I would be interested to know how many P900/P910s or Nokia 9500/9700s they sold - that would be a reasonable comparison against WM and POS devices. I'm bettting the number is substantially lower. Anyone got the numbers?
No, but you are exactly right. Saying Nokia sold 6M phones is a meaningless number when talking about smartphones. The vast majority are the freebies or sub $50 phones after rebates, not the high powered phones with bluetooth, cameras, email support, the ability to install third party apps, a non-WAP-only browser, etc.
Symbian only sold licenses for a bundled OS - not a single device. Nokia etc sold devices that run Symbian OS.
That figure of 6+ million includes vanilla mobile phones which are not really relevant to this conversation...the vast majority of so-called "smartphones" touted by Symbian supporters are plain-jane mobiles. Not PDAs. They don't even try to be and that's fine - many people just want a telephone. The N-Gage is supposedly a Symbian "smartphone"...nuff said.
I would be interested to know how many P900/P910s or Nokia 9500/9700s they sold - that would be a reasonable comparison against WM and POS devices. I'm bettting the number is substantially lower. Anyone got the numbers?
Urm, thing is the NGage IS a decent smartphone.
Email clients, productivity software, avantgo(windows mobile smartphones STILL dont have that), mobipocket, realplayer etcetera etcetera all can be used on it, it has a pim suite etcetera.
The NGage is as much a smartphone as any of the windows mobile smartphones.
I would be interested to know how many P900/P910s or Nokia 9500/9700s they sold - that would be a reasonable comparison against WM and POS devices. I'm bettting the number is substantially lower. Anyone got the numbers?
No, but you are exactly right. Saying Nokia sold 6M phones is a meaningless number when talking about smartphones. The vast majority are the freebies or sub $50 phones after rebates, not the high powered phones with bluetooth, cameras, email support, the ability to install third party apps, a non-WAP-only browser, etc.
No they are not, Nokia in Europe ships around 2 million cellphones per quarter, around half those ship with series 60 or higher, series 60 is a FULL SMARTPHONE OS.
Its a cluttered mess compared with PPCs and a small mess compared to win mobile smartphones but it still is a full smartphone OS.
I'm not disputing that Series 60 plus is a reasonable smartphone OS if properly deployed...but small screen, no touchscreen, no SIPs, no keyboard, often no Bluetooth, useless email clients, WAP-only browsers, minimal PIM capability, rudimentary media capabilities and in the case of Nokia at least, appalling sync software, and I do dispute that you can legitimately call most of these devices smartphones.
I'm only up because I've had to send a fax to New Zealand and a little tired to actually pick an actual example phone...but will happily carry on tomorrow...
Symbian's OS is OK in itself but just because a device runs it doesn't mean that it is a smartphone or a PDA.
I'm not disputing that Series 60 plus is a reasonable smartphone OS if properly deployed...but small screen, no touchscreen, no SIPs, no keyboard, often no Bluetooth, useless email clients, WAP-only browsers, minimal PIM capability, rudimentary media capabilities and in the case of Nokia at least, appalling sync software, and I do dispute that you can legitimately call most of these devices smartphones.
I'm only up because I've had to send a fax to New Zealand and a little tired to actually pick an actual example phone...but will happily carry on tomorrow...
Symbian's OS is OK in itself but just because a device runs it doesn't mean that it is a smartphone or a PDA.
How big are the screens on MS Smartphones and do they come with a stylus?
Don't rest your case quite yet because I happen to think that the current crop of MS "smartphones" aren't all that smart either - in fact I would prefer one of the high end Nokias if it were a choice between them...
So there!
The MS smartphone platform will start getting serious with WM5 and should hopefully go from there (IMHO).
However - one thing that MS phones do is sync well with Outlook/Exchange etc, even now...Noks are pants at syncing.
Right, so insead of smartphones you want a PDA with cellphone capabilities then.
It wouldve been a lot easier for both of us if you would have just said so from the start.
I'm not disputing that Series 60 plus is a reasonable smartphone OS if properly deployed...but small screen, no touchscreen, no SIPs, no keyboard, often no Bluetooth, useless email clients, WAP-only browsers, minimal PIM capability, rudimentary media capabilities and in the case of Nokia at least, appalling sync software, and I do dispute that you can legitimately call most of these devices smartphones.
I think you're a little out of touch with Series 60.
For the record, every Series 60 released has had bluetooth, has had a full HTML web-browser (Opera or NetFront) and has been capable of playing music and video.
The out-of-the-box e-mail solution is pretty poor but there's very decent third party software available.
Syncing is still Nokia's number 1 problem though. At least Series 60 phones sync with Lotus Notes and Macs out-of-the-box though and, in that respect, they've got Windows Smartphones beaten.
Right, so insead of smartphones you want a PDA with cellphone capabilities then.
It wouldve been a lot easier for both of us if you would have just said so from the start.
Why are you thinking that these are different things...? We are not talking mutually exclusive featuresets here.
A smartphone is a converged device, with both PDA and telephony capabilities...
Try syncing a 9300 or a 9500 with a Mac. Ain't happening.
As a quick aside, does anyone else think Lotus Notes is devilware? I shudder to think about it now.
Right, so insead of smartphones you want a PDA with cellphone capabilities then.
It wouldve been a lot easier for both of us if you would have just said so from the start.
Why are you thinking that these are different things...? We are not talking mutually exclusive featuresets here.
A smartphone is a converged device, with both PDA and telephony capabilities...
I agree, although you can blame MS for the confusion. How many people call the Treo a PalmOS Phone Edition? Although its debatable that the 3 flavor nomenclature makes sense to identify each one's concentration. I'm clear on it atleast.
IMO I consider WM Smartphones to be smartphones (beyond the obvious) because of their rich PIM functionality and support for even richer 3rd party applications. Touch screen is not a prerequisite.
But so much of it is subjective.
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