Also, you forgot to mention it's a 200 Mhz Xscale vs. a 150 Mhz MIPS (though probably about the same power).
Nuh uh. Go back and reread it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by heov
You also forgot to mention that the Clie has twice as many pixels than the Casio, that's also transflective (iPaq 3900). That is a BIG point that know one should miss- the screen is very important too MANY people...
And you forgot to get the point of the post. It is the size I was referring to. I didn't get into all the details. The E125 looks as good or better indoors than the iPAQ or Sony. Horrible outside, but inside, it is a fantastic screen. I also didn't mention how the E125 could multitask, use a bazillion CF accessories, etc. It wasn't meant to be a direct comparison on each point. It was about the tired old "big bloated Pocket PC that requires a big device and sucks battery life" argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by heov
Also, you seem to be uninformed of Sony's product line.
For those who do not need a camera, they get the NX60.
For those who do not need the keyboard, shorter battery life, size, they get a T series (655c).
For those who do not want MP3s, they get an sj30.
For those who do not want Color, they get an sl20.
For those who do not want lithium ion batteries, they get an sl10.
For those who want lower resolution, they get a Palm, and maybe even a PPC.
Yes. Very interesting. Irrelevant though. None of these devices have the specs I outlined. Again, go read the post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by heov
Personally, I love PPC Thoughts and the news they give me, including some of your comments. Although I understand this site is PPC bias, which I don't have a problem with (since you're not claiming you have unbias material), your (Ed) posts on Palm are misleading.
Also, just to note, it's .93 inches thick at the CF slot, not uniformly.
Ok, and .85 or .8 elsewhere? Nothing I said was misleading. Go look up "opinion" and you will see I cannot possibly be wrong about my opinion.
so, what you are comparing is apple with apple here. There is no hope that Sony can perform 15 hrs straight on single charge, or the battery won't drain charge slowly like the rest of PPC.
You're agreeing with me. I'm saying that the Clie probably has similar battery life to the other PPCs (5 hours with backlight on), not 5 hours without the backlight. People are using the LATTER as a disadvantage of the clie compared to PPCs when it's probably incorrect.
I'm absolutelly impressed with new Clie NX70. High res screen, built in photo/video camera, keyboard, 200MHz processor (can you imagine just how fast will Palm OS fly with that?) and a sheer coolness factor that is just through the roof :O
My main concern is that I've heard screen on NR models was not as good as Ipaq 3950, despite being transreflective, and despite both being made by Sony.
My other concern is that I'm not a big fan of Palm OS, but the new launcher/UI looks extremely slick.
I don't mind propriatary WiFi card as it's still very affordabe (and again better than my Casio that I can't get online)
Now if someone would only make a MAME port for it :))
Xscale is and always has been part of the Palm OS Ready Program.
How did I kill the topic- just when you discuss things about the different OS on the different machines, don't forget to talk about the big points he missed, such as the transflective screen that has 2 times more pixels. And the keybaord- the keybaord is not just a "feature", it is designed into the PDA, it is a big aspect of the PDA, and people don't buy things they don't use- that's like asking why would someone buy a PPC with CF and SD if they just use the CF slot- the keyboard adds weight, size and decrease battery life- it's a big thing for the PDA.
Back to topic about why everyone is raving... who is raving again? All i've heard were complaints about the lack of innovation from sony and this being the LEAST innovated product yet... But, it's great for palm because it is now capable of doing almost everything a PPC can do (in practical senses). Yes, it doesn't have a file system, etc, but you can still get on the net, still get on WLAN, type of papers, record voice, play music, play good games, play videos, etc. plus it can take pictures too!
Also, I believe sony used the same battery from the older NR series- so the Xscale drains more power than the Dragonball, and the power for CF plus the newer camera puts a heft toll on this machine. I wouldn't be surprised if it does have poor battery life.
fundmgr90210... the way I see it is it's not an "I hate Palm" post... it's a "this is how E-125 was offered before and Palm zealots were slamming it then... now what would you say about the CLIE now?" post. (when I say "was offered"... just like what Ed said... it's not a side to side comparison of features but what I meant was the battery usage and bulkiness of the unit)
These arguments against Ed are stupid. All Ed said was that he thinks it's stupid that a Palm with hardware specs below that of Pocket PCs 2 years ago (less RAM, even bigger; not taking the screen into account) is getting so much attention. If you look at this from the perspective of a veteran Pocket PC enthusiast (like Ed or me), you can understand his frustration. Sony isn't innovating. Their basic idea of the clamshell design is almost as old as the cellphone (well, actually, look at the communicator in the original Star Trek...), and the rest of the specs could have been made up by Sony guessing about a way to beat the hardware on Pocket PCs when they were still Palm-Sized PCs. The only really "new" part of the hardware is the camera. Sure, the resolution is really good, but it's ratio is like that of Pocket PCs more than Palm's 1:1 ratio (years ago, people were asking for even better resolution from PPCs and some PDAs running CE have been seen at VGA hardware resolutions; also, Sony's position as a supplier of LCDs gives it the ability to use expensive LCDs and still make a decent profit). I guess if us PPC enthusiasts really wanted to stretch it, Handheld PCs, which are "clam-shell"-like devices, do have as good of a resolution as Sony's best PDA.
This article by Ed is not misleading. He talks about how the Sony PDA is not really so amazing to us PPC users. He doesn't say that it stinks. I guess it's like being all excited about Mac's getting a 4x AGP port on select models when PCs have had them STANDARD for about a year (I know about the technical reasons for why Macs don't need a 4x port as much and I also know that doubling the AGP bus speed only gives like 10 or 15% increase in performance... don't over-analyze examples or analogies... they are only given to help someone understand what someone else is trying to explain).
Back to the point of this conversation, the only thing I envy about the Sony is the screen. All the other stuff either doesn't matter to me (keyboard) or isn't as good (only 16 MB RAM and 200 MHz XScale? pfft...) or is mostly a novelty (the camera, which you can of course get on PPCs, although non-integrated, but I would never want to get such a camera like the CF cameras or Sony's integrated one unless they gave it to me for 100% free). PPCs are still much more expandable. And, ironically, thin. PPCs are smarter devices that seem more thought-out than Sony's devices. Integrated WiFi is a very big selling point for someone like myself who lives in a place populated with WiFi networks. A lot of people complain about the size of PDAs. Today's PPCs are very thin. Dual integrated expansion with the option of external expansion is common. Standard yet high-end specs like integrated stereo audio (not codec dependent, like Palms basically are), integrated microphone, high resolution color screen, a lot of RAM (32 MB), non-volatile FlashROM for safe storage of extremely sensitive information that must be always available and also OS updates, and a standard processor platform that is at least as good as the next generation of the very best Palm device and will be available in the future. Sony's device seems like a thrown-together tech novelty/concept device. It has really nice various features, but how important or useful are they, really? The Palm software can't use the XScale processor directly yet, the screen is nice but the OS doesn't use it to it's full advantage (like I believe the PPC has), the keyboard is really nice for some people but takes up a ton of space for others, and the camera has little usefulness, since you can't take high-resolution pictures with it that you would actually want to print out (I can only speak for myself, but how often do YOU actually use the camera in front of your PC to take pictures of yourself to print out?). Now, these are only the things that are considered "amazing advantages" of this Sony device. I would personally just like a nice $300 PPC that's really thin and has nice expansion and a fast processor with plenty of RAM to put those great gam*cough*... uhhh... productive programs that make good use of the well-matured cpu platform (such as Pocket Artist and Photogenics or whatever). If I'm going to spend more, I'd like dual expansion, 400MHz processor that runs older programs as well, 64 MB of RAM, and integrated WiFi. USB host support would be cool, too. That's right, I'm a PPC enthusiast. I have my reasons, too.
BTW, don't think that I'm trying to be unbiased. Most of this post is at least somewhat biased, although that doesn't mean that it is entirely untrue, because you can put the right spin on just about anything and make it say almost the opposite of the same thing with a different spin.
These arguments against Ed are stupid. All Ed said was that he thinks it's stupid that a Palm with hardware specs below that of Pocket PCs 2 years ago (less RAM, even bigger; not taking the screen into account) is getting so much attention.
This article by Ed is not misleading. He talks about how the Sony PDA is not really so amazing to us PPC users.
That's the point, it's NOT supposed to be so amazing to us PPC users; but IT IS supposed to be amazing to current Palm users. So this is really not a big deal. No offense to Ed, but his perspective is a little off. I realize that he mainly wanted to emphasize the bias of the media, but comparing PocketPC with Palm reminds me of some of the reviewers who didn't really get that PocketPC Phones were 'all about data first' (something Ed correctly pointed out not so long ago). Sony is targetting a different market. The new Clie was not meant for you guys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotbeat
Sony isn't innovating. Their basic idea of the clamshell design is almost as old as the cellphone (well, actually, look at the communicator in the original Star Trek...), and the rest of the specs could have been made up by Sony guessing about a way to beat the hardware on Pocket PCs when they were still Palm-Sized PCs.
Have you really looked at the device? Innovation in design with respect to what Palm has to offer in general is tremendous.
(BTW, please ignore my avatar...I am loyal, but not that loyal )
so, what you are comparing is apple with apple here. There is no hope that Sony can perform 15 hrs straight on single charge, or the battery won't drain charge slowly like the rest of PPC.
You're agreeing with me. I'm saying that the Clie probably has similar battery life to the other PPCs (5 hours with backlight on), not 5 hours without the backlight. People are using the LATTER as a disadvantage of the clie compared to PPCs when it's probably incorrect.
honestly, i have serious doubts that sony actually took battery drain due to time standing by into account (as your first post said). my guess is that sony feels that 10 days sounds a whole lot better than 5 hours with backlight off...which it does.
and seriously, if sony could claim 5 hrs with the backlight on and 15 with the backlight off, i think that they would try to say 30 days with 1/2 hour usage everyday with backlight off.
and do x-scale devices really have that much of a battery drain? i seriously doubt it......
I would also like to point out that Clie NR series had the *same* battery specifications - 10 days, 30 minutes per day, backlight off. I assume if it didn't bothered people then, it won't bother them now.
Besides, I don't think that translates to 5 hours of continuous usage. Battery drains even when the device is turned off, and 10 days is a pretty long period, so I assume the battery would drain quite a lot even if the device is not used much.
"That's the point, it's NOT supposed to be so amazing to us PPC users; but IT IS supposed to be amazing to current Palm users. "
Actually, I'm a PPC enthusiast and I'm pretty damn amazed what they crammed into this device and how elegant it all looks. Way better than any pocket pc on the market right now, IMO. It looks like something from... bright and better future, for the lack of better words Integrated photo/video camera, to me is a much more interesting thing, than just about anything PPC makers have come up in the last year or so.
As for the processor speed - if Palm OS was so snappy with it's 33MHz processor, can you imagine just how fast this thing is going to be?
The only thing I don't quite like is the lack of gamepad of any kind. Again, there's a snap add on that corrects this 'problem'
It's comparing apples and oranges. For example, is a PocketPC even usable with only 16MB of RAM? On PalmOS it's more than enough to run all the applications. And even if you are going to compare.. why leave out important features like built-in keyboard, digital still and video camera, MPEG4 video playback and the highest resolution screen of any PDA.
On the other hand, the battery life is pathetic no matter who you compare it to. And the CF slot is not as useful as it can be while taking up valuable space.
So there's good and bad, but this article seems to be too one sided. If you are going to compare... do the whole bit. Even as a PPC fan, if somebody gave me the choice of the two, would I seriously pick the Casio over the Sony? I don't think so!
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