Verizon To Be Fair With Early Termination? Verizon!?

[Janak Parekh]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060628/ap_on_hi_te/verizon_wireless_contracts' target='_blank'>http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060628...eless_contracts</a><br /><br /></div><i>"Targeting a top gripe by cell phone users and breaking ranks again with its industry, Verizon Wireless plans to prorate the fee it charges subscribers who break a contract so they only pay an amount proportional to the time left on their agreements. The change in the early termination fee will be implemented this fall for all new customers and any Verizon Wireless subscribers who sign a new contract...[the company] was [also] addressing another customer frustration by enabling existing subscribers to upgrade to a new handset at the same steep discounts being offered to lure new customers."</i><br /><br />8O Verizon, of all companies, is moving to improve the cellular phone contract situation in the United States. Verizon was first to support number portability, and the remaining carriers caved in soon after; I hope this is the beginning of contract fairness for all carriers as well. It's a bigger issue for power users like us who are more likely to switch contracts. Those of you interested, though, take note: this is going to take effect sometime in the fall, and presumably not for contracts starting now. :?

[Brad Adrian]

As Artie Johnson (look it up) used to say:

"Veeerrry innnnnnterestink!"

This seems to be great news. I can't help but wonder what the economic incentive for this is. Just good PR? An attempt to force the other players to do likewise and get the good early PR AND the benefit of a playing field that will ultimately level itself on this issue?

[Jacob]

This seems to be great news. I can't help but wonder what the economic incentive for this is. Just good PR? An attempt to force the other players to do likewise and get the good early PR AND the benefit of a playing field that will ultimately level itself on this issue?

If I remember correctly from when I last shopped for phones/plans, Verizon gives you less minutes per dollar and their primary selling point has been their network being the best. For example, Verizon offers 450 mins for $40, while T-mobile offers 600.

Now that other companies have likely caught up at least a bit when it comes to network, they need to keep people with them somehow.

Also the allowing new phone upgrades at lower cost is a huge incentive to stay with a company.

[Don't Panic!]

I think the economic incentive at least here in Massachusetts is that they can now charge Higher late fees for late bill payment. This pro-rating announcement came shortly after I heard about the late fee hike (http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2006/06/27/1696915.htm).

[don dre]

it may also be a "our network is better than yours" statement. I am a cingular user and have been pretty happy with their service in my home state (a former ATT stronghold). However, I now commute via train to DC from Philly. The Cingular service is flat out lousy while Verizon is solid just about the whoel way through. That doesn't even mention the fact that I get about 70% Broadband access coverage on the route (100% between Philly and NYC). Not only does cingular not offer this coverage along this route outside DC/Balt but even there it seems to have trouble handing off the signal at the train speeds. They do have more expensive plans, but I rarely use all my minutes anyways. T-mobile is terrible is you don't live in a major city, it seems...although when I was with T-mobile I have to say they did make noticable strides. My beef with verizon is that I can't use, say, the i730 as a modem and a phone. does anyone know vz's churn rate vs the competition?

[Janak Parekh]

Now that other companies have likely caught up at least a bit when it comes to network, they need to keep people with them somehow.
I believe statistics have shown that Verizon has the least turnover rate of all the wireless companies, largely due to coverage. This would also explain why they're the first to prorate ETF fees -- they're not worried about the lost income.

--janak

[Janak Parekh]

does anyone know vz's churn rate vs the competition?
I googled for a bit; it seems like it's 1.18% (http://www.kensei-news.com/bizdev/publish/business/wireless/article_45671.shtml). The next carrier is around 1.9%, a significant difference.

[PPCMD]

Now that they covered the ETF issue they should focus on one of their customers biggest complaints - crippling their phones. Stop messing with BT profiles, poorly implemented Verizon UI and leave the phones as designed by the mfg's. All wireless providers rip us off its just a case of who rips you off less.

[Don't Panic!]

My beef with verizon is that I can't use, say, the i730 as a modem and a phone. does anyone know vz's churn rate vs the competition?On the i730 with WM2003SE OS dial **7284 to bring up modem options. You'll need Verizon's dial up software to make it work with your laptop. Basically you turn on the modem, dial in on your laptop then launch the browser. Our friends at pdaphonehome turned me on to these features. Check in the i730 FAQ list there for more details and links.

HTH

[Kamokazi]

Stuck with Verizon because I live in a small town, and they are the only ones who cover it 100% So I can't contribute to their 1.18 even if I wanted.

[Underwater Mike]

It's not just you: Cingular coverage in the DC metro has TONS of holes. It's getting really frustrating -- and I just signed a 2-yr renewal to get an affordable 8125. (The ONLY reason I didn't jump to VZW is beause of the phone-crippling problem.)


it may also be a "our network is better than yours" statement. I am a cingular user and have been pretty happy with their service in my home state (a former ATT stronghold). However, I now commute via train to DC from Philly. The Cingular service is flat out lousy while Verizon is solid just about the whoel way through. That doesn't even mention the fact that I get about 70% Broadband access coverage on the route (100% between Philly and NYC). Not only does cingular not offer this coverage along this route outside DC/Balt but even there it seems to have trouble handing off the signal at the train speeds. They do have more expensive plans, but I rarely use all my minutes anyways. T-mobile is terrible is you don't live in a major city, it seems...although when I was with T-mobile I have to say they did make noticable strides. My beef with verizon is that I can't use, say, the i730 as a modem and a phone. does anyone know vz's churn rate vs the competition?

[Janak Parekh]

It's not just you: Cingular coverage in the DC metro has TONS of holes. It's getting really frustrating -- and I just signed a 2-yr renewal to get an affordable 8125. (The ONLY reason I didn't jump to VZW is beause of the phone-crippling problem.)
The question is which aspect is more important. I'm not a huge fan of Verizon's Bluetooth crippling, but having suffered with T-Mobile which only worked in two spots in my house, give me crippling any day over an unusable phone. :|

--janak

[Jacob]

The question is which aspect is more important. I'm not a huge fan of Verizon's Bluetooth crippling, but having suffered with T-Mobile which only worked in two spots in my house, give me crippling any day over an unusable phone. :|

--janak

Do you know if this is still happening? I spoke to someone at Verizon about that when I was considering leaving them because of the phone crippling thing and they said that they didn't expect the new RAZR for Vz to have its bluetooth crippled.

I agree that the ability to use a phone as a phone is quite a bit more critical than whether bluetooth is crippled or not.

[Janak Parekh]

Do you know if this is still happening? I spoke to someone at Verizon about that when I was considering leaving them because of the phone crippling thing and they said that they didn't expect the new RAZR for Vz to have its bluetooth crippled.
I don't know about the V3m. I do know that Verizon has started offering EVDO tethering support over some phones, including a number of non-smartphones and the 700p, but they do not yet for any Pocket PC phone. :? Also, some phones only support cabled tethering, not Bluetooth. PdaNet supports both cabled and Bluetooth tethering on the 700w, but I haven't gotten it working reliably over BT yet, plus it's against Verizon's Terms of Service (TOS). Rumors have suggested that 700w tethering will be offered "some time soon", but nothing has panned out yet.

Update: You can check out Verizon's Bluetooth charts. Here's the one for regular phones (http://dts.vzw.com/pdf/BT_Chart_Handsets.pdf), and here's the one for PDA phones (http://dts.vzw.com/pdf/BT_Chart_PDAs.pdf). Looks like the V3c did support BT DUN, so the V3m might too, although the chart hasn't been updated to list it yet.

I agree that the ability to use a phone as a phone is quite a bit more critical than whether bluetooth is crippled or not.
And, of course, Verizon knows this. If you talk to them about their pricing, this is the first thing their sales reps will say. "But your Verizon phone will actually work." (Of course, there are areas where other carriers do better than Verizon, but not so much in the NY metro area.)

--janak

[coaldat6]

IF IT IS TRUE...

Fact is, I'll believe it when i see it. This is kind of a first for Verizon. Also, for those of us who got a new phone (and contract) this year, it'll be close to two years before we get a new contract that supports these changes...

Now if only they would be up front about all those "service fees and regulatory surcharges"...

[myrampar]

I don't know about the V3m. I do know that Verizon has started offering EVDO tethering support over some phones, including a number of non-smartphones and the 700p, but they do not yet for any Pocket PC phone. Also, some phones only support cabled tethering, not Bluetooth. PdaNet supports both cabled and Bluetooth tethering on the 700w, but I haven't gotten it working reliably over BT yet, plus it's against Verizon's Terms of Service (TOS). Rumors have suggested that 700w tethering will be offered "some time soon", but nothing has panned out yet.

I just spoke with a CSR at Verizon and he told me that I would be able to use my Verizon XV6700 as the modem for my laptop via either usb or bluetooth. So are you saying this is incorrect? In looking at the PDA phone Bluetooth chart, it shows that Bluetooth DUN for 1xRTT and EVDO is supported but the footnotes say that "maximum download speeds will be limited to 460kbps."

I don't have EVDO here in town yet but I do have 1xRTT coverage and have successfully tethered my phone to my laptop with both Bluetooth and usb. I just signed up for the PDA/Smartphone Unlimited plan because I will be in Seattle next week and wanted to "preview" the EVDO service.

In response to Verizon's change dealing with the ETF, I think it's great. I'm fairly certain that the other carriers will follow. I can say that I've really had nothing but positive experiences dealing with Verizon in the last 6 years I've been with them and they probably do have the best network overall. Now if we could just get them to reduce the rates for their data plans. :wink:

[Janak Parekh]

I just spoke with a CSR at Verizon and he told me that I would be able to use my Verizon XV6700 as the modem for my laptop via either usb or bluetooth.
He is incorrect, as are you. If you look at that chart carefully, the XV6600 supports tethering; the 6700 does not officially support any tethering at all. People have gotten it to work, though.

I just signed up for the PDA/Smartphone Unlimited plan because I will be in Seattle next week and wanted to "preview" the EVDO service.
From what I've heard, tethering on supported phones requires an add-on that costs $15 above-and-beyond the regular Smartphone EVDO plan. If you don't have that, and use EVDO excessively, your account could be flagged by Verizon. (This is based on reading HowardForums and pdaPhoneHome.)

Now if we could just get them to reduce the rates for their data plans. :wink:
I don't think it'll happen soon. I think Verizon uses the pricing as a way to prevent their network from being overloaded, amongst other things. I'd like it cheaper, too. :)

--janak

[myrampar]

Janak-

You're right. I think it's funny that I'm a stickler for looking at the fine print but totally overlooked the obvious in regards to the XV6700 at the top of the chart. :roll:

I haven't used it much yet with my laptop but thanks for pointing that out. I will have to call them back and double-check on the $15 add-on as I don't want to be hit with a large data charge.

BTW- How would they know you were tethering to your laptop or desktop? Would they go off of the amount of data or maybe the browser version being used?

[Janak Parekh]

I haven't used it much yet with my laptop but thanks for pointing that out. I will have to call them back and double-check on the $15 add-on as I don't want to be hit with a large data charge.
Apparently, they won't give it to you unless you have a tetherable phone. :roll:

BTW- How would they know you were tethering to your laptop or desktop? Would they go off of the amount of data or maybe the browser version being used?
From what I've heard, data usage. I've heard differing reports as to what the threshold is. If you do the occasional email check, I'd guess you wouldn't be flagged. As my previous post implied, you might want to surf some other forums for further discussion on this topic.

--janak