This Site Cracks Me Up II

[Andy Sjostrom]

<a href="http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3626">http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3626</a><br /><br />Brad just posted <a href="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1614">some comments</a> related to a site that cracks him up. I'm next!<br /><br />I found this recent PalmInfocenter editorial amusing! (Thanks to Willy Gautvik for the link!) Ed Hardy explains why "the Palm OS Is the Inevitable Winner" over the Pocket PC. Based on a conversation with Brighthand's Steve Bush, Ed Hardy presents a number of arguments why Palm wins and Pocket PC loses. The article presents a representative pro-Palm and anti-Pocket PC world view, and is well worth reading!<br /><br />The five years of Palm sleeping is revisionistically described as a "working" Palm approach. The fact that Palm has not brought any innovation to the market while sleeping is explained by stating that it is because the hardware hasn't been up to the task. The reason to why PalmSource is trying to catch up with the Pocket PC is explained by stating that since the hardware is up to the task today, it is worth adding things the Pocket PC has been able to do for years. Successfully.<br /><br />The user interface myth is also brought up. According to Ed Hardy, the Pocket PC has an "interface designed for a screen at least four times bigger than any possible on a handheld" because Microsoft tries to put too many features into a small device. Well, it will be interesting to check up on this analysis if PalmSource manages to catch up with the rich Pocket PC feature set! The fact is that user interface and feature set are two separate software design aspects. A complex feature can be represented by an easy-to-use user interface, just as a simple feature can be represented by an impossible-to-use user interface. The Pocket PC implements a clean and easy-to-use user interface design, far away from the days of the early "Palm Sized PC" when this myth was not a myth.<br /><br />Another argument, repeated almost to the level of chanting from Palm OS supporters, that is supposed to explain a Palm strength and a Pocket PC weakness at the same time is the number of Palm OS applications: "There are thousands of Palm OS applications and a thriving third party software market." On behalf of all Palm users, I am glad there are many applications to choose from and that the third party software market thrives. For the same reasons, I am glad on behalf of all Pocket PC users. Seen any really cool Palm OS games lately?<br /><br />The fact is that the Pocket PC has the momentum in all aspects, and that PalmSource is in "catch up-mode" and way behind.

[JvanEkris]

That's the arrogance of a palm-dinasour just before he becomes extinct. They add just more of the same lame stuf..

Jaap

[pradike]

:D
Palm's napping & loss of market focus & expectations has left it in the dumper. All their high priced "experts" from the past have left the company. One attempt of these jolly fellows was to start Handspring, which is also faltering in some of the same goofy business decision doldrums as Palm.

Its so ironic that now the Palm plan is to, in essence, "catch up" to PocketPC. They never will....unless maybe the rumored buyout by Sony takes place, and even then, it will take a whole new vision there to make things work.

Put a fork in your Palm...its DONE![/b]

[farnold]

Yeah right, PALM will win, because it is not as innovative as PocketPC. Ha, but the old abacus will always be better than the PALM then, won't it?

[wiredguy]

Palm may have thousands of applications, but over 80% are completely useless things that some Palm developer put together for the fun of it. Most are not color, are 160x160 resolution, and have little or no value.

Instead of a hundred little drawing programs, Pocket PC has quality apps like Pocket Artist and Photogenics. Instead of a limited Sony MP3 player, the PPC has Windows Media Player and Real One. Palm users brag about Datebk 4, but PPC has Agenda Fusion and Pocket Informant. I can't think of any popular Palm OS application for which Pocket PC doesn't have a match.

[wiredguy]

BTW, for anyone that thinks it would be good to see a company other than MS dominate the handheld market...

Palm has already shown how they would handle a monopoly. They raised prices and droped innovation. If anyone has read Animal Farm (George Orwell), you'll understand what's happening here.

[Jonathan1]

Seen any really cool Palm OS games lately?
Games are irrelevant. Look at Apple. They have a niche market, have a loyal following, very few games for the platform, and still manage to thrive. (Even with the bumbling stupidity of Jobs) Games are a good way to show of the power of the pocket PC but isn't a major selling point for anyone.

Excuses. I mean at the end of the day that's all they really are right? Excuses. Its what the manufacturers put down is what matters. In a comparison of Palm OS 5 and Pocket PC 2002 the PPC still has a lead in a number of major categories. 3 months ago I thought OS 5 was going to be the one. The one where I jumped back into the Palm camp. I was expecting so much with this OS. I was seriously disappointed and just down right pissed when I say when Palm did with OS 5. I liken OS 5 to Pocket PC 2002. There was a lot of potential there. And nothing materialized out of it. Multimedia support is only in API’s only, ARM support is nonexistent, and multithreading\tasking hasn’t been implemented (If I got my facts straight.). The biggest claim to fame for OS 5 is support for higher res displays. Something that the PPC has had for year. The release of OS 5 has galvanized me. Until Palm decides to stop swimming in the kiddy pool and create a “real” up to day OS I’ll continue to be a PPC advocate.
I find this……http://www.palmos.com/images/about/palmsource2002.gif
Hilarious. What innovation!?!?!?!?!

The Pocket PC may have been developed with a different philosophy in mind. It may have more in common with a desktop OS then anything. It may need the user to close their apps down after opening 10 or so because of slowdown. But who gives a flying crap?!?! As long as it works, who cares HOW it works! If I hear another Palm zealot use the term Zen I'm gonna shove my foot so far up his/her rear I'll charge em for a colon cleansing. :twisted:

[sesummers]

In the MS vs. Palm war, Palm=Apple.

Apple came up with something new and innovative, then rested on their success while MS slowly (but surely) caught up. Now, they're at 2.5% of the market. Their followers are still as loyal and rabid as Palm's, but Apple is marginalized and largely irrelevant.

Personally, I'd rather see the competition tighter, but Palm is showing all the arrogance and bumbling idiocy that caused Apple's demise- they're even making a lot of the same mistakes. Anybody else see the similiarites between "System X" and "OS 5"? All the old apps run in compatibility mode, new apps are scarce and still buggy, obvious difference in operation between old and new apps cause machine to "feel" clumsy, lots of old apps don't quite work the way they're supposed to, etc?

We'll see, but if you start reading about people buying OS 4 Palms because they don't want to deal with the problems of OS 5, you'll know Palm is doomed.

[palmsolo]

I read this PalmInfocenter article on the bus last night and almost fell off my seat laughing. I was a Palm user for over 4 years before switching to the Pocket PC and I still check the PalmInfocenter site daily since I think it is a great resource for the Palm OS. However, this article by Ed sure shows that he hasn't used a Pocket PC and really can't offer a fair comparison. I like Jeff Kirvin's article for the Palm vs. Pocket PC comparison and trust it far more since Jeff has actually used devices from both operating systems.

My Palm had to be reset much more than Jornada. I have never once had to do a hard reset on my Jornada 568 and find it much more stable than my Palms. I even test a ton of software and don't have problems. I don't understand his screen analysis. I personally love the full screen of my Pocket PC and think the worst thing about Palms is their tiny screen taken up by the Grafitti area. The ability to seamlessly use expansion cards, use an email client, use AutoCad on a portable device, etc. are what set the Pocket PC way above the Palm. I even bought a Palm a couple of months ago to see if I could go back, but was just too limited in what I could do. Granted, Palms are good for some people, but to say that Palm is the Inevitable Winner is a joke!

[PlayAgain?]

I'm not saying you're wrong....... I'm just laughing at Microsoft fanboys calling someone else arrogant... Thanks, this is cracking me up!

[Dave Conger]

What makes me mad about that article isn't even the biased content, but a comment later on by Ed H in his comments section in resonse to someone making a derogitory reference toward him..

Look kids, we got our first Pocket PC troll. Normally I delete troll comments but this one was particularly unintelligent so I thought I'd let it stand as an example of the type of comments the pro-PPC crowd leave.

It is funny that the Pocket PC crowd is defined as trolls and he deletes their posts where "his" Palm crowd can posted the most biased anti-PPC posts that sometimes aren't even correct. How the heck is anyone suppose to know what kind of comments the "PPC crowd" if the moderator simply deletes them.

[Foo Fighter]

I trust Ed Hardy's analysis of PDA market as much as I would trust a Catholic Priest alone with a 9 year old boy.

I particularly loved this quote:

Hardly any companies are developing for the Pocket PC and so there are few applications.

Palm still has a much greater pool of third party software, but PocketPC is gaining more support from those same Palm developers. Where has Ed been living for the past 2 years? :roll:

The Giga Group's Carl Zetie wrote a much more accurate assessment of the mobile device market. Read:

http://www.informationweek.com/story/IWK20020328S0007

[PPCRules]

What the guy is saying is that Microsoft didn't make a Palm type OS, then saying that's necessarily bad. I'd give them credit for not copying, but making something fresh and innovative for the mobile computer arena.

Microsoft made a handheld OS from a desktop window's reference point, not from the reference point of another company's connected organizer. But where is Palm now? If it took Microsoft 3 major revs to scale down the desktop Windows OS to make a well-working handheld OS, anyone want to guess how many revs it will take Palm to scale up the Palm OS to where PocketPC OS is? (True, Microsoft wasn't targeting the handheld market until Palm-sized PC, so it wasn't really three revs, more like two). It also seems that the author of the editorial does not realize what the first release of OS5 really is. He speaks about the vision for OS5, but then uses "now" (first rev just released to developers, no product in sight) as the point in time that that vision is realized.

I don't read a lot of Palm OS news, but as for the predicted end of the Palm OS market share slide, I can't think of any new company coming into the Palm OS market (other than maybe niche markets), whereas we are seeing a glut (?) of new suppliers of PocketPCs arriving this summer. I'd say the rest of this year belongs to PPC as far as exciting new products are concerned, now that Sony NR70 has arrived. (Did you see the comment on PalmInfoCenter: How did they get the e310 so small?)

I've always said that Palm and PPC are two different types of products, so it doesn't make sense to compare them. But now that Palm has felt it was necessary to try to rise to the level of PPC, let the comparing begin! Just keep in mind there won't be any $100 X-Scale Palm units that run for two months on a pair of AAAs.

I still think Microsoft should release or endorse a product in the Palm OS4 space, to compete with $100 Palms. I had thought the Casio BE-300 could be just the thing. But I suppose few companies want to go where Palm and Handspring haven't been able to make any money.

[Jonathan1]

Umm isn't Apple's share of the market more like 10%?!? :?: And from what I understand Apple is going to be unleashing a serious marketing blitz in the next few months. Something akin to the Think stupid…I mean different campaign that occurred in the 90’s

*shrugs*
At this point I'm not sure what Palm's problem IS.


Arrogance that their product is superior in their own little minds (PlayAgain arrogance isn't a MS only trait.)
Bad management who only knows how to play spin control but you can only put so much spin on a company who’s market value is sliding into the toilet. And who has to run a buy one device get one free to move inventory.
Fear in moving in a new direction. I’m betting on this one. Palm has never HAD to compete against anyone in its history. Now that MS is playing ball they don’t have a freaking clue as to how to battle back against the Redmond giant. So we get this wonderful song and dance about Zen, about how, people want simplicity, about how users aren’t interested in color, audio, video, etc (Think I’m putting you on? Comdex 2000. Palm execs are quoted as saying that color, audio, and video aren’t what a user is looking for.)
Incompetent lead designers\programmers who are having problems updating the OS.


:?: Who knows.

Everyone here knows it. Palm knows it too. The only thing keeping Microsoft and company from whipping the floor with Palm is the fact that PPC's cost more. I mean face facts. A $600 device (Yes I know the new Toshiba’s are a LOT cheaper then that.) vs a $150-$250 device.
Its the price factor that will always hurt MS. Palm's not going away. I've discussed this with umpteen people. Palm will eventually become a niche market for consumers. That is where Palm excels. Cheap, reliable dependable devices. But in the enterprise market they WILL eventually get thrashed by MS. It’s just a matter of time. MS is like a steady drip of water on a boulder. Just a steady trickle of water and time is all that is needed to destroy that boulder. Microsoft has the funds, and resources to take on Palm for another 10 years if necessary while still taking a loss in profits. The same CAN’T be said about Palm. I just hope the end comes swiftly for Palm and Sony swoops in to grab Palmsource. One of those new Clie’s with “real” OS in it. The thought makes me want to drool. 8O

[Venturello]

The market votes.

See http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/quickchart/quickchart.asp?symb=PALM&sid=0&o_symb=PALM&freq=2&time=20&x=35&y=15 8O 8O

Hmmmmm nice going Palm!

Whatever... let the whine.

[Foo Fighter]

Umm isn't Apple's share of the market more like 10%?!? :?:

No. It's currently 3.7%

[CTSLICK]

I trust Ed Hardy's analysis of PDA market as much as I would trust a Catholic Priest alone with a 9 year old boy.

:lol: Yes Foo...but tell us how you really feel :lol:

Mr. Hardy's commentary is a little out of line but interesting never-the-less. Opinions (and thats really all this is) are like belly buttons...everybody has got one.

I would hope that no one can claim "ultimate victory" in the end. I want Palm and Microsoft to fight and struggle with each other for years to come. Heck, I hope Linux makes it a 3-way fight. Even better, get Symbian into the game too. We all benefit from fierce competition. Just look at all the cool MS based devices that are coming out. Would we have seen this stuff in the same time frame had Palm not had such a monumental market share? I wonder. And I wonder if Palm can wake up soon enough to save themselves. I hope so.

[farnold]

I trust Ed Hardy's analysis of PDA market as much as I would trust a Catholic Priest alone with a 9 year old boy.

Foo Fighter, that is really crap! There are hundrets of thousands of 9 year old boys that meet thousands of cathlic priests every day. And yes, some of them fail badly. But what you say, is racist. With the same argument you won't trust any 20 year old man anymore, because there are some 20 year old rapists - or any black american, just because there are some criminals with dark skin. And yes - not all the evil on earth comes from Moslems, just because a big terrorist hides behind this religion. It is a racist mentality to pick one example and generalize it for everything that seems to be similar.

And regarding PALM - because I thought that's what we're talking about - I don't like it as much as the others here. And the market seems to confirm it. But I still think it's good that there are some who go on with it and keep an alternative alive.

[Rob Alexander]

CTSlick has it right. There aren't two players here, there are three: MS, Palm and consumers. If either of the first two win, then the last one loses. Since I own no stock in MS or (thankfully) Palm, why would I want either one to win? We're the ones who would pay the price if that happened. What we should want is for both companies to be healthy and successful in handheld products so they can continue to improve, innovate and lower prices.

[mememe]

In the MS vs. Palm war, Palm=Apple.

Apple came up with something new and innovative, then rested on their success while MS slowly (but surely) caught up. Now, they're at 2.5% of the market. Their followers are still as loyal and rabid as Palm's, but Apple is marginalized and largely irrelevant.



I believe Apple is about 5% market share amoung OS's for the desktop.. Funny thing about it though, my next system will be a Mac. Sick and tired of Windows, nothing but problems..

[Foo Fighter]

I believe Apple is about 5% market share amoung OS's for the desktop.. Funny thing about it though, my next system will be a Mac. Sick and tired of Windows, nothing but problems..

It's been under 5% for quite some time. Apple's global marketshare is about 2.5%. US marketshare is 3.7%

[Duncan]

What the Palm crowd never seem to grasp is that we arent all MS 'fanboys'. If Palm had produced the goods - I would have bought a Palm. I really wanted Symbian to work as well (because they had the chance to blow MS and Palm out of the water) but they cocked that one up...

It isn't: 'MS Right or Wrong' - it's: 'MS - Best We've Got'!

[Foo Fighter]

my next system will be a Mac. Sick and tired of Windows, nothing but problems..

What problems are you having with your PC? Are you running XP?

I use a new G4 iMac, in addition to my PC workstation, and I have to say...OSX is damn cool! 8)

But be forewarned...there is a dark side to the Mac platform as well.

Macs just aren't as fast as PCs, and OSX makes matters even worse. If you are used to a responsive 1.5GHZ or faster PC, you are going to be sorely disappointed with a Mac. Get used to seeing the mulit-colored spinning ball.

OSX is quite stable, but applications crash constantly. They will die right out from under you.

Also, Macs are much slower at browsing the web. Again, if you are used to the speed of a Windows PC, the Mac is a step backward.

Overall its a matter of personal preference. Go with what you like.

Good luck! :)

[fundmgr90210]

I trust Ed Hardy's analysis of PDA market as much as I would trust a Catholic Priest alone with a 9 year old boy.


Why would you say that? Incidentally, yes, I get the analogy and no, I'm not offended. I'm just curious why you don't think he's a good a source concerning Palm and it's place in the PDA market as say Jason, Andy, etc are concerning PPC's place in the same market?

Either way, you (meaning PPC supporters on this site) may not like his rationale, but the numbers are on his side in regards to the conclusion.

When PPC was new and considered revolutionary, it was arguably plausible to make predictions that it would one day dominate. It's over 2 years later however, and that doesn't look at all to be happening. We can all debate the reasons why. You can get pissed and flame me if you want, but you can't argue with the numbers. You may want to keep making excuses for why those predictions haven't even come close to fruition, but that's exactly what they would be: excuses.

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean you can't enjoy using your Pocket PC. Palm may not be as revolutionary as you'd like, but it doesn't seem to matter. It certainly doesn't matter for MS in the desktop OS arena. As has been said before, MS doesn't always win.

[Foo Fighter]

I'm just curious why you don't think he's a good a source concerning Palm and it's place in the PDA market

Because he is blatantly biased, and he spins every news item about Palm.

...as say Jason, Andy, etc are concerning PPC's place in the same market?

Where exactly did I say that I value their opinion more?

I place as much value in opinions as I do with the lint in my pockets.

Either way, you (meaning PPC supporters on this site) may not like his rationale,

Uh...I'm not a PocketPC user.

but the numbers are on his side in regards to the conclusion.

Numbers? Of what?

Whether or not his conclusion is correct, his logic is flawed, and he deliberately distorts the truth in order to convince his readers that he is correct.

It's over 2 years later however, and that doesn't look at all to be happening.

I agree. And I think now that Sony is pushing the envelope in PDA design, PocketPC is going to lose some more of its momentum.

You may want to keep making excuses for why those predictions haven't even come close to fruition, but that's exactly what they would be: excuses.

Where have I made ANY excuses? I've been one of the biggest PocketPC critics on this site.

[fundmgr90210]

I'm just curious why you don't think he's a good a source concerning Palm and it's place in the PDA market

Because he is blatantly biased, and he spins every news item about Palm.

Where exactly did I say that I value their opinion more?

I place as much value in opinions as I do with the lint in my pockets.

Uh...I'm not a PocketPC user.

Numbers? Of what?

Whether or not his conclusion is correct, his logic is flawed, and he deliberately distorts the truth in order to convince his readers that he is correct.

I agree. And I think now that Sony is pushing the envelope in PDA design, PocketPC is going to lose some more of its momentum.

Where have I made ANY excuses? I've been one of the biggest PocketPC critics on this site.

I was asking you why you said it simply because I wanted to know. For instance, maybe you were saying it not because you thought he was biased but rather because you believe he just didn't know the PDA industry that well. Or maybe you've met him and think he's just not very smart. In other words, there could have been a host of reasons behind your statement and I was asking you what they were as I did not know the answer. Actually, I think he's far less biased and guilty of blatant spinning than his some of his PPC counterparts, but that's another topic altogether.

No offense, but does that mean you value no one else's opinion but your own?

I know you're not a PPC user.

Marketshare numbers. There's no reason to believe they'll change as there's apparently a good reason for the ones that exist today. For that reason alone his conclusion is much more credible than those with the opposite projections.

As I stated in the previous post, you may not agree with his logic (I happen to), but it doesn't matter. His conclusions are, again, much more plausible based on what we already know about the market.

I think you misunderstood the second part of the post. When I say you, I'm using the imperative. I was afraid you'd make this mistake, that is why I said "(PPC suppporters on this site)" after using the word "you".

Same as above, I never said you, Foo Fighter, had been making any excuses. Rather, I'm referring to potential flamers coming my way.

We're actually on the same page here (well, mostly). I just wanted you to clarify your statement and I used it to make some commentary about the market in general.

[PlayAgain?]

The contents of this post have been removed by the author because they caused offence.

[ppcsurfr]

So are they trying to say that they can get an application for the Palm with 100 functions and still have these functions come up in a simple interface?

How the hell can you do that?

100 functions = 100 icons or commands.

Palm or Pocket PC 10 commands will always be 10 commands, a hundred commands will always be a hundred commands.

If Palm's application is simple... then it simply menas it can't do much.

[marlof]

Why can't PPC users just brag about what the PPC can do rather than have to point out what Palm can't?

It must be a terrible insecurity to live with. Froyd would certainly have something interesting to say about it I'm sure.

It think you mean Freud (http://users.rcn.com/brill/freudarc.html). ;) And I think Freud would say that comparing, and then come to a conclusion would be a more intelligent approach than just bragging.

I find it quite amusing that in this particular thread, which was triggered by an article on a Palm site that was bragging about Palm, and pointing out why a Pocket PC is worse than a Palm, you blame Pocket PC users for not leaving Palm alone.

If a Palm based site publishes an article on why a Palm is better than a Pocket PC, I think it's only natural that on Pocket PC Thoughts you'd get the Pocket PC view on this statement. And of course that would lead to comparing Pocket PC with Palm. And setting some facts straight. Or is that not allowed?

If we ever publish anything about Palm that is not true, I hope people will tell us that much as well. But most of the time, people don't say more that we're biased, and that we should leave Palm alone. If I ask for a discussion on the merit of the statement that Palm is not better, I get the response that I'm biased, and that I should leave Palm alone. If I ask to in return please educate me why I'm wrong, I get the response that I'm biased, and that I should leave Palm alone.

I really want to learn. And the first one that will persuade me that a PalmOS device would be the best for my daily use, will have won him or herself a Palm customer. But most of the time, we don't get intelligent responses that cause me to change my mind. We just get accusations that we're biased, and we should leave Palm alone.

Which I think is a funny thing to say. Because yes, we're biased, that's why this is Pocket PC Thoughts. And we're quite frank about that bias. But how can we *never* discuss anything Palm? This is not Pocket PC News, this is Pocket PC Thoughts. What we're saying here is not just "Version 1.2b of Pocket Calorie Counter is out", but also "We feel the Pocket PC is the best choice in this setting". We do news, but we also do views, rants and raves.

How can you state that something according to you is the best solution, if you may not compare it to other products? How can you, as a Pocket PC enthusiast be blind for marketshare numbers, where Pocket PC is gaining or losing on Palm? How can you be blind for the problems the competition is having? You can learn from the competition! Remember the "Innovate or get hit on the head" post by Andy?

Does that mean we would like to wipe Palm or the PalmOS of the face of the earth? No! You can find postings from each and every one of us who declares that we believe in healthy competition. That is the best incentive for Microsoft to keep on creating a better Pocket PC, and that is what we'd like to see.

Does that mean we're blind for the Pocket PC misses? No! You can find postings from each and every one of us who declares that they feel something should be a lot better in a next generation of Pocket PCs.

Does that mean we like Palm devices as good as we like Pocket PCs. No! If that were true, this would be PDAThoughts.com. We're biased, but we're open to dissenting opinions. There is no war. There is just a choice. To each his or her own. To some a PalmOS device, to others a Symbian device, and to me: a Pocket PC. If you think I made a stupid choice, feel free to tell me. But if you don't like me comparing that Pocket PC to other devices, than move on. I'm sure you'll have better things to do in your life than reading things you don't like.

[PlayAgain?]

Woah there tiger! It was a joke and I had no intention of hurting your pride. But thanks for the spelling correction, I felt it was wrong but didn't quite know what was the right spelling.

No offence intended, so chill with the still!

I've gotten into some nasty wranglings with Mr. Dunn about the content of this site and I have said some pretty nasty things which I regret, particularly since I was slow in understanding where you guys are coming from (I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer).

Heck, say what you like, it's your site and Microsoft fanboys have to meet somewhere.

I was just commenting on the fact that since the PPC has great multimedia, connectivity, financial backing (which means it will survive, even if it makes a thumping loss) and games, I don't understand why you get so upset when someone says something about it's poor UI or how it's totally unsuitable for the smartphone form factor.

The PPC has behind it, spin, government contacts, government influence, desktop establishment and unlimited financal backing from the biggest monopoly on the planet, so why should anybody feel so threatened by these comments?

Microsoft owns the desktop, do you really think it's going to play as fair for the palmtop? Relax and enjoy the ride, you're on the winning side (as far as the PDA goes anyway).

[Jason Dunn]

Why can't PPC users just brag about what the PPC can do rather than have to point out what Palm can't?

And why can't you finally accept the fact, after more than a year of coming here, that we LIKE to post on Palm-related topics now and then. It's our site, and we post on what we find interesting or what will spurr interesting discussion. It's not related to insecurity - stop the insults please.

What will it take for you to understand this? How many times have we discussed this in private, yet you keep returning with the same rhetoric over and over... :?

Visit, read, contribute, but quit beating the dead horse ok?

[For those that don't know "PlayAgain?" is the infamous "Chubbergott"]

[marlof]

I was just commenting on the fact that since the PPC has great multimedia, connectivity, financial backing (which means it will survive, even if it makes a thumping loss) and games, I don't understand why you get so insecure when someone says something about it's poor UI or how it's totally unsuitable for the smartphone form factor.

No, you did not. That would almost have been an intelligent response. In stead of doing that you posted two comments, both of which were very short, and ridiculed the posters on this site ( fanboys, arrogant, insecure, brag, threatened ). It doesn't take a photosensitive pride to notice that. I let your first comment go by, but as nobody took the bait, and you posted a second time, I decided to step in as I thought you might keep posting them same silly posts ( humor? ) until someone did take the bait. And I thought it best me one of the site admins, as they at least know who's talking. But I'll stop here and now with you. You sound like a broken record, and in replying to that I do too.

[PlayAgain?]

As I said, no offence intended. :roll:

[marlof]

Ok Play Again?, let's move on then!

[ppcsurfr]

Okay, why are they not comparing OS 5 to CE.net?

[indy500099]

Reading the last posts I just came to realize that this site and Palminfocenter are not really impartial sources for picking one or other device. This is such a biased place just like the other. One place is not better or worse than the other. And opinions here are not better or worse than the other guy. In a few minutes I have read about Mr Freud, Catholic Priests and a bunch of interesting human behavior, a legacy of the internet era I think. This is such an amusing place, just like the Psychic stuff on TV, just for amusement only, not to be taken that serious.
So, I am waiting for the next round in the PPC Vs Palm battles. You may go on fellows, LOL
Peace :P

[Dave Conger]

Okay, why are they not comparing OS 5 to CE.net?

CE.net isn't OS 5's big competitor, Pocket PC is. They aren't compared for the same reason CE 3.0 and OS 4 are rarely compared...there aren't even devices on the CE side. With only one CE 3.0, it is kind of hard to make a lot of arguments (at least that is what I would think). Pocket PC is what is going to appear on the bulk of the next generation of PPC's as Palm OS 5 will be on next gen Palm OS devices. When CE .NET get put in Pocket PC version, then is when the closer compare will be made.

[shilmover]

This "editorial" just proves it. It is the media and the sites that require to bash Pocket PC devices that put PPC and Palm head to head.

Bottom line: they are two different devices for two different markets. One is a PDA, the other is a Pocket PC (as the article states). Mark my words, the future is bright. we will not have desktops in the future. We will have a Pocket PC with built in networking, video out, storage, etc. you will take this device with you everywhere and have a "docking station" for it in the office and at home. You will have wireless, portable keyboard/mouse and wireless, portable, flexible screen. THis will be your "laptop".

My company builds wireless system administration tools for Pocket PC, HPC, and RIM. What? No Palm? But why? there are 900 gazillion Palms out there in enterprises. Think of the market we are alienating.

Of all the customers that have purchased and asked to purchase our products, we have had many requests for Palm. How many serious? Zero. How many were wirelessly enabled? Zero. How many wanted to wirelessly enable their Palms? Zero.

Just my $0.02 worth (being from Canada, that is like $0.00002 in the States) :twisted:

Barry Shilmover
Chief Technical Evangelist
www.sonicmobility.com
www.pocketpctools.com

The opinions stated here are my own and not necessarily that of my company.