Now, with that said... I agree that cookies aren't spyware. They're not any kind of "ware", for that matter. They are potential privacy hazards, but they have no inherent ability to hijack a machine or otherwise interfere with the normal use of the OS.
They are simply text files that uniquely identify a browser in some ad agency's database. And as such, are appropriate targets for deletion by pro-privacy applications.
And having said that, I think we can come to the conclusion that these cookies that are being served up from the PPCT website are only present due to the delivery of ad-banners you see on the site.
PPCT, as you would know, is a perfectly legit site and we have no intention in secretly installing spyware on your computer.
A quick trip to the Avenue A website and you will see that there are other legit sites out there such as MSN and Best Buy that make use of the Avenue A services.
So if people believe that PPCT is distributing spyware, I ask that you think about it a little more carefully. That would also make well-known companies like MSN and Best Buy guilty as charged.
__________________ Want the latest news, views, rants and raves? Visit our portal. Wish to contact me? Send me a private message or e-mail.
I think we need to seperate SPYWARE that only collects information through use of cookies and those that install SPY programs that watch everything, possibly change the system and send information somewhere without the users knowledge.
When an internet browser surfs to a particular web site then most users know that a cookie (or several) may be used to hold data such as being logged in or certain temporary session information. He would not know that some SPY in memory periodically sends information to a site that he visited once four weeks ago.
I have arguments with my wife over the usefulness of non-malicious SPYWARE. Take for example AMAZON. They have a database that tracks all of the purchases that YOU and EVERYONE else have made. If I buy a particular book then they automatically inform me that many people who bought this book also bought book 'xyz'. I find this to be a very useful feature. They also compile long term shopping info and there is a 'personal' page where they display items that they think I might be interested in based on my past purchases. This I find also very useful. If we expand this to 'daily life' then consider all of the tons of junk mail that you recieve every day. Most of this crap goes unopened into the garbage! This is an irritation for OCCUPANT and COSTLY for the ADVERTISER. Imagine if SPYWARE worked here as well. Then you would only get junk mail for things that you are interested in. Of course you will have to now open and read the damn things and will end up spending more money but you are only wasting your time on things that you are interested in doing so (kind of like the POTM)!
With the advent of Hypersonic sound and invention of Woody Norris there are a large number of potential applications that could also be onsidered an invasion to your privacy. Personally I am waiting for the television headphones that don't require headphones that Woody said should be in WalMart this summer (would also be useful as a PC speaker for work) but the applications where they are already in use is mainly for advertising. Location specific advertising, they are calling it an aurial laser (although AESER would probably be more appropriate).
In any case, as someone has already mentioned almost any kind of technology can be used for GOOD or EVIL (if used by police to decapacitate criminals without permanant injury is also GOOD, if used in WAR to KILL - NOT). Hypersonic sound has many, many, GOOD applications and some that can be EVIL. I think that true SPYWARE (i.e. just COOKIES and/or a database maintained by companies such as AMAZON) can be a force for GOOD. When the same mechansim is used by nefarious individuals (or companies) then it becomes the ROOT of all EVIL.
While I agree, cookies are not the root of all evil, they DO report information back to double click and the like on what doubleclick affiliated sites are reported back to doubleclick. Saying they do that anonymously is not true either. PPCT has logins as do many other sites that run ads. That means THERE'S a cookie thats written to your machine so that you don't have to relogin on every visit. That cookie has your login id. While most people don't use their real name for there login, some do. Most people cannot be tracked back to the real name via login cookies. Some people don't even want information that is anonymous collected about where they go on the web. In any case, it would be wrong to say that cookies are nto spyware of sorts. It IS reporting information back to the advertiser, but it's usuallly anonymous info.
Isn't this as much a discussion about changing values in the internet as anything else? Two years ago nobody thought about the dark side of the net and everyone was happy... now the 1st topic everywhere is security and all of a sudden people don't just think what the can do on the net, but also worry what the net does to them... and gee, they don't like being tracked and examined w/o ever given permission.
Jason, if you respect my privacy I would ask you to not install coockies on my PC. I would be very surprised if you see that any different.
Jason, if you respect my privacy I would ask you to not install coockies on my PC. I would be very surprised if you see that any different.
:lol:
If you don't like cookies, then turn them off in your browser. Don't ask Jason to stop using cookies on his site. If he does that, you can kiss this forum goodbye. Cookies are used to keep you logged into a site, and to keep items in your shopping cart when you buy online, amoung other things. Cookies are not bad.
Places like double click may use cross site cookies, but they aren't ready your thoughts media cookie that stores your login.
Once again, cookies are not bad, if you like, turn them off in your browser, and report back and let us know how you like surfing after that. :wink:
__________________
"I have no special talents, I am only passionately curious" - Albert Einstein
For my part, I don't like the third party cookies. Whoever the advertiser is they are probably not bound by Thoughts Media's privacy policy. I'm not usually a paranoid type but I don't really want any agency out there databasing my surfing habits.
If you could drop those ads that would be great but I understand that for non-subscribers such as myself the site is ad supported. Still I would rather see your in-house ads in heavier rotation that know that some ad company out there is tracking my moves.
If you don't like cookies, then turn them off in your browser. Don't ask Jason to stop using cookies on his site. If he does that, you can kiss this forum goodbye. Cookies are used to keep you logged into a site, and to keep items in your shopping cart when you buy online, amoung other things. Cookies are not bad.
Places like double click may use cross site cookies, but they aren't ready your thoughts media cookie that stores your login.
Once again, cookies are not bad, if you like, turn them off in your browser, and report back and let us know how you like surfing after that. :wink:
Exactly! I don't see the big problem. Yes, there could be privacy issues with certain cookies, but if you dislike them that much, just block the cookie from those sites. It's not that hard. :|
Of course the main concern are third party cookies, not pocketpcthough's own cookies which keep you logged into forums. The issue is that these cookies are used over many sites, some of which might not have such savoury privacy policies.
If any of these sites require your postcode (zip code) and share this with the advertising agency, now they have a real-world address and a real person to tag on to the surfing pattern and list of websites you visit.
If people think this is impossible, remember the story 4 years ago when Doubleclick merged with a junk mail and credit aggregation company called Abacus Direct/ Abacus Alliance.
The single example of public resistance occurred last month when the New York advertising and catalogue data company DoubleClick Inc., which has archived profiles of the mail-order buying behaviour of more than 88 million U.S. households and has placed cookies on an even larger number of personal computers to track online buying patterns, was forced to suspend its plan to link data from the online and offline worlds. By linking those two sets of data, the Internet's largest advertising company would have been able to identify consumers as they moved around the Web by their name, address and telephone number, rather than by an anonymous serial number.
This temporary victory for privacy is overshadowed by two awful facts:
Despite DoubleClick's retreat, some of its competitors are pressing on with practises that are arguably even worse, and the law offers consumers little protection from any of these practises.
These people know where you live, they know how much you earn, and now they know you visit pocketpc websites (example only). Their websites and databases have been hacked in the past. They are subject to the very unsafe terrorism laws in America, which basically means they can request any type of information just on suspicion.
Also, due to the size of the databases, there is the very real potential for confusion, with some-one else's data being mistaken for yours, because you share the same surname for example.
Suppose you visit a Amazon, and click on link taking you to a book on making a bomb and survivalist strategies. Maybe you found the title interesting. You dont even have to buy it. Some-one else buys a pile of fertiliser of another website, and has been mistaken for you. Doubleclick as a good patriot has been asked to monitor occurrences like this, and before you know it the ATF is at your door, killing your wife, children and dog like Randy Weaver, while you are completely innocent.
Now this all may sound very far fetched, but my understanding of the current climate in the world and especially the US, is that you can be disappeared and detained without trial, and not even be told what the charges are, making it impossible to defend yourself.
If your behaviour is monitored closely, you will never know when you are innocently creating a similar pattern to a dangerous person (because in a large population with a small number of real positives, false positives are invariably very common) which might result in unsavoury consequences.
So, in short, if you are the kind of person who is concerned about these thinks, one would know that even simple text third party cookies can invade one's privacy.
Surur
PS: I'm not really a raving tin-foil headed conspiracy nut, but I can understand where they are coming from. Im generally an optimist, and am sure they will come for my neighbour, not for me
Two years ago nobody thought about the dark side of the net and everyone was happy... now the 1st topic everywhere is security and all of a sudden people don't just think what the can do on the net, but also worry what the net does to them... and gee, they don't like being tracked and examined w/o ever given permission. Jason, if you respect my privacy I would ask you to not install coockies on my PC. I would be very surprised if you see that any different.
Your statement has part of the heart of the problem on cookies. You say install. You install programs. Cookies are not programs, they can't do anything on their own. Cookies are potential spyware, but spyware of the weakest type. Most of cookies are harmless and to most are actually helpful. Making a blanket statement asking them not to be used is not fair, especially when you can easily set your browser to not accept cookies at all or just to prompt you and let you make the decision. So despite your statement above, by not turning cookies off, you have given permission. Why punish those who do understand the usefulness of them and realize there is little risk. Next thing you will be asking that Jason not use any graphics on his pages because of the potential to get embedded spyware downloaded through a flaw there http://www.eweek.com/article2/0%2C17...17045%2C00.asp .
As for your statement that two years ago no one thought about the dark side of the internet, I had to laugh. Plenty of people were thought about it, unfortunately, Joe user wasn't listening and for the most part still isn't. The number of computers that don't have an up-to-date firewall and antivirus package is pitful. Those are the big issues.
Even SPYWARE can be legit, and EVEN USEFUL
Linear Mode
