Windows Update for Windows Phone: This is What You've Been Waiting For [Archive]

View Full Version : Windows Update for Windows Phone: This is What You've Been Waiting For

Jason Dunn

10-21-2010, 12:53 AM

It's a story I need not go into too many details about: anyone who's owned a PDA or phone running Windows Mobile, from the first Pocket PC to the latest Windows Phone 6.5, knows the horrors of device ROM updates. Whether it's a new ROM image designed to fix bugs and enhance performance, or a whole new OS, as buyers of these devices we've always been at the mercy of the device manufacturer and/or the wireless carriers. Who amongst us hasn't raised a fist in anger at being denied a vital software update that would fix a problem with our device? This is how the entire underground ROM scene was born - out of frustration and desperation.Or, if you were "lucky" enough to have an update offered for your phone, you'd have the pleasure of re-installing and re-configuring everything on your phone; often a process that would take hours. Microsoft's broken model, combined with OEM/carrier refusal to offer updates likely drove more customers away from buying a second Windows Phone than any other factor. We could only look on with envy as our iPhone-using kin happily docked their phones, got an update, and were using it minutes later.Well, envy begone! Windows Phone 7 solves this pain point once and for all - witness my interview with Andrew Brown, Program Manager for Windows Phone Update, and be amazed...<img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287617689.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" />WPT: Let's start with the best news I've heard about Windows phone 7: how will device updates work now? What will the update mechanism be?Brown: Like many other things in Windows Phone 7, we're taking a different approach to updates than we have in the past with Windows Mobile. To start with, we're going to leverage the world-class infrastructure we already have with Microsoft Update today and use that to deliver updates directly to Windows Phone 7 phones - no more worries about figuring out where to go to download an update. We're also making it much easier on our partners (OEMs and Mobile Operators) by establishing a single, consistent update process that they can take advantage of, meaning they don't have to be responsible for their own individual update creation and delivery like they've had to do in the past. So it's really a win for everyone.We've also built in a notification that pops up right on the phone that tells you when an update is available. When you see that, you connect your phone via USB cable to a computer running the Zune client software. At that point it's literally just one click and the update is downloaded and transferred to the phone, a restore point is created, and the update is installed, all done automatically. <MORE />WPT: Gone are the days of "You do an update, you wipe everything out on the device". How does the process work now?Brown: Yes, that was very painful for users, and was one of the most important things on our list to fix for Windows Phone 7. Our new update process won't do anything to your personal data, settings, or installed apps. When the update is complete, you'll be able to use your phone right away, exactly as it was before, along with all the new benefits from the update itself, of course.WPT: The backup that's made during the update - is that a backup that the user can restore at any time?Brown: We actually don't refer to it as a "backup" because people have different ideas of what that means - in our case, the intent is very specifically to recover you back to a "snapshot" of the phone taken directly before the update, in case there are any problems as a result of the update process. To answer your question about when you can recover your phone to its previous state: the idea is that even if there's something in an update that is causing you trouble later on - maybe there's a third-party app that you really like that hasn't been updated to be compatible with the latest OS, for example - you can restore your phone back exactly the way it was before the update. In most cases, the restore point will remain on your computer so you'll be able to keep it as long as you want.WPT: Microsoft creates the update, but does it go right to the phone from Microsoft update servers? Or is there carrier or OEM testing first that has to happen? And if that's the case, knowing the carriers the way we all do, will the process drag out during their phase? Can a carrier stop Microsoft from releasing an update? Or can Microsoft override the carrier in a worst-case scenario?Brown: In terms of who creates the update, I should clarify that Microsoft is ultimately responsible for "packaging", if you will, the update, as well as delivering it to the phone. But OEMs and Mobile Operators can submit their own update code as part of an overall update that is delivered through Microsoft Update. We definitely will work very closely with our partners to make sure updates are tested thoroughly, but also released in a timely fashion, following standard practices in the industry today for smartphone devices.WPT: Let's get technical here. One of the reasons we were told the original update model worked the way it did was because Microsoft made the software, then the OEMs had to do their customization of drivers and whatnot for the hardware. We were told a hardware abstraction layer (HAL) was the only way to have Microsoft software work on a variety of hardware without the involvement of the OEMs. Does Windows phone 7 use a HAL, or is it simply that the new hardware specifications for Windows phone 7 are so exact there's no need for OEM involvement at the driver level?Brown: Our OEMs definitely play an important role in customizing each phone they develop and adding their own unique expertise, including at the driver level. But we've made it a lot easier for them in Windows Phone 7, in part by having more prescriptive guidance for some hardware specifications, and in part by doing some work "under the hood" to provide a little bit of a cleaner separation between Microsoft and OEM software at low levels of the hardware.WPT: So no over-the-air (OTA) updates then. Why not?Brown: For our first version, we really wanted a consistent, reliable solution that our customers could trust 100%. Connecting to a computer and using the Zune client software for the update gives us several advantages, including a large screen for the update user interface, the ability to charge the phone while updating, and a full backup of the phone in case any problems occur. However, we've definitely been thinking ahead as we've designed and built our current process, so we won't have to redo a lot of work in order to implement OTA capability in the future.WPT: After all of the criticism that Microsoft has taken over the years for the way device updates have worked, it must feel great to deliver a solution that will thrill customers. Any closing thoughts?Brown: Well, I'm not going to declare victory until I can come back to the community and hear everyone's feedback on how we did once we've shipped. But the great thing is that when we need to make improvements, we've now got a solid process for doing so!WPT: Thanks for your time Andrew!Screenshots of the process were also provided - check them out below.<img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618253.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618263.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618311.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618373.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618439.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618459.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618473.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618548.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618562.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//wpt/auto/1287618581.usr1.png" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/wpt/auto/1287618593.usr1.jpg" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/wpt/auto/1287618605.usr1.jpg" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" /><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com/resizer/thumbs/size/600/wpt/auto/1287618618.usr1.jpg" style="border: 1px solid #d2d2bb;" />Jason Dunn owns and operates <a href="http://www.thoughtsmedia.com/" target="_blank">Thoughts Media Inc.</a>, a company dedicated to creating the best in online communities. He enjoys <a href="http://photos.jasondunn.com/" target="_blank">photography</a>, mobile devices, <a href="http://www.jasondunn.com/" target="_blank">blogging</a>, digital media content creation/editing, and pretty much all technology. He lives in Calgary, Alberta, Canada with his lovely wife, his wonderful son Logan, and his sometimes obedient dog. He's mostly digging Windows Phone 7 so far.<img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//ppct/auto/1240336793.usr1.gif" />Do you enjoy using new hardware, software and accessories, then sharing your experience with others? Then join us on the <a href="http://www.thoughtsmedia.com/reviewteam.php" target="_blank">Thoughts Media Review Team</a>! We're looking for individuals who find it fun to test new gear and give their honest opinions about the experience. It's a volunteer role with some great perks. Interested? <a href="http://www.thoughtsmedia.com/reviewteam.php" target="_blank">Then click here for more information.</a><img src="http://images.thoughtsmedia.com//ppct/auto/1240336793.usr1.gif" />

Fritzly

10-21-2010, 08:50 PM

Lee Yuan Sheng

10-22-2010, 03:57 AM

Jason Dunn

10-25-2010, 11:31 PM

Bottom line: OEM first and carriers seconds are still the ones which decide if, how and when releasing updates to the customers.... at least for the time being. While I am sure that will be at least marginally better than before I am curious to see how this scenario will evolve.

Um...no. That's not how it's going to work at all. While some updates will be OEM or carrier initiated - a hardware bug that needs fixing, a carrier tweak - the majority of the upgrades we'll see will be from Microsoft and for the built-in apps.

paschott

10-26-2010, 06:41 PM

Thanks for clarifying, Jason. The carrier line didn't read really well. It's good to know that we'll be getting updates to the OS directly from MS and tweaks to carrier-specific stuff from the carriers through MS. That's been a really, really big concern and too many hints abounded that the carriers would be able to delay updates to the OS. I'm very glad to hear that is not the case. Now if we could just get some information on actually buying one of these devices in the North America region.....

Paragon

04-06-2011, 12:43 AM

I thought it might be interesting to see what people's thoughts are on this now........

Jason Dunn

04-06-2011, 12:45 AM

I thought it might be interesting to see what people's thoughts are on this now........

I was wondering when someone was going to bring this up. :D I, for one, feel a lot of personal disappointment because based on that interview I was led to believe we wouldn't be in the situation we're now in with some people getting updates, some not, and there being a lot of confusion and anger at Microsoft over the state of things.

This are definitely not the way that Q&A made them sound like they'd be... :(

Sven Johannsen

04-06-2011, 05:16 PM

Well, like many I was vocal about the prickly (as opposed to smooth) update process we are seeing. I've done most of my griping in private groups, because it just wasn't going to do anybody any good to blast the program openly. I like Microsoft, Windows Phone, and I would like it to succeed and get better. Piling on doesn't help.

That said, my T-Mobile branded HD7 got NoDo last night. Got the pre-NoDo a week or two ago. AT&T Focus still waiting for either.

I must say the implementation was everything promised. I got the announcement pop up in the device. It asked me to connect it to my PC and Zune. Zune told me I had an update, and offerred to apply it. It cautioned me to not disconnect and it could take some time. I clicked OK and 20 min later I had an updated device. The screens kept me abreast of intermediate steps making me comfortable stuff was happening. What I ended up with was a device configured just like I had it before the update, but with improvements. Totally painless once the anticipation was over.

I gather that there have been glitches with updates, APNs changing, maybe a tile being removed (not lost), but I have had glitches myself on iPhone updates as have others. No process is 100%, but this certainly proposes to be very friendly. I'm pleased with the technical aspects of the new Windows Phone update capability. The bureaucratic aspect needs some work, but that is not something that MS can fix unilaterally, unfortunately. My guess is MS was not willing to sacrifice customer choice, for the power that comes with exclusivity. It's a tradeoff that in the end should see everyone with a Windows Phone, on multiple carriers in the US and around the world, having the same version. Not some of them, all of them.

So, for me, if I look at my HD7, I'm pleased. If I look at my Focus, I'm ticked....at AT&T.

Paragon

04-06-2011, 09:27 PM

I'va always been a bit more blunt than my friend Sven.......so here goes....I'm piling on. ;)

We were all asked to pay a high price to switch to WP7. We were lead to believe that having a tightly controlled platform would mean a better update process. We were lead to believe that not being able to sideload applications meant a better update process with controlled apps only in the Marketplace. We were told that OEMs, carriers, and endusers could not change the UI in anyway because it would have a negitive impact on the update process. We were told that developers would have limited access to APIs because they could then provide a better update process. We were lead to believe that doing all this would make it much easier for Microsoft to deliver updates directly to the enduser with little or no interference from the carriers.

Instead we find that after all these concessions carriers still need to test the updates and sign off on them, adding weeks if not months of delays. The process is not uniform. It is taking forever to roll out to everyone. With many people still left wondering if they will even get the update.

Microsoft really needed to nail this right out of the gate. Not just this update but the whole platform launch. They left such a bad taste in so many people's mouths with Windows Mobile. Many said they would never buy another Microsoft phone. This launch and update have been very closley watched by a wide audience, not just for its content, but to see how Microsoft handled it. Microsoft needed to prove to these people they were capable of managing a mobile platform. I don't think they have convinced anyone other than the already converted they are capable of producing a winner with WP7.

In typical Microsoft fashion it looks like they are going to have to take 3-4 runs at this to get it right.

Dave

Lee Yuan Sheng

04-07-2011, 02:04 AM

I thought I'd check my local forums and see how the WP7 updates are going.

Considering that telcos here are limited to what they can do (ie government regulations make them less likely to screw around with users), the update isn't completely flawless. Even on the same handset and same telco, some users are reporting updates while others are not. One thing's for sure, no matter what OS you're on, it's good to have some hackers doing home brew code. :D

Sven Johannsen

04-07-2011, 04:39 AM

Well Dave, I don't recall being asked to pay a high price for anything. Nobody said, hey, move from 6.5 to 7 and you'll get all these great things. I didn't even get the idea they were targetting 6.5 users when they conceived 7. I opted to go for WP7 with my eyes open, though with admitedly high expectation of a better upgrade process. Heck, having an upgrade process seemed better to me.

I don't recall that all those things you list were actually tauted as being the cost of better upgrades. For the most part I saw them as independent, largely positive moves. I had no problem with a tightly controled platform that ensured we weren't saddled with substandard hardware, with fragmented feature sets. Not letting OEMs and Carriers muck with the UI, seemed a great idea to me. Wasn't a detriment for the iPhone, and it certainly made it easier to market, recognize, support Windows Phone. With the glut of 'skins' on Windows Mobile you could barely tell if it was running a MS OS or not half the time. User customization is a touchy subject. I find WP is way more personalizable (that a word?) than iPhone, but certainly not as much as WM or Android. Every option has code behind it and I'd just a soon they work on function over flash. Not side loading apps seemed a concession to the 'obvious advantages' of an app store. I recall numerous blog posts decrying every OS that didn't have one. To that end, now even Intel and Apple have them for PC OSs. Seems like not having one became a liability. If you have to have one, might as well use it to bring some consistancy to the platform. Limited access to APIs? That is softening, but I have no issue with keeping wanna-be coders out of critical areas while the OS is maturing. Had to hard reset my PPC/WM stuff more than once due to a rogue piece of code. A little stability guarantee isn't unwelcome. While these items have some drawbacks, I think they also provided some positive aspects for the new OS, at least initially. A better upgrade story was in adition to them, not dependent on them or because of them.

Don't disagree that this first/second upgrade/update couldn't have been handled better, but better might just have meant keeping their mouth shut about it until it happened. In that case, the end result wouldn't have been much different. I still think the intent and reality is that everyone will get it. That certainly wasn't even marginally true with previous MS phone stuff, and isn't currently tru with another popular mobile OS. It's pretty solid on the fruit phone, but that comes from a legacy of one device, one carrier (who Apple had by the short hairs). Beyond that the update process is pretty smooth. Easily as good an experience as Apple's.

There are a lot of things I would gladly beat MS up for in WP7, but the speed of the update, and transparancy around it just isn't that big a deal to me, really. To bad it is so easy to latch on to as a great failure, when the failure was more in marketing it, than the actual implementation. By implementation I mean what happens once the bureaucracy has been vanquished.

Maybe I'm not as blunt, but that is not because I'm holding back, but because I have faith that folks are actually trying to do their best, and don't figure beating them up for their best falling a bit short helps. Remember we are talking just about the upgrade process here. I'm not even addressing what is in the update (or not), or the OS as a whole here.

There you go Dave, guess my glass is half full. :)

Paragon

04-08-2011, 03:06 PM

I don't recall that all those things you list were actually tauted as being the cost of better upgrades. For the most part I saw them as independent, largely positive moves. I had no problem with a tightly controled platform that ensured we weren't saddled with substandard hardware, with fragmented feature sets. Not letting OEMs and Carriers muck with the UI, seemed a great idea to me. Wasn't a detriment for the iPhone, and it certainly made it easier to market, recognize, support Windows Phone. With the glut of 'skins' on Windows Mobile you could barely tell if it was running a MS OS or not half the time. User customization is a touchy subject. I find WP is way more personalizable (that a word?) than iPhone, but certainly not as much as WM or Android. Every option has code behind it and I'd just a soon they work on function over flash. Not side loading apps seemed a concession to the 'obvious advantages' of an app store. I recall numerous blog posts decrying every OS that didn't have one. To that end, now even Intel and Apple have them for PC OSs. Seems like not having one became a liability.

I think I need to clarify something here. Being able to sideload apps has nothing to do with not having an app store. Apps stores are a definite necessity. However it is NOT a necessity to block sideloading apps to have one. Android has a very sucessful app store yet every single Android phone has a box you can check to allow sideloading. I personally feel that not having this and forcing everyone to buy from the company store is a monopoly. I'm quite surprised that Apple and now Microsoft, and whoever else are allowed to get away with it.

You say you have no problem with a tightly controlled platform. The problem here is that you are unfortunately in a small group. The market proves this. Just look at Android's marketshare and how it continues to explode. People are easily embracing its openess and flexibility, even if it has some flaws. Yet WP7 is not doing well. The only way we see any traction for WP7 is in the future when Nokia's huge market starts to hopefully flip over to WP. I'll say it again, Microsoft put too high of a price on updates. And now that people are seeing what they are getting for an actual update process they are far from happy. Look around at different sites and forums, and even the faithful are extremely disappointed.

Killing the monster known as fragmentation is becoming an impossible dream. It would be nice to think it's possible but with such an exploding market with 100's of millions of devices, for anyone to keep their platform all on the same page, I think, is slipping from everyone's grasp. Even Apple has fragmentation, with only one device per generation. They already are unable to keep older versions updated. How can a platform with multiple devices, multiple OEM's, and ever advancing hardware keep it all together. What will happen when WP sees dual core processors? If they overcome that hurtle who knows what the next will be.

Here we see Microsoft having issues very early on with its update process. I for one do not see them holding off fragmentation in the coming years as more and more devices come on line from more and more OEMs, with ever advancing hardware. I think Microsoft put too many eggs in that basket. Especially in light of how this update has gone. Adding to the problems are carriers not signing off on it in a timely fashion, causing even more unrest.

Dave

Sven Johannsen

04-08-2011, 04:08 PM

I'll say it again, Microsoft put too high of a price on updates.

Dave
And I'm just saying I don't see all the other stuff as a means to the update process. Each of those changes were independant decisions, right/wrong, better/worse. Different discussion(s).

Personally I don't get the apparent appeal of Android. I don't see much there I couldn't do with Windows Mobile and folks didn't flock to it. I think it is marketing, and that is an area I just don't get. Other than the folks who hang out at these sites, I would guess that the vast majority of folks who buy a Smartphone, Apple, Android, WM, WP, are using it pretty much the way it came out of the box. Sure apps get loaded, and periodically used, but an app is an app is an app. eWallet does pretty much the same thing on every platform it runs on, as does AngryBirds, and Bing. I really don't get why "People are easily embracing its openess and flexibility, even if it has some flaws", when that pretty much described the state of Windows Mobile when that was an abject failure in the press, the blogs and the marketplace. It's all marketing.

Paragon

04-08-2011, 05:02 PM

I don't see much there I couldn't do with Windows Mobile and folks didn't flock to it. ................ I really don't get why "People are easily embracing its openess and flexibility, even if it has some flaws", when that pretty much described the state of Windows Mobile when that was an abject failure in the press, the blogs and the marketplace. It's all marketing.

I think it was all timing. 2-3 years ago Microsoft had pretty much given up on Windows Mobile. It sat fairly stagnate for a year or two before that. Android has simply filled the hole Windows Mobile left. I think if Microsoft had of stayed with WinMo through that time, fixed it and brought it upto date, Android would be floundering in its wake. Instead Microsoft spent a couple of important years openly doing nothing much in the market, and have now taken a different path and Android has had free reign with MinMo out of the way.

Dave

Jason Dunn

04-08-2011, 07:19 PM

You say you have no problem with a tightly controlled platform. The problem here is that you are unfortunately in a small group. The market proves this. Just look at Android's marketshare and how it continues to explode. People are easily embracing its openess and flexibility, even if it has some flaws.

I'm personally really curious to see what happens with Android's marketshare over the next few years - my hunch is that the appeal of Android is more about the carrier marketing and hardware, and less about the OS itself. I've known more than a few people who have gotten on the Android train then gotten off a year later because of instability, platform fragmentation, etc. I feel like the world is moving more toward a computing model of reliability, appliance-like usage, etc.

Guess we'll see! :D

Paragon

04-08-2011, 08:07 PM

I'm personally really curious to see what happens with Android's marketshare over the next few years -
Guess we'll see! :D

It will be interesting to see.

While I think Android will stay strong, I can't see it continue at its current pace. I think its bubble will soon burst. For me personally, at the moment, I like Android better than anything else, but it sure doesn't make me go "WOW" I think someone could easily come out with something new that does make an impact. Right now no one is. WP isn't. Apple is looking old, and beginning to loose marketshare. BlackBerry is sure struggling... Anyone of them could come out with something new and stand the market on its head like Apple did with the iPhone. Android is the most likely to take a hit in that case.

Dave

Sven Johannsen

04-09-2011, 05:29 PM

I think it was all timing. 2-3 years ago Microsoft had pretty much given up on Windows Mobile. It sat fairly stagnate for a year or two before that. Android has simply filled the hole Windows Mobile left. I think if Microsoft had of stayed with WinMo through that time, fixed it and brought it upto date, Android would be floundering in its wake.
Dave
Can't argue there. I honestly think MS could have a lock on the Tablet market too, had they done more than create some tablet concessions in 2002, and not much significant since.