Engadget Hands On With HTC Advantage x7510

[Nurhisham Hussein]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/02/16/hands-on-with-htcs-updated-advantage-x7510/' target='_blank'>http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/...dvantage-x7510/</a><br /><br /></div><i>"We peeked at the updated HTC Advantage X7510 at Mobile World Congress, there aren't wholesale changes here, HTC has chosen to simply revamp the keyboard and tidy up the face. The result is a somewhat tidier looking -- though still rather large -- device, with more memory -- now 16 GB of flash -- that still gets all of its previous jobs done."</i><br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/hisham-20080220-engadgetmobile_advantagemwcmain.jpg" /><br /><br />There's not much to this hands-on post, as Engadget have confined their comments to the new keyboard and the looks. On the other hand, they <i>have</i> got some nice photos of the new Advantage, including the first I've seen of the redesigned display window on the keyboard - the new design looks a lot more durable and useful. If you've been thinking about getting this beast, the pictures are worth a look-see.

[Menneisyys]

HTC has chosen to eschew traditional keys for a smooth touch-sensitive keyboard, and while we weren't huge fans of the first, we're afraid this isn't a whole pile better -- sure, it looks lovely, but feedback from the keys is about nil.

Absolutely agreed. While a lot of people (that, seemingly, either haven't ever touched a Universal or a Kaiser/Tilt or just write an ad called a "review") praise the new keyboard, my feelings were the same after testing the new keyboard on MWC. (I've also elaborated on this very issue at http://mobilitysite.com/2008/02/htcs-updated-advantage-x7510/ )

All in all, I'm not very happy with the new device.

BTW, some commentors over at Engadget asked for 3D drivers for the new Athena. It's pretty much useless to ask for drivers as, just like before, the new Athena is still PXA270-based (read: no Qualcomm MSM7200) and, therefore, have absolutely no 3D hardware acceleration.

[alese]

Talking about history repeating itself, in 1980/81 there was a device called Sinclair ZX80/ZX81 with 1Kb RAM that had pretty much exactly the same keyboard and was more or less the same size (without the screen of course).

As for Advantage, I still have mixed feelings about it, yes it's nice and it is an ultimate PDA, but it's still expensive and big for something to carry with you all the time and still very much underpowered is you want to use it as UMPC - mostly due to WM...

[Menneisyys]

Talking about history repeating itself, in 1980/81 there was a device called Sinclair ZX80/ZX81 with 1Kb RAM that had pretty much exactly the same keyboard

Yup; albeit the (membrane) keys on the ZX81 at least traversed a bit so thety did give some mechanical feedback (of course, in no way as much as a decent, non-membrane keyboard). The vibration-based "feedback" on the new Athena is just a joke.

[virain]

I see HTC put its SHIfT CrapVue on this device. Actually, it does make a lot of sense when you run full WM. It isn't that offensive, but useful.

[packetstorm]

Talking about history repeating itself, in 1980/81 there was a device called Sinclair ZX80/ZX81 with 1Kb RAM that had pretty much exactly the same keyboard and was more or less the same size (without the screen of course).

As for Advantage, I still have mixed feelings about it, yes it's nice and it is an ultimate PDA, but it's still expensive and big for something to carry with you all the time and still very much underpowered is you want to use it as UMPC - mostly due to WM...

Dude, I still have my Timex Sinclair ZX81 with the 16k memory upgrade...Talk about nostalgic!

=]

[danrhiggins]

I have been an HTC Advantage user for about 6 months. I love mine and use it heavily - but not much as a phone. For years I had been an iPaq 4700 user and am accustomed to the size of a PDA. I use this device for taking notes (Phatnotes), reviewing PPT presentations, spreadsheets and especially email. Lots of email both for the office, gmail and hotmail. But as a phone I only use it for a speaker phone or with a BT headset and that only for previously scheduled calls. I carry a small, light cell phone that is only a cell phone. I like WM6 as I hate trying to do full Windows on a UMPC. For me WM6 is much more appropriate for a device like this.

My only real disappointment with my HTC 7500 is that it is not VGA. Come on. A screen of that size on not VGA? But I have learned to live with it as I can adjust the fonts down on most of the apps I use. (PI, PB, IE, Pocket Bible, Spb Insight, Phatnotes, Lygea's calculators, WorldMate, etc.) I just can't get it to synch via USB anymore. Don't know why. But that is another story. And it may have to do with my 4 year old, corporate-issued Dell.

Now to the 7510. What are they thinking! They just made it far less useful as a PDA - and it is too big for being primarily a phone. I do not like this keyboard at all! And I don't like the fact that they removed the OK key and apparently the "joystick" button or whatever you all call it from the front of the device. I most frequently use this thing without the keyboard preferring to enter notes using Transcriber. And most of the time I am reviewing email, web pages, Spb Insight, etc. and I don't even have the keyboard attached. So for me this is a major step backwards. I am extremely disappointed. I guess I better take care of what I have. Or maybe in the future I'll need to see what, if anything, HP comes up with.

Sorry, HTC, but you just lost a future customer. And one that actually valued the form factor of this device.

[JamesM]

My only real disappointment with my HTC 7500 is that it is not VGA. Come on. A screen of that size on not VGA? But I have learned to live with it as I can adjust the fonts down on most of the apps I use. (PI, PB, IE, Pocket Bible, Spb Insight, Phatnotes, Lygea's calculators, WorldMate, etc.)

Umm, the Advantage does have a VGA screen. Check out this review and try RealVGA.

http://www.geardiary.com/2008/01/08/how-i-turned-the-htc-advantage-into-a-laptop-replacement/#more-5389

[virain]

I would buy it in a moment if I could hack it to use Skype video calling, not just a voice :twisted:

[Nurhisham Hussein]

My only real disappointment with my HTC 7500 is that it is not VGA.

As JamesM states, the 7500 does have a VGA screen - it's just that the implementation of 'VGA' in Windows Mobile is a little different than what we'd see on a PC. Essentially what MS has done is to double the DPI, so what you get is a screen with VGA-number of pixels, but with a 'QVGA' look. If you want 'true' VGA, it can be had, but at a price.


I do not like this keyboard at all! And I don't like the fact that they removed the OK key and apparently the "joystick" button or whatever you all call it from the front of the device.

On this, I absolutely agree - touch is no substitute with a form factor that big.

[Menneisyys]

I would buy it in a moment if I could hack it to use Skype video calling, not just a voice :twisted:

Unfortunately, it seems it's pretty much impossible. If you read thru my past MS Portrait reviews (also cross-posted here at the PPCT forums), you'll see Portrait can't access the front cameras either because HTC (and other manufacturers) simply don't publish the API to do this.

[Menneisyys]

My only real disappointment with my HTC 7500 is that it is not VGA.

Use OzVGA. See for example http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=415945

[virain]

If you read thru my past MS Portrait reviews (also cross-posted here at the PPCT forums), you'll see Portrait can't access the front cameras either because HTC (and other manufacturers) simply don't publish the API to do this.

That's my point, exactly! If one of manufacturers did this, it could be a good selling points. "Now you can make video calls using your favorite VOIP provider! Skype, Yahoo, or Live Messanger over Wi-Fi or 3g network!" :devilboy:

[Menneisyys]

If you read thru my past MS Portrait reviews (also cross-posted here at the PPCT forums), you'll see Portrait can't access the front cameras either because HTC (and other manufacturers) simply don't publish the API to do this.

That's my point, exactly! If one of manufacturers did this, it could be a good selling points. "Now you can make video calls using your favorite VOIP provider! Skype, Yahoo, or Live Messanger over Wi-Fi or 3g network!" :devilboy:

To put it mildly, it seems major WinMo manufacturers are not really listening to us...

[k_kirk]

HTC makes a lot of money through telco relationships. There must be a lot of pressure on companies like HTC to limit possibilities of telco revenue loss through things like Skype etc. I am not suprised APIs are not readily available.

[virain]

HTC makes a lot of money through telco relationships. There must be a lot of pressure on companies like HTC to limit possibilities of telco revenue loss through things like Skype etc. I am not suprised APIs are not readily available.
That is not an excuse! :evil: HTC customize its products for telecoms all the time, (Five faves for T-Mobile USA, removing CMOS camera from Tilt a.k.a Kaiser for AT&amp;T, etc.) So for unlocked, retail version they could come up with some kind of solution, otherwise you, the consumer, paying for something that is completely useless, and in fact you have no chance to prove that it actually works! Maybe it is just a peice of glass and that's it. :devilboy:

[k_kirk]

HTC makes a lot of money through telco relationships. There must be a lot of pressure on companies like HTC to limit possibilities of telco revenue loss through things like Skype etc. I am not suprised APIs are not readily available.
That is not an excuse! :evil: HTC customize its products for telecoms all the time, (Five faves for T-Mobile USA, removing CMOS camera from Tilt a.k.a Kaiser for AT&amp;T, etc.) So for unlocked, retail version they could come up with some kind of solution, otherwise you, the consumer, paying for something that is completely useless, and in fact you have no chance to prove that it actually works! Maybe it is just a peice of glass and that's it. :devilboy:
Trust me I feel your pain. I dont work for HTC so not trying to defend them or anything. The camera definitely works. I can use it to make video calls through telcos 3G network but here's the catch. Eventhough I am on a flatfee 3G data plan telco still charges me for the video call as if its not IP traffic on my connection... thats why thy dont like Skype.