Philly Pocket PC Summit: There's nothing like a good plug

[Jason Dunn]

And so the Pocket PC Summit begins! My journey into Philidelphia was fairly uneventful, although long - I left at 8 AM Calgary time and arrived in Philly 5 PM. I had a transfer in Toronto, and after 20 minutes of taxiing down the runway (I thought we were driving to Philly) we finally took off, and I arrived and made it to the hotel. Today was a half-day session, and in Chris De Hererra's opening session he was talking about community - and look who happened to be on the slide!<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/cheap-plug.jpg" /><br /><br />Chris compared us to CNN, which I took as a great compliment, although pt and I decided later that Thoughts was more like Wayne's World. :-) The last session of the day, a presentation by a Gartner Group analyst, was rather...interesting. More on this tomorrow - but it ended the day on a strange note.

[Kevin Daly]

I'm dying to hear about that last presentation...given how Gartner specialise in dismissing the importance of anything Microsoft promote, a strange note from that direction doesn't surprise me in the least.

[JonnoB]

The last session of the day, a presentation by a Gartner Group analyst, was rather...interesting. More on this tomorrow - but it ended the day on a strange note.

Terrible to leave us in the lurk! Television news programs would not tell viewers to wait until after a commercial to listen to the details of a story... wait - yes they would/do! Still terrible.

Is a 'strange note' a bad note, good note, or just an odd note? Enquiring minds want to know.

[Bob S]

8) FILM at 11:00 :wink:

[Beth from Microsoft]

Sooo, Beth here from MS. I thought it was funny that after making his way down the runway Jason thought they might be driving. I am also at the Summit, and when I flew in from Seattle I was stuck in DC for four hours due to bad weather and ended up doing just that. I rented a car and drove to Philadelphia with my trusted Pocket PC at my side! Talk about going mobile.....

:D

[TomB]

Jason, so with the XScale rollout SUPPOSED to be next month, is Casio or HP showing XScale prototypes or are they waiting for PCExpo? Oh yes, it would be nice to know if the Sendo Z100 will be shown too...

[Jason Dunn]

Jason, so with the XScale rollout SUPPOSED to be next month, is Casio or HP showing XScale prototypes or are they waiting for PCExpo? Oh yes, it would be nice to know if the Sendo Z100 will be shown too...

Nothing is being shown yet - the show floor opens tomorrow. I'll let you know what I see!

[Jason Dunn]

Sorry for the pain of waiting, but it was 1 AM, I was dead tired, and I wanted to call Ashley, so I just didn't have it in me to write it up. Today!

[JamesM]

For those of us who can't wait...

http://www.pocketpchow2.com/log/

[gmelfissg]

KEEP the good work Jason, you make us proud and sorry again for my long list of bad mouthed post, it won't again i promise.

Giuseppe Melfi :lol:

[Jason Dunn]

For those of us who can't wait...
http://www.pocketpchow2.com/log/

Well shucks - should I bother writing anything up then?

[JonnoB]

Well shucks - should I bother writing anything up then?

Yes, I for one come to this site not just for news, but for the Jason Dunn 'views, rants and raves' associated with the news. Let us hear your take on this Palm bias oddity. I assume there was a mis-casting, a need seen to kick everyone in the rear, or something else...

[Ed Hansberry]

Sooo, Beth here from MS. I thought it was funny that after making his way down the runway Jason thought they might be driving. I am also at the Summit, and when I flew in from Seattle I was stuck in DC for four hours due to bad weather and ended up doing just that. I rented a car and drove to Philadelphia with my trusted Pocket PC at my side! Talk about going mobile.....

:D

So, Derek's plot to have you delayed for a day failed eh? ;-)

[kstagg]

Hey folks...

Are you really surprised by the fact that Palm has such an overwhelming percentage of the market compared to PPC? Is this the first time you've heard this and is the Gartner group the only folks that you've heard this from?

For those individuals who weren't there, Todd Kort from Gartner, a respected market analyst of PDA sales (if he isn't, why was he invited to the Summit?), was quoting statistics at the Pocket PC Summit in Philly showing that Palm had such a huge market share compared to PPC and other stats (which he backed up without pause by the way) which showed things fairly rosy for Palm.

One of the attendees came up during Mr Kort's presentation and called him down from the podium (is this the WWF?), basically calling Mr Kort's presentation as "Microsoft Bashing". Probably about a 1/3 of the audience agreed with the former individual.

Haven't we all heard from other sources besides the folks at Gartner that Palm has such a huge market share? Is this really a surprise?

People, how can we strengthen the Pocket PC product without analyzing our achilles heel (ex: high-end pricing) and the leader in the market (Palm)? Do we think that Palm is just going to go away?

The sooner the OEMs realize that they need to come up with "entry-level" devices that the average Joe can actually afford, the better off we'll all be in the end and the general public will be able to see firsthand what they've been missing by not having a PPC device sooner.

Kevin

[JonnoB]

People, how can we strengthen the Pocket PC product without analyzing our achilles heel (ex: high-end pricing) and the leader in the market (Palm)? Do we think that Palm is just going to go away?

The sooner the OEMs realize that they need to come up with "entry-level" devices that the average Joe can actually afford, the better off we'll all be in the end and the general public will be able to see firsthand what they've been missing by not having a PPC device sooner.

Kevin

I am not convinced that 'lowest cost' is always the best path to take. Low cost PCs were thought to eventually devalue high-end systems, but gaming and other applications drove the need for faster and better multimedia systems. I believe the same will happen with PDAs. The problem with the PPC is two-fold.

1) There is no strong brand name. Some people who hear 'PocketPC' ask me if it is some kind of 'PalmPilot'. PDA and PalmPilot have become synonymous. If people know a distinction, they may know it as an 'iPaq' even if I carry a Casio or HP Jornada. There is a definate identity problem that needs to be corrected.

2) Although the 'killer application' is mostly a myth now, a flurry of cool apps will drive sales. Example: Games. No one game has driven high-end graphic card sales, but a bunch of them have made high-end video and computers an item in demand. More applications that take advantage of what the OS and CPU power in PocketPC do best will make people willing to pay more for more.

Bottom line, I would rather the improved PPC products and applications drive demand at the higher end, rather than lower the products to meet pricing needs to meet a lowered bar.

[Robert Levy]

"One of the attendees came up during Mr Kort's presentation and called him down from the podium (is this the WWF?), basically calling Mr Kort's presentation as "Microsoft Bashing". Probably about a 1/3 of the audience agreed with the former individual."

For clarification, that attendee was John Tidwell - the conference organizer.

[JonnoB]

For clarification, that attendee was John Tidwell - the conference organizer.

Obviously the speaker either misrepresented what his intended topic would be, misunderstood the requested topic subject or Mr. Tidwell did not seek a specific topic subject at all. The speaker may have been correct, may have not been asked to focus on a specific subject matter and just spoke his mind - but should he have known better based on the audience?

[kstagg]

I'm not saying that the PPC devices have to be the "lowest" prices, just "competitive". When John Q. Public sees that for MAYBE two hundred or so more dollars, they can buy an entire desktop system, which do you think they'd rather buy, a device which up until the time of purchase, was totally alien to them...

...or the desktop model which they've been using for years and are familiar with?

If eMachines can sell a desktop system for almost half the price of an iPAQ, why can't we find a similar manufacturer to do something similar with the PPC OS?

I think you're dead-on though about the branding. Whenever I tell someone I have a PPC, they ask me immediately thereafter what model Palm it is....

HERESY! Aaaaaaarrrrggggh!

One other note about the Summit, I thought Torrone's keynote was the best keynote so far.

Kevin

[JonnoB]

...When John Q. Public sees that for MAYBE two hundred or so more dollars, they can buy an entire desktop system, which do you think they'd rather buy, a device which up until the time of purchase, was totally alien to them...


Can't lug around a desktop system. I used to use a PalmPilot... but it was too light (applications) for me. The WinCE devices were bad... When PPCs came out, I had enough power in applications to make it worthwhile and it has only gotten better. I think many are like me and are willing to pay for super ultra-portability, but still want/desire the power of a near-laptop. As power and function demands increase as they did with the desktop, I think you will see the PalmPilot go the way of the Rex. Over the long-haul, I don't think the PalmOS can manage to keep up...

[denivan]

I'm sorry, but sometimes you guys forget how cheap PPC's are in the US. I bought my ipaq 3660 at an extremely low price here in belgium last september, which was about 580 USD. You guyz have things like the e-570 for 299USD after rebates and stuff. I think this is a really great price for a system like that. I really don't understand why prices should get lower than that, or are we forgetting what cutting edge technology we're dealing with?

[kstagg]

I'm not sure when you were profiled on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous, but sorry I missed it. $580 USD isn't exactly "cheap". (grin) The only reason I'm able to carry around an iPAQ 3870 is because of the fact the company I work for picked up the tab.

Never seen a PPC device for $299, but that is on the right track. Please let me know when PPC devices are being offered in the sub-$200 or even sub-$100 range. In comparison, look how much more inexpensive palms are.

Yeah, I know, you "get what you pay for", but I think PPC devices can do better than a $299 price (never seen one that low, but will take your word for it).

Kevin

[denivan]

I guess you totally misread my post. I said that I had to pay 580 USD here in Belgium last September for an iPAQ 3660 which is pretty dated by now. This was the cheapest way I could get one over herea,d 580 USD is alot of money. I've seen webpages offering Toshib e-570's voor 299 USD after rebates. Hell, when I bought my iPAQ 3660 I saw them being offered in the USA for about 350 USD.

[JonnoB]

Never seen a PPC device for $299, but that is on the right track. Please let me know when PPC devices are being offered in the sub-$200 or even sub-$100 range. In comparison, look how much more inexpensive palms are.


There have been a few - Maestro, URThere, etc. I even bought an iPaq 3135 for $99 new a year ago. There are cheap devices, but that is not what most PPC users want. When price is an issue, they go with Palm because there isn't a difference in perspective with PPC. When a user becomes educated and demands performance, the price delta to move up to a good PPC is worth it. I say innovate on size and performance... the slight price difference will mean less.