Lance Wonders About Digital Images Lasting

[Jason Dunn]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1591282,00.asp' target='_blank'>http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1591282,00.asp</a><br /><br /></div>"I'm a born worrier. Lately I've been wondering if we're about to turn a digital corner from which there is no return. We're in the process of raising the first generation of children who will not be captured on film. There'll be tons of digital photographs and hours of digital video—ones and zeros recounting their first smiles, steps, days of kindergarten, proms, and more, but precious few film-based photos. <br /><br />Sure, there'll be inkjet photos, CDs full of stored digital data, and DVDs full of movies. And there'll be duplicates of all of these and multiple copies of inkjet photos stored in numerous places. However, there will not be any shoeboxes of old silver-halide photos. I should be happy. I'm a proponent of digital photography and digital video. I use it and write about it. But I'm also plagued by little panic attacks. I haven't taken a 35mm photo of my kids in months. What if my computer hard drive dies? I have all my photos backed up on a CD, but what if I lose that or it somehow becomes corrupted?"<br /><br />Lance, buddy...<b>GET A GRIP</b>! &lt;smack> :roll: He believes that his digital photos are vulnerable to loss, yet somehow the shoebox in his closest is not vulnerable to fire or floods because he can "avoid those". I think he should quite writing for PC Magazine and go work for the local fire department if he has paranormal skills that can detect fires! :lol: He has some good points about not trusting optical media for longer than a few years, but what he forgets is that the most amazing thing about digital photos is the ability to have <i><b>multiple backups</b></i>. Sure, keep the originals on your hard drive. Then burn a DVD. Then get an external hard drive and keep a copy there. Then FTP then to a buddy's computer. Try doing that with physical prints. :wink:

[possmann]

:lol:
Reminds me of the comments I get about my PocketPC being less "safe" than the old fashioned day-planner...

I wonder how they back up that data?

:lol!:

[dean_shan]

I feel more safe with my digital photos. With digital photos I can find the shot I'm looking for in a matter of minutes. With physical prints they end up getting lost in boxes and the like. The elements also effect physical prints. I have had physical photos damage due to the sun but none of my digital photos have had that problem. I for one prefer digital to film.

[Filip Norrgard]

Lance, buddy...GET A GRIP! &lt;smack> :roll: He believes that his digital photos are vulnerable to loss, yet somehow the shoebox in his closest is not vulnerable to fire or floods because he can "avoid those".
Exactly!
Remember what happened to the "unsinkable boat" called Titanic? :roll: Superstitiously said: you shouldn't talk about trouble, or you'll get trouble.

[ND Bob]

I've shot nothing but digital (except for a few rolls in a photography class that we were to develop and print ourselves) for about the last three years. I love the flexibility and freedom it gives me, and now that I've got a D-SLR and good image management software, I'm even more excited about having gone digital.

That said, there's probably some merit to worrying about digital photos, their storage and long-term viability.

Jason and others have mentioned the very real benefits of digital when it comes to multiply-redundant backups. There's just no way to do this with film, and so digital seems inherently more secure. But I would bet that most folks making the jump to digital are more like my parents than like Jason or me - they don't even have CDs of their pictures, nevermind copies on multiple media in multiple locations. The files stored on their hard drive are the original and only copies of all their priceless pictures. Hard as it is to believe, folks like my parents are pretty ignorant when it comes to basic file management on a computer - and they're by no means alone! But they're living dangerously, at least as far as their digital photos are concerned.

Now, it's true that the "shoebox" approach is rife with dangers, too. But let's be honest here: How often has your house burned down? Once? Ouch. Twice? Wow, that's really terrible! Three times? Um... is there something your insurance company should know about?

Now think about how many times your computer has become fubar. Right... :evil:

Even for those of us who are more obsessive about backing up our images, there are lots of unknowns in digital image archival: What sort of longevity will CD-R/DVD-R discs have in the real world? How long will 5" optical discs be standard media? Will opening a JPEG, TIFF or (God forbid) RAW file twenty years from now be as problematic as opening my old Windows Write (the predecessor to WordPad) files from just ten or twelve years ago?

Sure, all of these potential problems can be overcome. All it takes is periodically recopying your files to new CDs or whatever medium comes down the line, and converting the files to any new formats that might be required if the current ones somehow start to lose support. But again, let's be honest - that's a lot more work than you ever have to do with your shoebox just to keep your pictures in a viewable state.

As I said, I'm shooting 100% digital, and have never been happier as a photographer. But this is a very new medium, and even with the mature devices that are starting to appear, it's good to realize that we're early adopters - the first generation to take our pictures with bits - and that the long-term consequences of the digital revolution are not so clear.

On another note altogether- Hi, Jason! :D Thought I'd take your advice and stop lurking here.

[James Fee]

As long as you aren't saving your photos to your winchester drive, you should be fine. I think I'll be able to read DVDs in the next 10 years. :roll:

[Jorgen]

I have lost plenty of data through changes in technology (from Apple-II to CP/M to MS-DOS not to mention the problems with getting data out of various databases in a format that could be re-used). Theoretically there always were ways to transfer the data from one platform to another but somehow they didn't always work. However this should - fingers crossed - be a thing of the past as ND Bob also says.

However dPreview indicates here
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp that CD's may only last something like two years! I have plenty of CD's older than that but I am still worried that one day I will be trying to copy from a CD that have drawn its last breath.

Anyone knows more about this? Is it a hoax?

[Jonathon Watkins]

On another note altogether- Hi, Jason! :D Thought I'd take your advice and stop lurking here.

Good man. 8) Welcome ND Bob - great first post! Very thoughtfull and some very good points.

I know that going digital has revitalised my photography and has made it a lot more enjoyable. I take care to back up to multiple DVDs (+ and -) and to another computer as well. I feel a lot safer than when I had a box full of negatives. :P

[James Fee]

However dPreview indicates here
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0404/04042201cdrlifetime.asp that CD's may only last something like two years! I have plenty of CD's older than that but I am still worried that one day I will be trying to copy from a CD that have drawn its last breath.

Anyone knows more about this? Is it a hoax?
From what I understand it is overblown. I think it is possible if you abuse you CDs, but the bigger risk will be scratchs. As long as you take care of your CD media, you'll be fine.

[Jason Dunn]

But I would bet that most folks making the jump to digital are more like my parents than like Jason or me - they don't even have CDs of their pictures, nevermind copies on multiple media in multiple locations.

A good point. People can understand the concept of keeping film negatives in a safe place, but not backing up files from their computer. What I'd like to see is more of an emphasis placed on backing up images from image cataloguing programs (iPhoto, Picasa, etc.)...

[Jason Dunn]

From what I understand it is overblown. I think it is possible if you abuse you CDs, but the bigger risk will be scratchs. As long as you take care of your CD media, you'll be fine.

Hmm...that's not my understanding at all. The issue is the dyes used in creating the CD-R discs, not physical damage - some of the companies making the affordable no-name discs use cheap dyes that more or less destroy the CD over a short period of time. It's best to use the cheap CD-Rs for non-critical data and name-brane CDs for the important stuff. Or keep it all on hard drives like I do. :wink:

[ctmagnus]

There was the issue of the group in some hot, steamy tropical local that ended up with bugs inside their CD-Rs, but that's kind of an extremely rare thing to happen. ;)

[RenesisX]

I think I'll be able to read DVDs in the next 10 years. :roll:

I'm glad you think so! :) I have DVD-Rs that are about 2 years old and are already getting *very* hard to read - in fact, some of them I've only just managed to get the data off and had to bin them. I've got some 8+ year old CD-Rs somewhere (from when I had 0.5X burner that was the size of my PC and the media cost $15 a go!).. I'll try and dig one out tonight and see if it's still readable!

I think Lance is right though - most people I know who shoot digitally have no clue about backing up their files and routinely lose their entire HD to virus/spyware infestation. I sincerely believe there will be a whole generation of kids who have hardly any childhood photos.

Although saying that, there are other ways to lose prints - my ex-gf took all hers on a plane to visit her relatives and they lost her baggage! Ugh. She got $1000 compensation, but childhood photos are one of the most irreplacable objects on the planet.

> Chaz &lt;

[James Fee]

OK, I've got DVD-Rs that work fine. What's your point? I was listening on NPR last week and the discussion was very early CD-Rs could fail, but the biggest issue was how they were stored. A properly stored CD-R will last for many/many years.

I stand by that its overblown.