Porting OS 4.2 to ARM and adding audio feature doesn't sound like "very significant progress" to me.
Its more like temporary patch to get ARM to work with POS.
Where is the killer apps for ARMPOS? The two mp3 players? heh....
its more than just looking at the OS without considering the progress that has been made over the years and limitations the OS imposes on manufacturers.
the pocketpc OS is cool because it supports multitasking, sound, etc... but think about this:
1997 Windows CE 1.0 was released supporting multitasking, audio, built in modems, PCMCIA slots, 480 or 640 x 280 black and white screens.
1998 Windows CE 2.0 was released for the Palm sized PC reducing the screen size to 320x240 and butchering the GUI. pocket access is ditched and the functionality of the other applications (outlook, word, excel) are reduced further.
1999 Windows CE 2.1 for Palm sized PCs was released adding color and refining the GUI.
now windows mobile 2003 is out (6 YEARS AFTER CE 1.0!!!) and there is minimal added functionality to the core apps. THATS RIGHT -- YOU ARE RUNNING SOFTWARE APPLICATIONS THAT ARE SIX YEARS OLD ONLY NOW ITS RUNNING FASTER AND WITH MORE STORAGE. WHAT IS GOING ON!!!!!!!!
arguably, the windows OS is actually preventing manufacturers from making better devices because it stipulates that the screen resolution is 320x240. someday we may make it back to 1998 and actually have higher resolution screens.
i recommend taking a trip through history and looking at the devices from 1997 and 1998 and ask has the windows CE OS made much progress in the last 5-6 years?
microsoft should be doing better. we should have highly functional core applications. we should have an advanced synchronization process that WORKS. we should be using higher resolution devices.
i think we are actually being taken for a ride and microsoft is milking us for all we are worth (much like palm just finished doing for the last 5 years)....
i recommend taking a trip through history and looking at the devices from 1997 and 1998 and asking has the windows CE OS made much progress in the last 5-6 years?
I see it and feel it when I use the devices every day. Did you actually use a PSPC? I had the opportunity to work with a Nino, and it was weak, in so many ways. Poor SIP options. Poor multimedia (no MP3 support!) Slow. Needed frequent resets. Lacking UI. Horrible, unreliable sync support. Promising, but not practical. The customer I sold it to ended up never using it.
The current Pocket PCs are light-years ahead of what those old devices were. True, the original CE 1.0 kernel was ahead of its time, and that's evolved less. But the devices have come a long way, in my opinion.
CE changes kernel, API, UI during the time line you mentioned, even the built in apps are added.
now, did Palm even bother to change the icon design? lol
oh right it was black and white 6 years ago, now it's blue... weeee
I recommend YOU look at Palm history and see if it changes or just one continuous patch and minor tweak after another.
and really OS 5.0 is just OS 4.2 running on ARM, big deal. That's why it has such a difficulty with browser keep crashing, or developer can't make a quick adaptation of rich multimedia player. The OS is too primitive to support such apps.
I see it and feel it when I use the devices every day. Did you actually use a PSPC? I had the opportunity to work with a Nino, and it was weak, in so many ways. Poor SIP options. Poor multimedia (no MP3 support!) Slow. Needed frequent resets. Lacking UI. Horrible, unreliable sync support. Promising, but not practical. The customer I sold it to ended up never using it.
The current Pocket PCs are light-years ahead of what those old devices were. True, the original CE 1.0 kernel was ahead of its time, and that's evolved less. But the devices have come a long way, in my opinion.
--janak
I liked the Nino. Also check out the Casio EM-100 (CE 2.11), it had stereo out in 1999 and I'm not even sure the mp3 codec had been created then...
Our current incarnation of the user interface GUI was created in 2000 with version 3.0 (yep we've been using it for 3 years) and it was a minor upgrade (they added a Today screen and stuck the start button on the top instead of the bottom. They also got rid of the CLOSE BUTTON :evil: )from the original palmsize GUI created in 1999 with CE 2.11.
I agree that the hardware has changed -- namely CPU speed, memory size, and miniturization. I dont consider the optimization of the OS for a particular processor to be an impressive acheivement. They just massaged the same code and recompiled it.
As far as instability :lol: I reset my T-Mobile PPC phone almost as much as I use the ON/OFF switch!
And "Horrible, unreliable sync support." :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Youre right.... ActiveSync has come a long way :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
(I think i wet myself 8O )
Someone is going to mention expansion so I'll point out again that the original CE 1.0 devices supported PCMCIA cards so the expansion was there.
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Originally Posted by TawnerX
even the built in apps are added
actually we are using scaled down versions of the original applications that came with Windows CE 1.0. thats right, Pocket PC Mobile 2003 Word, Excel, and Outlook are LESS FUNCTIONAL than the apps in the original windows CE 1.0. not to mention one of the applications (that I liked a lot) was thrown out -- we lost Pocket Access!
I used to use a Velo500 and I find it pretty ironic that people are drooling over the latest Sharp clamshell when it is actually a color Velo500 with a flip screen and todays processor and memory. I do look forward to returning to at least a 640 x 240 screen :roll:
I also came across this story and its pretty funny! > THIS <
I liked the Nino. Also check out the Casio EM-100 (CE 2.11), it had stereo out in 1999 and I'm not even sure the mp3 codec had been created then...
MP3 was long available before that, just not broadly used. As for the Nino, it was very cute, but bulky and the battery life was strictly subpar. IMHO, the E-100 was the first PSPC worth having.
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Our current incarnation of the user interface GUI was created in 2000 with version 3.0 (yep we've been using it for 3 years) and it was a minor upgrade from the original palmsize GUI created in 1999 with CE 2.11.
Hmm, I disagree, and we'll probably have to leave it at that. The CE 2.x interface was severely clunky, and needed a lot more taps than PPC2k/2k2/2k3.
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They just messaged the same code and recompiled it.
Ha! That is so far from the case, it's not funny.
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As far as instability :lol: I recet my T-Mobile PPC phone almost as much as I use the ON/OFF switch!
I agree the T-Mobile Pocket PC Phone isn't the best in stability... but I think that's a device-specific issue. I didn't reboot my 3870 in months, except for BT operation, which was a driver loading issue that's been resolved in PPC2k3.
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And "Horrible, unreliable sync support." :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
(I think i wet myself 8O )
Dude, do you not remember Services for Windows CE? It was a billion times worse than ActiveSync. ActiveSync is the most stable technology compared to that stinkin' piece of crap.
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I used to use a Velo500 and I find it pretty ironic that people are drooling over the latest Sharp clamshell when it is actually a color Velo500 with a flip screen and todays processor and memory.
What exactly do you think should be done, may I ask? The Velo 500 was a monochrome 480x240 display, 75MHz processor, 16MB of RAM. The new Sharps are light-years ahead, with more in every category -- and it's more compact.
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I also came across this story and its pretty funny! > THIS < [/url]
ukeface: AnchorDesk's predictions were never worth a grain of salt, in either direction.
Dude, do you not remember Services for Windows CE? It was a billion times worse than ActiveSync. ActiveSync is the most stable technology compared to that stinkin' piece of crap.
Services 2.1 was ok (1999) but we've had ActiveSync since 2000 and honestly it has become more unstable (at least for synchronizing with 2 machines).
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What exactly do you think should be done, may I ask? The Velo 500 was a monochrome 480x240 display, 75MHz processor, 16MB of RAM. The new Sharps are light-years ahead, with more in every category -- and it's more compact.
the point im making is that although the hardware has improved, the software is actually holding things back by not improving the built in applications and restricting the resolution to 320x240....
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ukeface: AnchorDesk's predictions were never worth a grain of salt, in either direction.
Services 2.1 was ok (1999) but we've had ActiveSync since 2000 and honestly it has become more unstable (at least for synchronizing with 2 machines).
Services 2.1 was not OK. I agree, though, that ActiveSync has work to do. We all do.
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the point im making is that although the hardware has improved, the software is actually holding things back by not improving the built in applications and restricting the resolution to 320x240....
No argument on the screen resolution issue, although (a) I don't believe that's generalizable to all of the featureset of Pocket PCs; and (b) the Sharp you cite is 640x480 and running Linux.
No argument on the screen resolution issue, although (a) I don't believe that's generalizable to all of the featureset of Pocket PCs; and (b) the Sharp you cite is 640x480 and running Linux.
--janak
I'm not knocking all of the pocket pc features (I love my T-Mo PPC Phone resets and all!), I'm just pointing out that the core apps suck -- they were better on my Velo500 and the resolution is lame and Microsoft has had 6 YEARS TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!!!
As far as the Sharp goes -- I was confusing it with the Nexio -- which runs CE.net and has a 640x480 screen :cry: .
I'm not knocking all of the pocket pc features (I love my T-Mo PPC Phone resets and all!), I'm just pointing out that the core apps suck -- they were better on my Velo500 and the resolution is lame and Microsoft has had 6 YEARS TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!!!
Amen for the most part, but that doesn't translate to the operating system not having changed noticeably.
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As far as the Sharp goes -- I was confusing it with the Nexio -- which runs CE.net and has a 640x480 screen :cry: .
Porting OS 4.2 to ARM and adding audio feature doesn't sound like "very significant progress" to me.
Its more like temporary patch to get ARM to work with POS.
Where is the killer apps for ARMPOS? The two mp3 players? heh....
Hey there is the resolution (320x320 and 320x480), WI-FI support, 3D game capabilities (there is a device comming with a built in ATI 3D Card) also there is even a DivX player.
I want to see more resolution in the PPC, and better office support (and I am not talking about features I mean compatibility not to change formatting in documents).
ukeface: AnchorDesk's predictions were never worth a grain of salt, in either direction.
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