Microsoft to Lock Down Longhorn?

[Jason Dunn]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.ehomeupgrade.com/entry/710/the_broadcast_flag' target='_blank'>http://www.ehomeupgrade.com/entry/710/the_broadcast_flag</a><br /><br /></div><i>"For people who've been obsessed with issues surrounding the broadcast flag on HDTV content, things are about to get even more difficult. Heise Online is reporting that the next version of Windows will have extra-strength DRM capabilities tied into PC hardware. The move by Microsoft is to assure content producers that products they release will be protected against unauthorized copying and distribution when used on a PC. So say bye bye to audio stream rippers and video capture techniques that in the past have circumvented copy-protection on digital works."</i><br /><br />After reading this article, I was a little shocked at the implications. The way most "ripping" programs work today, whether they be audio or DVD rippers, is by intercepting the post-decrypted data. It sounds like Microsoft is planning on encrypting the whole thing, from end to end, making it impossible to capture a DVD video stream after it's been decrypted. This doesn't bode well for those of us who like to use our media in different ways and on different devices. 8O

[sub_tex]

It' a simple thing actually, just don't upgrade.

We can speak our minds by withholding our money.

It's going to get worse and worse with restrictions if everyone just keeps accepting thngs like this.

Educating people about the restrictions they will have on things they paid for already is a good start.

Peolpe don't like to hear they can't do what they've been enjoying for a while.

[Jason Dunn]

It' a simple thing actually, just don't upgrade. We can speak our minds by withholding our money.

I agree fully about voting with our wallets, but it's not so simple to just "not upgrade" - as a geek I want the latest and greatest technology, but to have to chose between having it and having an OS that fights with my digital media...it's not so simple. ;-)

[Chris Gohlke]

And, at some point, support for XP will be dropped. This will mean no security updates, etc. Of course, if you do rip a lot of media, you can just keep an old PC that is not connected to the net with a set of software you know works. And, there will always be linux.

[Lee Yuan Sheng]

I agree fully about voting with our wallets, but it's not so simple to just "not upgrade" - as a geek I want the latest and greatest technology, but to have to chose between having it and having an OS that fights with my digital media...it's not so simple. ;-)

uhhh, I was expecting better than that. Technology for the sake of it is a no-no. It's what makes MS &amp; Co think they can get away with pulling stunts like these.

[Jason Dunn]

uhhh, I was expecting better than that. Technology for the sake of it is a no-no.

Come on, you know that Longhorn is going to have some cool features in it - it's not like Micrsoft could, or would, ever take XP and give it a new name and release it to the public...there are ALWAYS improvements, but the question is how much of course. It's not like I buy every new Intel CPU that's 100mhz faster than what I have now, but if the improvements are enough to warrant the cost, then yes, I'll upgrade.

[treo007]

Typical MS; however, I'd rather just run some flavor of Linux for my media purposes anyway. It's not as if Longhorn won't play something like a Divx file encoded on a non-Longhorn system. Unless I'm missing something here.

[wrightca]

This may piss people like us off, but think of the general computer idiot. They probably won't even know. What is the ratio of us to them in the computer world. Most business customers won't care either.

I don't think Microsoft would even notice if we switched to Linux.

[Lee Yuan Sheng]

Come on, you know that Longhorn is going to have some cool features in it - it's not like Micrsoft could, or would, ever take XP and give it a new name and release it to the public...there are ALWAYS improvements, but the question is how much of course. It's not like I buy every new Intel CPU that's 100mhz faster than what I have now, but if the improvements are enough to warrant the cost, then yes, I'll upgrade.

Yea, but the idea of locking down media to such an extent places its own cost on the OS, and it's a cost I'm not willing to pay, and neither should most of us who value the freedom of manipulating digital media to our own needs and wants.

[Steve1496]

This may piss people like us off, but think of the general computer idiot. They probably won't even know. What is the ratio of us to them in the computer world. Most business customers won't care either.

I don't think Microsoft would even notice if we switched to Linux.

But then there's no tech geeks to provide support to windows users, if this all actually happened. Plus, don't most normal people follow what the techies do and upgrade to the OS they use? I know that if I switched completely tok linux, so would my friends and family.

[Crocuta]

Some of you seem to be debating this as if it's a battle that will be decided when Longhorn is released, but it's more likely to be some years after implementation before the full impact (if any) of this decision can be measured.

Linux teters on the edge of critical mass. It's increased in popularity, but for many users like me, there has been no compelling reason to go through the learning necessary to make such a move. My system works just fine right now so why go through the painful chore of choosing a Linux variant, installing it, learning it, finding applications for it, etc.?

But that could change if MS and friends get together to make it difficult for me to enjoy digital content that I've legitimately paid for. These are the types of things that can push people over to a new platform and no one knows how much of a defection would be needed to begin a move that could snowball some years in the future. It doesn't have to be the case that the whole world shifts to Linux en-masse, but simply that enough people make the move to give it that extra boost so that mainstream application developers decide it's worthwhile to support it.

MS is betting that we're mostly sheep and that they can ignore those of us who might complain. Only time will tell if they're right, but they're betting their future on it. IBM executives once thought they were in full control of this industry. The lesson we learn from them is that no company, no matter how big, can afford to assume that their customers have no options.

[Jason Dunn]

Typical MS; however, I'd rather just run some flavor of Linux for my media purposes anyway. It's not as if Longhorn won't play something like a Divx file encoded on a non-Longhorn system. Unless I'm missing something here.

Well, actually, that's the fear that some people have: every piece of digital media would have to be flagged as "yes, I'm legitimate" in order for it to play on Longhorn.

I honestly have a hard time believing that Microsoft would be so stupid as to make a move like this though. They've survived this long because they hire smart people.

[Jason Dunn]

Yea, but the idea of locking down media to such an extent places its own cost on the OS, and it's a cost I'm not willing to pay, and neither should most of us who value the freedom of manipulating digital media to our own needs and wants.

Indeed, that's exactly the decision I'd have to make - I'd probably switch to...gasp...Apple. :? Linux will never be ready for a consumer market just by it's very nature.

[Lee Yuan Sheng]

Indeed, that's exactly the decision I'd have to make - I'd probably switch to...gasp...Apple. :? Linux will never be ready for a consumer market just by it's very nature.

Ack, extremely expensive closed hardware platform is a no-no for me. I'll take Linux. Or simply use XP until it can no longer be used. =P

[[email protected]]

Typical MS; however, I'd rather just run some flavor of Linux for my media purposes anyway. It's not as if Longhorn won't play something like a Divx file encoded on a non-Longhorn system. Unless I'm missing something here.

Well, actually, that's the fear that some people have: every piece of digital media would have to be flagged as "yes, I'm legitimate" in order for it to play on Longhorn.

I honestly have a hard time believing that Microsoft would be so stupid as to make a move like this though. They've survived this long because they hire smart people.

Wouldn't this technology be dependant on the "Fritz-chip"? From what I've heard of it, you'll be able to turn off the chip in BIOS. But I guess Longhorn can still choose to not play media which will then be definately unverified.

[sub_tex]

Indeed, that's exactly the decision I'd have to make - I'd probably switch to...gasp...Apple. :?

I would probably end up with some mid range mac just to use the apps I can't get for Linux, like flash and photoshop (thoug i could run photoshop easily using crossover).

But going completely mac based? forget it. I don't have that kind of cash. :)

Linux will never be ready for a consumer market just by it's very nature.

I disagree. Linspire is exactly what the consumer market needs when it comes to linux adoption.

Idiot friendly, geek unfriendly. :)

[Jason Dunn]

I disagree. Linspire is exactly what the consumer market needs when it comes to linux adoption.

Hmm...it's been about a year since I tried it (back when it was Lindows) - it's evolved so much that you'd consider it consumer friendly? No more re-compiling the kernel? :-)

[Lee Yuan Sheng]

Hmm...it's been about a year since I tried it (back when it was Lindows) - it's evolved so much that you'd consider it consumer friendly? No more re-compiling the kernel? :-)

That, I thought, was the whole attraction behind Lindows/Linspire? No funny mucking around with the innards when you need to install a program.

[sub_tex]

Hmm...it's been about a year since I tried it (back when it was Lindows) - it's evolved so much that you'd consider it consumer friendly?

Pretty much. The CNR system is so drop dead simple, it even makes apple software installs look hard.

Of course it's not near as complete a package as and mac or windows box, but as far as linux distros go, it's the closest for prime time. Unified software, lots of stuff right out of the box without having 500 programs like some distros give you.

No more re-compiling the kernel? :-)

ha!

That kept me away from linux for years.

Currently I run Suse 9.2 on my laptop to keep up with it. It's slowly getting there, but for me, can't be my main OS.

But I'm honestly considering Linspire boxes for many friends of the family that have internet/word processing/photo needs when it comes to comps.

It's simple like the mac stuff (and hides so much, like mac, much to the chagrin of linux heads), but won't kill me in $$.

[Jason Dunn]

Hmm - Linspire does look like it has evolved! If I have nothing better to do with $90, maybe I'll pick it up... :-)

[sub_tex]

If I have nothing better to do with $90, maybe I'll pick it up... :-)

You could always just run the Live CD to test it out for free. It's what I always suggest doing with any Linux distro.

Unfortunately, at this time, I don't think there are downloads yet for Linspire 5. Soon though.

[pacemkr]

They (MS) are really wasting their time and money. Somebody will always find a way to crack something like this. If not crack then find a workaround. I mean how hard is it to dual boot with Linux? Look how long windows activation lasted? That was cracked BEFORE windows xp was released! I wonder how much money they wasted on that. People who want to crack software will always find a way.

This "feature" just cripples windows multimedia capabilities. I assume dvd sales will only go DOWN as the result of this. And what would be the point in selling all these portable media players? I'm not a huge fan of open source, but this is REALLY counter productive and I am seriously thinking of trying linux again.

Maybe they are doing this to please the "content producers", but are going to make it really easy to crack. A little consiracy theory here. :lol:

[sub_tex]

Somebody will always find a way to crack something like this. If not crack then find a workaround.

I agree. But they'll still put it in there and end up pissing off honest customers like me who will realize that in order to have functionality we've been used to and expect in our devices, newer versions of software will let us do LESS than we have.

The whole idea of DRM means that all buyers are crooks first, and honest second. I don't need DRM to keep me reined in from pirating software across the globe. I don't d it. Period.

Yet I'll be punished by lockdowns and all the other BS because of it.

Again, this is something that has really got me thinking about where my future will lie in the OS world.

As it is now, it looks like eventually I'll have to break down and run XP (still loving 2k pro) but that will be my last MS OS. I'll move to a linux distro after OR just stay on XP.

And for the apps I can't get to run on Linux*, I'll still have an XP box there to use. I'll tell you what, though, at this point I would almost rather spend the money on a mac in the future just to run the adobe apps i can't get rather than support MS in this type of movement.

I'm not a huge fan of open source, but this is REALLY counter productive and I am seriously thinking of trying linux again.

Not a huge fan? I don't understand that. Someone or a group of people who allow you to take their code and make other things with it. This is something to not be a fan of?



* Wityh Codeweavers Crossover plugin on my linux box, I'm running Photoshop 7 and Flash MX without any problems at all. Those two apps are maybe the only major apps I need that aren't available on anything but mac and windows.

[pacemkr]

I'm not a huge fan of open source, but this is REALLY counter productive and I am seriously thinking of trying linux again.

Not a huge fan? I don't understand that. Someone or a group of people who allow you to take their code and make other things with it. This is something to not be a fan of?

I think the whole idea is great. However, I personally think that for the most part open source software is not as good as commercial alternatives.

[sub_tex]

I think the whole idea is great. However, I personally think that for the most part open source software is not as good as commercial alternatives.

Ah, so you're confusing open source with freeware.

Open source is just allowing your source to be downloaded and used based on whatever permissions you allow.

You can have a commercial app be open source.