Sony PSP vs Nintendo DS

[Fishie]

I think that in the non-phone market, Palm is damned if they do and damned if they don't.

As a videogamejournalist and gadget freak I fail to see how the PSP is competition for WinCE

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[Felix Torres]

]
As a videogamejournalist and gadget freak I fail to see how the PSP is competition for WinCE

Keep an eye on it, you'll see why.

Sony is doing an SDK for it and the hackers are all over it, doing interesting things like (crude) ebook readers, browsers, media players.

With a full SDK to work with and the UMD now a standard there are...possibilities...

CE competes in many areas and the PSP is going to, ahem, play in many of them.
Its a dark horse right now, but looking at the 07-08 timeframe I was quoting, the PSP-platform (not necessarily the existing product) is going to be a contender simply because with PalmOS imploding there is going to be a vaccum.
There will be room for a new platform out there and Sony, unintentionally and all, is in the right spot at the right time.
A few months ago I might've put an evolved pod in that position but the PSP got there first and has momentum...
<shrug>
Think of it as a gut feeling; PSP is going to be bigger than games and media...

[Fishie]

Think of it as a gut feeling; PSP is going to be bigger than games and media...

No its NOT.
Its failing horribly, from the sales which are much lower then Sony´s projections to the asswhipping its receiving from the Nintendo DS to the UMD movie sales figures that are fabricated by Sony to the crap quality of the screen to Sony themselves who are doing everything they can to stop homebrew(newer games require firmware to be updated, Sony for the next wave of games is planning to write code on the games that make the firmware update as you insert the game to stop people from messig with PSP´s ).

The PSP is a storm in a glass of water, in Japan its sales are consistently lower then those of the DS becouse the novelty has worn off by now and the games dont offer enough to keep people compelled about the product.

Its got a big LOW RES screen with ghosting problems, memory stick media is crippled and the games are light versions of better console software at prices that are too high.

At this point the LONG TERM prospects of the PSP platform(fture iterations) is in question.

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[guinness]

At this point the LONG TERM prospects of the PSP platform(fture iterations) is in question.

Depends on what you compare a PSP to, a DS or a PDA. If comparing it to the DS, I wouldn't say that it's low res at all, 480x272, compared to 2 screens that are 256x192. Compared to a VGA PDA, the PSP is relatively low res, but for a gameing handheld, it is not. Besides, it took the DS a long time to catch on, when it first launched, it only had a handful of games for it, the only thing that keep it going is that it's backwards-compatible with the GBA.

Playing homebrew emulators on the PSP seems like a waste, since it isn't all that fast, and that I can already do that with my X5.

The Memory Stick Duo is a pain, like xD cards, since they're not as much of a standard, and therefore more expensive. UMD seems like a dead fornat, unless Sony opens it up more, like they did with the Minidiscs.

Can't complain about the screen too much, hardly any ghosting, and no dead pixels.

The biggest positive of the PSP is potential that Sony hasn't even touched yet, it can be upgraded, therefore, many more features should get added to it. Also, it gives competition to Nintendo in the market, how many times can they release the same rehashed GB? Knocks against it are that there really aren't any great games for it right now (love Wipeout Pure though), and the price is relatively high for a portable.

Like the DS, the PSP is a dumb purchase if there aren't any games for it you like.

Once the PSP gets a killer game or 2, all of the problems will get glossed over, I got my PS in 1995, but it wasn't really until 1997 and the release of Final Fantasy 7, that the system took off.

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[bjornkeizers]

No its NOT.
Its failing horribly, from the sales which are much lower then Sony´s projections

In all fairness though, the PSP isn't available everywhere at the moment. It'll be released here in Europe on September 1st - and I'll be first in line to pick up a unit, and most of my gaming friends here with me. You can't compare the figures at the moment, since the DS has a huge head start. Also, the European release has been delayed for months now, so it's only logical that the sales are lower then projected before this happened..

I agree with you on the lack of games though.. not a lot available. I'm waiting for Gran Turismo and the new GTA, and I hope one or both will be available on release (I haven't folllowed the release list)

[Fishie]

I agree with you on the lack of games though.. not a lot available. I'm waiting for Gran Turismo and the new GTA, and I hope one or both will be available on release (I haven't folllowed the release list)

At E3 2004 Sony assured us they would launch worldwide in November 2004, now its launching 10 months later in Europe.
Thats not Nintendo´s problem, its Sony´s.
In Japan too the PSP outsold the DS for a couple of months when it launched, now however week on week the DS is outselling the PSP.
Same thing we will see in the coming months in the US, the DS will hold its sales while the PSP will fall behind until there is a price drop/more compelling games.
A price drop is hard becouse the machine costs a lot to make, and for the games nearly every journalist at E3 had the same comment: Where are the PSP games.

The PSP is intended to be like a miniature PS2, this has the added side effect that to make a high profile release that looks good and plays well a company has to spend several million dollars in making and marketing a game.
On the DS a game can be made for a fraction of that cost and marketed to a bigger installed base.
Sony is seriously fumbling with the PSP.

Another problem Sony has never faced and which Sega and Nintendo have experience with is resource dilution becouse they have to support several formats at the same time.
Sega did a crappy job of that in the 90s when they were trying to simultanously support the Gamegear, Megadrive/Genesis, Mega/SegaCD, 32X and were preparing to launch the saturn.
They foolishly dropped their most profiteable products too early becouse of that(Megadrive/Genesis and Game Gear).
EA did the same and felt it heavily in their bottom line at the start of the current generation, they were hurting becouse they refused to support the Dreamcast and once the PS2 released they dropped support for the PS1 too fast.
Now Sony is making the same mistake, they are entering a new faze with the PS3, still have to fully support the PS2 and the PSP seems to be faling behind becouse of that.
Sony was counting on third parties and the third parties for now on PSP are not delivering.

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[Fishie]

OH BTW, In Japan the DS and PSP launched only a couple of weeks apart(DS released in Japan AFTER the US), not only did the DS have a bigger launch then the PSP, after having lower sales the first few months of the year the DS hasbeen consistently outselling the PSP and its lead in Japan is now well over a million units.

[bjornkeizers]

At E3 2004 Sony assured us they would launch worldwide in November 2004, now its launching 10 months later in Europe.
Thats not Nintendo´s problem, its Sony´s.


Chill dude. You seem to be taking this very seriously. I'm very Angry at Sony and rightfully so because of this. If I was to go to the US or Japan, I could buy a PSP in every store. Obviously, they're not sold out - so if they have stocks over there, why the **** can't they ship some of those damn things over here. :roll: I have money! Please take it! :roll:

Sony definitely needs to learn a lesson from the way Nintendo handled the DS release. Very smooth, two, three good games, available everywhere... Sure, the DS doesn't really have many high-profile titles and a bunch of crap ones (I doubt Tiger Woods golf, Pokemon Dash or Atari Classics sell units!) - but at least they have old Gameboy games to entertain themselves.

Many gamers are holding on to their money for now, because there aren't any games. But that *will* change when the high-profile games become available. Stuff like Gran Turismo or Grand Theft Auto will sell units.

[Fishie]

Many gamers are holding on to their money for now, because there aren't any games. But that *will* change when the high-profile games become available. Stuff like Gran Turismo or Grand Theft Auto will sell units.

Of course I am taking this seriously, this is my livelihood and I am passionate about the games industry.
That being said before the releases of the respective machines many people were saying the DS was stillborn, that the PSP would be Sony´s kiuller blow to Nintendo, that Nintendo had no way they could compete, that game werent that important and that the PSP would sell on its gadget factor alone, the movies, MP3s(people were saying it competed with the Ipod instead of Nintendo), now a lot of those people are saying wait a bit itl happen yet.
Yeah it will get some high profile games along the way, but dont forget, so is Nintendo and a darn lot more at that since its a lot cheaper to develop for(a high profile DS game can be developed for well under 500K, for PSP the figure is between 2 and 3 million).

People are now saying, just wait, itll come.
That is shortsighted since the competition is moving along as well the games cost as much as their console counterparts yet offer less for the money, with DS you have mostly DIFFERENT games and games that are cheaper at that and better designed for portable play.

In short the strengths on which the PSP was supposed to sell arent strengths at all and with regards to games it is not fullfilling its promises.

Its a sexy looking gadget yes but at the moment it is little more, the 50$/50€ games do not convince and the other capabilities are severely crippled.

Sony has the gadget freaks and hardcore buy everything thats released gamers on their side, they however cant convince the mass market outside of those people who get convinced by the aforementioned groups doing Sony´s bidding on their side.

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[guinness]

Sony has the gadget freaks and hardcore buy everything thats released gamers on their side, they however cant convince the mass market outside of those people who get convinced by the aforementioned groups doing Sony´s bidding on their side.

You're glossing over the fact that the DS is backwards compatible with the GBA. At the US launch, the DS only had 6 games, one of which was a straight port of Mario 64, with a few extra levels added on. But people could get a DS over the GBA, knowing that there was added potential with the DS. Sony had 24 games at launch, but most were sports-related, and only 3 stood out: Wipeout, Lumines, and Ridge Racer.

The DS took off in Japan because games like Kirby and Nintendogs, not sure how well Nintendogs would go over here, since Japanese and US tastes are different. Soon they'll release another version of Mario Kart for the DS.

The only thing that will keep the PSP from being successful is Sony. I can't see them dropping the Clie line, and not adding some those features to the PSP at least, that would be very disappointing to me. The Clie's were the only real competition that MS really had in the PDA market, even if the Clie were handicapped by the POS.

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[Fishie]

Sony promised 24 titles, it launched with 16, the rest was delayed for a week or more.
And I am not glossing over it, its one of the strengths of the DS and its one Sony glossed over with their We will take handheld gaming out of the ghetto and The DS is below us we are not competing with Nintendo crap.
In short the backward compatibility of the DS is a strength of Nintendo and one which Sony neglected to take into account.

Funny you should mention Nintendogs.
Nintendogs will take of in the west as well.
Let me tell you the story of a little FAD called Pokemon, a series that has sold more and continues to sell more in each iteration then the GTA games.
Back in the early 90s a company called Gamefreak who had good contacts with Nintendo and Sega decided to make a game based on two Japanese traditions.
those traditions were beetle fights and collecting little vending machine toys.
Since a company in the US had a game called monster in my pocket they decided to call their concept Capsule monsters.
The game concept was offered to Sega(for the Game Gear) and Nintendo(for the old black and white Gameboy).
Both companies declined it 3 times
Gamefreak everytime they brought the concept forward lowered their royalty demands and tried to sweeten the deal since they really wanted to make the game.
Sega as well as Nintedo kept saying no.
The fourth time the concept was offered sometime in 94 years after the first concepts were shown Nintendo finally said OK we will do it but only if you guys partner with a third company for the designs of the creatures(a new company called monsters inc was created) and the three companies jointly foot the bill since we have no faith in the concept.
Thus it happened with a budget of under 300k split tree ways Gamefreak started working on Capsule monsters, Nintendo from its side made sure that they could trademark the name Pokemon.
The game much to Nintendo´s surprise became a sleeper monsterhit so AFTER its initial succes they decided to start the cartoon etcetera and offered it to Nintendo America, meanwhile Nintendo Japan was kicking themselves becouse at one point Gamefreak had offered to do the entire project themselves with full rights going to Nintendo for 200k,
Nintendo America had no faith in the title, US gamesjournalists were saying it was a fad and that those silly Japanese would buy anything.
In the end NoA decided to take the title and release it on condition that NoJ would liscence the cartoon to US TV to help awarenes of the game.
Right before that happened NoJ representatives also showed the title to Nintendo europe.
They had no faith in the title either, coming from bad experiences with localising and translating RPGs for PAL markets and losing lots of money in the process NoE could be excused for having no faith in the title.
After all they had invested in localising RPGs heavily to disastrous results and here was NoJ saying we have this runaway hit here but its designed for kids and we refuse to localise it, you can take it in english or not have it at all.
The target audience for the game was kids and here was a game that Nintendo had no intention of translating to Dutch, German, spanish, Italian or whatever so off course NoE had no intrest in it.
It launched in the US and became a big hit there as well despite the NoA reservations, in the end NoE had to cave in and release the game too over 3 years after it first appeared in Japan and 8 years after Gamefreak had tried to sell the concept to Sega and Nintendo.
Bottomline is, I keep hearing the same people say the same things about Nintendogs as were said about pokemon so I have no doubt that the game(if it can even be called a game in the traditional sense) will do really really well in the west.

As for Sony, you have far too much faith in their abilities.

[Craig Horlacher]

It's much better for gaming than any other handheld device. That's a fact. If you don't think so you havn't played it. If you don't like the games that are out for it then that's another issue.

To the person knocking it's screen resolution...I found that rather odd. If you do the math it's one screen has 30,000 more pixels than both screens on the ds put together. Technically, the ds is a joke compared to the psp. The psp has a much faster processors and a much more advanced graphics subsystem...look at Ridge Racer for each system. You'll laugh at the way it looks on the ds after seeing it on the psp. The only bad thing about the screen is that it's not transreflective so it washes out in the sun. It makes up for that with it's excellent qualtiy and brightness in other contidions though - not to mention viewing angle.

Does the ds have a place? Absolutly! If you like mario and pokiman or whatever else there is for nintendo systems then I guess it's your best option. For me, it's the PSP all the way. IMHO the graphics, sound, screen, physical design, and features are much better. I'll take a video player, music player, and photo viewer as extras over an underutilized touch screen and a mic any day.

I'll also add that I still think the Pocket PC is best for some things. RTS games like Argentum would be hard to do without a touch screen and the resolution on the ds screens is too low for it to work well. Also, any game with lots of text input - where where dpad and button control are not so important - I think is best on the pocket PC. Card games also, I'll never buy one of those for a handheld as long as I can play them on my pocket pc.

[Fishie]

It's much better for gaming than any other handheld device. That's a fact. If you don't think so you havn't played it. If you don't like the games that are out for it then that's another issue.
I'll also add that I still think the Pocket PC is best for some things. RTS games like Argentum would be hard to do without a touch screen and the resolution on the ds screens is too low for it to work well. Also, any game with lots of text input - where where dpad and button control are not so important - I think is best on the pocket PC. Card games also, I'll never buy one of those for a handheld as long as I can play them on my pocket pc.

It was not my intention to turn this into a DS versus PSP(just check my first post, it coinsisted of me saying that I failed to see how the PSP was competition for WindowsCE) thing but hey thats where we seem to be at right now.

That being said, Vector I disagree profoundly.
It might have the best graphics of any handheld videogameconsole for now but it definitly is not better for gaming then other handheld devices.
What is the best is entirely subjective and history has shown us that in the end graphics might be important yes but they dont make the system.
The black and white gameboy was uncontested king of the hill despite the availability of far more powerfull handhelds back in its day.
The GameGear outsold it for 18 months and then fell way back while the Lynx never even made a dent in its sales.

Its downright insulting of you to say that I must not have played it becouse if I would have I would agree with you.
As mentioned before I am a videogame journalist, I see, test and play these things long before they are released.

With regards to technical specs like resolution etcetera.
Yes the DS technically might be a joke compared to the PSP and yes the resolution on both its screens combined is lower then the resolution on the PSP etcetera.
But guess what, that doesnt matter much since Nintendo never set out to make ONE HANDHELD TO RULE THEM ALL.
Nintendo made a sturdy handheld that plays games and introduces new playstyles and possibilities at low prices.
Sony on the other hand made something they claimed would be a multimedia machine witouth peers that would TAKE HANDHELD GAMING OUT OF THE GHETTO(Sony´s words, not mine).
As such Sony failed horribly.
For the average mass market consumer the added functions of the PSP are too hard to work with(similar to palmOS the PSP can only see stuff on the Memory Stick if it is on certain paths, compatibility with media files is horrible etcetera) so they end up with a light version of a PS2 that plays woirse versions of the games they already own at the same price, and it becomes a movie player that plays movies of lower quality then the DVDs they already own at a higher price.

Memory Stick media is artificially crippled(only QVGA video and only a few formats at that, no high bitrate MP3s, Sony´s own Atrac3 format tht wont play on bigger capacity MS Duo cards etcetera).
The screen sucks for what Sony set out to achieve(no matter which way you turn it, there is ghosting and a res lower then half VGA on a screen that size is not impresive for a media oriented machine).
These arent problems for Nintendo since Nintendo made a machine that plays games and thats about it.

Downplaying the DS as something for Mario and Pokemon lovers is incredibly short sighted as well.
Not only becouse Pokemon is the biggest franchise in the history of videogames but becouse you automatically disregard hundreds of other games, some of which will have no peers on the PSP or even home consoles.
Games like Fire Emblem, Castlevania Dawn of Sorrow, Advance Wars DS, Meteos, Nintendogs, Feel the magic etcetera etcetera, games that actually push gameplay and playability forward instead of offering a wattered down home console experience.

Oh BTW one of the most populr DS applications at E3 was its VoIP software.

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[guinness]

It's much better for gaming than any other handheld device. That's a fact. If you don't think so you havn't played it. If you don't like the games that are out for it then that's another issue.

It's about the games and marketing.

I have an Atari Lynx II, replaced the Lynx I that I got as a kid in 1989. First portable with a color screen, ran at 4 MHZ, did hardware scaling, roatation, the Lynx II even had stereo sound. Other than the anemic screen resolution, it mopped the floor with the Gameboy, technically. Problem was that Nintendo had a game called Tetris, whereas Atari had Klax (if you've ever played that version, it's just as addictive as Tetris). Unfortunately, Atari could never get the developers Nintendo had (I believe that Nintendo made everone develop exclusively for them), and Atari sucked at marketing.

Some of the games for the Lynx were really good, but many were just so-so. The Lynx was also about twice as much as the GB, but having a color screen made all the difference for me. The Game Gear had a lot of the problems that the Lynx did. Will the same happen to the PSP? I doubt it, Sony has too much money and marketing experience to let it die slowly, IMO. The PSP isn't a niche product like the Aibo or PSX.

Even with the lack of dozens of top-notch games, there are features that Sony should add to the PSP to make it more appealing. Some PDA functions, a simple web browser, better audio/video players, finally release that keyboard for it, media reader adapters, etc that could tide people over, until a more varied game library builds up.

And ideally, Sony should fully embrace homebrew programmers. Not piracy (although, it will always happen), but release an open source, watered down SDK that will let people design apps for the PSP, make it more of a handheld PC.

But that's just me.

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[Fishie]

Sony should embrace?
For what, the minority of gadget slaves like us?

[Typhoon]

Isn't a Palm OS update in the works for Nintendo DS? I accidently stumbled onto the DS at Circuit City, and I was totally blown away...it is such a cool device! It is small (despite the measurements of it's size). The graphics looked great as well. After hearing about the features of DS and PSP here and there, I started to like the DS more and more. If the DS can become a game console and a PDA, I think that the DS would have a great edge over the PSP. I'm not saying that his edge will make the DS outsell the PSP...but it should keep the good sales of the DS strong. Has anyone heard of the Palm development? Plus, I tried searching for news on the DS Linux development but I can't find any screenshots of any X Window system or GUIs. Anyone know where I can find them? Actually...the only thing positive I can really see about the PSP is that it has much better graphics...but I won't say much more...you know? Because I haven't seen it in person.

And what is your opinion? Do you think that the DS's bottom touchscreen LCD could be a usable keyboard? I've never tried it before.

[Fishie]

Urm, the DS IS outselling the PSP and will continue to do so for at least the next 12 months.
Sony has lowered their forecast and parts orders for the coming year from 16 to 12 million units(this includes the upcoming launch in Europe, before someone jumps on me and says but the PSP has not launchd in PAL countries yet) while Nintendo upped their estimates to 18 million units.

[Fishie]

As for PalmOS, dont count on it.
Not enough control for Nintendo in what the OS allows people to do.

[Typhoon]

As for PalmOS, dont count on it.
Not enough control for Nintendo in what the OS allows people to do.

Not enough control? What do you mean by that? I think it would be a great idea to be able to see a Windows CE update for the DS? It would become an utlimate communications entertainer and gaming device all together.

[Fishie]

Not enough control? What do you mean by that? I think it would be a great idea to be able to see a Windows CE update for the DS? It would become an utlimate communications entertainer and gaming device all together.

What i mean is that an OS like PalmOS or WinCE would allow customers as well as software publishers to make software or do things with the DS which for Nintendo would be counterproductive.

Who would buy Zookeeper for 30$ when they can get Bejeweld for 10$?
Why would a software publisher pay Nintendo a royalty on every game sold and pay Nintendo for manufacturing cartridges if they can target the machine freely trough PalmOS?

Same reason why Sony has crippled the PSP and is doing their darned best with all the mandatory(in order to play the newest games) firmware updates.

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[Typhoon]

What i mean is that an OS like PalmOS or WinCE would allow customers as well as software publishers to make software or do things with the DS which for Nintendo would be counterproductive.

Ohhh I see. Good point. Does the DS have software? And what kind of software? Will they release more software, etc.? Like as if the DS had a Nintendo OS?

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[Fishie]

It has an aplication called pictochat built in that allows you to chat wirelesly with nearby owners(the ap will prolly be useable over wifi as well once the DS goes online), you can chat on it and draw stuff etcetera.
As mentioned before they had a great VoIP area for the DS set up at E3 and a lot of companies are integrating its comunications functions into actual videogames.
In that regard the DS can do things the PSP will never be able to do(easy data input, voice recognition, the touchscreen and all of em combineable with eachother and the wireless functions).

Its one of the reasons despite my love of cool gadgets that I actually prefer the DS over the PSP.
The PSP just gives us more of what we already have while from a gameplay standpoint the DS offers so much more.

[guinness]

It has an aplication called pictochat built in that allows you to chat wirelesly with nearby owners(the ap will prolly be useable over wifi as well once the DS goes online), you can chat on it and draw stuff etcetera.
As mentioned before they had a great VoIP area for the DS set up at E3 and a lot of companies are integrating its comunications functions into actual videogames.
In that regard the DS can do things the PSP will never be able to do(easy data input, voice recognition, the touchscreen and all of em combineable with eachother and the wireless functions).

Its one of the reasons despite my love of cool gadgets that I actually prefer the DS over the PSP.
The PSP just gives us more of what we already have while from a gameplay standpoint the DS offers so much more.

I can see that (the various input methods), although it wouldn't be difficult for Sony to release a keyboard, headset, or camera for the PSP. If you look at the back of the PSP, the headphone icon already shows it as a headset, not to mention why do you think Sony put the extra I/O connection there? Probably not until SOCOM comes out, will Sony bother to release the headset though.

On the other hand, other than jotting down quick notes on my X5's touch screen, I absolutely hate writng on it for any length of time, the screen is just too small, IMO. Rather have a smaller tablet PC, half way between a laptop and PDA, but that's a whole other topic.

One thing I really hate about the PSP is that goofy analog nub, what an akward position for it. :evil:

[Fishie]

One thing I really hate about the PSP is that goofy analog nub, what an akward position for it. :evil:

The combination of gamestyles the DS allows will NEVER happen on PSP.
Feel the Magic has games where you physically have to blow out candles in the game, one where you have to shout at the game etcetera.
The gameplay in Meteos(same guy who did Lumines for PSP) is fresh and entirely touchscreen based, in Nintendogs you use to touch screen to attract attention of the dogs and play with them, in Castlevania you use the touchscreen to capture the undead creatures inside the magic seal you have to draw.
Every single game can use and many do use these capabilities in a machine that costs under 150$.

Now compare those capabilities from a pure gameplay stand of point with what the PSP offers and you will no doubt see that the DS despite being a technological dinosour that is a full generation behind on PSP does have the most to offer.

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[Typhoon]

Now compare those capabilities from a pure gameplay stand of point with what the PSP offers and you will no doubt see that the DS despite being a technological dinosour that is a full generation behind on PSP does have the most to offer.

Blowing out candles? Sounds like a capability that brings in more of the player to the game. Sounds like a cool usable feature for a 3rd person game.

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[Craig Horlacher]

I didn't mean to offend you Fishie.

Let me explain my point of view a little more. I feel that I'm right that the psp is better gaming hardware period. To me, touch screens don't belong on gaming devices and analog nubs do:) My opionon there, yeah. Really, what matters, as I think you would agree, is the games that come out. I'm very happy with the current psp lineup and the 9 games I have bought for the psp. On the other hand, if someone is into games like mario, zelda, metroid, or pokiman, they would be morons if they bought a psp. It's not for them.

So the main thing is that I like the games for the psp, and there are no games that excite me for the ds. If you like the games for the ds and especially if you like the touch screen, mic, and voice recording then hey, it's for you. To me, the mp3 playback, photo viewing, web browsing with wipeout, and video playback are worth much more than the touch screen and mic.

I'll also point out that my strong defense probably comes from the fact that I have a habbit of picking looser devices that are technically good but never catch on. I liked (but never owned) the lynx, I had an omnigo, nino, casiopia, iriver mp3 player - lots of good stuff but all died off. They were good devices but never had a large support base. It doesn't really matter for the iriver and I'd still take it over any ipod out there now. Anyway, I'm glad you like your ds. It's just not for me.

[Fishie]

For me this isnt even over picking one machine over the other since hey I do play them all anyway, its my job.
Fact remains that despite the inferior tech specs the DS remains the better hardware from a gamplay point of view and Nintendo and its partners are capitalising on that big time.

[Craig Horlacher]

For me this isnt even over picking one machine over the other since hey I do play them all anyway, its my job.
Fact remains that despite the inferior tech specs the DS remains the better hardware from a gamplay point of view and Nintendo and its partners are capitalising on that big time.

Wow dude! That's more bold than my original post.

Many would disagree with that...it's also very debatable as to whether or not nintendo is capitolizing on anything...pokemon is keeping them alive and the ds isn't doing anywhere close to as well as you are saying based on what I've heard. Whatever.

I wish it was my job to play these things! You're lucky man! Have a good one.

[Fishie]

I wish it was my job to play these things! You're lucky man! Have a good one.

Nothing bold about it.
The DS features alow it to explore new gameplay avenues which the PSP cant so while the DS can and does go new places the PSP is stuck being a PS2 light.

As for WHAT YOU HEARD well I once heard someone say that he was Napoleon Bonaparte.

Read a bit trough this thread.
Nintendo upped their estimates to 18 million units for the year running while Sony lowered theirs to 12 million units.

Sony thus admited to selling far below the 16 million units they initially estimated(ad yes these figures do include the units for the European markets) while Nintendo is selling better then even they had predicted.

At the moment on a global basis the DS is slaughtering the PSP in raw numbers and it will continue to do so for at least the next 12 months.

***Massive double quote trimmed by moderator JD: Please don't quote entire messages, thanks.***

[Typhoon]

At the moment on a global basis the DS is slaughtering the PSP in raw numbers and it will continue to do so for at least the next 12 months.

That is probably true. You get more bang for the buck! The DS graphics are pretty good. And the touch screen + microphone capabilities makes the DS more of a promising featurewise game console for future use.

I know the graphics for PSP are far superior than the DS, but the DS's graphics are not that bad.

Everyone is buying a DS because it is a proven fun macine. The PSP is another choice, but when it comes down to it, do you want to spend $100 to $150 more for the PSP? Kids like the idea and parents do as well. I think parents are more willing to shell out money for the DS for $100-$150 rather than the PSP for $250.

I've never really had the opportunity to see what dual screens can do, but I can imagine that it probably provides a lot of convience. Have you ever played a 3D PC game and constantly had to change to see the world map? Being able to see what you opponent is doing sounds like a cool idea too...

But I am not agreeing that the DS is a better machine for you or anyone else. The suitability will be up to the person buying it. But it seems like a REALLY good machine for the market. A proven money maker... Know what I mean? So far it is beating the PSP in sales...

Does anyone think that the PSP NEEDS to be sold at $250?? What do you think? Do you think they can lower the price? To how much? Wasn't the GameCube beating PS2 and XBOX sales when they lowered the price to $100? If so, then I think that this market strategy probably proves it. You know? Like Dell making it to the top by selling cheap good quality PDAs, computers, laptops, etc.

And speaking of affordability... why in the heck can the DS be sold at $150 and a PDA be sold at $400? Shez...it's got 2 screens, a large battery, a highly capable graphics system? I'm guessing it is because that the chip makers, LCD makers, and makers of other DS parts trust that Nintendo will sell the DS by the millions, so that allows for the Nintendo to buy the parts very cheaply... or is this only part of the bigger picture?

[Fishie]

Heh, funny thing is.
At 150$ the DS is lss bang for the buck technology wise then the PSP is at 250$.

Sony I suspect is having a hard time breaking even at that price point while Nintendo is selling the DS at a profit.

[Typhoon]

Heh, funny thing is.
At 150$ the DS is lss bang for the buck technology wise then the PSP is at 250$.

Sony I suspect is having a hard time breaking even at that price point while Nintendo is selling the DS at a profit.

Did you mean "more" bang for the buck for "less"? And is $250 really a breaking price point for the PSP? Why would you say that? Or maybe you didn't mean exactly that?

[Typhoon]

]
As a videogamejournalist and gadget freak I fail to see how the PSP is competition for WinCE
...
CE competes in many areas and the PSP is going to, ahem, play in many of them.
...


lol sorry, I just thought this idea was funny. Aren't "most" customers, of the PDA market, adults? At least in their twenties or older? It's hard to imagine adults, in any office, would bust out a PSP so they can take notes, etc. Or a teacher saying "Wait, just a second. Let me see if I can arrange time for you in my schedule on my PSP" during class. LOL Or how about the doctor? "What? You're appointment was set for May 5th? I always keep my appointments on my PSP...let me see here...". Or instead of ruggedized WinCE devices, WalMart warehouses get PSPs to keep track of inventory.

I think the SDK will be out there to get the best out of the PSP, but it's not going to turn it into a PDA. Remember the B&W handheld that was mainly meant to be an eBook reader? I think it was cook eBookMan? For eBookManager? Nobody was buying that.

[Fishie]

Yeah I did mean less bang for the buck.
From a purely echnological price point of view the DS is overpriced while the PSP is way too cheap.

The property screens Sony choose over standard VGA or Half VGA screens(both of which are higher res AND cheaper) are costing them dearly, they choose to go with non standard chipsets and grafics parts as well.
That all costs money, especially when most of the machine is outsourced.

The DS is made of of the shelf parts and parts that are so low tech that anyone can make em cheaply and Nintendo can still shop around for the best prices while Sony is more or less forced becouse of their own stupidity to pay the prices its few supliers ask.

[Typhoon]

Ahhhh... I see.

[Fishie]

Last week the DS sold over 86K in Japan the PSP 18k.
The week beforethe DS sold over 103k and the around 23k.
Telling numbers.

[Fishie]

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, this thread takes me back.

Also:

http://www.joystiq.com/media/2006/01/DSPrintsMoney.jpg

[Typhoon]

lol

[Fishie]

As ussual, I was right.
Thats why I get paid the bucks to write about the games biz.

Hahahahaha