No, HERE is what YOU need to do: Every other off-topic post skip licking MicroSh*t a$$ and STFU.
Now really, you need to get a bit of grip and some grain of common sense. Like a plethora of ppl have pointed out before, Stinger platform is NOT mainstream stuff. In other words you won't see any time soon (tm) grandma with a Stinger powered phone, anytime soon (the "less then curtain" -- to put it mildly -- M$ attitude towards OEM being _not_ the smallest factor).
Not that I like Nokia so much better, but compared with Stinger, Symbian is _much_ more mature, proven, and used in gazillion of phones worldwide so it is in much better position than Stinger. Obviously, the 800 lb gorilla (M$), with its deep pockets and "ramming down competitors" attituted has still have some chances to burry it. But Symbian won't go down without a fight, that's for sure. And the fact that Nokia "has seen the light" and is open sourcing their developm. platform is _more_ than welcome. Now _that_ is "innovation".
Ah, and a last note: FYI, more than3 yrs ago, a phone based on a Symbian platform (i.e. Nokia 9110) could use custom WAVs as ringing signals (and it was darn cool, I had one for 3 yrs). But, given the "high end" target of those phones it didn't quite "catch" to lower end phones. And I really doubt it ever will. This segment is what (I guess) Jorgen was talking about (standardizing phone ringing signals) and this is what "got you laughing". And make you post an utterly stupid off-topic subject.
I dont see the inclusion of WAV as anythign great. Its certainly not new. The 9210 supports both ringiong tones (as we think of 'em) and WAV files. They'll still be a market for people wanting to customise and who are prepared to pay for a given wav file.
Let's be honest here, people have been able to record and use wav/mp3 ringtones on their *cheap* mobiles for the past year, and combining the different kinds of customisation isn't M$ innovating it's them copying what the opposition is already doing. Perhaps it would help to look at the mobile phone market before making statements that are unfounded about it.
No, HERE is what YOU need to do: Every other off-topic post skip licking MicroSh*t a$$ and STFU.
Now really, you need to get a bit of grip and some grain of common sense. Like a plethora of ppl have pointed out before, Stinger platform is NOT mainstream stuff. In other words you won't see any time soon (tm) grandma with a Stinger powered phone, anytime soon (the "less then curtain" -- to put it mildly -- M$ attitude towards OEM being _not_ the smallest factor).
Not that I like Nokia so much better, but compared with Stinger, Symbian is _much_ more mature, proven, and used in gazillion of phones worldwide so it is in much better position than Stinger. Obviously, the 800 lb gorilla (M$), with its deep pockets and "ramming down competitors" attituted has still have some chances to burry it. But Symbian won't go down without a fight, that's for sure. And the fact that Nokia "has seen the light" and is open sourcing their developm. platform is _more_ than welcome. Now _that_ is "innovation".
Ah, and a last note: FYI, more than3 yrs ago, a phone based on a Symbian platform (i.e. Nokia 9110) could use custom WAVs as ringing signals (and it was darn cool, I had one for 3 yrs). But, given the "high end" target of those phones it didn't quite "catch" to lower end phones. And I really doubt it ever will. This segment is what (I guess) Jorgen was talking about (standardizing phone ringing signals) and this is what "got you laughing". And make you post an utterly stupid off-topic subject.
Sounds to me like you have some unresolved anger that you need to work out. No matter.
But just because Symbian has been around, you almost make it sound as if you think that no one else has a right to enter the market. You say `compared with Stinger, Symbian is much more mature, proven, and used in gazillions of phones worldwide`. Well, yeah, this is pretty obvious. But I wonder why? Could it be that Smartphone hasnt COME OUT YET?
Then you say `so *Symbian* is in a much better position than Stinger`. Why do you think this? Because of the reason you gave above? Just because a phone or technology has been around awhile doesnt automatically make it the best choice to be the reigning technology. Better technologies come along all the time. Give Smartphone a chance. It hasnt even arrived yet. You may end up liking it.
You also said `you won't see any time soon grandma with a Stinger powered phone`. So what? And exactly what age group of grandparents are you talking about here? Ive seen grandparents in their forties, if you want to get technical about it. If youre talking about someone so old they cant tie their own shoes anymore, then I would doubt youd find someone like that with any cell phone in the first place. Dont assume that because someone is in their sixties, that their minds are gone. If someone knows how to operate a cell phone period, chances are, they could operate a Smartphone. It certainly wouldnt be harder to operate than the advanced features of a lot of the current phones on the market, with their crappy DOS like WAP interfaces, that are anything but intuitive. How many grandparents do you see using those features? But from the looks of things, it would be a lot easier to navigate through the menus and features of a Smartphone, then the current crap thats out there now. But even if the older generations found this difficult, again I say, so what? No phone is meant for everybody. But its certainly a much better alternative, in terms of ease of use, to all the other garbage that exists today. Just look at the screen shots. Honestly, just how hard could a Smartphone be to use? The bottom line is, technology is going to advance whether we like it or not. Its not going to stay the way it currently is whether we like it or not. New alternatives are going to arrive whether we like it or not. Thats reality. Thats life.
You say `Stinger platform is NOT mainstream stuff`. Oh really? If the pending deal between Microsoft and SonyEricsson goes through, this phone is going to be as mainstream as any other. And what about the younger generations? Do you think theyre going to say, `ooooh, yuk, this Smartphone is so boring and stupid`, or do you think that theyre going to like the 16 bit color screen, chat, email, MP3, internet, high quality ringtone and sound effects, and gaming features better than the other crap currently on the market, which either doesnt have these things or doesnt have them implemented as nicely? Think about it. This kind of an interface and these features, whether its Microsoft or not, is the future. Not Nokia WAP crap.
Maybe these Smartphones will be more expensive when they first come out, but this would be no different than any other type of technology. Give it time, prices will drop, and everybody will choose one of these over those dreadfully boring Nokias, Motorolas, and other brands, anyday.
Microsoft entering the market with this phone will breathe some life into the industry. It certainly will put a fire under Nokias and these other manufacturers` lazy butts, especially in the States. I welcome competition. It forces companies to innovate, to create more or better features in their products. But Ill add one other thing... If what Nokia currently offers, was their vision for the future, then I welcome Microsoft to kick their butt.
Im buying a Smartphone when they arrive. Just dont come crying to me when you decide you want one.
But just because Symbian has been around, you almost make it sound as if you think that no one else has a right to enter the market.
Funny you should say that. It reminds me of a story I heard where a company was striking deals with PC Manufacturers to create a dual boot system which would offer Window$ by default but also an option to load a new OS called BeOS.
Now, the funny thing was, the company that made Window$ told the computer manufacturers that this was not allowed, "Windows or Nothing" the manufacturers were told. Why could that be? Could it be that nobody has the right to enter the OS market?
It must be something I've eaten, but I'm suddenly visions! Visions of pots and kettles!
As for buying a M$ phone..... Oh, you make me giggle!
Oh really? If the pending deal between Microsoft and SonyEricsson goes through, this phone is going to be as mainstream as any other.
Actually I think your find that this is partly unfounded rumour. Ericsson aren't getting into bed with MS despite the various rumours floating around. They are just as committed to Symbian as ever as is shown by their statements in the press release for Symbian 7 and UIQ, but then I doubt you have read that. Ericsson are actually developing two Symbian smartphones, one Pearl 9ish) based and one on UIQ.
Rafe,
I was saying, IF it goes through. Who knows who exactly will make this phone. Someone will, though. None of us really know or can be sure until its officially announced. Ive seen the new Nokia, but it wont be offered in the States. At least my understanding is that there are no plans to, anyway. I cant say I like the design all that much, to be quite honest. Based on those things, Smartphones look really good to me.
Chubbergott,
Well, Im glad I can make you laugh here and there, thats cool. :lol: But I must say, Im not defending Microsofts actions with other things. Thats hardly my responsibility, and if theyve done things that arent right in the past, those things have no bearing on the points I was trying to make.
But for logic sake, not Microsofts, I feel I must point out in reference to your example, even though Microsoft doesnt build pc hardware, expecting them to agree to having another competing OS ship with the same computers Windows ships with, is like expecting Nokia to ship its phones with both an MS OS and Symbian. Or to expect Apple to ship its computers with both the Apple OS and Windows. Microsoft isnt required to agree to allowing additional OS`s to ship with Windows, just for the sake of being nice. Its business. Youre not going to give your competitors a pass. Besides, it didnt prevent BeOS from entering the market, or prevent users from installing the OS, anyway. If a company has a way of beating out the competition, then thats just business. Sometimes, standards arent such a bad thing. But the bottom line is, competitors still come out with their products. And users can still use them.
For my dear Ker (Crash course in embeeded software devel.)
*sigh*...let me sort out some things for you, briefly.
- As it appears that you're not familiar with the techie language: "Grandma" has nothing to do with age/gener/color/race or anything of sorts. It's just techie slang for technology impared and/or complete ignorant. Like for example the average Win$ user :twisted: )
- (Some) reasons behind my "Symbian is in a much better position" statement: 1) They sucessfully incorporated Epoc ( _very_ respectable embeeded RTOS) 2) "They been around many years" i.e. they have _many_ heavy/experienced phone manufacturers that used their platform. In case you're not familiar w/ soft. developm (especially embeeded soft) this is something no money can buy. Really. You get this kind of stuff only by sorting out many, MANY (and i really mean..MANY) bugs, debugging lines of code, software development cycles, etc...In a single word in plain english: EXPERIENCE.
- SonyEricsson and Stinger...Now _I_ start laughing. Ask your dear Andy about the local (i.e. swedish) jokes Ericsson was targeted with when they went into joint venture with M$ (aprox 4 or 5 yrs ago). The result of that partnership (this is first hand information): The use of Microsoft Exchange "as a strategic product" at several Ericsson company as mail server !!! . *lol* And everybody ROFL-ing and pointing the finger at them when they got massively CodRed-ed and whole Ericsson companies could not even send corporate mail for days in a row. End products ? None. Mutual partnership experience: Yeah rite...Anyway, it was so bad that even the completely dumass Ericsson management took the decision to shoot down that partnership. So, SonyEricsson with Stinger ? Now THAT is the joke of the day. Really, more seasoned ppl. here already pointed out that SonyEricsson is _really_ heavy behind Symbian.
- Personal side note about /me wanting M$ powered phone. I have to (somehow shamefully) admit that I'm using for various task some M$ crap (like the InternetExploder I'm using rite now for wasting my time and continuing this flame; Or the PPC02 I'm playing with every once in a while). But using it for _work_ or really important stuff, now that will take a VERY,VERY long time. Double that, and you'll get the time until I'll buy a Stinger phone.
All in all my gut feeling (and my best bet) is that Stinger will be another "long-sighted" and "free of any ulterior motives" attempt from M$ to "INNOVATE" the mobile phone market as it was when M$ tried to use MSN to "innovate" the Internet :wink:
Well its clear you dont like anything Microsoft, and thats alright. Everybody is entitled to their opinion. And as I said before, no one knows who will manufacture this Smartphone. As far as this is concerned, we can only go by what we read or hear from other sources. The bottom line is, none of us truly know what is going on behind the scenes. Some things are obvious, other things we can only speculate about. With some of these things, we just have to agree to disagree. Time will tell all.
Oh, and uh, excuse uh me for taking the grandma thing a bit too literal. I understand the slang, but sometimes the way others infer things isnt always perfectly clear in written form. :lol:
Rafe,
I was saying, IF it goes through. Who knows who exactly will make this phone. Someone will, though. None of us really know or can be sure until its officially announced.
But for logic sake, not Microsofts, I feel I must point out in reference to your example, even though Microsoft doesnt build pc hardware, expecting them to agree to having another competing OS ship with the same computers Windows ships with, is like expecting Nokia to ship its phones with both an MS OS and Symbian. Or to expect Apple to ship its computers with both the Apple OS and Windows. Microsoft isnt required to agree to allowing additional OS`s to ship with Windows, just for the sake of being nice.
I think the point being made was that MS was saying to someone else we wont let use Windows if you install BeOS as an option. Forcing another company not to do something doesn't seem right to me.
You alternative about Nokia doesn't make sense. It would be like Symbian saying to Nokia you cant use Symbian if you also use MS). i.e. its an OS provider imposing terms of use on manufacturers and obviously this is anti-competitive. Yes it is for business reasons, but its not right. It be like a tyre company saying to a car manufacturer you can only use our brands of tyre.
Oh yeah and I think the major thing about ericsson thing - well yes someone will make an MS phone, but if its not a big mobile phone player it got a much smaller chance of sucess.
Flamebait (infoSync talks Smartphone 2002)
. *lol* And everybody ROFL-ing and pointing the finger at them when they got massively CodRed-ed and whole Ericsson companies could not even send corporate mail for days in a row. End products ? None. Mutual partnership experience: Yeah rite...Anyway, it was so bad that even the completely dumass Ericsson management took the decision to shoot down that partnership. So, SonyEricsson with Stinger ? Now THAT is the joke of the day. Really, more seasoned ppl. here already pointed out that SonyEricsson is _really_ heavy behind Symbian.
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