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Menneisyys
06-26-2005, 12:06 PM
Java is a hugely popular programming language with millions of programmers worldwide. It has a lot of advantages over traditional programming languages like C or C++ and some ever over C# (even when the latter has certainly eliminated some of Java's shortcomings and is definitely better for developing programs targeted at a specific platform like the Pocket PC).

Sun has made a major mistake when they stopped developing (please read this thread (http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jspa?threadID=408223) on this subject) its free PersonalJava implementation. Furthermore, Microsoft has never provided any JVM (Java Virtual Machine; the environment to run Java programs) for the Pocket PC platform either. This means we have to rely on third-party JVM's to run our Java programs on.

Fortunately, especially with some degree of hacking, these third-party JVM's are much more powerful and versatile than you would think.

What can I do with them? Are they more than just environments to run silly 'dancing letters' applets?

Yes, they are! In cases, they are very important to have. The most important example that comes into mind is the toonel.net client. Toonel.net (http://www.toonel.net/) is a free service to reduce Internet bandwidth usage. Please read my tutorial on setting it up on PPC devices (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16017).

There're other examples too. For example, I've released a few tools for the Pocket PC's to, for example, to create your own custom word dictionary (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=41049), to extract embedded sound (WAV) files from Pocket Notes (PWI) files (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=351079) or to demonstrate the NetFront DST problem (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=351433).

Also, as there is no decent compiler for the PPC platform. Forget the not-even-C-compliant PocketC (http://www.orbworks.com/wince/), which requires the programmer to learn a completely new, WindowCE-specific - you can't use the experience you've gained anywhere else, unlike with Java or C#! - language & class library. It's just a toy if you compare it to the C# and the CF combo or Java, especially if you take into account the need for learning a new library and being developed by a small developer firm compared to Microsoft or Sun.

There may be a lot of situations you need to do some specific task on your PDA (for example, writing/modifying a rudimentay HTTP proxy that deletes/modifies some HTTP headers or kills some ad HTTP requests to save bandwidth - this kind of coding can be finished by an experienced Java programmer in a few minutes and you really don't need a desktop computer for this) you can't do in popular scripting languages like MortRunner (http://www.pocketgear.com/software_detail.asp?id=13738) and you don't want to use any desktop computer emulator (for example, PocketDOS) on your PDA to write a non-native solution to do the stuff either.

With Java, even program development and compiling are certainly possible (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=40880).

What JVM's are available now?

Not many, but, fortunately, more than for the Palm OS, also with great hackability and real J2SE-compliance (unlike with plain CLDC/MIDP solutions).

Insignia/Esmertec Jeode:

this JVM is not sold any more except for the overly expensive Jbed version (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?siteId=1&productType=2&catalog=0&sectionId=0&productId=59096&programId=45&affiliateId=1218). Because this JVM was freely shipped with a lot of iPAQ devices and can be installed on any kind of PDA's, you may still want to use it. I certainly recommend it if you still have it lying around on some of your old iPAQ CD's.

I really recommend this JVM if you still have it. It works great in almost all situations (with toonel, my tools or as a compiler) and has a very good 'hackability' factor.

Installing it is pretty starightforward. If you install an old(er), but still perfectly usable version like 1.7.3, you may need to relocate it into a storage card because this version will only install to the main memory. You can relocate it to any card if you, after installing it, go to the \Windows directory and move Jeode.evm, evmawt.dll, evmcore.dll, evmpie.dll, iepluginvm.exe, hwawt.dll, javalib.dll, jdwp.dll, math.dll, net.dll and evm.exe from there to the new destination on yoru card. Make sure you also move the \Windows\lib subdirectory in there, so that the files that were in \Windows\lib are in a subdirectory called \lib in the new directory, just under the above-listed files. (I've also described this relocation here (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16051).)

As with all the two other major JVM versions (J9 and CrEme), it has no registry entries so you can freely relocate it and/or just copy it from one device to another. This also means that you can have several versions of Jeode (or, for that matter, J9 and CrEme) on the same device - they won't interfere in each other. This is definitely a big plus, especially if you compare the capabilities of different versions of the same JVM and you don't want to do this on two different PDA's.

IBM J9, Personal Profile 1.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140997&programId=458&affiliateId=1218):

(please do not mistake it for the IBM J9, MIDP 2.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&jid=174XB87D2AB596AD2AF1CX346FB7641C&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140968&sectionId=0&catalog=30&txtSearch=WebSphere+Everyplace+Micro+Environment+Personal&pc=list%5B6%5D_title) version. The latter can't be used for running standalone applications. It only has Midlet support. To find out more about using it for running Midlets, please read this (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=36013) thread.)

This is a very cheap (US$ 6) JVM, which also has a trial version. Excellent for running Java applications, even toonel. Its hackability factor is, however, much less than that of CrEme or Jeode. It can't function as a compiler either. For running already-made programs that only use Java 1.1, however, it's great. It's easily relocatable and also survives even a hard reset if installed on a memory card, just like with the other major JVM's.

CrEme (http://www.nsicom.com/Default.aspx?tabid=159):

a very fast (especially at compiling other programs, compared to Jeode) JVM. It renders AWT widgets/text different from Jeode/J9 though, which may be a showstopper in cases like running it on a VGA device.

It currently has two versions: the PersonalJava (that is, JDK1.1.8) -compliant 3.x (3.26 is the latest) and the CDC1.1/MIDP1.0-compliant 4.x (currently in beta stage; 4.0b8 is he latest build). Which of the two? Most apps (including the compiler) will run using the stable 3.x versions. Furthermore, I've been unable to made toonel work with the current 4.0 beta version. Therefore, you needn't to run to pick the latest beta instead of a stable build.

Can be used for compiling programs and has a good 'hackability' factor.

A little bit of warning: if you execute the installer app on a desktop Windows that has a localized \Program Files directory (for example, the German Windows, which has \Programme instead), the installer will fail (this bug has been noticed also by me). This is a bug still present in the latest, 3.26/4.0b8 versions. You MUST run the installer app on a Windows version that uses the standad \Program Files directory name.

NetFront JVM (http://nfppc.access.co.jp/english/):

this JVM comes with the Java-enabled NetFront Web browser (http://nfppc.access.co.jp/english/). As of version 3.1 (I haven't tested the JVM shipped with version 3.2 yet, but, hopefully, will manage to do it in a few days), this JVM can be used to run some standalone programs (but definitely not all of them - it didn't run, for example, my ).

Its 'hackability' factor is pretty low (again, see my posts on compilation at Pocket PC Thoughts (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=40880)); it can't really be hacked to run my NetFront DST problem demo (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=351433).

Installing

The three stand-alone JVM's are very easy to install. J9 and CrEme can be installed straight to a memory card; older versions of Jeode must be relocated to there manually (it, again, isn't complicated at all). The JVM in NetFront gets installed with the NetFront browser - you don't need to install it by hand. (And, incidentally, you don't need to enable it inside NetFront either.)

After installing the given application, it's ready to run anything.

Running applications in Pocket PC JVM's

Applications mostly come in JAR files. (For the Java-savy: you can also run individual class files in the four JVM's too. I've described this in my compilation-related article (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=40880). This is best used if you also compile your Java programs on your PDA and . However, because most Java programs are distributed in a JAR file, to keep things simple, I only explain how JAR's should be run.)

You'll need to put the absolute path (for example, \jars\someApp.jar) of these JAR files in the so-called 'classpath' variable, which you pass to the JVM executable file described in the next paragraph.

Just like with any Pocket PC program, JVM's also have an EXE file to run. You must supply the JAR file path and the class that must be run to this program. The four JVM's need to be invoked the following way from the standard WindowsCE .lnk (link) files:

Jeode:
255#"\<path to home directory>\evm.exe" -Djeode.evm.console.local.keep=true -cp <full JAR file path> <main class name>

CrEme:
255#"\<path to home directory>\bin\CrEme.exe" -Ob -classpath <full JAR file path> <main class name>

IBM J9:
255#"\<path to home directory>\bin\J9.exe" "-jcl:ppro10" -cp <full JAR file path> <main class name>

NetFront:
"255#"\<path to home directory>\jvlite.exe" -classpath <full JAR file path> <main class name>

You can create these link files by hand if not supplied. They only should contain one row - the one that has just been shown. You can put these .lnk files anywhere in your \Windows\Start Menu\Programs directory - they will behave like a "real" link file, just like the ones Windows CE is shipped with.

The <path to home directory> is, for example, \Program Files\NetFront3\ with NetFront 3.1 installed into main memory, \Windows with Jeode installed into main memory, \<card name>\IBM PPRO10\ with IBM J9 installed into a storage card etc. You can easily find it with Pocket File Explorer or, even better, from the desktop using Total Commander with the WinCE file system plug-in (http://pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15577).

That is, if you decide to store your something.jar file in, say, \SD Card\something.jar, you'll need to pass "\SD Card\something.jar" (notice the " marks! They are needed if the path contains a space like in "SD Card"!) as the <full JAR file path> parameter.

The second parameter passed to the JVM exe file is the name of the main class. With my programs, it's exactly the same as the JAR name. With, for example, toonel, it's gui.ClientForm. (For the Java-savy, you can't use the well-known <JVM exe name> -jar jarfilename execution form with any of the JVM's). If you are unsure/don't know this, rename the JAR file to a ZIP file and go into it with, say, Total Commander, Go to the META-INF subdirectory and read the MANIFEST.MF file in there. It'll contain something like this:

Manifest-Version: 1.0
Main-Class: gui.ClientForm

You'll need to pass the JVM EXE file the value that stands after the Main-Class attribute; that is, gui.ClientForm in this case.

Please note that you will need to switch to the console mode with command-line batch variable support if you want to invoke your Java applications with varying parameters. You can pass parameters to your applications in your link files (the parameter(s) come(s) just after the main class name), but if you need to run your application on several different files to be processed (see for example my embedded-sound-PWI or user.dic-to-WinCE-wordlist converter), you may be better bite the bullet and install/get familiar with a console environment like PPC Command Shell, also described in my Java compiling-on-the-PDA article (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=40880).

The most important links on other tutorials/forums:

Java on PocketPC, the Unofficial FAQ (http://www.vikdavid.com/mobile/) - perhaps the best and most up-to-date article/FAQ on PPC JVM's

The focal point of Pocket PC & Java-related discussion (http://forum.java.sun.com/forum.jspa?forumID=80)

Some other links (not as recommended as the two above!):

Java Support on Pocket PC (http://www.comp.lancs.ac.uk/computing/users/fittond/ppcjava.html) - a heavily outdated article; it contains a lot of links to non-exisiting JVM's.
Java On Pocket PC Devices, Mikko Kontio (http://www.informit.com/articles/article.asp?p=344816&rl=1) - only discusses a small subset of running full-fledged Java apps on the PPC; still, may be worth reading for some
JAVA for PocketPC PDA's (http://www.berka.name/stan/jvm-ppc/java_for_pda.html) - one of the most detailed articles (next to the Unofficial FAQ linked as first) on recent JVM's.

Menneisyys
08-15-2005, 09:56 AM
While evaluating Pocket Mechanic in the Utilities /Maintenance (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/awards/category_2005.asp?catid=45) category (I will publish a detailed roundup of these apps in the near future, so, stay tuned :) ) during the Pocket PC magazine Best Software Awards 2005 (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/awards/main.asp) process, I’ve noticed another bug in CrEme, in addition to the System Path bug, also discovered by me (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=774170): it registers .jar and .jad files in the Registry without using “ marks when entering the path of creme.exe to the Registry. This will mean the system won’t find creme.exe at all when you click a .jar or a .jad file.

Curing this problem is very simple: insert " marks before and after the \< home>\NSIcom CrEme\bin\creme.exe string (so that the entire registry value becomes "\\SD-MMCard\\NSIcom CrEme\\bin\\creme.exe" -Of -mv '%1') in both [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jadfile\Shell\Open\Command] and [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jarfile\Shell\Open\Command] .

burtcom
08-15-2005, 05:16 PM
The nsicom site has an option for downloading the trial version of CrEme, but there isn't any mention of how to buy or how much it is. Can any of you CrEmeusers enlighten us?

Menneisyys
08-16-2005, 07:03 AM
The nsicom site has an option for downloading the trial version of CrEme, but there isn't any mention of how to buy or how much it is. Can any of you CrEmeusers enlighten us?

I couldn't find any price either. You could send an e-mail to the NSICom people, as is recommended for example .here (http://www.comp.lancs.ac.uk/computing/users/fittond/ppcjava.html)

burtcom
08-16-2005, 03:13 PM
Already e-mailed :)

Still waiting to hear back.

I'm a little worried -- since they don't publish the price on the site -- that it's uber-expensive (i.e. if you have to ask, you can't afford it)

I'll report here when/if I hear back.

burtcom
08-18-2005, 03:18 PM
Sorry to have to tell you folks, but for most of us CrEme is not a (legal) option.

There is no single-user license available -- the minimum number you can get is 1000.

And, as noted in the License Agreement below, you are allowed to use it for only 30 days for evaluation putposes.

Too bad -- perhaps if enough people bug them they'll consider a single license for personal use, like IBM does for their product.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CrEme(tm) Evaluation License Agreement

Please read the terms and conditions of this agreement carefully before using CrEme or it's associated programs and documentation.

This agreement represents the entire understanding between you and NSIcom Ltd. ("NSIcom"), concerning CrEme, and supersedes any prior
agreements.

BY USING THIS SOFTWARE YOU ARE AGREEING TO BECOME BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THIS AGREEMENT. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO THE TERMS OF THIS AGREEMENT, DO
NOT INSTALL THE PROGRAM.

LICENSE GRANT:
NSIcom, Ltd. ("NSIcom") grants you, and you accept on the first use, a personal, non-transferable and non-exclusive right to use the CrEme(tm) ("SOFTWARE") contained herein on a single processing unit for evaluation purposes only and for a period of 30 days from the date of the first use of the SOFTWARE. This license shall apply only to the SOFTWARE referenced above, and shall not apply to any other software products and shall not convey any rights in other NSIcom software except as provided herein.
You may not copy or distribute CrEme in any way and for any purpose without the explicit prior written consent of NSIcom. You must purchase a full-use license if you wish to do any of the following: (a) use the SOFTWARE after the end of the 30-day trial period, or (b) use the SOFTWARE for any development, commercial, or production purpose, or (c) distribute the SOFTWARE for any such use.

martin_ayton
08-30-2005, 05:00 PM
I'm just downloading the IBM JVM from Handango. 89.4MB - ouch! I'm not sure I want to take up that much space on my SD card. How much space does this actually take up when it's loaded?

Menneisyys
08-30-2005, 05:11 PM
I'm just downloading the IBM JVM from Handango. 89.4MB - ouch! I'm not sure I want to take up that much space on my SD card. How much space does this actually take up when it's loaded?

The PP JVM takes some 5M, the MIDP JVM takes some 2M.

Fergus
09-06-2005, 12:53 PM
I'm interested in developing a small application along the lines of a flash card/quiz program for the PPC platform. Is developing this or any PPC application viable using Java. If i were to make this publicly available would this cause any problems or is the C# (net?) route a better alternative in this case.

I haven't programmed in C for years and have just started learning Java which i would like to continue with. What do you think taking into consideration i have not developed for PPC before.

Many thanks
Fergus

Menneisyys
09-06-2005, 12:59 PM
I'm interested in developing a small application along the lines of a flash card/quiz program for the PPC platform. Is developing this or any PPC application viable using Java. If i were to make this publicly available would this cause any problems or is the C# (net?) route a better alternative in this case.

I haven't programmed in C for years and have just started learning Java which i would like to continue with. What do you think taking into consideration i have not developed for PPC before.

Many thanks
Fergus

I'd definitely choose C# over Java for purely PPC-related development. C# (CF) is natively suppoted by the operating system, unlike Java. That is, your app will run on any PPC if you write it in C#/CF.

Furthermore, C# is an extended, even more logical/clever version of Java. You'll certainly like it.

Fergus
09-06-2005, 01:41 PM
Hi Menneisyys
Can you recommend any resources for learning C# CF specifically for PPC developement using a format like CBTs, books or websites. Do I need to learn C# or will C# CF which i assume is a subset of C# do the job?

Many thanks for your help
Fergus

Menneisyys
09-06-2005, 02:03 PM
Hi Menneisyys
Can you recommend any resources for learning C# CF specifically for PPC developement using a format like CBTs, books or websites.

There're several books on C# and some on CF (Compact Framework; a scaled-down version of the .NET framework). I've read some of the C# books and will also post some more detailed remarks when I get back to my firm (where my books are).

As I'm a Java pro and can code anything in Java (I'd say Java is my mother tongue, programming-wise), I find it the easiest to write code in Java and then, later, rewrite the stuff into C#. Fortunately, Java is very similar to C# and the Java class libraries to CF, so, this can very easily be done, in most cases, by mechanical class/method name/parameter list change.

This all means I didn't really need to learn/read CF-related books because CF is so similar to the Java libraries than I can use most of my Java/Java library knowledge when programming in C#/CF too.

You, however, may also want to read CF-related books too (only one C# book discusses CF too) if you don't plan to learn Java first.


Do I need to learn C# or will C# CF which i assume is a subset of C# do the job?

Many thanks for your help
Fergus

CF is the Compact Framework and is almost independent of the language you use. Therefore, you can learn C# and CF separately. It's another question they should be learnt together. I wish we had more books (and not just one) on doing this...

Fergus
09-07-2005, 11:40 PM
Thanks very much for your input, after doing some research i have decided to go ahead and learn C#. I will see how i get on with this and then have a look at CF and hey maybe I will get as far as producing something for my PDA, that would be great!

Cheers
Fergus

Learn to program with c#
.NET Compact Framework Programming with C#

Phillip Dyson
09-08-2005, 03:53 PM
IBM J9, Personal Profile 1.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140997&programId=458&affiliateId=1218):

(please do not mistake it for the IBM J9, MIDP 2.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&jid=174XB87D2AB596AD2AF1CX346FB7641C&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140968&sectionId=0&catalog=30&txtSearch=WebSphere+Everyplace+Micro+Environment+Personal&pc=list%5B6%5D_title) version. The latter can't be used for running standalone applications. It only has Midlet support. To find out more about using it for running Midlets, please read this (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=36013) thread.)


Do I need to install both if I want java apps and midlets?

Menneisyys
09-08-2005, 06:38 PM
IBM J9, Personal Profile 1.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140997&programId=458&affiliateId=1218):

(please do not mistake it for the IBM J9, MIDP 2.0 (http://www.handango.com/PlatformProductDetail.jsp?productType=2&optionId=1_2_2&jid=174XB87D2AB596AD2AF1CX346FB7641C&platformId=2&siteId=1&productId=140968&sectionId=0&catalog=30&txtSearch=WebSphere+Everyplace+Micro+Environment+Personal&pc=list%5B6%5D_title) version. The latter can't be used for running standalone applications. It only has Midlet support. To find out more about using it for running Midlets, please read this (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=36013) thread.)


Do I need to install both if I want java apps and midlets?

Yes, both. I think they can co-exist on the same device (haven't tested).

Phillip Dyson
09-08-2005, 10:47 PM
I've tried installing both on my eten and my system immediately destablized. Everytime I attempted to got to Settings I got a soft reset. Even after I uninstalled.

Finally I had to do a hard reset and restore from back up.

Perhaps they don't play nicely with the Samsung processor?

Also, I've been unable to get the Mobile gMaps application to work with the Netfront 3.2 jvm. I created a .lnk file and copied it to windows\start menu\programs\ java

I keep getting the console which said some class not found. I can't read it because the console closes just after its finished printing.

I can get the demo calculator to work.

Menneisyys
09-09-2005, 05:29 PM
I've tried installing both on my eten and my system immediately destablized. Everytime I attempted to got to Settings I got a soft reset. Even after I uninstalled.


That's strange. I've installed it on my PPC; the two JVM's can co-exist. I haven't encountered the Settings problem either.

The latter is pretty strange as these JVM's don't put any *.cpl files (Control Panel; these files define additional Settings controls that the Settings menu uses) in \Windows. Furthermore, everything they enter in the Registry are safe, at least on a non-phone enabled Pocket PC:

- [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\IBM\jclPPro10] (PPRO10) and [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\IBM\jclMidp20] (MIDP)

These don't interfere with anything on a plain (not PE) PPC.

The MIDP VM also enters a JAR/JAD association:

- HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jarfile and HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jadfile



On a PPC - phone combo (PPC PE device), where there may be a pre-installed MIDP VM, the jar/jad files may already be taken (that is, HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jarfile and HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jadfile may be already existing). I think this is causing the problem with your ETEN.

Could you please check the pre-existence of these two associations with either a registry editor or with a tool like myExtensions v1.1.0 (http://www.freewareppc.com/utilities/myextensions.shtml) (also see this thread (http://pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17100) on its usage) before installing the MIDP VM?

Also, I've been unable to get the Mobile gMaps application to work with the Netfront 3.2 jvm. I created a .lnk file and copied it to windows\start menu\programs\ java

I keep getting the console which said some class not found. I can't read it because the console closes just after its finished printing.

I can get the demo calculator to work.

The NetFront JVM is not a MIDP VM; this is why it can't run the MIDP Mobile Gmaps (http://www.mgmaps.com/download.php). You will need a MIDP environment: either J9 or CrEme (in trial mode). Then, transfer the two (jar + jad) file to your PDA, click the JAD file and it'll be installed.

Give a try to other, more advanced JVM's - the NetFront JVM is pretty simple, as far as running non-applets is concerned.

Phillip Dyson
09-09-2005, 07:08 PM
On a PPC - phone combo (PPC PE device), where there may be a pre-installed MIDP VM, the jar/jad files may already be taken (that is, HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jarfile and HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jadfile may be already existing). I think this is causing the problem with your ETEN.

Could you please check the pre-existence of these two associations



I did a search and didn't find these entries. I'll try the CrEme vm. It was encouraging that they seemed to recognize the existence of my processor on their site.

Phillip Dyson
09-09-2005, 07:19 PM
After installing CrEme everything seems stable. Both the .jad and jar files have the CrEme icon but when I click on the .jad file it always brings up the asociation dialog.

Am I missing something?

thank

Menneisyys
09-09-2005, 07:39 PM
After installing CrEme everything seems stable. Both the .jad and jar files have the CrEme icon but when I click on the .jad file it always brings up the asociation dialog.

Am I missing something?

thank

CrEme is buggy as far as its file association is concerned.

It registers .jar and .jad files in the Registry without using " marks when entering the path of creme.exe to the Registry. This will mean the system won’t find creme.exe at all when you click a .jar or a .jad file.

Curing this problem is very simple: insert " marks before and after the \< home>\NSIcom CrEme\bin\creme.exe string (so that the entire registry value becomes "\\SD-MMCard\\NSIcom CrEme\\bin\\creme.exe" -Of -mv '%1') in both [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jadfile\Shell\Open\Command] and [HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\jarfile\Shell\Open\Command] .

Phillip Dyson
09-09-2005, 08:30 PM
Thanks Menn,

That did the trick. It works! :way to go:
The screen is obviously formatted for a tiny phone. But thats another issue.

Menneisyys
09-10-2005, 06:48 AM
Thanks Menn,

That did the trick. It works! :way to go:


You're welcome :)

AlmostDecent
09-12-2005, 05:33 AM
Hi,

Many thanks for your info on Java. I have an Axim X50v, and was wondering whether you thought I might be able to run JavaFIBS (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/) a client to play at the free online backgammon server FIBS. FIBS (First Internet Backgammon Server) is a wonderful place to play backgammon online, but as far as I know there are no Pocket apps to do so. Or any other site for that matter. There are many client softwares, and interestngly enough, this one is the best and is entirely in Java, hence my hope I may get it to run in VGA (using ozVGA if necessary) on the Dell.

If successful, I would post detailed instructions (with due credit) to share this with other backgammon players. BTW, although not well-known, the world's strongest backgammon program, GNU Backgammon (http://www.gnubg.org), is available in a pocket PC version (for free) at:

BGLightCE - http://bglightce.homelinux.net/

Albert

Menneisyys
09-12-2005, 11:09 AM
Hi,

Many thanks for your info on Java. I have an Axim X50v, and was wondering whether you thought I might be able to run JavaFIBS (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/) a client to play at the free online backgammon server FIBS. FIBS (First Internet Backgammon Server) is a wonderful place to play backgammon online, but as far as I know there are no Pocket apps to do so. Or any other site for that matter. There are many client softwares, and interestngly enough, this one is the best and is entirely in Java, hence my hope I may get it to run in VGA (using ozVGA if necessary) on the Dell.


I have some bad news for you.

The stand-alone application, JavaFIBS 2001 (version 1.008) (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/download/JavaFIBS2001_v1008.zip), can't be used at all in current JVM's:

J9 PPR10: can't be hacked - after providing a pre-1.5 it the javax.swing and javax.accessibility package, it complains of a missing java.awt.Window method. As this class, therefore, should also be changed (which is impossible with the IBM J9 VM's - see my comments on its hackability), this JVM is not hackable.

(I used the script 255#"\Program Files\J9\PPRO10\bin\J9.exe" "-jcl:ppro10" -cp \swing.jar;\jfibs\JavaFIBS.jar JavaFIBS2001 to try to run the game, after copying the entire directory structure to the PDA. Here, I've put the missing Swing and javax.accessibility classes in the additional \swing.jar.)

CrEme 4.00b8: after some serious hacking (uploading javax.swing, javax.accessibility, java.awt.DefaultKeyboardFocusManager, java.awt.KeyboardFocusManager java.awt.KeyEventDispatcher, java.awt.KeyEventPostProcessor and overwriting java.lang.Boolean in VMclasses.zip), I coulnd't help the missing java.lang.Class.desiredAssertionStatus() because java.lang.Class is too deeply tied to the hardware and, therefore, can't be changed to a desktop version.

(I used the script 255#"\Windows\CrEme\bin\CrEme.exe" -Ob -classpath \swing.jar;\jfibs\JavaFIBS.jar JavaFIBS2001 . See the J9 section on the additional \swing.jar.)

Note that I haven't tested Insignia Jbed because they have no trial version. It may be able to run it - or not. (Sorry Insignia, you should provide a trial version of jBed - no trial version, no recommendations because I can't even test your stuff...)

The applet version (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/javafibs.html) is a no-go either:

CrEme 4.00b8 plug-in + PIE: no-go. Doesn't display any frames; they aren't visible in a task switcher either (unlike with Netfront). Using a multi-tab PIE plug-in like SPP or MultiIE (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/index.php?action=expand,42026&/pocket_pc_web_browsers_-_the_complete_roundup.htm) doesn't help either - they only allow for multi-tabbed Web page viewing, but don't do the same with top-level frames.

CrEme 4.00b8 in standalone, AppletViewer mode: no-go.

(the script to start: 255#"\Windows\CrEme\bin\CrEme.exe" -av -Ob http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/javafibs.html)

It starts, but as with CrEme in general, has an inconsistent, non-standard GUI. This also means there is no menubar in any Frames - that is, you can't even connect to the server because this is only accessible from the menu. Unfortunately, this renders CrEme useless for running applets like this. A screenshot:

http://www.winmobiletech.com/kuvat/CrEmeGomokuAV.gif.png

Thunderhawk 2.1: no-go: it doesn't display top-level Frames, just like PIE.

NF 3.2: a no-go because it can't connect to the server (User/JavaFIBS/Connect). I may try some day to find out why it doesn't connect (if we're lucky, it's just an easily fixable security problem); now, it seems to be absolutely useless.

As can be seen on the screenshots, the game's GUI is useless in QVGA because it uses fixed-sized Frames. Only the two on the left will be visible.

This also affects the native VGA portrait mode by default (fortunately, the frames can be moved around):

http://www.winmobiletech.com/kuvat/NFBackgammonAppletNativeVGAPortrait.gif.png

in Landscape, the window at the bottom right will be visible.

Note that the upper two frames (Chat and System) will always have hidden and they can't be moved back. Also note that you must use some kind of task switcher to switch between the frames. Another note: the menu bars will not be visible in neither NetFront and, as has already been pointed out, in the AppletViewer mode of CrEme; they can only be accessed from the Menu menu in the bottom left corner with NetFront and absolutely unaccessible from CrEme.

http://www.winmobiletech.com/kuvat/GammonOnTodayScreen.gif.png

This all means it's only with Netfront that it may run some day (that is, when I find out the cause for the error). As the Netfront JVM has no error log/console (AFAIK), it's very hard to find out exactly what causes the network connection problem (that is, it, seemingly, it doesn't even try to connect).

EDIT at 15:20 CET: added a section on CrEme AV mode.

AlmostDecent
09-12-2005, 03:24 PM
First of all, a huge thank you for all the trouble you went to. It was very interesting and informative. I'll send a link of this to the author of JavaFIBS since he may have an idea as to what is up. It would really be a dream to be able to play on FIBS from my PDA. I play 3 games online essentially, chess, backgammon, and poker. Poker is limited to whatever the sites have to offer, so i don't even bother concerning myself, but chess and backgammon are far more communitarian so there are usually many client offerings. I already found a choice for chess, but as of yet, none in backgammon. *sigh*. I hope this frustration is short-lived.

Albert

AlmostDecent
09-12-2005, 04:03 PM
Just out of curiosity. Since NetFront had the most success with the software, it was clear it used a JVM of its own. The descriptions says it uses JV-Lite2, which was none of the ones you had mentioned as far as I could tell. In fact, Access, the makers of NetFront, issue a stand-alone JVM called JV-Lite2 at:
http://www.access-sys-eu.com/jvlite2ce.html

If this is one you have already mentioned, but with a different name, accept my apologies.

BTW, I e-mailed the author of JavFIBS, asking him to look at this thread, and help if he is able.

Albert

Menneisyys
09-12-2005, 04:20 PM
First of all, a huge thank you for all the trouble you went to. It was very interesting and informative. I'll send a link of this to the author of JavaFIBS since he may have an idea as to what is up.

Just tell him not to use top-level frames - that'll fix the PIE/Thunderhawk problems, as far as graphics is considered. I can even help him in updating the applet (I'm a Java pro.)

Menneisyys
09-12-2005, 04:22 PM
Just out of curiosity. Since NetFront had the most success with the software, it was clear it used a JVM of its own. The descriptions says it uses JV-Lite2, which was none of the ones you had mentioned as far as I could tell. In fact, Access, the makers of NetFront, issue a stand-alone JVM called JV-Lite2 at:
http://www.access-sys-eu.com/jvlite2ce.html


JV-Lite2 is the JVM I'm referring to as 'NetFront JVM' because it's only distributed as part of the NetFront browser.

BTW, I e-mailed the author of JavFIBS, asking him to look at this thread, and help if he is able.


Great!

Cthulhu
09-12-2005, 08:13 PM
I have some bad news for you.

The stand-alone application, JavaFIBS 2001 (version 1.008) (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/download/JavaFIBS2001_v1008.zip), can't be used at all in current JVM's:

[...]

The applet version (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/javafibs.html) is a no-go either:



Have you tried the stand-alone version based on the applet (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/download/JavaFIBS.zip) then?



Just tell him not to use top-level frames - that'll fix the PIE/Thunderhawk problems, as far as graphics is considered. I can even help him in updating the applet (I'm a Java pro.)

Do you mean the java.awt.Frame? What else should I use if I want to have borders on my windows and the functionality they provide in Java 1.5?

Menneisyys
09-13-2005, 07:31 AM
I have some bad news for you.

The stand-alone application, JavaFIBS 2001 (version 1.008) (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/download/JavaFIBS2001_v1008.zip), can't be used at all in current JVM's:

[...]

The applet version (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/javafibs.html) is a no-go either:



Have you tried the stand-alone version based on the applet (http://www.fibs.com/~cthulhu/download/JavaFIBS.zip) then?


Thanks for the tip; I've tested it.

Under J9 (255#"\Program Files\J9\PPRO10\bin\J9.exe" "-jcl:ppro10" -cp \JavaFIBS.jar JavaFIBS), it refused to work; complained of missing JavaFIBS. (It often does so if something is incompatible with it. It certainly wasn't a CLASSPATH problem.)

Under CrEme (255#"\Windows\CrEme\bin\CrEme.exe" -Ob -classpath \JavaFIBS.zip JavaFIBS), it worked - to a certain degree. All functions seem to work, except the System window, where, due to the inconsistent AWT support of CrEme, EOL characters aren't properly rendered:

http://winmobiletech.com/kuvat/CrEmeStandaloneAppletbasedVGA.gif.png

I'll play with CrEme to fdind out what it can render properly in java.awt.TextArea's.

I've also given a try to the old JEODE version I have (link: 255#"\Windows\evm.exe" -Djeode.evm.console.local.keep=true -cp \JavaFIBS.jar JavaFIBS ). Unfortunately, it doesn't render menus either – they can't be accessed in any way:

http://winmobiletech.com/kuvat/JeodeGomoku.gif.png



Do you mean the java.awt.Frame? What else should I use if I want to have borders on my windows and the functionality they provide in Java 1.5?

Nope, I meant the applet version, not the application. PIE- and TH-based play is completely impossible because they can't render top-level java.awt.Frame's. If you could reconsider quickly redesigning the GUI so that it fits into a QVGA-sized java.applet.Applet window (you could switch between the four windows with using buttons / java.awt.CardLayout and could add a some-pixel-sized indicator to show if there is some activity in the other panes, especially in the Chat frame), then, even low-end QVGA Pocket PC's could run the game.

(Incidentally, by redesigning the app this way, you could even make a CLDC/MIDP version for Symbian/PPC PE users too. That would mean tons of new users.)

Cthulhu
09-15-2005, 11:39 AM
If you could reconsider quickly redesigning the GUI so that it fits into a QVGA-sized java.applet.Applet window (you could switch between the four windows with using buttons / java.awt.CardLayout and could add a some-pixel-sized indicator to show if there is some activity in the other panes, especially in the Chat frame), then, even low-end QVGA Pocket PC's could run the game.

(Incidentally, by redesigning the app this way, you could even make a CLDC/MIDP version for Symbian/PPC PE users too. That would mean tons of new users.)

Unfortunately I don't have any time to do this redesign, but if you are interested in doing it as you hinted earlier I can supply you with the affected classes so you can make the change. Please mail me on cthulhu 'at' fibs.com with the subject line "JavaFIBS applet".

AlmostDecent
09-17-2005, 04:29 PM
I'll just cross my fingers and hope the gauntlet is taken up. :wink:

Albert

Menneisyys
09-17-2005, 04:38 PM
I'll just cross my fingers and hope the gauntlet is taken up. :wink:

Albert

As soon as I have some time (after closing the PPCMag Software Awards 2005 voting), I'll redesign the applet so that it runs in PIE/Thunderhawk too :)

AlmostDecent
09-17-2005, 04:55 PM
:D :D :D

AlmostDecent
09-17-2005, 07:07 PM
I just saw this new JVM mentioned at Aximsite: http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~dat/java/project/jvm/index_en.html

Have you tried it?

Albert

Menneisyys
09-17-2005, 07:25 PM
I just saw this new JVM mentioned at Aximsite: http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~dat/java/project/jvm/index_en.html

Have you tried it?

Albert

Not yet. Looks very promising. Will test it ASAP.

Menneisyys
09-18-2005, 06:33 AM
Tested. Well, it's indeed promising, but still has tons of bugs. For example, it wasn't able to run Toonel at all:

http://www.winmobiletech.com/kuvat/JapaneseJVMToonelError.gif.png

It ran the applet-based application version of JavaFIBS; I haven't managed to actually join a game, so I couldn't test whether gaming is OK too:

http://www.winmobiletech.com/kuvat/JavaFIBSJapaneseJVM.gif.png

Note that it maximizes all windows, unlike other, Frame-capable JVM's. That is, you must use a task switcher to switch between them.

I used the following link file to invoke the JVM on JavaFIBS:

255#"\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp "\jf" JavaFIBS

after decrunching the contents of JavaFIBS.jar to \jf. (Unfortunately, it seems it isn't able to work on JAR files. Copying them to \Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\lib[\ext] won't help either.)

As this is a really new JVM with tons of updates coming all the time, I hope these issues will be fixed really soon.

Menneisyys
09-21-2005, 06:59 AM
Posted some new info on the new Mysaifu JVM here (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=119063).

Menneisyys
09-21-2005, 02:19 PM
I've continued playing with the current, 1.0.4 version of Mysaifu JVM (http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~dat/java/project/jvm/index_en.html), a promising, new, free JVM; now, compilation-wise (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/index.php?action=expand,40880). (Please see my last few posts here (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=41081) on my other remarks on Mysaifu JVM).

Unfortunately, it doesn't work. (I used the link file 255#"\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -Djava.ext.dirs=\ -cp "\" sun.tools.javac.Main \HelloWorld.java top compile; tools.jar and the JDK 1.3 rt.jar was in the root directory, as with HelloWorld.java.

(Incidentally, please notice the java.ext.dirs property. It must explicitly be set if you plan to put add-on JAR files in the classpath – just including them in the classpath (-cp/-classpath parameter), unlike with all the other Pocket PC JVM's, doesn't work.)

Unfortunately, with the additional JDK 1.3 rt.jar, the compilation doesn't work. If you, on the other hand, remove the additional JDK 1.3 rt.jar, you'll be presented the usual error message:

error: Package java.lang not found. Please adjust the classpath so that package java.lang is accessible.
\HelloWorld.java:1: Superclass java.lang.Object of class HelloWorld not found.
class HelloWorld
^
2 errors
JVM exit.

Unfortunately, Mysaifu JVM still needs a bit of work. However, it's really promising.

AlmostDecent
09-21-2005, 03:47 PM
Thanks for the results. I must admit close to total ignorance on Java itself, so much of what you said went right over my head. A pity it didn't work. I guess I'll have to wait until you have time to make the modifications you said would make it playable. Many thanks once more.

Albert

Menneisyys
09-22-2005, 04:15 PM
Thanks for the results. I must admit close to total ignorance on Java itself, so much of what you said went right over my head. A pity it didn't work. I guess I'll have to wait until you have time to make the modifications you said would make it playable. Many thanks once more.

Albert

NP. Maybe this weekend - I'm pretty busy right now. (Just writing a grand roundup of Today plug-ins, chasing some old Atari 2600 cartridges for my computing museum etc.)

Menneisyys
10-08-2005, 08:42 PM
Hot Pocket PC Java news:

1. The new, 0.1.5 version of the free and very promising Mysaifu JVM (http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~dat/java/project/jvm/index_en.html) has been released today (please also see my post here at Sun Sep 18, 2005 6:33 am (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=41081&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=30) for more information). To a certain degree, it's already capable of running Toonel (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=360414), but, according to the author (didn't have the time to test it myself), is still unstable. It has an experimental function, floating frame and dialog. If you set following system property, then you can move and resize windows.

gnu.java.awt.peer.wce.floating=frame,dialog

I haven't tested this either as yet – sounds promising though, as, up to now, one of the biggest annoyances with it was that it didn't allow for resizable, relocatable top-level client windows, unlike other JVM's.

2. I've played with public Jeode versions released after 2001 (that is, over version 1.7.3) and have written a tutorial on its relocation fix. You'll definitely need it if you want to run it from a storage card. The tutorial has been posted to the following PPC sites: PPCT (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=43519), iPAQ HQ (http://www.ipaqhq.com/forums/showthread.php?p=115536), AximSite (http://www.aximsite.com/boards/showthread.php?p=852747), PPC Magazine (http://pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=18633), FirstLoox (http://www.firstloox.org//forums/showthread.php?p=41557), BrightHand (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=120664).

Raphael Salgado
10-20-2005, 02:55 PM
Sorry to be jumping in with a side question, but is it possible to use IBM J9 (Websphere) as a plug-in for Internet Explorer Mobile (Pocket Internet Explorer)?

I created a tutorial on how to play the awesome internet multiplayer game, Buzztime Trivia, on the new K-JAM Pocket PC. By utilizing an old copy of Insignia Jeode, it provides a plug-in for Internet Explorer to run Java applets. www.beyondthetech.com/blogs/kjam

(By the way, it's a great game to play on Wi-Fi or some high-speed internet connection, you have to try it!)

But, initially I installed IBM J9 and went to the Buzztime website on my IEM/PIE browser, only to have it inform me that browser doesn't have Java.

Did I miss a step, or does J9 just not work that way?

Menneisyys
10-20-2005, 03:46 PM
Sorry to be jumping in with a side question, but is it possible to use IBM J9 (Websphere) as a plug-in for Internet Explorer Mobile (Pocket Internet Explorer)?

I created a tutorial on how to play the awesome internet multiplayer game, Buzztime Trivia, on the new K-JAM Pocket PC. By utilizing an old copy of Insignia Jeode, it provides a plug-in for Internet Explorer to run Java applets. www.beyondthetech.com/blogs/kjam

(By the way, it's a great game to play on Wi-Fi or some high-speed internet connection, you have to try it!)

But, initially I installed IBM J9 and went to the Buzztime website on my IEM/PIE browser, only to have it inform me that browser doesn't have Java.

Did I miss a step, or does J9 just not work that way?

The J9, unfoetunately, has no PIE plug-in.

BTW, I'm just writing a big roundup of PPC-compliant multiplayer games. Will also test and include your applet.

shivafool
10-30-2005, 11:19 PM
MySaifu version 1.6 is out now. I installed it, which seemed to go fine. There is no supporting documentation, which is not good for dummies like me. The nice clean interface comes up just fine, but I haven't been able to run anything. Do class files need to be in certain locations, or any other advice? :?:

Menneisyys
10-31-2005, 12:02 PM
MySaifu version 1.6 is out now. I installed it, which seemed to go fine. There is no supporting documentation, which is not good for dummies like me. The nice clean interface comes up just fine, but I haven't been able to run anything. Do class files need to be in certain locations, or any other advice? :?:

They can be anywhere in the file system; even in JAR files. For example, to run a class named mypackage.MyClass in a JAR file myjar.jar, use the following link file:

255#"\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp \myjar.jar mypackage.MyClass

If you don't want to put it in any JAR file, use the following (assuming the class file is under \myclassfiledir):

255#"\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp \myclassfiledir mypackage.MyClass

shivafool
11-01-2005, 06:09 AM
Thanks Menneisyys. I don't understand how you have such patience with us mere mortals.
So when I try to run from a link file as you suggest, here's the error that is listed in the console:
"java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: Card\My not found in java.lang.ClassLoader$1{urls=[file:/Storage], parent=null}
at java.net.URLClassLoader.findClass (URLClassLoader.java:816)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass (ClassLoader.java:341)
at java.lang.ClassLoader$1.loadClass (ClassLoader.java:1080)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass (ClassLoader.java:293)
at java.lang.VMMainThread$1.run (VMMainThread.java:96)
at java.lang.VMThread.run (VMThread.java:120)
JVM exit."

So I guess I am missing something. I am still very much a novice with programming. As I'm writing this, I'm thinking that maybe the problem is that I should be trying to run a jar file.

shivafool
11-01-2005, 07:09 AM
My dear Menneisyys,
maybe if you could point me to a java program that you know works in Mysaifu, I could try it out and see if there is something I'm doing wrong.
And may your many acts of kindness come back to you and brighten your days. :)
Cheers.

Menneisyys
11-01-2005, 09:13 AM
My dear Menneisyys,
maybe if you could point me to a java program that you know works in Mysaifu, I could try it out and see if there is something I'm doing wrong.
And may your many acts of kindness come back to you and brighten your days. :)
Cheers.

Check this (http://www.winmobiletech.com/sekalaiset/SaifuInvocationExamples.zip) out.

The ZIP has two directories; one for a class file in a package, another for without it. Put the class file in the former in a subdirectory named helllpack of the root; the latter right in the root. Execute the two link files to see whether 'HelloWorld' is indeed pronted on the console.

shivafool
11-06-2005, 12:04 AM
Even HelloWorld is not working, package or nonpackage. I get the same type of error message I quoted above.
I installed Mysaifu to my storage card. Is that the problem? Or perhaps I'm missing something else besides the jvm.exe that is supposed to be installed? :(
I sure would like to be able to use this, so any help is appreciated.

shivafool
11-06-2005, 12:55 AM
OK, well I got a HelloWorld. :D
The only way it seems to work for me is if I start up Mysaifu, then put in HelloWorld in the textbox of the interface, and the class file is in the My Documents folder in Main Memory, not on my Storage Card. Starting from a link file seems to give me the same old error.
So now I'll try some more.

Menneisyys
11-06-2005, 07:13 AM
OK, well I got a HelloWorld. :D
The only way it seems to work for me is if I start up Mysaifu, then put in HelloWorld in the textbox of the interface, and the class file is in the My Documents folder in Main Memory, not on my Storage Card. Starting from a link file seems to give me the same old error.
So now I'll try some more.

Use " to set the classpath that have spaces in them to access class files on a storage card. That is, use, for example,

255#"\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp "\Storage Card\" HelloWorld

lapchinj
12-04-2005, 03:23 AM
...Furthermore, C# is an extended, even more logical/clever version of Java. You'll certainly like it.
I like the way you phrased that 8) .

Jeff-

gsxr
03-06-2006, 01:23 AM
I got HP IPAQ 6515. Installed Cre-ME 4.1. Works fine, icons shown on .jar files, but any application i run it just shows screen where is written "cream started" it closes and nothing starts. I tried several programs and games ( King Kong for Java phones for example ). Just to state i am not very familiar with Java, so if you can and know please explain simplified what could be the problem.

Thanx

Menneisyys
03-06-2006, 08:19 AM
I tried several programs and games ( King Kong for Java phones for example ).

Those are Midlets. You may want to use the Midlet version of IBM J9 - that's the best solution for running these. Please read http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=36013 on using it.

Note that IBM J9 won't run midlets specifically designed for Nokia/Ericsson/etc phones, only generic midlets.

gsxr
03-06-2006, 01:41 PM
Is there a way to play Sony Ericsson or Nokia games on pocket PC or to run any software made for example for Sony Ericsson W800i?

Menneisyys
03-06-2006, 02:50 PM
Is there a way to play Sony Ericsson or Nokia games on pocket PC or to run any software made for example for Sony Ericsson W800i?

Impossible. I've tested a lot of S-E midlets under both J9 and the intent Midlet Manager (the latter is only shipped with the HTC PPC PE devices and is really superior to IBM J9). None of them run.

That is, you won't be able to run any device-specific games on your Pocket PC.

gsxr
03-06-2006, 03:11 PM
Thanks a lot bro. I couldnt start games with WebSphere Everyplace Micro Environment MIDP 2.0 for Windows Mobile 2003 but i am able to run several programs which is much more important.

Thank You again

maikii
03-06-2006, 04:32 PM
Using the IBM JVM, is there a way to set a proxy server, for applets that connect to the Internet.

For instance, if one uses Opera Mini with it, and need to use a proxy server for internet connection. AFAIK Opera Mini provides no way itself to set a proxy server (unlike Opera Mobile, with which that setting can be made in the opera.ini file), and I don't think it reads the system's proxy settings (as PIE does) either.

Some people have reported being able to use Opera Mini with a proxy server by setting the proxy in java settings. Is there a way to set a proxy in the IBM JVM?

Menneisyys
03-06-2006, 04:37 PM
Using the IBM JVM, is there a way to set a proxy server, for applets that connect to the Internet.

For instance, if one uses Opera Mini with it, and need to use a proxy server for internet connection. AFAIK Opera Mini provides no way itself to set a proxy server (unlike Opera Mobile, with which that setting can be made in the opera.ini file), and I don't think it reads the system's proxy settings (as PIE does) either.

Some people have reported being able to use Opera Mini with a proxy server by setting the proxy in java settings. Is there a way to set a proxy in the IBM JVM?

In standard Java, it's possible: http://www.rgagnon.com/javadetails/java-0085.html

I think the case is the same with midlets too.

maikii
03-06-2006, 11:37 PM
Once more, thanks again for the great info, Menneisys! :D

I'll try that when I get a chance. Make a link file that starts IBM Smartphone Java with those switches setting a proxy, and see if that works.

Perhaps it would even work with the built-in java on the SMT5600?

One other question. I have read your recommendations of a java app called Toonel. (I've downloaded it, but haven't tried it yet.) It occurred to me in reading the installation directions, that it probably wouldn't work for me in any case, since I need to connect to the Internet through a proxy server. It appears that to use Toonel you set it as the proxy server. Unless there is a way to set a real proxy server besides setting Toonel as one, I don't think that could work. Or is there a way to do that?

Using the IBM JVM, is there a way to set a proxy server, for applets that connect to the Internet.

For instance, if one uses Opera Mini with it, and need to use a proxy server for internet connection. AFAIK Opera Mini provides no way itself to set a proxy server (unlike Opera Mobile, with which that setting can be made in the opera.ini file), and I don't think it reads the system's proxy settings (as PIE does) either.

Some people have reported being able to use Opera Mini with a proxy server by setting the proxy in java settings. Is there a way to set a proxy in the IBM JVM?

In standard Java, it's possible: http://www.rgagnon.com/javadetails/java-0085.html

I think the case is the same with midlets too.

Menneisyys
03-07-2006, 06:52 AM
One other question. I have read your recommendations of a java app called Toonel. (I've downloaded it, but haven't tried it yet.) It occurred to me in reading the installation directions, that it probably wouldn't work for me in any case, since I need to connect to the Internet through a proxy server. It appears that to use Toonel you set it as the proxy server. Unless there is a way to set a real proxy server besides setting Toonel as one, I don't think that could work. Or is there a way to do that?


There is. Version 0.0.50.50 already supports parent proxies - that is, you can tell Toonel what proxy to use.

Menneisyys
03-14-2006, 01:43 PM
Great, free Java Virtual Machine Mysaifu Version 0.2.2 is out!

Mysaifu is currently the only, fully Java-compatible Java Virtual Machine (JVM) that is indeed worked on. The others either have been long abandoned long ago (for example Jeode) or haven't been touched for at least a year (IBM J9, CrEme).

Mysaifu has been developed by leaps and bounds. Some months ago it was completely unable to display any graphics or GUI components and was by far the slowest JVM; now, it's displaying them quite well and feels much faster.

I've throroughly tested it with Wyvern, the Java-based multiplayer game (please see the accordingly updated Roundup of Pocket PC Multiplayer Games (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/menneisyys/102005MPPPCGames.asp). Much as it still has bugs, generally, I was happy with what I have seen – indeed this JVM has great potential.

Menneisyys
03-15-2006, 07:55 AM
The new version of CrEme has also been released - here's the review:

I've reported today of the new Mysaifu version (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&title=great_free_java_virtual_machine_mysaifu&more=1). After having published the article, I've noticed that NSICom (http://www.nsicom.com) has released two, brand new versions of their CrEme JVM – now, with WM5 compliance.

CrEme is the fastest Java Virtual Machine (JVM) out with moderate system requirements and is, therefore, really worth checking out, particularly if you want to use the great bandwidth reduction tool Toonel or Java applets in Internet Explorer Mobile.

The previous versions of CrEme didn't work at all under WM5; they complained about not being able to load gfw/gfwconf and immediately exit. Fortunately, that's no longer the case – the new versions are WM5-compliant and work just great!

No article from me without thorough compliance testing. Let's see right away how the new version behaves in the most important usage areas of Pocket PC JVM's!

Toonel compliance

Toonel (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/menneisyys/ConfigureToonel45.asp) is, in addition to OnSpeed (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=511&more=1), a must for anyone that uses a restricted connection.

Click for screenshot (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CrEmeWM5Toonel.bmp.png)

All long test pages (incl. Yahoo Mail) arrived OK. It seems the "long-pages-don't-arrive-correctly-over-Toonel" bug (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=485&more=1) is a no-issue in the new, already WM5-compliant CrEme version.

An example screenshot of the Toonel summary screen is here (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CrEmeWM5Toonel-2.bmp.png).

Please also read this (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=430&more=1) for more information on configuring/using the latest version of Toonel.

PIE plug-ins

As I've reported over a month ago (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=492&more=1), up to until now, only the old, not-available/supported-any-more Jeode offered a working Internet Explorer Mobile (IEM) plug-in under WM5. (Under previous operating system versions, the IEM plug-ins earlier versions of CrEme worked, of course, great.) This has now changed: the plug-in works just great. Some example screenshots:

Rubik Cube (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CrEmeIEMPluginRubik.bmp.png) (see http://www.javaonthebrain.com/java/rubik/)

Iceblox (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CrEmeIEMPluginIceblox.bmp.png) (see http://www.javaonthebrain.com/java/iceblox/ ) (note that this game requires a built-in keyboard to operate – doesn't seem to work with the SIP one)

Wyvern (and graphics) compliance

Graphics and GUI component (menus etc) rendering has always been one of the weakest point of CrEme.

Unfortunately, nothing has changed in the new version. I've thoroughly tested it with Wyvern, the multiplayer Java game (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/menneisyys/102005MPPPCGames.asp). It behaves exactly like before – it just can't render the main menu (and the context menus), making the game just unplayable.

MIDP compliance

Tested with Mobile GMaps (http://www.mgmaps.com/) and some games.

The excellent Intent Midlet Manager (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/MidletJVMSplash.bmp.png) (the midlet environment coming with HTC PPC PE PDA's) displays this (with the MSN Maps) (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/MobileGMapsMSNMapsIntentMidletManager-2.bmp.png) and this (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/MobileGMapsMSNMapsIntentMidletManager.bmp.png) – that is, it works just great.

CrEme 4.1, on the other hand, is still useless when it comes to midlet support. It is still unable to access anything off the Internet; this is why it doesn't display anything here (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/Creme41GMapsMidlet.bmp.png). This also means no networking-dependent midlets will run – no Opera Mini (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=427&more=1), no IRC midlet clients (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/menneisyys/112005IRCClients.asp), nothing.

You will be able to run non-network-dependent apps – at a very bad quality, though. This screenshot (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CremeSprucemanMidlet.bmp.png) is made of SpruceMan (http://spruce.jp/freemidlets), for example (links: JAR (http://midlet.org/repository/spruce/spruceman/SpruceMan.jar?md=184) and JAD (http://midlet.org/repository/spruce/spruceman/SpruceMan.jad)). Needless to say, all these disconnected minigames run far better (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/SpuceMidletMan.bmp.png) in the intent manager (or, for that matter, even in the not any more recommended IBM J9).

Also note that while you must pass CrEme a JAD file (and not a Midlet JAR, as opposed to the intent JVM), the JAR file isn't fetched from the Net but must be present in the classpath (for example, the same directory as in the JAD file). Otherwise, you'll get ClassNotFoundExceptions.

Minor problems like not making use of the WM5 hardware buttons are problematic too.

All in all, there's (still) no point in trying to run midlets in the new version of CrEme.

An example command-line link file of passing the mgmaps.jad file in the root directory to CrEme:

255#"\Storage Card\Windows\Creme\bin\CrEme.exe" -Ob -classpath \ -mv mgmaps.jad

(Note that, under WM5, CrEme installs itself to \Windows\CrEme\ on storage cards.)

Pitfalls

When you give it a command-line classpath setting, you can't provide paths (for example, ones that include "Storage Card") with spaces in them enclosed in between quotes ("). You must use single quotes (') instead. This is different from the approach of all the other apps under Windows Mobile.

By the way, you can also put your JAR files into [\Storage Card\]Windows\CrEme\lib. Then, you won't need to pass any classpath parameter to the CrEme runtime – it'll find all your jar files automatically.

All in all - Pros

<ol><li>Speed – clearly the fastest JVM for the PPC
</li><li>Indeed compatible with WM5, unlike previous the versions
</li><li>PIE plug-in
</li><li>No networking problems under WM5 with Toonel – everything is working just great!
</li></ol>

Cons
<ol><li>No pre-WM2003 versions any more, which is a pity because even the latest betas supported both PPC2k (including non-ARM CPU's) and PPC2k2.
</li><li>Still uses its own, largely incompatible graphics library. This means for example Wyvern is still incompatible! Switching to Personal Java (-pjava) (also read my other remark on the missing PVMclasses.zip!), Tiny AWT (-tiny) or the full-screen mode (-ntb) (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CrEme41FullScreen.bmp.png) won't help.
</li><li>The system path "blind" overwrite bug is still not fixed (as can also be seen in this (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CremeSystemPathPointToStorageCard.png) and this (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/CremeSystemPathPointToStorageCard-2.bmp.png) screenshot) – it must be manually fixed by the user before any kind of a soft reset to avoid problems! Please read for example this thread (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=774170) (alternatives: MobilitySite (http://www.ipaqhq.com/forums/showthread.php?p=97841), AximSite (http://www.aximsite.com/boards/showthread.php?p=757809), PPC Magazine (http://pocketpcmag.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16986), FirstLoox (http://www.firstloox.org//forums/showthread.php?p=34220), PPCT (http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=354846)) on the bug and the fix. (Serach for "[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Loader]" inside the page to find it quick.)
</li><li>No OK/minimize button in system-level, maximized frames opened (http://www.winmobiletech.com/032006Creme41/Creme410WM5NoOK.bmp.png) ; you'll need to use a task switcher to minimize/close the current one. (A usable solution to this is using the full screen mode with the -ntb command-line switch. Then, you still won't be able to minimize them but at least move to somewhere else.)

</li><li>The Personal Java class library, PVMclasses.zip, is no longer shipped with neither versions. It can, however, be found in the previous versions (if you still have them) of both 4.1 and 3.27; that is, 4.00b8 and 3.26. If you just transfer the previous PVMclasses.zip file to the new version (you can also put it in the storage card, not necessarily in the main storage, despite what the User's Guide ( c:\Program Files\NSIcom\CrE-ME V4.10\Documentation\CrE-ME V4.10 UsersGuide.htm on the desktop) says), it'll work.
</li>
</ol>

Verdict

Go get it if you need a WM5-compliant, fast, reliable, Toonel-compliant JVM with a well-working, good IEM plug in and the midlet and graphics incompatibility is not a problem in standalone applications.

Menneisyys
03-16-2006, 07:42 PM
I've posted a detailed review/roundup/ compliance report / tip collection of current, midlet-capable Java environments on the Pocket PC (including some remarks on the midlet-compliance of Netfront 3.2). It's a must for anyone wanting to run midlets (for example, Opera Mini or Mobile Gmaps) on his or her Pocket PC.

The article can be found at

Smartphone & Pocket PC Magazine Expert Blog: http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/index.php?blog=3&p=644&more=1
FL: http://www.firstloox.org//forums/showthread.php?p=50584
MobilitySite: http://www.mobilitysite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=148245
PPCT: http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=393834
BH: http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=122613
AximSite: http://www.aximsite.com/boards/showthread.php?t=120659

Paul Martin
08-12-2006, 06:04 AM
I'm sure you've written about this before, but my company VPN uses Juniper Networks which utilizes a java program on my PC's. Can I run this on my Dell X51v? Thanks.

Menneisyys
08-12-2006, 06:15 AM
I'm sure you've written about this before, but my company VPN uses Juniper Networks which utilizes a java program on my PC's. Can I run this on my Dell X51v? Thanks.

I don't think it will, but I can give it a try. Is the Java app accessible somewhere? (I've made a quick Google search - in vain.)

Paul Martin
08-12-2006, 06:24 AM
Unfortunately not. When I visit my vpn site, there was some sort of initial install and now it just pops up. I guess I'm confused about how the whole PIE - Java thing works together. Could you point me to one of the tutorials you've written? Again, thanks for so many tutorials/reviews/etc you've written!

Paul

lapchinj
08-13-2006, 04:34 AM
...CrEme is the fastest Java Virtual Machine (JVM) out with moderate system requirements and is, therefore, really worth checking out, particularly if you want to use the great bandwidth reduction tool Toonel or Java applets in Internet Explorer Mobile...
That said, I downloaded the latest and greatest which is 4.1 but I don't know if I'll install it yet because of NSIcom's licensing. At the moment I'm running geode since it was only $40 on Handango. When I read through this thread a few months ago I requested from NSIcom for pricing and they were very expensive (I couldn't find their email with the pricing schedule though). Not a price that would let someone hack around with but rather for someone who intended to deploy some application(s). Am I missing something? Do they have a version with a community license or something that could be used for personal use?

Jeff-

Menneisyys
08-13-2006, 06:18 AM
...CrEme is the fastest Java Virtual Machine (JVM) out with moderate system requirements and is, therefore, really worth checking out, particularly if you want to use the great bandwidth reduction tool Toonel or Java applets in Internet Explorer Mobile...
That said, I downloaded the latest and greatest which is 4.1 but I don't know if I'll install it yet because of NSIcom's licensing. At the moment I'm running geode since it was only $40 on Handango. When I read through this thread a few months ago I requested from NSIcom for pricing and they were very expensive (I couldn't find their email with the pricing schedule though). Not a price that would let someone hack around with but rather for someone who intended to deploy some application(s). Am I missing something? Do they have a version with a community license or something that could be used for personal use?

Jeff-

It seems they only have offers for developers wanting to acquire mass licenses, NOT individual end-user ones. We've been in correspondence - I've asked them to reconsider their current offer startegy in order to offer CrEme licenses to individual users too.

This is certainly a sad situation as CrEme is the best JVM as of now.

lapchinj
08-13-2006, 06:58 AM
It seems they only have offers for developers wanting to acquire mass licenses, NOT individual end-user ones. We've been in correspondence - I've asked them to reconsider their current offer startegy in order to offer CrEme licenses to individual users too.

This is certainly a sad situation as CrEme is the best JVM as of now.
Yeah I was kind of surprised by their response. There really is no way a potential user or developer could use their product without jumping in with both feet. I myself am strictly a desktop RCP developer but would love to do some development on the PDA if I could start on a shoestring and hack around for a while to see if it's for me.

While I have no stats available to attest to the viability of a community or personal offering I do believe that it would be appropriate and even advantageous in getting the product into the publics hands. It was the community paradigm that got me into Java in the fist place just before the turn of the century (make one feel like an old salt). While I do continue my Visual Studio subscription the community paradigm has dragged me away from my 'C' roots and MS development environment over the past couple of years and more into the Java way of things.

Jeff-

Paul Martin
08-14-2006, 03:09 AM
BTW, in one review you mention using Jeode from one of the HP systems it's bundled with. I have one and tried to install it on my x51v. It didn't allow me to install, saying it was for HP only. :(

Menneisyys
08-14-2006, 05:38 AM
BTW, in one review you mention using Jeode from one of the HP systems it's bundled with. I have one and tried to install it on my x51v. It didn't allow me to install, saying it was for HP only. :(

It's version-dependent. Older versions run on other brands too; newer versions are locked.

Paul Martin
08-14-2006, 12:58 PM
Gotcha. It was from an Ipaq 5555 disk.

MTIW Podcast
08-14-2006, 11:44 PM
Although it's kind of unfortunate that Pocket PCs are not yet able to fully take advantage of Java enabled clients and apps, I read somewhere that the Sony MYLO will have rich Java support. Maybe PPC developers can take the MYLO as an example (althought the MYLO runs on an embedded version of Linux).

meenoo
02-16-2007, 05:55 AM
I need to develop speech application in Java and port it to Pocket PC.I was just wondering whether it is possible to make speech application using Mysaifu JVM ? Please help !!!

Great, free Java Virtual Machine Mysaifu Version 0.2.2 is out!

Mysaifu is currently the only, fully Java-compatible Java Virtual Machine (JVM) that is indeed worked on. The others either have been long abandoned long ago (for example Jeode) or haven't been touched for at least a year (IBM J9, CrEme).

Mysaifu has been developed by leaps and bounds. Some months ago it was completely unable to display any graphics or GUI components and was by far the slowest JVM; now, it's displaying them quite well and feels much faster.

I've throroughly tested it with Wyvern, the Java-based multiplayer game (please see the accordingly updated Roundup of Pocket PC Multiplayer Games (http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/menneisyys/102005MPPPCGames.asp). Much as it still has bugs, generally, I was happy with what I have seen – indeed this JVM has great potential.

abwal1
04-09-2007, 04:30 AM
Deal all,

Hello. I'm a newcomer for java pocket pc programming.
Currently, I'm working on a project and need to transfer and modify
the existing java applications running on jdk 1.4 to a windows
mobile pocket pc.

Is anyone able to provide some advices what would be the best
java development platform to do so.

Thanks very much in advance.

fmiguelez
07-13-2007, 11:42 AM
Hello,

I am at the same situation. I have successfully developed a new SWT graphical application with JNI interface for Windows CE 5.0 under WEME 6.1.1 .

My advice is:
-If you plan to migrate an app to PPC you should use the most similar configuration to JRE1.4, which is CDC/Personal Profile 1.1 (the most complete configuration)
-Forget about SWING. No support at all, and no future plans for it. If need GUI use better AWT or even better SWT, which has PPC support.
-Do not expect to find every JRE 1.4 package in J9's JRE. I.e., in my case a painful and notable lack is "java.util.logging", extensively used in my company's software. By the way, has anyone solved this issue in a clean way (no copying of Sun's JRE classes inside classes.zip or sth like that)?

I usually also have random errors when starting my application, such as missing JRE classes or "StackBufferOverflow"-like errors. It is strange since when you try to start the application, more likely when you update a jar in your application, J9 JVM responds with these random errors. Does someone have the same problem? It could be an issue about dynamic memory allocation in PPC platform, but I have no clue about it.

Regards and good look with your findings

fmiguelez
07-13-2007, 12:44 PM
I had forgotten it. The development platform I use is Eclipse (3.2) with the appropriate plug-ins (Visual Editor for SWT).

i00n
09-20-2007, 03:13 AM
How I can run a .jar file wich I dont know if this have any class. When I try simple run it by Mysaifu JVM I'm getting some error message. I dont know what to do, please help :)

edit:
ok, after many tries and falitures I managed to do it propely (I think that so) and still cant run it. Here's text from my .lnk file:

255#"\Storage Card\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp \jars\tibiame.jar tibiame.Main

in "tibiame.Main" I think that "tibiame" is a folder that is inside .jar file and in this folder there is file named "Main.class", Im not 100% sure if I load this class correctly (there are also many more class files inside this .jar but I think that this Main is most important).

Ok now here is what i get after executing my .lnk file:

java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: javax/microedition/midlet/MIDlet not found in java.lang.ClassLoader$1{urls=[file:/jars/tibiame.jar], parent=null}
at java.net.URLClassLoader.findClass(URLClassLoader.java:531)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:342)
at java.lang.ClassLoader$1.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:1112)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:294)
at java.lang.VMClassLoader.defineClass(Native Method)
at java.lang.VMClassLoader.defineClassWithTransformers(VMClassLoader.java:443)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClass(ClassLoader.java:472)
at java.security.SecureClassLoader.defineClass(SecureClassLoader.java)
at java.net.URLClassLoader.findClass(URLClassLoader.java:617)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:342)
at java.lang.ClassLoader$1.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:1112)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(ClassLoader.java:294)
at java.lang.VMMainThread$1.run(VMMainThread.java)
at java.lang.VMThread.run(VMThread.java:120)
JVM exit.


Firs messages that I was getting were kinda short but this one is very long :?

What I'm doing wrong? Please help :(

reymon
12-21-2007, 06:54 PM
look at this page:

http://www.codefund.com/68/running-java-apps-on-pocket-pc-683082.shtm

you can do something like this:
255#"\Storage Card\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp "/jars/tibiame.jar" tibiame.Main

use "" and / for your .jar file

hope it works.
sorry for my english

anydoby
02-21-2008, 10:16 AM
Recently I have had some real project experience with Java on PocketPC. You are welcome to have a look at my thoughts here http://anydoby.com/jblog/article.htm?id=85&lng=en

anydoby
02-21-2008, 10:19 AM
look at this page:

http://www.codefund.com/68/running-java-apps-on-pocket-pc-683082.shtm

you can do something like this:
255#"\Storage Card\Program Files\Mysaifu JVM\jre\bin\jvm.exe" -cp "/jars/tibiame.jar" tibiame.Main

use "" and / for your .jar file

hope it works.
sorry for my english

I've tried this with J9 and it worked. Just create a txt file on your PC, paste the command and then rename the file to lnk (windows won't let you do this, so use cmd "move myfile.txt myfile.lnk") and copy to pocketpc. the only drawback is that the icon will be the same as for J9 executable

winhax
06-20-2008, 09:27 AM
I looked everywhere and I found only partial information on this subject. So, is there any way to compile complete Java Midlets on a Smartphone such as the T-Mobile Dash? Is this most likely another problem for me to solve on my own?

winhax
07-08-2008, 08:00 AM
I started a thread in the Smartphone forums and came up with a solution. Here's a direct link to it for anyone interested. http://forums.thoughtsmedia.com/f27/compiling-midlets-t-mobile-dash-other-smartphone-89765.html#post688042

:)