Why Photostory 3 Video Won't Play on your Pocket PC Without WMP10 Mobile

[Jason Dunn]

When PhotoStory 3 came out, and I saw that it had video export templates for Pocket PCs and Smartphones, I immediately whipped up a video and tried to play it on my Orange C500 Smartphone...and only got audio. Puzzled, I started to dig deeper, and I eventually found the answer - and I wasn't pleased about it.<br /><br />When Windows Media 9 Series came out, it introduced a series of new codecs that completely broke the Windows Media platform when it came to mobile devices. People using Windows Media Player 8 Mobile couldn't get a new version of the player, or the codecs, so there was a period of frustration and users had no choice but to buy new devices if they wanted to play back Windows Media content based on the 9 Series codecs. It was a frustrating period of time, and it upset a lot of people who felt they weren't getting the full benefit of their investment, but I thought that sort of thing would only happen once. I should have known better. :?<!><br /><br />The exact same thing is happening again now with Windows Media Player 10 Mobile and certain types of video files. With no fanfare, two new types of video codecs were introduced to the Windows Media family: Windows Media Video 9 Advanced Profile and Windows Media Video 9 Image Version 2. The latter one is causing the problem, because that's the codec that Photo Story 3 uses. Here's a description of that codec and what it does:<br /><br /><i>"With this new codec, still images can be transformed into video by using pan, zoom, and various transition effects. By combining transitions with pans, zooms, and cross-fades, an almost unlimited number of effects can be created. The results can then be delivered at data rates as low as 20 kilobits per second (Kbps). These files, compressed using either constant-bit-rate (CBR) or one-pass variable-bit-rate (VBR) modes, can be shared easily because they are much smaller than the original image files. Note that Windows Media Video 9 Image version 2 is not compatible with the previous version of the codec."</i><br /><br />So, in essence, this codec was needed in order for Photo Story to use the transitions from Windows Movie Maker. My question is, why? The Ken Burns-style photo zooms and pans are a perfect way to present photos. Cheesy video transitions might look good on a marketing bullet list, but in real life they should be avoided.<br /><br />The story for owners of Pocket PCs without Windows Media Player 10 Mobile is grim: <b>unless the OEM who made your device decides to release an update, you'll never get the player</b>. And even though the codec is all you need, Microsoft has no system in place to update WMP9 Mobile with the new codec - even though, technically, it should be possible because it has a codec-pluggable architecture.<br /><br />This is yet another sign that the OEMs who make and sell the devices want us to think of them as appliances, like a microwave, instead of real computers that can be updated with new software. :?

[Janak Parekh]

This is yet another sign that the OEMs who make and sell the devices want us to think of them as appliances, like a microwave, instead of real computers that can be updated with new software. :?
... and another example of how Microsoft is hurting adoption of the Windows Media formats.

Another example: as far as I know, there is no chance I'll have a media player on my existing Pocket PC or Smartphone that'll be capable of Janus DRM-based (i.e., rental service) music. I'd love to have that service, but I guess I won't. I know I won't be buying a new Pocket PC for it. (In comparison, Apple released updates for all their iPods, including their oldest, when they unveiled FairPlay DRM.)

(In case one's wondering, this MVP isn't happy with the lack of support of Windows Media Player upgrades on Pocket PCs...)

--janak

[david291]

The same problem exists with Media Player for the Mac. The Mac version lags the Windows version, and newer video won't play on the latest Mac version. You get directed to a page that tells you to upgrade, and then in the same breath tells you're at the latest version.

[carrigaline]

Photostory 3 does not work well with my Axim X50v as the resolution choice given for the pocket pc is QVGA and comes out way too small on my unit. If I try to use the desktop version it is jumpy on the X50v. I tried installing OZVGA and then playing the desktop resolution version but that blew my unit and I had to do a hard reset.

I can't believe that a program team working on PhotoStory 3 which has WM output as an option, did not seek to include a pocket pc VGA resolution option in this new version of their software.......its not as if they didn't know it was out there!

[bob1919a]

I've seen a tricked out microwave before. Some guy thought his software which controlled the microwaves' radiation could be BIOS flashed. So he found the chip from another microwave which was newer, and soldered it in. It made his microwave super powerful. But of course, I guess that's a hardware upgrade. Heh, speaking of 'tricking out', he also added a neon underglow to the microwave plate, along with spinners and hydraulics.... 8)

[SpaceDust]

Janak, as an MVP I'm fairly certain you're aware of and understand how the OEM/Microsoft partnership works with regard to the ROMs, so I find it hard to believe you're blaming Microsoft for not providing the updated codecs to the public. The blame should be pointed squarely at the OEMs for failing to live up to your perception of their obligation to you.

Microsoft owns the code, sure, but the individually designed ROM packages are owned by the OEM. Microsoft is obligated to NOT offer updates to the software provided in the ROMs to the public. It's up to the OEM to provide updates.

Personally, I'm angry with HP that my h6315 doesn't have all the latest software, since at the price it was offered it SHOULD have been state-of-the-art. Instead, it's one OS version behind and buggy as heck. But the blame goes where it belongs for both software and hardware - HP.

It's quite a bit different from Apple and the iPod - Apple owns and controls both the hardware and software, there aren't 50 different hardware versions of the iPod built by third parties (all with very different hardware and different drivers) that have to be considered.

With regard to Mac, well, it seems that Microsoft doesn't put a high priority on freebies for the Mac beyond a certain point. I'm not saying I think that's good, but I guess I understand it.

[unuselessj]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.

[Janak Parekh]

Janak, as an MVP I'm fairly certain you're aware of and understand how the OEM/Microsoft partnership works with regard to the ROMs, so I find it hard to believe you're blaming Microsoft for not providing the updated codecs to the public. The blame should be pointed squarely at the OEMs for failing to live up to your perception of their obligation to you.
Oh, I'm fully aware, but I'm not happy with that arrangement. In Pocket PC 2002, we had "End-User Updates", or EUUs, in which Windows Media Player updates were delivered -- using CABs that were untouched, straight from Microsoft. We've regressed from there to the situation where OEMs have to assemble and distribute the ROM, which they tend to be less proactive in doing.

Also, it's in Microsoft's interest to promote Windows Media, right? Why not at least provide a RAM installer for WMP10? That would sidestep the whole issue (it'd bring up the RAM issue, but at least that's mitigable). Again, Microsoft used to do this: WMP 7 (or was it 7.1)? was released as a RAM download.

So it's not quite open-and-shut as you suggest. OEMs often won't bother, because they don't have a vested interest in Windows Media. But Microsoft does.

I'm also aware that Apple is a different situation, but currently their approach is winning in the media space. If Microsoft hopes to compete they've got to change tacks from alienating customers in the portable media space. Pocket PCs aren't that cheap.

--janak

[Menneisyys]

"With this new codec, still images can be transformed into video by using pan, zoom, and various transition effects. By combining transitions with pans, zooms, and cross-fades, an almost unlimited number of effects can be created. The results can then be delivered at data rates as low as 20 kilobits per second (Kbps). These files, compressed using either constant-bit-rate (CBR) or one-pass variable-bit-rate (VBR) modes, can be shared easily because they are much smaller than the original image files. Note that Windows Media Video 9 Image version 2 is not compatible with the previous version of the codec."

What's so revolutionary about this? ;) Tons of PPC slideshow viewers are capable of this. Just a quick list of the PPC slideshow'ers and the transition effects + special features they have off my forthcoming picviewer/editor roundup:

Spb Imageer 1.2: 24 transition effects
XnView 1.20: Creates an .EXE slideshow (watchable w/o any kind of pic viewer). There're a lot of transition effects (even if their speed can't be set (and may be, therefore, anningly slow) and can only be applied randomly); specifiable background MP3 music
Resco Picture Viewer 5.1: 16 transition effects; (even several; even MP3's) background music,
Fujitsu-Siemens Album: 52 transition effects

[Menneisyys]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.

Nope, the x5 won't get the WMP10 upgrade. Only the X30/X50 devices and the iPAQ 37xx have it; and, prolly, the A730(w) will also get it.

BTW, just check out my prev post: image viewers are FAR better solutions pic quality-wise.

[Janak Parekh]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.
Nope. WMP10 was released as part of an "updated ROM" for WM2003SE. Even many SE devices (like my e805) don't have it (and never will AFAICT). :|

--janak

[Menneisyys]

In Pocket PC 2002, we had "End-User Updates", or EUUs, in which Windows Media Player updates were delivered -- using CABs that were untouched, straight from Microsoft.

Yeah. It should be pointed out, however, that e.g. iPAQ 36xx users have never received the WMP 8.5 available for 32M ROM machines in EUU3, so Compaq didn't really pay much attention to "poor" 36xx users (it should have been Compaq's task to make it installable into RAM.)

(Incidentally, I've written about this a lot in my article on PPC-based multimedia / streaming / netsharing-related article at http://www.freeweb.hu/menneisyys/streaming/ - warning, it's non-English!)

[zetsurin]

Can't help but to think that someone might be able to make a truckload of cash by writing some kind of updater system which attempts to update some of these missing components compliments of a newer ROM. Of course, no ROMs would be able to be shipped and it would be up to the user to find them, but it's still almost like 98Lite in concept and the ROMs are there if you know where to look.

Of course, it wouldn't be possible to update all DLLs etc due to various system dependencies that they might have, but I am willing to suspect that it would still be possible to upgrade some components this way, as long as the chain of all dependencies could be worked out and if none of them rely on the actual hardware to be the same (of course, there have been cases where this hasn't been a problem as the hardware is the same: point in case the Toshiba e800 users who are running with the newer ATI video drivers lifted from a Compaq hx4700 ROM).

Granted, this isn't an easy task but factor in that the CE device driver model hasn't significantly changed since CE 2.11 or 3.0 (correct me if I am wrong) and the base implementation of the Win32 API hasn't exactly changed signicantly and technically there is some kind of hope with respect to feasability in the technical sence.

The variation in hardware on these Pocket PC devices isn't anywhere near what the variation is wssith desktop PCs, so it would be interesting to see how much binary code between two devices ROMs in fact are that much different (excepting the vendor specific bundles stuff of course).

Just an idea. Something needs to give and there's probably more chance of this happening than the vendors investing $$$ to provide us with the updates.

[SpaceDust]

Janak, as an MVP I'm fairly certain you're aware of and understand how the OEM/Microsoft partnership works with regard to the ROMs, so I find it hard to believe you're blaming Microsoft for not providing the updated codecs to the public. The blame should be pointed squarely at the OEMs for failing to live up to your perception of their obligation to you.
Oh, I'm fully aware, but I'm not happy with that arrangement. In Pocket PC 2002, we had "End-User Updates", or EUUs, in which Windows Media Player updates were delivered -- using CABs that were untouched, straight from Microsoft. We've regressed from there to the situation where OEMs have to assemble and distribute the ROM, which they tend to be less proactive in doing.


Yes, but in Pocket PC 2002 days I'm betting you would find there were fewer differences between the devices from a hardware perspective. I believe that the OEMs actually PUSHED for the "assemble their own ROM" so they could customize what was included depending on the intended use of the device, and so that they could build stripped down, less expensive models. Keep in mind that in this case, the customer for Microsoft is the OEM - they're buying the software license. Also keep in mind that this arrangement means that Microsoft is not bearing the brunt of support for multiple customized versions of the OS and included software - each OEM gets to support their own flavor. It's the price of allowing flexibility.


Also, it's in Microsoft's interest to promote Windows Media, right? Why not at least provide a RAM installer for WMP10? That would sidestep the whole issue (it'd bring up the RAM issue, but at least that's mitigable). Again, Microsoft used to do this: WMP 7 (or was it 7.1)? was released as a RAM download.


While I don't disagree with you, I'm not sure how well WM10 installed outside the ROM would play with the WM9 that still exists in the ROM. I don't remember; when WM7 was released as a RAM download, did a previous version of WMP already exist on the device? It's been so long in terms of technical evolution that I don't remember ;-)


So it's not quite open-and-shut as you suggest. OEMs often won't bother, because they don't have a vested interest in Windows Media. But Microsoft does.


Actually, if enough people make noise and KEEP making noise, as well as voting with their wallets and making sure the reasons are communicated up to the top of the companies, the OEMs will find they, too, have a vested interest in making sure the updates are made available. And not just for Windows Media Player, but for all their chosen components. There are lots of options out there these days. We have to make sure the big players are aware of that, and that they don't have some sort of automatic lock on our purchasing dollar if they fail to support us.

I think it's actually GOOD that Apple is doing well with the iPod and with their update model. Maybe it will help to serve as a wakeup call. But don't hold your breath - until the iPod does most or all of what a PDA does, it's not truly competition. The "big boys" are watching it, without a doubt, but it won't drive their decision making QUITE yet. After all, the success of the PocketPC doesn't really lie in being the best in any single arena. It lies in the flexibility of the product - the ability to do many things well. The iPod excels at one thing - playing media.

[Janak Parekh]

Yes, but in Pocket PC 2002 days I'm betting you would find there were fewer differences between the devices from a hardware perspective. I believe that the OEMs actually PUSHED for the "assemble their own ROM" so they could customize what was included depending on the intended use of the device, and so that they could build stripped down, less expensive models.
I'm aware of that. But we have to draw the line somewhere. Personally, I would have set the bar a little higher.

Also keep in mind that this arrangement means that Microsoft is not bearing the brunt of support for multiple customized versions of the OS and included software - each OEM gets to support their own flavor. It's the price of allowing flexibility.
Well, the EUUs were also "released" by the OEMs, but it didn't need an entire ROM reassembly, so it had a greater chance of being released.

While I don't disagree with you, I'm not sure how well WM10 installed outside the ROM would play with the WM9 that still exists in the ROM. I don't remember; when WM7 was released as a RAM download, did a previous version of WMP already exist on the device?
Yes -- the original version of WMP, v4. It only played music, and in fact it did it better than WMP7, but hey, it still stayed in ROM.

Actually, if enough people make noise and KEEP making noise, as well as voting with their wallets and making sure the reasons are communicated up to the top of the companies, the OEMs will find they, too, have a vested interest in making sure the updates are made available.
How does one vote with their wallet? HP hasn't released updates to WMP10 for all their units. Neither has Toshiba, Dell, Asus, etc. Are you suggesting we go over to Palm? ;)

And not just for Windows Media Player, but for all their chosen components.
Ah, but you see, some of the components evolve faster than others. WMP has moved much faster than the rest of the OS.

I think it's actually GOOD that Apple is doing well with the iPod and with their update model. Maybe it will help to serve as a wakeup call. But don't hold your breath - until the iPod does most or all of what a PDA does, it's not truly competition.
I'm fully aware. ;)

The "big boys" are watching it, without a doubt, but it won't drive their decision making QUITE yet.
In fact, I think OEMs are going in the opposite direction. The fact that HP released the 6315 after SE was released, and without it, clearly suggests the consumerization of the device where ROM updates are the exception, not the norm.

After all, the success of the PocketPC doesn't really lie in being the best in any single arena. It lies in the flexibility of the product - the ability to do many things well.
Somehow, though, I don't expect all the WMA-compatible media players to be updated with Janus DRM support. I think the Pocket PC situation with respect to WMP is symptomatic, not an aberration. I'd love to be wrong.

Yeah. It should be pointed out, however, that e.g. iPAQ 36xx users have never received the WMP 8.5 available for 32M ROM machines in EUU3, so Compaq didn't really pay much attention to "poor" 36xx users (it should have been Compaq's task to make it installable into RAM.)
Well... about this I'm not quite so sure. The problem here is that the EUU wouldn't be the same for the 36xx as the rest of the Pocket PCs, and (I think; it's been so long) WMP was only RAM installable for Pocket PC 2002 on the 36xx units in the first place anyway. But hey, if MS had made a RAM version installable, that would have solved the problem in the first place. ;)

--janak

[Menneisyys]

Yeah . It should be pointed out, however, that e.g. iPAQ 36xx users have never received the WMP 8.5 available for 32M ROM machines in EUU3, so Compaq didn't really pay much attention to "poor" 36xx users (it should have been Compaq's task to make it installable into RAM.)
Well... about this I'm not quite so sure. The problem here is that the EUU wouldn't be the same for the 36xx as the rest of the Pocket PCs, and (I think; it's been so long) WMP was only RAM installable for Pocket PC 2002 on the 36xx units in the first place anyway. But hey, if MS had made a RAM version installable, that would have solved the problem in the first place. ;)

--janak

Yes, PPC2k2's WMP8 ran from RAM on 31xx/36xx devices (16M ROM, as opposed to the 32 of the other iPAQ's) as well. Indeed, it should have been MS's job to make it RAM-installable, but they failed that; and, Compaq has also failed releasing WMP8.5 for the 36xx users too. How much we waited for it/wanted it...

[Jason Dunn]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.

It might be TECHNICALLY possible, but the reality is that you can't get it anywhere - Microsoft could have made a RAM-based installer available, but they didn't and left it up to the OEMs. :?

[Jason Dunn]

What's so revolutionary about this? ;) Tons of PPC slideshow viewers are capable of this. Just a quick list of the PPC slideshow'ers and the transition effects + special features they have off my forthcoming picviewer/editor roundup...

Which one of those products does the "Ken Burns" zooming/motion panning?

[Paragon]

Crud.....I used to like listening to music, it was so easy! Now it's almost impossible to listen to music on my PPC. It's to the point where it's easier just to hire the band to setup in my livingroom. Unfortunately there's a downside to having U2 living in your house full time. 8O

I too quite liked it when MS provided RAM upgrades for WMP. I guess it comes back to the issue of OEMs wanting to control what is available for present devices in such a way that it forces the need to buy new hardware in order to upgrade.

Personally I see providing easy upgrade access for WMP as a positive thing for the platform.

Dave

[jeffmd]

as jason just touched on, there is really NO reason MS could not have offered a RAM based upgrade. Heck it dosnt even need to upgrade, just make it a player that stands next to the old one, much like pocketTV and betaplayer do.

On the other hand, I don't think wmv9 is something you wanna mess with on the pocket pc. It's pretty clear on the pc that the wmv9 codec is alot more cpu intensive then the old wmv, you would be getting poorer performance on a pocket pc.

[ctmagnus]

Unfortunately there's a downside to having U2 living in your house full time.

The constant Irish-accented chatter?

[surur]

Hell, I hope desktops never go the way of pocketpc's. Imagine being so dependent on OEM's that you could never upgrade your device without their permission. Many laptop owners are in a similar boat, and it will probably only get worse. And laptops are getting very popular these days...

Surur

[Paragon]

Unfortunately there's a downside to having U2 living in your house full time.

The constant Irish-accented chatter?

Hehe! That and the cost of food, booze, electical, and all the arguments with the neighbors over the noise level..... come to think of it, it's no different from when the inlaws come over. :-)

An upgrade to WMP 10 would be much easier.

Dave

[threedaysdwn]

In comparison, Apple released updates for all their iPods, including their oldest, when they unveiled FairPlay DRM.

Actually, that's not true. Those of us that bought first-gen iPods (when 5GB was the only choice) were abandoned. Even though the hardware was exactly the same, Apple refused to add AAC and Windows support to that model.

Pretty harsh, considering the second-gen model came out within a month of my purchase (and the Apple store never told me a new model was coming... and had some wacky "17 day" return policy or something like that).

[Chafic]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.

I have come across a workaround that I thought I would share with you. After creating the photostory, import it into Windows movie maker, from there you can save it in a format that "older" media players can play on PPC/Smartphone. I tried it on my Ipaq 6315 and it worked well. You have to experiment with bitrate/size, but you can get away with a low bit rate since the 6315 is not exactly a screaming processor.

[Darius Wey]

What's so revolutionary about this? ;) Tons of PPC slideshow viewers are capable of this. Just a quick list of the PPC slideshow'ers and the transition effects + special features they have off my forthcoming picviewer/editor roundup

A temporary alternative is what I call it. Photo stories (a.k.a. videos) have become very popular lately, especially in Microsoft software. The beauty of it is you can bring it from Device A to Device B and still play it back with the transition effects. It beats the image viewers as not every device has Spb Imageer, Resco Picture Viewer, etc. Now the huge fallacy in this argument is that not every device is capable of playing photo stories created in PhotoStory 3 - evidently seen in the main discussion of this thread (not every device has WMP10 Mobile). But at least you can port it over to the PC and MCEs and still play it, as opposed to the picture viewers. ;)

Granted - with poor encoding, image quality may be a little lacking, but the fact is, if you do it right, it could turn out to be the better option for most.

[Darius Wey]

I have come across a workaround that I thought I would share with you. After creating the photostory, import it into Windows movie maker, from there you can save it in a format that "older" media players can play on PPC/Smartphone. I tried it on my Ipaq 6315 and it worked well. You have to experiment with bitrate/size, but you can get away with a low bit rate since the 6315 is not exactly a screaming processor.

Thanks for sharing. It's a seemingly obvious solution that I had to resort to when I first tried Photo Story a couple of months ago when it was released. While it was nice, it seems to kill the entire "automated" process that Photo Story delivers. What use is "user-friendly" automation, when manual control takes over at the end of the day?

[Jason Dunn]

Thanks for sharing. It's a seemingly obvious solution that I had to resort to when I first tried Photo Story a couple of months ago when it was released.

Yeah, whoops :oops: I should have mentioned this in my rant - this is the only solution at the moment.

[Janak Parekh]

Actually, that's not true. Those of us that bought first-gen iPods (when 5GB was the only choice) were abandoned. Even though the hardware was exactly the same, Apple refused to add AAC and Windows support to that model.
Huh? You mean iPod Software 1.4 (http://www.apple.com/ipod/download/) for the Scroll Wheel iPod doesn't work? IIRC, the Scroll Wheel iPod was 1G, the Touch Wheel was 2G, the complete touch was 3G, and the Click Wheel 4G. I could have sworn one of my colleagues had one and we updated it, but it was some time ago...

Mind you, you probably need a Mac box to do the initial update, as the original iPod was only supported on Macs, but I'd be surprised if no one developed a workaround...

--janak

[Menneisyys]

Again, Microsoft used to do this: WMP 7 (or was it 7.1)? was released as a RAM download.


Actually, it was a free upgrade (build 0103) for the official, build 0096 WMP8.0 that came on the PPC2k2 upgrade CD's. The latter was never available as a free download at Microsoft, only the build 0103 upgrade, which was useless without installing the (mostly paid-for) WMP8 upgrade first.

[Menneisyys]

What's so revolutionary about this? ;) Tons of PPC slideshow viewers are capable of this. Just a quick list of the PPC slideshow'ers and the transition effects + special features they have off my forthcoming picviewer/editor roundup

A temporary alternative is what I call it. Photo stories (a.k.a. videos) have become very popular lately, especially in Microsoft software. The beauty of it is you can bring it from Device A to Device B and still play it back with the transition effects. It beats the image viewers as not every device has Spb Imageer, Resco Picture Viewer, etc. Now the huge fallacy in this argument is that not every device is capable of playing photo stories created in PhotoStory 3 - evidently seen in the main discussion of this thread (not every device has WMP10 Mobile). But at least you can port it over to the PC and MCEs and still play it, as opposed to the picture viewers. ;)


That's right - but XnView 1.20 on the PPC took this even further - it creates an .EXE-based slideshow, which is watchable without any kind of installed pic viewer. The EXE contains all the (downscaled) images, the transition effects and so on (of course, it's PPC-based, not multi-platform). So, there is (in this case, free) alternative to WMP10, at least on the PPC.

[silver99]

Photostory 3 does not work well with my Axim X50v as the resolution choice given for the pocket pc is QVGA and comes out way too small on my unit. If I try to use the desktop version it is jumpy on the X50v.

It's a little jumpy on my X50v too. No reason it should be that way with all the horsepower in that thing. I just want smooth transitions.

[Menneisyys]

Photostory 3 does not work well with my Axim X50v as the resolution choice given for the pocket pc is QVGA and comes out way too small on my unit. If I try to use the desktop version it is jumpy on the X50v.

It's a little jumpy on my X50v too. No reason it should be that way with all the horsepower in that thing. I just want smooth transitions.

If you don't need desktop/MCE compliance, why don't you use e.g. Spb Imageer or Resco for real VGA slideshows/really cool transitions? PDA-based slideshow viewers are pretty advanced.

[david291]

It's a little jumpy on my X50v too. No reason it should be that way with all the horsepower in that thing.
Four times the number of pixels requires four times the work to bring those pixels to life. An X50v will be slower and consume more battery than its non-VGA counterpart.

[Janak Parekh]

Again, Microsoft used to do this: WMP 7 (or was it 7.1)? was released as a RAM download.

Actually, it was a free upgrade (build 0103) for the official, build 0096 WMP8.0 that came on the PPC2k2 upgrade CD's. The latter was never available as a free download at Microsoft, only the build 0103 upgrade, which was useless without installing the (mostly paid-for) WMP8 upgrade first.
Ah, but I was referring to WMP7 on Pocket PC 2000. I'm aware WMP8 was different, and in fact that was when Microsoft started shifting to preferring ROM-based WMP -- it feels like WMP8 was a throwin on the CD more than anything else.

--janak

[Jason Dunn]

If you don't need desktop/MCE compliance, why don't you use e.g. Spb Imageer or Resco for real VGA slideshows/really cool transitions? PDA-based slideshow viewers are pretty advanced.

I didn't see you answer my last question - which of these products do motion panning? There isn't one, which is all I was trying to get you to admit. ;-) You're trying to suggest solutions that simply are not relavent to this problem - we want to view our PhotoStory 3 created video files on our Pocket PC, and we can't, which is my complaint.

I helped create Imageer, so I'm very much aware of the fact that is has transitions. ;-)

[silver99]

It's a little jumpy on my X50v too. No reason it should be that way with all the horsepower in that thing.
Four times the number of pixels requires four times the work to bring those pixels to life. An X50v will be slower and consume more battery than its non-VGA counterpart.

Granted but I'm not about to substitute qualtity for performance.

[silver99]

Photostory 3 does not work well with my Axim X50v as the resolution choice given for the pocket pc is QVGA and comes out way too small on my unit. If I try to use the desktop version it is jumpy on the X50v.

It's a little jumpy on my X50v too. No reason it should be that way with all the horsepower in that thing. I just want smooth transitions.

If you don't need desktop/MCE compliance, why don't you use e.g. Spb Imageer or Resco for real VGA slideshows/really cool transitions? PDA-based slideshow viewers are pretty advanced.

Well I just looked at those 2 solutions but can't seem to find if they allow you to attach an audio clip with the photo viewing and also allow you to gradually zoom in (like a movie camera).

I'm all up for new solutions but the ease that Photostory gives me to create a great photo montage is awesome with the music. I haven't found one yet of this calibur. For just picture viewing the Picture app that comes with the X50v is sufficient. What'd be great is to convert these Photostory files (.wmv) into a MPEG-4 so that Betaplayer could play them back smoothly. I think that would be the best solution but haven't really had the time to check it out if it could be done jumping through some hoops.

[Menneisyys]

Ah, but I was referring to WMP7 on Pocket PC 2000. I'm aware WMP8 was different, and in fact that was when Microsoft started shifting to preferring ROM-based WMP -- it feels like WMP8 was a throwin on the CD more than anything else.

Yeah, that's OK. The WMP8 series just occurred to my mind at first when heard the word 'RAM-based (that is, on the 31xx/36xx series) media player' - I've spent several hours trying to hack WMP8.5 on my iPAQ 3660. (I from time to time live abroad and my preferred way to listen to Finnish radio stations is via my PDA's. This is why I wanted WMP8.5 with it far stabler streaming capabilities than the older WMP8-series WMP's so much.)

[Menneisyys]

Well I just looked at those 2 solutions but can't seem to find if they allow you to attach an audio clip with the photo viewing and also allow you to gradually zoom in (like a movie camera).

(this really should be split to another thread because it's completely offtopic, and I promise won't discuss alternative solutions in this topic any more: Resco allows for attaching any number of MP3 files to be played along with the slideshow, even in a loop. Check out View/Slidehos/Slide Show Audio. Of course, zooming and similar, advanced transitions are missing from PPC-based slideshowers, so they can't be full-fledged WMP10 alternatives. I've only mentioned there're some slideshow-capable PPC progs to offer some alternative to this particular problem.)

[rene_canlas]

What's so revolutionary about this? Tons of PPC slideshow viewers are capable of this. Just a quick list of the PPC slideshow'ers and the transition effects + special features they have off my forthcoming picviewer/editor roundup

While these products may have transition effects, what they lack is the pan/zoom effect popularized by Ken Burns (http://www.picturetotv.com/kenburnseffect.htm), which blew me away the first time I used Windows Media Center Edition slideshows.

[Menneisyys]

You're trying to suggest solutions that simply are not relavent to this problem - we want to view our PhotoStory 3 created video files on our Pocket PC, and we can't, which is my complaint.

Thta's right, sorry for being offtopic.

[Darius Wey]

That's right - but XnView 1.20 on the PPC took this even further - it creates an .EXE-based slideshow, which is watchable without any kind of installed pic viewer. The EXE contains all the (downscaled) images, the transition effects and so on (of course, it's PPC-based, not multi-platform). So, there is (in this case, free) alternative to WMP10, at least on the PPC.


Cool. But my point was that the photo-stories go one-up on the picture viewers because of the multi-platform support. The only rant is that not all Pocket PCs support Photo Story 3-created files, but I still think multi-platform support takes the cake. ;)

[inteller]

Is it possible to run Windows Media Player 10 Mobile on WM2003 as opposed to WM2003SE? I use an Axim X5 and I'll probably be using it for a while. I think it would be nifty if I could make small little slideshows and use my axim to shot them to people.


oh its entirely possible, but the *******s at microsoft orphaned us 2003 users so we'd be forced to get a new device.

[Rob Alexander]

Actually, if enough people make noise and KEEP making noise, as well as voting with their wallets and making sure the reasons are communicated up to the top of the companies, the OEMs will find they, too, have a vested interest in making sure the updates are made available.
How does one vote with their wallet? HP hasn't released updates to WMP10 for all their units. Neither has Toshiba, Dell, Asus, etc. Are you suggesting we go over to Palm? ;)


How about if we stop buying every new model of PPC that comes out when it's of only marginal improvement over the previous generation. That is, stop buying any PPC that doesn't offer a full slate of major advances in technology.

There are two ways to vote with your wallet: you can actively buy a competing product (i.e. Palm) or you can just continue to use your existing PPC for another two years. You can also encourage people to buy the previous generation of PPCs, which are getting down to bargain prices now, and see if the industry doesn't get the message that they'll need to come up with exciting new devices to get repeat business.

[Rob Alexander]

Pretty harsh, considering the second-gen model came out within a month of my purchase (and the Apple store never told me a new model was coming... and had some wacky "17 day" return policy or something like that).


Oh yeah, that would be the 'however long you've had it minus one day' return policy. It's getting more popular all the time. :lol: