Log in

View Full Version : Video Woes & Wishing For More Laptop Firepower


Jason Dunn
03-29-2007, 04:27 AM
I took a several videos today at CTIA, all of Windows Mobile applications being demoed. It seemed like a good idea at the time, but in hindsight I really didn't have the right hardware or software to get the job done properly. I thought that YouTube was limited to videos 10 minutes long, but they also have a 100 MB file size limit. My Canon SD800 doesn't have any sort of video compression beyond basic MJPEG, so the file sizes are huge. An 8 minute 44 second video clip at 320 x 240 resolution weighs in at 325 MB. That means I'm having to compress them to get the file size under 100 MB before I can upload the videos to have YouTube compress them all over again. It's not like you can see the double-compression though with the crappy bitrates YouTube uses.

Normally this wouldn't be a big deal, but my Fujitsu P7010D doesn't have the graphics power to run Windows Movie Maker (which is incredibly stupid that it requires hardware acceleration and won't run at all), and I didn't install Premiere Elements before leaving, so I was left without any ability to edit video files. I tried Movavi (http://www.movavi.com), but it turned out to be highly problematic - it locked up on me several times, complained about missing codecs even when Windows Media Player could play back the file without trouble, and generally wouldn't do a damn thing properly. I really wanted to like Movavi - it seems to have a great set of features, but I've tried it on two PCs now (one Vista, one XP Pro) and it was unstable and dysfunctional at editing video, splitting video, and ripping a DVD. Next I installed Nero 7 because I happened to already have the 175 MB "upgrade" downloaded - it's ridiculous how Nero releases a trial version of the entire suite as an upgrade for customers, but in this case it happened to be helpful to me. A quick phone call to Ashley got me the serial number I needed. I installed it and rebooted, but bizarrely enough Nero Vision (the video editing application) won't work with the Canon AVI files properly - when I add one to the timeline it only recognizes the first ten seconds. No errors, it just won't work properly.<!>

I started to get a bit desperate at this point, so I did a search for a freeware video editing application and tried AviTricks (http://www.bobyte.com/). I didn't work and puked on codec errors. At this point I was loudly cursing Canon for making their video format so difficult to deal with. As a last-ditch effort, I tried the crusty old Windows Media Encoder 9, and it actually worked! The problem is this 1.2 Ghz Pentium M CPU is exactly made for fast video encoding - it's taking me forever to encode each clip, especially when I encode a file only to discover it ends up being more than 100 MB in size.

I actually spent some time researching what laptops a local Best Buy here had because I was convinced I'd need a new laptop in order to get all this video transcoding finished before I left Orlando - selecting a new laptop is a topic for another post though, because it's proving to be a frustrating trying to find the right one. At any rate, the closest Best Buy was out of stock on all six of the HP laptops I was looking at. What are the odds? :-( The nearest Circuit City only had one HP laptop, not the one I wanted, and no one at the store would pick up the phone. I gave up and decided to rough it with my little Fujitsu, and while it's slow, I'm getting the videos transcoded and uploaded (http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=jasondunn). Back to the grind...

sdattilo
03-29-2007, 03:23 PM
I feel for you... I used to have a Dell laptop and had some of the same issues with trying work on some videos of my kids on vacation to send back to the grandparents. I'm not trying to start a war here, but... My new MacBookPro... needless to say that works flawlessly. Maybe part of your next topic of which laptop to get. (of course there are times when I miss some windows features... ) But again... mostly just posting to tell you I feel your pain. :wink:

Jeremy Charette
03-29-2007, 03:48 PM
Honestly, I was looking at laptops last night for a friend, and the MacBook Pro is actually a good deal. The same system from Dell is anywhere from $300 to $1000 more expensive than the equivalent MacBook Pro.

Think about it.

Jason Dunn
03-29-2007, 03:55 PM
A Mac? Nah. Most of this post was about compatibility problems, so using a Mac would only make things worse. As Vincent pointed out over at my blog (http://www.jasondunn.com/video-woes-wishing-for-more-laptop-firepower-331#comments), even iMovie has problems with the SD800 video files. It's a myth that Macs are somehow magically better at video editing than PCs - it's all about having the right software, and unfortunately I wasn't prepared in the right way.

I think I am looking at something in the 12" to 13" screen range though, but a MacBook isn't really on the radar...

Jeremy Charette
03-29-2007, 04:11 PM
A Mac? Nah. Most of this post was about compatibility problems, so using a Mac would only make things work.

ROFLMAO! :lol:

No, I meant strictly from a hardware standpoint. Of course, I'd suggest running Vista on it using Boot Camp.

Jason Dunn
03-29-2007, 04:19 PM
A Mac? Nah. Most of this post was about compatibility problems, so using a Mac would only make things work.
ROFLMAO! :lol:

Heh. Nice slip up there Jason....I wonder if my sub-conscious is trying to tell me something. Nah. :roll:

No, I meant strictly from a hardware standpoint. Of course, I'd suggest running Vista on it using Boot Camp.

I thought though that Boot Camp was still a bit fugly with drivers and whatnot - I don't think the Mac hardware is superior enough to warrant having to fight with my system all the time...

Jeremy Charette
03-29-2007, 04:53 PM
http://www.apple.com/macosx/bootcamp/

Boot Camp 1.2 beta includes:
- Support for Windows Vista (32-bit)
- Updated drivers, including but not limited to trackpad, AppleTime (synch), audio, graphics, modem, iSight camera
- Support the Apple Remote (works with iTunes and Windows Media Player)

jeffd
03-29-2007, 05:10 PM
Wow I am shocked, jason you've never used virtual dub? Its been around for many years now.

http://www.virtualdub.org/

You'll need to make sure you have a real codec like xvid installed (So if you just rely on ffdshow to playback everything like I do, it wont work), but from there you just load the avi, set the output settings (a single pass should be fine for youtube) and save. Vdub will also give you the fastest encode times over adobe or movie maker. You should easily be re-encoding that 320x240 clip at double time on a current cpu.

Jason Dunn
03-29-2007, 05:15 PM
Wow I am shocked, jason you've never used virtual dub? Its been around for many years now.

Sure I've used it before - but I've never kept it on any PC because I always found it to be clumsy and confusing to use. I'll give it another go though and see if things have improved...

jeffd
03-29-2007, 09:40 PM
Ahh, thats a shame. I didn't have much trouble with its learning curve but it does lack a more friendly UI then the other editors. Its not even really an editor (splicing multiple clips, or doing any cutting other then beginning/end is a royal pain), how ever when it comes to compressing or recompressing videos to avi, its the best out there (its what the groups use in their dvdrips, and what all the anime fansub groups use as the final encoder for their releases).

Its also small, consumes very little memory, and requires no installation. Though I havn't beenable to get a traditional codec to install right in vista so I cant encode anything to mpeg4 in vista yet. Also untill the next version, any program writing .avi files in vista are writing improper .avi files. But it may still work for uploading to youtube.

bmhome1
03-30-2007, 12:57 AM
TMPGEnc always works wonders with virtually anything thrown at it. I'm using old version that still works great in Vista. Full editing and all essential features to quickly edit and re encode to another format and great price.

Even works in Vista running on 1Gz tablet, so horsepower needs are LOW.

Another powerhouse, ultra efficient editor specifically for MPEG2 full editing DIRECTLY without conversion first is Womble or Mpeg Video Wizard.

Windows Media Encoder 9 runs perfectly in Vista also.

Between the three nothing else will be needed for simple editing video and re encoding any format, including DVD clips.

Jason Dunn
03-30-2007, 09:04 PM
...how ever when it comes to compressing or recompressing videos to avi, its the best out there (its what the groups use in their dvdrips, and what all the anime fansub groups use as the final encoder for their releases).

Yeah, it's not impossible to use, but it's not very intuitive either. I was able to get it to do what I needed though, thankfully, so I appreciate the suggestion.

Also untill the next version, any program writing .avi files in vista are writing improper .avi files. But it may still work for uploading to youtube.

Oh really? Maybe that's what happened to me - I used it to split up a single AVI into two AVI files, but then neither AVI would work in Windows Media Encoder. Or, rather, it seemed to work but the resulting WMV was corrupt and encoded much faster than it should have been. Putting the same AVIs into Nero Vision allowed me to re-encode them to AVI DivX format though, which got them under the magic 100 MB barrier and they're now up on YouTube.

Talk about a nightmare though - this is WAY too hard. :roll:

Jason Dunn
03-30-2007, 09:19 PM
TMPGEnc always works wonders with virtually anything thrown at it.

Yeah, I've heard good things about it - I might need to pick up a copy. A few years ago I was writing Faster Smarter Digital Video and asked them for a copy of the program for testing - and they refused. It was completely bizarre to have a company not want to give up a software license - they told me to download the demo, and if I wrote about it AND sent a copy of the book to them in Japan they'd give me a copy of the software. So incredibly bizarre. But I'm glad to hear their software is good even if the company doesn't understand how to deal with the media. ;-)

Even works in Vista running on 1Gz tablet, so horsepower needs are LOW.

Well, running an encoder isn't stressful on the CPU - encoding the video is. Ultimately that's why I'm looking at getting a laptop that's still fairly small but has a Core 2 Duo CPU in it. A 1.2 Ghz ULV CPU just doesn't cut it for video editing, encoding, or working with RAW files.

jeffd
03-31-2007, 03:53 AM
I didn't care much for the old tmpg, it was good for encoding fast mpeg1 but that is no longer needed. I do how ever use tmpgs express to create mpeg2 files. Its pretty awsome and it takes advantage of multi core cpus too. I havnt tried it in vista though.