CDMA and Bluetooth?

[Janak Parekh]

http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupd...2914156,00.html

David Berlind writes an article about upcoming converged devices, and how he'd rather prefer a Bluetooth solution, except for the fact none are available for CDMA. A quote:

"Today, virtually all SprintPCS voice plans come packaged with an all-you-can-eat data plan. These plans are designed to encourage the sales of data-capable phones such as the $99 Sanyo 8100 camera phone, which makes it easy to take low resolution pictures and transmit them to friends and family. But the reason SprintPCS can offer these all-you-can-eat data plans to business users and consumers alike without overwhelming its 2.5G network is that the company never envisioned any of the wireless devices in its lineup as loquacious generators of data. When used as intended, even the most sophisticated of the PDA/phones that SprintPCS resells (such as the Treo 300) can only generate modest amounts of data."

Unfortunately, it's no longer clear whether the CDMA phone he refers to in the article will even exist. The SE T608, which David refers to, may never be offered -- Sony Ericsson just pulled out of the CDMA market.

It seems that Verizon and Sprint are very afraid of the implications of a BT phone on their network -- since 1xRTT allows greater bandwidth than GPRS (at least in most commercial implementations in the US), they seem reluctant to release one until they figure out the cost structures. Compare that to T-Mobile, who's willing to offer $19.99 unlimited data (assuming you have a voice plan), whether it's over a PC card, a Bluetooth phone, a smartphone, etc. However, it's very frustrating for customers, myself included.

[Janak Parekh]

http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupd...2914156,00.html

David Berlind writes an article about upcoming converged devices, and how he'd rather prefer a Bluetooth solution, except for the fact none are available for CDMA. A quote:

"Today, virtually all SprintPCS voice plans come packaged with an all-you-can-eat data plan. These plans are designed to encourage the sales of data-capable phones such as the $99 Sanyo 8100 camera phone, which makes it easy to take low resolution pictures and transmit them to friends and family. But the reason SprintPCS can offer these all-you-can-eat data plans to business users and consumers alike without overwhelming its 2.5G network is that the company never envisioned any of the wireless devices in its lineup as loquacious generators of data. When used as intended, even the most sophisticated of the PDA/phones that SprintPCS resells (such as the Treo 300) can only generate modest amounts of data."

Unfortunately, it's no longer clear whether the CDMA phone he refers to in the article will even exist. The SE T608, which David refers to, may never be offered -- Sony Ericsson just pulled out of the CDMA market.

It seems that Verizon and Sprint are very afraid of the implications of a BT phone on their network -- since 1xRTT allows greater bandwidth than GPRS (at least in most commercial implementations in the US), they seem reluctant to release one until they figure out the cost structures. Compare that to T-Mobile, who's willing to offer $19.99 unlimited data (assuming you have a voice plan), whether it's over a PC card, a Bluetooth phone, a smartphone, etc. However, it's very frustrating for customers, myself included.

[mangochutneyman]

Actually its's being reported that by July 1st, SprintPCS will be changing their TOS to allow use of their mobiles as modem for laptops/pda's:

http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/Web...y?newsID=11167

Sprint PCS has done an about-face and now allows subscribers to use their 1xRTT Vision service with laptops and PDA's.

Sprint PCS quietly updated their Terms of Service effective 6/1. Most notable, is the removal of the portion of the Terms of Service that stated that customers could not use their phone as a modem with the $10 to $15 a month Unlimited Vision plan.

Previously the Terms of Service warned that users could be blocked from using Vision, or have their contracts terminated for using it as well. The Terms of Service also blocked the usage of "PCS Vision Connection Kits" which were USB cables that Sprint sold to allow customers to use their phone as a modem. These kits were pulled from stores when Unlimited Vision was announced, and most customers were not given a refund for buying it.

This is extremely good news for people using Vision with their PowerBook, as Sprint had even gone beyond their Terms of Service and started charging customers up to $.002 cents per KB of data transfered, accusing them of violating the ToS.

This comes on the heels of T-Mobile announcing an unlimited data plan that could be added to most voice plans for only $20, and $29.99 for data cards. Sprint PCS still sells data card plans with unlimited access to Vision for $80 a month.

Thus I'm not so sure SprintPCS is "afraid" as the article above descibes!!

[MultiMatt]

Originally Posted by Janak Parekh

It seems that Verizon and Sprint are very afraid of the implications of a BT phone on their network -- since 1xRTT allows greater bandwidth than GPRS (at least in most commercial implementations in the US), they seem reluctant to release one until they figure out the cost structures.

Thank you Janak! I have been asking for ages (on numerous discussion boards) why neither Sprint nor Verizon offered BT phones, and I never heard a clear answer.
Now I know - both companies realize that there are thousands upon thousands of people who are waiting for a (Sprint or Verizon) BT phone with baited breath, ready to connect with various BT-enabled devices and surf at high speed, and they aren't ready for that.

Which truly sucks.

Matt

[Cipr0]

I chuckle at all the pro GSM/GPRS cackle on this site......


BTW......? Where is UMTS?

[Janak Parekh]

Originally Posted by Cipr0

I chuckle at all the pro GSM/GPRS cackle on this site......

Hardly. I'm a big fan of Verizon and 1xRTT, and it has substantially better coverage than T-Mobile in the NY metro area. It's just that it's not an option for me, what with it being very expensive Express Network-wise (although rumors are circulating about free use of your minutes for Express Network) and the lack of Bluetooth!

--janak

[clinte]

Originally Posted by Janak Parekh

Unfortunately, it's no longer clear whether the CDMA phone he refers to in the article will even exist. The SE T608, which David refers to, may never be offered -- Sony Ericsson just pulled out of the CDMA market.

Preview of Sony Ericsson T608 for Sprint PCS (Updated)
Tuesday, June 24, 2003
R. Emory Lundberg, Assoc. Ed.
From the Mobile Phone Dept.

"Press Release from Sony Ericsson makes a few things very clear.

This move to stop work on new CDMA handsets, and scale back on R&D efforts is clearly a bad sign. Ericsson has been getting short on money for quite some time, and completely killing off an entire line of products is certainly a drastic move considering they had not even attempted to penetrate that market.

With the R&D money gone for a product they'll never sell, hopefully Sony Ericsson can pull a rabbit out of their hat to stay even remotely competitive. Phonescoop is reporting that Sony Ericsson may still continue to sell this product, but with little to no future development in the queue, it may leave people wondering what they'll do when there are bugs that need fixing."

more
http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/Web...MZClLXpPhKxor0

"Sony Ericsson Mobile Communications has decided to prioritize development of its GSM/UMTS/EDGE business and discontinue the development of CDMA mobile phones for the North American market. Sony Ericsson remains committed to the continued development of CDMA phones for the Japanese market and CDMA machine-to-machine modules."
http://www.sonyericsson.com/spg.jsp?..._1_73%26B%3Die

Maybe the demand for CDMA phones with built-in Bluetooth by Americans isn't interesting enough for SonyEricsson to continue in this market. The overhype, lack of US Carriers support, the WiFi (overhyped) success story and the doom and gloom stories by some so-called tech experts (especially in the US) seem to be a few but very important points why Bluetooth has been slowly adopted in the US imho.

"Verizon knows or has to know that there are enough interesting mobile phones with Bluetooth available. I read that Analysts say that 1 out of 5 phones made today has Bluetooth and that will increase overtime. I don't know if there has to be a special Mobile phone with Bluetooth for the Verizon *Cellular technology!? AT&T, T-Mobile, Cingular, Vodafone and soon Sprint (will) offer Bluetooth services. It's a joke imho that a "Carrier" like Verizon, which seems to back WiFi big time, doesn't offer Mobile Bluetooth Solutions or safety handsfree bluetooth solutions."

Verizon Wireless is the first nationwide wireless carrier to offer FreeSpeak (Jabra Bluetooth Headset): "I was looking at Verizon phones today while I am home visiting in NY. I asked about Bluetooth (specifically looking for the *Motorola T-68i) and was told that the only Bluetooth phone they had was recently discontinued, but that they have bluetooth headsets they could sell me... "for the phones you don't sell?" I asked, "yes" they said! *shakes head* So apparently I have to go to T-Mobile (Voicestream) to get that phone, not sure their service is any better, but apparently no ones is good so it's worth a try I guess."

Verizon employee (?) on Monday October 21, 2002: "Several Bluetooth phones have been tested or will be tested. Motorola has a bluetooth module for headsets and PCs that they may be releasing late this year or early next year. Embedded phones to follow, but hopefully there will be applications that can take advantage of what Bluetooth has to offer."......."1XRTT or CDMA 2000 is the technology of choice for Verizon Wireless and Sprint PCS. Verizon has national coverage in over 800 cities, which is larger than Sprints entire national service offering, and there are more cities to come. The benefits of CDMA 2000 is in data speeds (40-60Kbps up to 144Kbps) and in voice capacity. If every customer replaced their current handset with a 1X capable handset, Verizon and Sprint would be able to double the number of customers on their respective networks without sacrificing voice quality or capacity. That is a big advantage. Additionally, CDMA 2000 device are backwards compatible to the older CDMA IS-95."

Am very curious which phones they tested(?). Maybe the checked the T608 out (and/or the discontinued Mot 270c phone with added BT module) because more CDMA/BT aren't available. Or they have tested GSM/GPRS/BT phones!?

source:
http://www.pocketpcpassion.com/forum...774#post174774

[DerekTheGeek]

I have to agree with the author of the article. For almost 1.5 years I have watched GSM providers offer Bluetooth implementations that actually work. While Verizon and Sprint target the "TeenAge & Rave crowd" with phones that can change color and download ringtones of the latest boy band, the rest of us are stuck. The only CDMA bluetooth phone was the Timeport 270c which has since been discontinued and does not support High speed data access. If GSM coverage were on par with CDMA and analog in my area I would switch in a hearbeat. But alas, it is not. So here is my solution.

1) Bought a Timeport 270c on eBay (used) - $65
2) Bought Motorola Bluetooth module for 270c - $60

End result = A great Tri-Mode phone with Bluetooth. I was able to connect to my wifes iPaq 2215 (yes the PPC 2003 just released) via Bluetooth without any problems. My Jabra BT200 can link with the 270c but not reliably. I have since purchased the Motorola Bluetooth headset and its seems to work fine. Sure I am limited to 14.4 kps data access but its far better than nothing. Keep in mind that the Bluetooth module for the 270c may not be Bluetooth v1.1 compatible when you buy it. You can send it to Motorola to have it flashed to the latest version for free. Also the 270c handset needs to be flashed to the latest firmware. I did this at my local Verizon store.

- Derek

[Janak Parekh]

Originally Posted by DerekTheGeek

The only CDMA bluetooth phone was the Timeport 270c which has since been discontinued and does not support High speed data access. If GSM coverage were on par with CDMA and analog in my area I would switch in a hearbeat. But alas, it is not. So here is my solution.

You know, I was this close to getting the 270c when it was still a current phone, but I was drooling over the T68 at the time. And now, I can't justify getting a 14.4 modem... GPRS is slow enough as it is. :cry:

There was/is a Sony Ericsson phone, the T61c, that theoretically can do both 1xRTT and Bluetooth (via optional back, similar to the 270c), but I've never heard of anyone who was successful in doing so.

--janak

[srs]

I am looking to get a new cellphone / service, and so far verizon seems to be the best for voice / data ($40, 500 anytime minutes, unlimited nights and weekends, and you can access the express network (144kbps data using your regular airtime minutes).

the downside seems to be the lack of good phones (bluetooth, camera, etc) so I will be stuck having to use a wire to connect my pda / laptop.

T-mobile seems to have really good phones / rebates but I am unsure of the coverage in my area, and also the speed of the internet acces (19 kbps ???)

edit: wow I have a t61c and didn't even realize bluetooth was a possibility

edit2: looks like it may or may not work as it is not listed as an accessory for the t61c: http://www.sonyericsson.com/us/spg.j...=PSM_V&gal=105

and the bluetooth adapter doesn't list it as compatible either: http://www.sonyericsson.com/us/spg.j...&LM=PSM_V&gal=

[Janak Parekh]

Originally Posted by srs

edit: wow I have a t61c and didn't even realize bluetooth was a possibility

Right -- this is the problem. There is a Bluetooth module that was developed for the T60c, and rumors have had it that it should be compatible with the T61c, but I've heard fairly unsuccessful reports at best.

--janak