a515e9633d614cdddbadf41044ea&threadid=52621&perpage=15&pagenumber=1">http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=f142a515e9633d614cdddbadf41044ea&threadid=52621&perpage=15&pagenumber=1</a><br /><br />There's a discussion thread over at Brighthand - someone started an online petition for HP/Compaq to recall the 3800 series Pocket PCs. What do you think? Are they blowing the issues our of proportion, or is there a legitimate concern here?

[jpzr]

What do you think? Are they blowing the issues our of proportion, or is there a legitimate concern here?

I think that they are right.

Firstly: I do have problems with 256 MB CF card in Bluetooth expansion jacket.

Secondly: I am angry that my SD slot does not have SDIO but dirty cheap Palm devices have SDIO slot (and can put there Bluetooth or SD-WiFi or whatever).

I would not buy neither Jornada nor iPAQ again. Now I probably would go for Fujitsu Loox or Toshiba.

[Chris Spera]

Most definitely, yes.

The 3800 series should be recalled, and users should either get a (finally) fixed 3800, or credit towards a new 3900 series device, or what ever suceeds the 3800.

There have been too many customer advisories and too many end user problems for the devices to be of use or value...IMHO.

Christopher Spera
-------
pocketnow Writer

pocketnow.com -- it's all about portability...
http://www.pocketnow.com

[Jason Dunn]

I just added a poll question, so go vote...

[dochall]

Compaq certainly have as much idea of customer service as the Cavemen has of nuclear fission. The debacle over the 'free' upgrade to PPC2002 still rankles with me.

The arrogance of some of the management in the organisation has to be seen to be believed and of course these aren't the people that will be getting pink slips.

I think you could get the queen, dubiya and Osama Bin Laden to sign the petition and still not see a recall.

[T-Will]

The iPAQ should have been recalled two years ago with the first batch of 3600's but I think it's a little late now...Compaq is just living up to their great quality control reputation and anyone buying an iPAQ now should be well aware of this reputation which Compaq has carefully built over the past two years. BTW, after my fifth 3600 I decided to sell it and buy a Toshiba.

[Shaun Stuart]

Are you any happier with the Toshiba ? What is better ?

[T-Will]

I am quite a bit happier with the Toshiba. It doesn't have any quality issues like the iPAQ, it's smaller, has dual slots built in, decent screen (not as bright as the iPAQ but definately good enough for me, I rarely have a need for the sidelight, and even with the sidelight it is plenty bright), no dust bunnies under the screen, the battery life is better, it's smaller, supports multiple button presses, diagonals, 64 MB RAM, and is smaller.

Some disadvantages, not for me but for other people are it doesn't have the expansion capabilities of the iPAQ, it has very few accessories, and the screen is slightly smaller (3.5" instead of 3.8").

[Will T Smith]

[quote=Jason Dunn]
I would not buy neither Jornada nor iPAQ again. Now I probably would go for Fujitsu Loox or Toshiba.


Hold on there cowboy. Don't sullie Jornada for iPaq's mistakes. That would be a BIG mistake. High Jornada sales may eventually convince Hewlett Paq-ard to continue (and emphasize) the reliable, simple Jornada form factor over the complicated, low-quality, high maintenance iPaq design.

Such a possibility is still in the cards. Especially if iPaq sales start declining in the face of strong competition for Toshiba, ASUS, and especially Symbol (for vertical markets).

The sleeve concept has simply been poorly executed. It adds extra expense and complexity that is simply not needed. The device is locked into it's form factor to retain device compatibility. In retrospect, the sled concept is probably better from the standpoint of flexibility. Sleds don't have arms and need not conform to a specific thickness, nor even a specific width.

Let's pray that HP doesn't throw out the practical reliable Jornada Lexus Sedan) device in favor of the flashy, high maintenance Compaq iPaq (Chevy Corvette).

[sallys]

Even though I do not own a 38xx, I am supporting this thread at Brighthand. I am very disgruntled owner of an unusable 36xx. I am working on adding the 36xx problems and issues to the petition process that this group on Brighthand thread are working on. I will never buy another Compaq (now HP) product, unless they change drastically and start doing the right thing by their customers.

The Compaq IPAQ PPC has been plagued with defects since the beginning and they have not addressed the problems in an ethical way. They just come out with a new version/series and advertise the heck out of it and lure more and more unsuspecting customers into the trap. All of us who feel this way need to stand up and talk about it in a loud way and tell everyone we know about the defective IPAQ products they have sold us.

Thank you for posting this POLL.

[denivan]

First I'd like to say that I'm sorry for all you unlucky bastards out there, but I'd like to mention that I hardly had problems with my iPAQ. When my first one started to loose some paint I e-mailed compaq and they shipped me a new one. I have this iPAQ still and it works great for me , never experienced things like dust problems or stylus lock problems or whatever, and I can fairly say I'm a heavy user.

So : I'm sorry for all those people out their with defective iPAQs, but I'd like to let people know that not all iPAQs are bad ;)

Ivan

P.S. I have a 3660

[pradike]

As the former owner of both HP & Casio devices thorugh WIN CE 2.0 and beyond...I AM HAPPY WITH MY IPAQ. Like ALL other PocketPC's its not perfect, but the few minor issues are really non-issues.

I look at the groups of Palm Pilot owners I know, and they all whine all the time about how crummy those things are, and how they can't do what they want - sure there's 10,000 programs for them, but 9,000 are useless, and the rest are B&W or primative....

IPAQ still rules!

[MovilPRO]

I m an 3850 user. I have problems with the SD port, because it do not work as well as I spect, but I thing that it can be solved with a system upgrade. By example, I have stored files and programs in it, when I turn on my iPaq by first time, There is an slow down displaying and executing programs, but if I extract and reinsert the card while on, all seems corrected.

About the bluetooth expansion sleeve problems, they are problems with the sleeve, nott with the iPaq. I has the old PC card sleeve and now the new PC Card sleeve Plus, the Flyjacket, CF memory cards with 512 Mbytes, the Sierra Wireless PC Card, and many other hardware, and lot of programs AND ALL WORKS VERY WELL.

I hope that all this is not a killing program against iPaq, because it is a revolutionary concept.

Thanks


Hector Hernandez

[jpzr]

So : I'm sorry for all those people out their with defective iPAQs, but I'd like to let people know that not all iPAQs are bad ;)


No, you are wrong. You simply don't do too much things with your iPAQ, you do almost nothing with your iPAQ, and that is why you don't have problems. I suggest that you use it as a hammer - then maybe you will have even less problems. Shorlty speaking: you miss the point totally.

[ollie]

Let's not get carried away jpzr. I've had an iPAQ 3630 for over a year now and have not had any problems with it. I am a heavy user, and always have been. I use a CF sleeve with it, and have never had anything to complain about. One of my friends has a Jornada, which he believes is slow compared to the iPAQ ... but comparisons are odious!

Now, if there are indeed serious issues with the 38xx series, and it seems to me that there are, then HP/Compaq should do the *right* thing and recall the product. It's as simple as that. Users forked out money to buy this device, the least they can expect is to have it working to its optimum standard. So I'd have to say YES to the survey! I can never understand why manufacturers seem to release products which haven't been extensively tested. :(

[denivan]

Shorlty speaking: you miss the point totally.

I think it's about time the moderator kicks you out of this place. I've seen you reply'ing a couple of times and every time you're insulting. Remember the stupid debacle with the SD cards ? Every time you get carried away for no reason and frankly I've had enough of it. When I say I'm a heavy user, I mean I use my iPAQ for an average of 5 hours a day (of course sometimes you don't use it all for a day) I use it for gaming (which is certainly hardware intensive), i constantly take it with me as an mp3 player and when I'm bored i use it to watch simpson divx movies. Most days I charge twice or three times a day, just because I use it so much. When I say that I am a heavy user, I am not wrong. Compaq has been great for me, when I had my first problem (paint comming off) , I got a new iPAQ, no questions asked. Their pick up and return service was flawless and I don't see why I won't buy another Compaq problem again.

[jpzr]

Remember the stupid debacle with the SD cards ?


Not everything that YOU don't understand is stupid.

I mean I use my iPAQ for an average of 5 hours a day (of course sometimes you don't use it all for a day) I use it for gaming (which is certainly hardware intensive), i constantly take it with me as an mp3 player and when I'm bored i use it to watch simpson divx movies.


No wireless usage? No WLAN (WiFi), no Bluetooth?
No usage of big capacity memory cards? No infra-red usage?

And you call it heavy? Maybe, but it is narrow usage.

I repeat: I have been screwed by Compaq (no SDIO slots, problems
with various wireless stuff, no CF slot) and now most likely I would
buy Fujitsu Loox or Toshiba.

(no HP: not all models have SD&amp;CF slots built-in, dust problem in display not solved)

[jpzr]

i use it to watch simpson divx movies.

it is illegal - to watch stolen movies. as far as I know there is no such thing as legal "simpson divx movies".

[denivan]

it is illegal - to watch stolen movies. as far as I know there is no such thing as legal "simpson divx movies".

First, what are you trying to prove here? Are you trying to dismantle my previous arguments by stating that I'm doing illegal stuff?

It is not illegal. The Divx5 Codec is not a hacked codec, but 100% legal. The consumer has the right to make 1 personal copy for himself, so for me it's totally legal to rip a Simpsons DVD, convert it using Divx5 and watch it on my iPAQ. Heck, this was one of the main reasons that made me buy a PPC instead of PalmOS device.

For your info by the way, I use IRDA all the time for communication with my cell phone (SMS, E-mail, WAP etc.). I don't understand why this would make a heavy user, because I see that as normal PDA use, you know, what a PDA was meant to do. I don't have wifi (too expensive over here) and I don't have bluetooth (not mature enough imo). And what is so special about using big capacity memory cards? I have a 256 Mb cf card and really don't see why that would make me a heavy user.

By the way, you say that you've been screwed by Compaq because there's no CF slot ? You must have been the least informed iPAQ buyer then. I agree with the SDIO problems, but why is no CF card slot a problem? You knew that before you bought it, didn't you? I also thought that I wouldn't need a CF card, but after some time I purchased a CF jacket and then bought a Silver Slider CF jacket.

And what I meant about the 'stupid SD debacle' was how you overreacted (as you did just now) and that you were commented on that by some other people (and the moderator I believe).

Really, you should learn how a forum works and not overreact everytime when someone says something you don't agree with, or else people would get fed up with you rather fast. I know I'm starting to...

Ivan

[jpzr]

The consumer has the right to make 1 personal copy for himself, so for me it's totally legal to rip a Simpsons DVD, convert it using Divx5 and watch it on my iPAQ.


OK, I thought that you use KaZaA for acquiring these divx. Anyway no way to proof either way.


I don't have wifi (too expensive over here) and I don't have bluetooth (not mature enoug imo).


I have both ! and I used WiFi and Bluetooth hardware from various vendors. Having just infra-red does not make any heavy wireless user.

If you don't have it then you don't know many things!


And what is so special about using big capacity memory cards? I have a 256 Mb cf card and really don't see why that would make me a heavy user.


because it has problems in jackets - sometimes it is not recognized.
the same story I have heard with bigger SD cards in iPAQs



By the way, you say that you've been screwed by Compaq because there's no CF slot ? You must have been the least informed iPAQ buyer then.


Of course not, right away with iPAQ I bought also expansion jacket. Again very weak argument of yours.


I agree with the SDIO problems, but why is no CF card slot a problem? You knew that before you bought it, didn't you?


Lack of SDIO is my main problem. And you are boring with this CF card slot - I told you - I knew that it has none.


Really, you should learn how a forum works


And you should learn that if you have no relevant experiences that you should not speak out with critics about people who had these experiences!

Also: please note that results of vote that Jason established for this subject clearly indicate that huge majority of people share my views.

So you, being only a very narrow user, not using many features, are in minority.

Now I only think about selection: Fujutsu Loox or Toshiba. I am 100% sure that I will not buy another iPAQ. Probably I will take Toshiba with built-in Wi-Fi and Xscale 400 MHz...

[jpzr]

I don't have wifi (too expensive over here)

over where? wifi (WLAN) is several times cheaper - as far as LAN Access points are concerned than Bluetooth.

[denivan]

OK, I thought that you use KaZaA for acquiring these divx. Anyway no way to proof either way.

Indeed, there's no way to proof it. Although I certainly don't understand why it should make a difference.


I have both ! and I used WiFi and Bluetooth hardware from various vendors. Having just infra-red does not make any heavy wireless user.
If you don't have it then you don't know many things!


What tells you that the problem doesn't lie with the BT and WiFi hardware? When I got my iPAQ i seriously contemplated on equipping me with lots of BT stuff, but when I started reading I saw that the technology is great, but that the implementation isn't how it should be, so because the concept of BT seemed insecure I opted to stick with IRDA untill BT2.0 or so arrives. And 802.11b also seemed to slow for me. I'll let you know when cheap 802.11a setups arrive ;)



because it has problems in jackets - sometimes it is not recognized.
the same story I have heard with bigger SD cards in iPAQs


Maybe it's because it's faulty CF cards ? If have 2 samsung cards and one dane-elec card, never had any problems with them. Once I bought a 'POI' 128 Mb CF card which was fearly cheap and it never worked, so I send it back and got my money back.



Of course not, right away with iPAQ I bought also expansion jacket. Again very weak argument of yours.


No it's not a weak argument. You say that you're disappointed by the SDIO cards, no CF card etc. (read your post again). So I ask how you can blame the no CF card on compaq? That's just how they felt their product should be, if you didn't like it, then why did you buy it ? I'd say my argument is pretty strong.



Lack of SDIO is my main problem. And you are boring with this CF card slot - I told you - I knew that it has none.


Again, then why did you mention it as one of the down sides? Seems like a bit unfair to me.



And you should learn that if you have no relevant experiences that you should not speak out with critics about people who had these experiences!

Also: please note that results of vote that Jason established for this subject clearly indicate that huge majority of people share my views.

So you, being only a very narrow user, not using many features, are in minority.

Now I only think about selection: Fujutsu Loox or Toshiba. I am 100% sure that I will not buy another iPAQ. Probably I will take Toshiba with built-in Wi-Fi and Xscale 400 MHz...[/


I see that lots of people have problems with the 3800 and I'm pretty sure most of them are Backlight and SDIO card related. I have an 3660 and all I wanted to say is that with the experience that I have with it (which I conseder more than average use) it is a great machine. And the one time I needed support, it worked flawlessly.

Again, I respect the fact that people have problems with their 3800 devices (although I'm also sure that some of those problems are cause by the accesoires), but you should also respect that for some people it works perfectly. Like I said, I consider myself as a fairly heavy user (remember that most people buy an ipaq and only use 10% of the included apps and never install new appz or buy accesoires) and I haven't had any problems with it. Maybe its because I'm lucky , but I think there's no shame in being lucky ;)

Ivan

[denivan]

over where? wifi (WLAN) is several times cheaper - as far as LAN Access points are concerned than Bluetooth.

I live in Belgium. Wireless routers have come down in price, but it's fairly difficult to get my hands on a CF WiFi card. The only way I see of getting one is importing one from the UK or something and then it would be too expensive. I can't justify the cost just yet for what it is. (too expensive, too slow imo).

[jpzr]

And 802.11b also seemed to slow for me. I'll let you know when cheap 802.11a setups arrive ;)

11 megabits per second speed to the device that has just 64 MB of base memory is too slow?

802.11b was never too slow for me. of course my fixed LANs (not wireless) are 100 megabit/s but for private wireless usage 11 megabits is not too slow.

[denivan]

11 megabits per second speed to the device that has just 64 MB of base memory is too slow?
802.11b was never too slow for me. of course my fixed LANs (not wireless) are 100 megabit/s but for private wireless usage 11 megabits is not too slow.

When I invest in a setup, I pretty much want it to do most things, not just one thing. For browsing the Internet , 11Mbps would do just fine, but I also want to use it for copying over stuff to my CF cards etc.

[jpzr]

When I invest in a setup, I pretty much want it to do most things, not just one thing. For browsing the Internet , 11Mbps would do just fine, but I also want to use it for copying over stuff to my CF cards etc.

now you use USB for copying: it uses 1.5 Mbps so it is still much slower than 11 Mbps and WLAN.

and what is the real, hidden reason? that you can't use WLAN and CF at the same time?

[Mark (NL)]

Can you guys please take this personal warfare to an e-mail battle? I'm not interested in throwing things back and forth, we all have different expectations from what a PPC should do for us, attacking another user because he thinks different just makes no sense!

I have to agree with denivian though that "some" of us get more than a little tired by the comments that jpzr makes on other users experience!

jpzr, the first rule in every forum discussion should be that you respect other peoples view on things, no matter if you agree with them or not! If you don't agree than please just explain why you feel that way without attacking a user personal... I CAN understand that you feel strongly about certain things, and that you would like to bring them across to other people, but I feel that the way you do that makes people quite agitated and not willing to see your points even anymore!

Sorry for the kinda “off topic” reply, but after reading so many discussions here (that go in the same flaming way) I had to say something…

[denivan]

now you use USB for copying: it uses 1.5 Mbps so it is still much slower than 11 Mbps and WLAN.

and what is the real, hidden reason? that you can't use WLAN and CF at the same time?

No, the real reason is that a USB cable was supplied, so I didn't invest in it and I can't nag. When I need to buy a CF WiFi card an a wireless router, it'll cost me roughly 300 - 400 EURO and I think this is way too much for my needs and for what the technology delivers. I can call myself an innovator, and I like gadgets, but please allow me the right to dislike a technology and therefor not invest in it. Apparantly it didn't only save me money, but also made me a happier person, because you seem to have problems with your setup.

[jpzr]

Apparantly it didn't only save me money, but also made me a happier person, because you seem to have problems with your setup.

No! I had/have problems with Bluetooth - none with WLAN (WiFi)... WLAN brougth me more fun than worries.

But Bluetooth, if one wants to make more than just simple FileTransfer , is a pain in the *ss...

[denivan]

No! I had/have problems with Bluetooth - none with WLAN (WiFi)... WLAN brougth me more fun than worries.

But Bluetooth, if one wants to make more than just simple FileTransfer , is a pain in the *ss...

Yeah, but that Bluetooth problem is not only a Compaq thing, right ? I thought about getting a bluetooth phone, but I decided to buy the Siemens S45, an excellent phone, packed with features, but without Bluetooth.

Anywayz, as far as I'm concerned, this discussion is closed. My point still stands, I haven't had any problems with MY ipaq. Apparantly lots of people aren't happy with THEIR ipaq 3800, I suppose mainly because of the SDIO and backlight issues. Sorry for them, but I enjoy my 3660 still every day.

Case closed

[Jason Dunn]

Jeese - I don't check the board for 12 hours and all hell breaks loose. :roll:

The thread is now locked and no comments can be made to it - jpzr and denivan's back and forth bickering has effectively ruined it. jpzr's account is suspended for one week and hopefully when he returns he'll be more civil. denivan, you should know better than to respond to jpzr. :wink:

To everyone else, I apologize for not stepping in sooner. :?