As to the above, I'm inclined to think at least some of that is due to the carriers, no? I can't believe the amount of crap installed on the AT&T Tilt that I'll never use, but seemingly have no ability to remove w/o resorting to some unsupported ROM hack.
Yeah, I think it's a combination of OEMs and carriers "not wanting to". HP stopped releasing updates even before WM phones were prevalent.
Part of the problem is, I fear, that the three-tier (software, OEM, carrier) model makes it very difficult to gain concessions. Microsoft has two parties to convince, and if both the OEM and carrier consider it a support nightmare (or just not cost-worthy), well, that's a lot harder than Apple's situation. Apple also has a direct consumer connection, unlike OEMs, so AT&T can in theory just point the customer to Apple (e.g., if a ROM update fails), whereas finger-pointing in a three-tier situation is much harder.
This, unfortunately, makes me think that WM7 can't be a major improvement in the update arena. I'd be happy to be wrong, though.
I'm usually pretty critical of MS in these discussions, but this just isn't one that gets my back up. There are many things about WM that I hate worse than this. I'm not even sure if this would be in my top ten. Maybe it's because I get so few updates, but I don't do it often enough for it to really bother me that I have to reinstall my apps. I just look at it as a chance to clean out the stuff I don't want any more. It would be nice if we had non-destructive updates like Apple, but we don't, and we never will, and so that's just one of the tradeoffs you make when you make any product choice. I get multitasking, they get easy updates. I get the apps I need, they get a better UI. I can talk in rural areas, they can talk overseas. It all balances out in the end.
Seems to me that everyone has forgotten about the biggest elephant in the room: the need to completely sever the link between the carriers and hardware.
All I really want from my carrier is the following and ONLY the following:
airtime (voice and broadband data)
a primo network
assisted GPS (unlocked, thank you)
ability to use phone as a modem
ability to use wi-fi networks
deliver text and media (video, image) messages
possibly TV, like Sprint offers
I don't want carrier apps preinstalled, a pre-chosen browser other than IE mobile installed or any other software that cannot be removed. I have Verizon and right now, their offerings SUCK!! And that's not a term normally in my vocabulary. Currently, their Windows Mobile offerings are:
a "Verizon wireless" XV6900 (I've no idea who makes this or what it is)
Samsung Omnia
Samsung SCH-i760 (I might have bought this two years ago)
Samsung Saga
crippled HTC Touch Pro (with weird keyboard and only 192 MB memory)
How pitiful is that?? This link needs to be broken so that I can select from a larger set of devices of my choosing: namely the Palm Treo Pro or an unmolested HTC Touch Pro or even a CDMA version of the Samsung SGH-i780. Microsoft wants to introduce outlet stores to showcase the innovation going on? Fine. I can tell you Verizon will never offer up any of that innovation. Those innovative phones will simply sit on the shelves, waiting to be selected by Verizon.
Why should I have to put up with the fact that Verizon simply chooses not to offer any of the above mentioned phones (or any others in which I might be interested?) They are clearly heavily marketing the Blackberry Storm right now and if users want anything else, forget it. Oh I didn't mention that you can't even walk into a Verizon store and look at the HTC Touch Pro. It is only available by Internet! What kind of $$##@! is that??
Anyway, until the keys drop off of my Treo 700W (yes, you read that correctly, I am still using that old war horse) or until Verizon finally introduces a phone which has significant amounts of RAM in an uncrippled phone or until I decide that I've had enough and migrate to another carrier, I will just keep using my old Treo.
The point of this rant is that until the carriers lose their ability to dictate what phones are offered, I'm not going to worry about whether or not updates are offered. There is a bigger battle to fight!
Clearly msft has been letting users down for a few years now. my winmo works for me (I accept the bad with the good), but I recognize that it doesn't work for most people. I don't see 6.5 changing much other than the today screen. The same core problems remain. And PLEASE, will someone fix pocket wmp?
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With enough tenacity and money, they can make a success out of their own hardware (Xbox 360), but in general that's not what they're good at.
Maybe they should put the team that launched the 360 (or at least part of that team) on relaunching Windows Mobile. Now follow me on this one.
Between the iPhone and the new Toshiba TG01 (and ever-dropping prices on SDHC cards), the potential hardware capabilities exist for what I'd propose. The iPhone comes in 8GB and 16GB flavors, with the iPod Touch also having a 32GB variety. The TG01 has a processor that runs at 1GHz, based on an entirely new chip, indicating that faster versions of said chip might be possible in the near future. (near, in relative, WM terms, meaning in the next few years, of course. )
I submit that, given the hardware that OEMs CAN (but don't yet) use, it would be possible to make a phone using an entirely new OS, that could emulate either the entire WM 6.x OS, or at least enough of it to run most WM 2002 through 6.x apps. The handful of apps that have very specific (and high-end) hardware requirements, like a graphics processor, would likely not work in this environment, but that would account for a VERY small percentage of existing WM apps. Others that use device- or brand- specific hardware would likely receive new OS versions. With the Xbox, Microsoft has proved that they CAN break in to markets dominated by other companies.
I think the best strategy in this case, is to actually work something out more akin to PC development. MS provides the OS and core apps (office mobile, et al). They get a couple/few chip makers to make VERY specific chips and chipsets (like Snapdragon). They would insist on certain minimum hardware features from OEMs, and work with them on getting phones released in a TIMELY MANNER. Finally, they'd need to figure out a strategy to get electronics retailers (or e-tailers) to offer at least a handful of the new phones, while still encouraging carriers to offer service-subsidized phones.
On the software side, they could create their equivalent of the "app store", but in order to continue encouraging smaller developers, they'd allow developers to offer freeware and shareware through their store. For that matter, they could even contract with one of the larger WM software retailers (like Handango, or somesuch) to convert their site to the new WM store.
I realize all this would require significant investment, and would represent a pretty big gamble on the part of Microsoft. But then again, who'd have thought, almost 7 1/2 years ago, that a software company could produce a (hardware) game system that would come to dominate THAT market?
Back to the topic at hand, if Microsoft did all (or most of) the above, particularly issuing VERY specific minimum requirements to OEMs, it would be a MUCH simpler matter to offer upgrades and/or updates. For that matter, in that scenario, updates COULD even be sent over the (3G) networks, directly to the devices. You wouldn't even need to sync up to your computer, to download updates!
If they can do it with XP/Vista/etc., then why not Windows Mobile? These operating systems are installed on millions of computers the world over and they roll out updates monthly if not weekly and everything works just fine. People have up-to-date computers and everyone is happy. Why didn't they implement "Windows Mobile Update" back in the day when it first popped up with Win98? It's beyond me why the upgrade process for WinMobile has been an epic failure on Microsofts part. I'd still take WinMo over iPhone OS any day of the week though.
Would it be so hard to add a "Check For Updates" feature to Activesync/WMDC? Or keep a database of drivers for phone hardware? I wouldn't think so. It would help all the companies that make devices based around WinMo AND most importantly, make it a more popular platform.
Those of use who use and enjoy our BlackBerries! I still use my Wing as a PDA only, but my Blackberry Curve is my main communications device.
I've only owned a BB for a few months and T-Mobile has only offered one (significant) update. Same thing with my Wing - only one update was ever offered for it. T-Mobile doesn't seem to be particularly aggressive in providing updates for its phones. Obviously, they'd prefer you buy a new phone to get more features.
I agree that Apple's model for updates is neigh perfect and they are certainly aggressive in developing them. I'm just not a huge fan of touchscreens and have shied away from the iPhone for this reason, plus the fact that all the functionality I enjoy with WM devices still isn't there yet for the iPhone. The BlackBerry is a wonderful communications device, but still doesn't offer the functionality of WM which is why I still use my Wing as a PDA.
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XBox 360 S, 16GB iPhone 4S, iPod Classic 160 GB, Dell Inspiron Mini 1018; Macs: Mac Mini 2.4 GHz 6 GB RAM; Macbook 2.0 GHz 3 GB RAM; MacBook Air 11", 24" Cinema Display
The whole update thing for WM is what finally drove me to the iPhone. Every time an update came out I either had to wait to hear if my device was going to get the update, most times it wasn't and I had to purchase a new device to get the upgrade. Even then I was always disappointed because the update didn't amount to much or caused some other problem. If my device was chosen for an update I had to purchase a back up program, wipe my device clean then if the update didn't turn my device into a brick I had to spend all that time reconfiguring the device. Not only that but MS has never had a sync program that was worth anything either.
With the iphone I dock the device, click update, itunes automatically backs up everything, updates the device and then restores everything including even the smallest of settings. 10 minutes and you're done.
iPhone 3.0 is coming out I don't have to keep checking all the forums for someone who may have some inside information on my device and if it's going to be upgradable. Now I already know exactly what to expect.
I agree that for the most part it seems like MS is damsel here. But in their OEM license model, they have just as much to lose by prolongng the life of a device. Eveytime they update a device, that is a potential lost sale on a new one.
If OEMs increase their development cycle due to longer device life span, then that means fewer licensing fees for MS.
The only way that a OEM might be able to of set that is to come up with more hardware variations to lure people away from their, still up to date, device.
Apple on the other hand, as several other have said, maintains a constant revenue flow through the App Store, ITunes, and revenue sharing with carriers (if they're still doing that).
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