I didn't read all of the posts, but since Thoughts has introduced me to Amazon, I haven't been tempted to download an mp3 from a p2p network, not even once.
I stopped downloading from P2P services when it became a pain. Mostly what I miss from P2P downloading were non-studio and non-released amateur recordings of stuff I had in all its form from the labels.
I NEVER bought DRM protected music. I've always felt that anything that required a DRM server made my purchase...more of a "rental at will". I've always thought of this as an evil RIAA scheme to keep reselling you the same music over and over as time passed.
Since WalMart and Amazon started selling non-DRM music I've bought about 100 songs. Mostly music I was introduced to through Pandora. I'd have bought more, but not every song I want is available on the non-DRM services.
(It's too bad that Pandora totally dissed us WM users and developed their first smartphone app for the iPhone...bastards)
Prior to that, the only thing I purchased were used CDs. I could rip my own and didn't have to worry about it ceasing to work.
It's hard for me to believe that anyone who buys DRMed music doesn't use one of many converters available to get it to regular MP3s or burn them to CDs as backup so they can be re-ripped. A pain to be sure, but it's always been the smart thing to do.
DRM is evil and has been from day one. It's been discredited and is a marketing negative, and eventually all DRM services will cease operating. What should happen, is that legit services should offer their users tools to convert all their DRMed music to non-DRM, including Microsoft and Apple, and the RIAA should bless such a movement. Rather than pinning their hopes on selling DRM buyers their music in non-DRMed form (the only reason such tools are not yet authorized).
I'd put my money on Microsoft embracing such a move before the far more fascist, customer-control and developer-control obsessed Apple.
It's hard for me to believe that anyone who buys DRMed music doesn't use one of many converters available to get it to regular MP3s or burn them to CDs as backup so they can be re-ripped. A pain to be sure, but it's always been the smart thing to do.
I think that for most people, it is either not known it can be done, if known, it isn't known where to get the software, or as you said, it is enough of a pain that it is beyond their skill set, which is what the RIAA is counting on.
Helio, my friend, I have to disagree. Burning files to a CD then re-ripping them results in an audio file that is inferior to the one that was burned in the first place. It's also a waste of a CD. What Wal-Mart should have done was offer people their music in DRM-free MP3 format - because they're shutting down their DRM server, they know all that music out there is going to stop working eventually, so by offering it in MP3 format they'd be giving customers what they thought they were buying in the first place: music that they can listen to for the rest of their lives (assuming they don't lose the files), just like what you get when you purchase a CD. But Wal-Mart didn't do that, they instead decided to screw their customers. So very typical. I can't blame anyone for seeking out DRM-free versions of their tracks on P2P networks - Wal-Mart isn't giving people a reasonable option.
OK, now I understand what you guys mean. The fact is that all these DRM music shops were never available to Israeli public (they didn't sell to us guys), so until Amazon began selling their DRM-free music I never bought digital music from websites, only bought CDs.
However, at least from what I have seen, the quality of the tracks you can get on a P2P network is usually a lot lower than what you get after burning and re-ripping.
Anyway, I have to agree that Wallmart should provide a better solution.
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Helio Diamant
Editor www.pocketpcfreak.com - The Hebrew Windows Mobile and Wireless Website
I think that for most people, it is either not known it can be done, if known, it isn't known where to get the software, or as you said, it is enough of a pain that it is beyond their skill set, which is what the RIAA is counting on.
Let's face it, more people need to be more cynical and less trusting.
And there is no reason for us to feel sorry for people who aren't resourceful enough to solve this conundrum on their own. They've got the Internet and Google, and that's all you need to learn just about anything.
They've got the Internet and Google, and that's all you need to learn just about anything.
Just to put it in perspective, some of these people, when you tell them to go to Google, they put "Google' in the preinstalled Yahoo Search bar on their browser to search for Google, then click on the link to get to Google. I see it happen every day.
I'll buy albums online when they are DRM-Free and at least 256 kbps AAC files.
EDIT: Ignore my previous rant about iTunes Plus not counting because it was seriously lacking in songs. I just took a look for the hell of it and within the last couple months they went from not one song I wanted to dozens of awesome Industrial, EBM, and Powernoise albums from small labels. I just bought like 6 albums. That's DRM-Free 256kbps AAC files! FTW!! I noticed though that the big labels are still being bitches about not supporting iTunes Plus, but then mainstream music tends to suck anyways. I bet quickly getting all these smaller labels onboard was in response to Amazons DRM-Free MP3 service.....
/But MP3 sucks!
//Painful bad sound quality.
///Why can't this ancient standard just die?
////Slashies!!!
Last edited by James Beatty; 09-29-2008 at 06:00 PM..
Wal Mart has always suggested that users strip DRM from the music after purchase by burning to CD.
This is actually their official support line. Twice I've had to call them up to reauthorize music and both times they told me this is the official word because as they said, "the servers won't be available forever".
Would you steal from your local supermarket only because it sells things more expensive than others? Or even because they refused to give you money back for bad fruit that you have only remembered to return one month after you bought it?
Thieves are thieves and they will stay thieves everywhere, all time, and for all reasons. There is no way to justify it.
This is the one analogy that has always bothered me whenever piracy is brought up. No matter how you feel on the issue, when you walk into a supermarket and steal something you are physically removing something from the store and therefore removing money from their pockets. This isn't the same as making a digital copy of something where the original stays there.
Morally wrong? Yes. On the same level as stealing physical products? No.
What this is really like is you buying an apple from the supermarket and every time you want to take a bite out of it you have to call the supermarket first and get permission. Then one day the supermarket decides to stop selling apples and comes over to your house and rips the apple out of your stomach, replacing it with a unusable rock, and goes on their merry way, leaving you hungry and unfulfilled and maybe even a little nauseous.
Only good honest people get hurt by DRM. DRM, especially on music, is a disease and as long as users continue to support DRM we will forever hear complaints of things from event like this. The easiest way to avoid this is to stop renting music you would rather own because that is all you're doing when you purchase DRM tracks.
What a bunch of BS. Compared to MSN Music, Wal-Mart is really giving people a screw-job...at least MSN Music is keeping their DRM servers online for a few more years (even before the public pressure it was two years I think). Wal-mart is pulling the plug on ther servers right away it seems...
Based on the date of the letter sent (9/26), they're not even giving the consumer two weeks. That's ridiculous.
Also, as others have said, why not give the users access to the DRM-free versions of music they purchased. If that's too insecure or to costly, just give the customers a credit for what they've purchased so they can buy DRM-free copies. (Yes, some people will probably abuse that by stripping the DRM from the existing tracks and using the credit to buy new tracks, but see the first sentence, then.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Dunn
And really, how much can it cost to keep a DRM server or two online for authentication?
If WalMart is paying somebody to run the DRM servers, probably more than you think.
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