A Strong Competitor - Asus MyPal A730 Reviewed

[Zack Mahdavi]

<img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-0.jpg" /><br /><br /><b>Product Category:</b> Hardware, Handheld, Pocket PC<br /><b>Manufacturer:</b> <a href="http://www.asus.com/">Asus</a><br /><b>Where to Buy:</b> <a href="http://www.mobileplanet.com/private/pocketpcthoughts/product.asp?dept%5Fid=2621&amp;pf%5Fid=MPK00354&amp;listing=1">Mobile Planet</a> (affiliate)<br /><b>Price:</b> $499<br /><b>Specifications:</b><li>520Mhz Intel processor;<br /><li>64 MB SDRAM, 64MB FLASH ROM;<br /><li>3.7" VGA 65536 color display;<br /><li>Compact Flash and Secure Digital slots;<br /><li>Bluetooth and USB Client/Host;<br /><li>1.3 MP Camera;<br /><li>1100 mAh battery for up to 9 hours battery life;<br /><li>117.5mm x 72.8mm x 16.9mm, 6 oz (170 g).<br /><b>Pros:</b><li>Beautiful, large VGA display;<br /><li>USB Host support is useful for those who want to connect external devices;<br /><li>1.3 MP camera;<br /><li>Case design is solid and well built;<br /><li>Cradle is solid and heavy;<br /><li>Very long battery life.<br /><b>Cons:</b><li>Taking pictures is a slow process and pictures are impossible to take in dark conditions;<br /><li>WiFi model coming soon.<br /><b>Summary:</b><br />Asus has introduced a high end Pocket PC that rivals the HP iPaq hx4705 in price and features. It's built well, has a VGA screen, and a ton of other features at a very competitive price. Does this device have what it takes to compete with the big boys?<br /><br />Read on for the full review!<!><br /><PAGEBREAK><br /><span><b>What's in the Package?</b></span><br />The Asus MyPal A730 comes with the usual array of items. The cradle is heavy and makes sliding the PDA into and out of it easy. It even features a convenient stylus holder, although there is not a battery slot for charging a second battery. A USB sync cable and power cable plug into the back of the cradle. They also double as travel cables to sync and charge the PDA. <br /><br />The A730 also comes with a fairly nice case with a magnetic closure. A slot on the back of the case allows you to slip your belt into it. It also comes with a removable wrist strap.<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-2.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 1: The included A730 case.</i><br /><br />Finally, a CD is included with a ton of free and trial software. Some of the software is only available in Traditional Chinese, however. The English programs included are MoneyTracer, Presentation DX, Pocket Painter, Map King, Engineering Calculator, Dung Cleaner, and Monster Chinese. Some will find these programs useful, but I didn't bother to install them. Still, kudos to Asus for including such a large software bundle.<br /><br /><span><b>What Really Matters...the PDA</b></span><br />I was really impressed by the Asus A730 on many levels. First of all, the PDA is well built. The buttons have a good "click" to them and do not rattle. The PDA is made of a very hard plastic, which closely imitates an aluminum metal finish. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-3.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 2: The MyPal A730 is well built and feels solid to the touch.</i><br /><br />The MyPal A730 features a removable battery; the entire back of the case slides out for access to the battery. This gives the back of the PDA a clean look with no annoying doors or hinges. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-4.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 3: The entire back slides out for easy access to the battery.</i><br /><br />The top of the PDA gives you access to a headphone jack, Compact Flash slot, and Secure Digital slot. As expected, both memory slots come with slide-in covers to protect the slots from getting dust-laden. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-5.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 4: Top of the A730.</i><br /><br /><PAGEBREAK><br />The bottom of the PDA contains the sync/charge port, reset pin, and the stylus slot. Yes, the stylus goes into the bottom of the PDA. Considering that I am used to accessing the stylus from the top of the PDA, it took me quite a while to adjust to pulling the stylus out from the bottom of the device. This is frustrating since you must pull the device out of the cradle to access the stylus. That makes the cradle's "stylus holder" very convenient. I found it very useful to keep the bundled second stylus in the cradle stylus holder at all times.<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-6-v2.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 5: The stylus is located on the bottom of the device.</i><br /><br />The PDA's VGA screen is very large and bright. After playing around with this device for a few days, I couldn't bear reading news on my QVGA HP iPAQ 4155. If you're thinking about buying a new device, I'd highly recommend buying one with a VGA screen. I am not going to show VGA vs QVGA screenshot comparisons, since these kinds of comparisons aren't related to the device itself. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-7.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 6: The A730's screen at full brightness is much brighter than the iPAQ 4155.</i><br /><br />The size of the Asus A730 is larger than I like my PDAs to be. Of course, I prefer my PDAs to be as small as possible since I keep them in my jeans pocket. I would have preferred that this device come with a flip cover, which would eliminate the need for an external case. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-8.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 7: The A730 is noticeably larger than an iPAQ 4155.</i><br /><br />A unique feature of this PDA is the USB host support. You will have to purchase the proprietary cable separately, which connects the USB device to the PDA's sync port. I wasn't able to test this feature since I did not have the right cable. <br /><br /><PAGEBREAK><br /><span><b>Camera &amp; Sound</b></span><br />The MyPal A730 has a built-in 1.3MP camera, making it one of only a few of the currently available VGA resolution Pocket PCs to offer such a feature. However, the pictures are murky in scenes that are lit with artificial light. Even with the flash on, I couldn't get the pictures to look quite right. It's nice, however, to see a Pocket PC manufacturer include a flash with the camera. A flash can make all the difference in a dark scene. Another thing to note is that it takes the "Asus Camera" application several seconds to start up, which pretty much eliminates the possibility of using this camera to take quick shots. I think that this slowness problem can be fixed with a ROM update. In general, however, the 1.3MP pictures turn out very nice when taking pictures of scenes illuminated with natural light.<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-9.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 8: This is a picture of my room taken with a very bright fluorescent light.</i><br /><br />On the other hand, the ASUS Camera application has some cool features including a picture organizer and a slide show program. It can also access photos stores anywhere on the Pocket PC. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-10.gif" /><br /><i>Figure 9: The included ASUS Camera program is loaded.</i><br /><br />Sound plays well on this device. The built in speaker is loud, and mp3s play well through the headphone jack. The model that I tested includes the new Windows Mobile 2003 Second Edition "Adaptation Kit Update 2" (aka AKU2), which basically includes the new Windows Media Player 10. Since this program is still in its debug stages, I did not thoroughly test it out. However, I will include a screenshot for your drooling pleasure. As you can see, Windows Media Player 10 is a massive update to the previous player. I especially like the new look of the program.<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-11.gif" /><br /><i>Figure 10: A preview of Windows Media Player 10.</i><br /><br /><PAGEBREAK><br /><span><b>WiFi Coming Soon...</b></span><br />The Asus A730 will come in two separate models. One model will feature Bluetooth only, and the other model will have Bluetooth and WiFi. My test unit only had Bluetooth, which was a small disadvantage since I use the WiFi on my Pocket PCs quite a lot. However, I was told that a dual-connectivity model will be arriving shortly. <br /><br /><span><b>Included Asus Programs</b></span><br />In addition to the Asus Camera program discussed above, ASUS also includes their own backup and and launcher programs. The Asus Backup program is useful to do basic backups. However, it doesn't include any sort of scheduled backup mechanism, so you'll have to manually run backups. Asus Backup does have a feature, however, called "SmartKeeper," which will automatically back up the PDA when the battery power is low. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-12.gif" /><br /><i>Figure 11: The Asus Backup program is useful for basic backups.</i><br /><br />The Asus Launcher is quite unique. You can easily create categories for your programs and move the icons from one category to another. You can also edit the titles of the programs or remove the icons altogether. I found this launcher to be much more useful than the basic Pocket PC launcher. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-13.gif" /><br /><i>Figure 12: The Asus Launcher is far better than the standard Pocket PC launcher.</i> <br /><br /><PAGEBREAK><br /><span><b>Benchmarks</b></span><br />The MyPal A730 performed very well in the SPB Benchmark tests. In this preproduction unit, the A730 scored a value of 2064.2 in the CPU Index tests. However, the A730 scored lower than the iPAQ 4150 in platform index tests. Keep in mind that I was testing a preproduction unit, so take these benchmark values with a grain of salt. Overall, my informal tests with the A730 made me feel that the A730 was actually <i>faster</i> than my iPAQ 4155. <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-14.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 13: SPB Benchmark CPU Index.</i> <br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-15.jpg" /><br /><i>Figure 14: SPB Benchmark Platform Index.</i> <br /><br />Regarding battery life, this Asus model was able to hold its juice very well, especially considering it sports a VGA screen and a very hot processor. I used SPB Benchmark to run battery tests on the device. At max backlight and standard usage, the device lasted for 3 hour, 9 minutes. However, with no backlight and no usage, the device lasted for over 6 and a half hours. This battery life is more than satisfactory to me. This A730 doesn't have built-in WiFi, so naturally the battery drain wouldn't be as high as a PDA with WiFi. However, Asus says the included 1100 mAh battery should last up to 9 hours. Obviously, I didn't get anywhere close to 9 hours. If you need more power, Asus sells an optional 1800 mAh battery as well. <br /><br /><span><b>Conclusion</b></span><br />All in all, I'd highly recommend the Asus MyPal A730 at its MSRP price of $499. If Asus is able to price their upcoming WiFi version at under $549, I think this device will be a steal. The MyPal A730 definitely has what it takes to compete with the HP iPAQ hx4705.

[surur]

1.3 MP camera, a first for the Pocket PC;

Can some-one say Loox 720?

Surur

[Underwater Mike]

Zack, any idea how this thing compares subjectively with the X50v? And, WTH is "Dung Cleaner"? :rotfl:

[duncanhbrown]

I've been trying out an Asus A730 recently, considering it as a replacement for an HP 4150. The VGA screen is great, but last weekend, my A730 sat in a drawer, turned off, with no programs loaded in memory. When I came in to work Monday morning, the battery had drained down to 30%. My 4150, which I used constantly over the weekend to look at Notes, Excel spreadsheets, Contacts, and Reminders, and to run other programs, also had its battery drained down....to 84%.

[scary]

I have a question about these new devices that can act like a USB Host. Do they also act like a USB client when connected to a PC? Could you see the CF card for instance? Probably not, but just curious. That would relieve me of having to carry a USB card reader around (I know, I could explore the device and see the card, but I seldom use Exploere to do file management. I need a drive letter).

S.

[NLS]

720 has more capabilities. This is a good device (of course it's EASY to be better than 4700) but I still prefer my 720.

50v could be second, this third and MAYBE after them, the 4700...

OF COURSE it's not the first device with 1.3MP camera.

[felixdd]

Nice subtle product placement :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-5.jpg

[Kati Compton]

Zack, any idea how this thing compares subjectively with the X50v? And, WTH is "Dung Cleaner"? :rotfl:

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20084&amp;start=0

[Jonathan1]

Nice subtle product placement :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

:) I was going to say the same thing. I SUPPOSE that there is a chance that he was taking the picture in front of his iMac and simply didn't pay close enough attention. There is also a chance monkeys might fly... ;)

I like the Asus. It’s a nice device. The reason I didn't go with it is the 4" screen on the 4700. It's just too juicy to pass up IMHO that and the lacking of WIFI. My next device must have WIFI. Not optional.

[NLS]

pitty that for you guys at the other side of the pond is more difficult to get hold a LOOX 720... really the best I've seen by far ever (and I've seen many - inc. ahem a certain new model by a very big company)

anyway as I said 730 is certainly good (still lacking some things compared to the aforementioned model) and certainly better (to my opinion) that the certain new model by a very big company I talk about above ;)

[ipaq_wannabe]

1.3 MP camera, a first for the Pocket PC;

Can some-one say Loox 720?

Surur

that is generally my first thought - it looks so LOOXy...

[ipaq_wannabe]

I have a question about these new devices that can act like a USB Host. Do they also act like a USB client when connected to a PC? Could you see the CF card for instance? Probably not, but just curious. That would relieve me of having to carry a USB card reader around (I know, I could explore the device and see the card, but I seldom use Exploere to do file management. I need a drive letter).

S.

i was looking for the same thing a while back, and made a post here to PPCT - and well never got a satisfactory answer, ie., you could see the CF card. with a catch, you install ActiveSync on the PC...

[arnage2]

very long battery life?

absolutely not. i had one, and it had worse battery life than a T3 and pretty much every other pda ive had

[Typhoon]

lol... yea, I agree. I have the LOOX 720 and the ASUS a730, and I have to say that the battery life sucks for the a730. If you do basic work...maybe it might be okay (but that is borderline). But if you do some intensive work, that PDA is not going to last very long. Actually I did a little battery test myself. I think I set the a730's backlight in between 1 notch to half full light, and I just let the PDA sit there and do nothing...I got 5 hours from it.

I also got to complain about the RAM as well. It only offers 45 usable MBs. I know most people will think...just add in a memory card! Yes you can...but some programs install by CAB files only. The problem is here because the CAB files automatically install into the PDA RAM and not the memory card, so it really kills the purpose of using a memory card. My ASUS PDA had a defect, and I sent it back to ASUS. They told me they would replace it w/a brand new PDA. I'm actually going to sell my a730 on eBay pretty soon. But the screen IS great! I like it better than my LOOX 720.

Here is where the ASUS beats the LOOX...way better buttons, brighter screen, better looking device, shorter physical length, and that's about it.

[Typhoon]

Hey does anyone have any opinion about the screens between the ASUS a730 and the FS LOOX 720? Which one looks better? I think the ASUS does. It is much brighter, and the white is a pure white...and the LOOX 720's white has no problem...but can not really compare to the a730's purest white. But someone else told me that they thought the LOOX 720 screen was much better...I'm not sure why...so I guess I could be wrong. I know that the LOOX 720's viewing angle is much better than the ASUS. But I guess for anyone to be able to make an opinion has to be able to have both PDAs at the same time.

[Fishie]

1.3 MP camera, a first for the Pocket PC;

Can some-one say Loox 720?

Surur

Or Ipaq 3715

[Menneisyys]

Quote from the article: "I am not going to show VGA vs QVGA screenshot comparisons, since these kinds of comparisons aren't related to the device itself."

Too bad there're no comparisons at all just to have some idea how colors are rendered on the new screen. It's one of the most important questions IMHO because not all VGA screens are equal. The Dell x50v screen, for example, has much more "washed out" colors than both the hx4700 and the Pocket Loox 720. That's a showstopper for me, because I use my VGA PPC a lot as a digital photo wallet.

(Also worth checking out http://menneisyys.freeweb.hu/SCREENQUALITY on this subject and to see how e.g. the PL720 fares against QVGA/Palm machines when used as a Photo Wallet.)

[Menneisyys]

It is much brighter, and the white is a pure white...and the LOOX 720's white has no problem...but can not really compare to the a730's purest white. But someone else told me that they thought the LOOX 720 screen was much better...I'm not sure why...so I guess I could be wrong.

There seem to be quite visible differences between PL720 screens, as was the case with some palmOne Tungsten T3's in the past. Some are a BIT yellowish, while the rest are totally white. The latter ones are just beatiful. The former - well, double-check before buying :)

Check out http://menneisyys.freeweb.hu/SCREENQUALITY to see how my one (which isn't one of the yellow ones) compares to the palm Z|71 (one of the best PDA screens), the iPAQ 2210, the E-125 (one of the best PDA screens) and the rusty iPAQ 36xx.

[Menneisyys]

I also got to complain about the RAM as well. It only offers 45 usable MBs. I know most people will think...just add in a memory card! Yes you can...but some programs install by CAB files only. The problem is here because the CAB files automatically install into the PDA RAM and not the memory card, so it really kills the purpose of using a memory card.

The situation is not that bad (see CabInstall, http://www.yorch.net/apps.htm).

Of course, even with CabInstall, you'll still have problems - 64M (that is, 45) is just not enough. Not even on the hx4700 - no wonder the hx4700 folks are diligently trying to move all the DLL's that are otherwise always put in the main memory into storage cards / iPAQ store :) (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&amp;threadid=113915)

IMHO there're a lot of problems with both the A730 and the upcoming A730w. The biggest problem is the 1100 mAh battery, even with the A730w... Yes, the A730w will still have the 1100 mAh battery and not the 1440 mAh one previously advertised.

[Menneisyys]

I have a question about these new devices that can act like a USB Host. Do they also act like a USB client when connected to a PC? Could you see the CF card for instance? Probably not, but just curious. That would relieve me of having to carry a USB card reader around (I know, I could explore the device and see the card, but I seldom use Exploere to do file management. I need a drive letter).

S.

i was looking for the same thing a while back, and made a post here to PPCT - and well never got a satisfactory answer, ie., you could see the CF card. with a catch, you install ActiveSync on the PC...

If you mean a pendrive-like functionality like that of CardExport (http://www.softick.com/cardexport/) on Palm OS - nope, unfortunately, no. PPC's are worse in this respect than Palm machines - you DO need to install ActiveSync on the desktop machine in order to be able to access the contents of the memory card(s) of the PDA.

[Menneisyys]

Nice subtle product placement :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/mahdavi-nov04-asus_a730-5.jpg

yeah, at first I thought it's a new Apple PDA :mrgreen:

[NLS]

interesting that 1-2 people mentioned it has better screen than 720, because 720 has a GREAT screen, so the asus screen must be REALLY awsome (in any case I can EASILY use 720 as a photo album - a pro photographer friend already agreed to that), so believe me 720 or asus, no screen deal breakers there (look "ELSEWHERE" in "other" brands advertising their screen, if you know what I mean)

anyway I don't find asus more beautiful, nor buttons better placed (never had a problem with them) but that could be subjective (both ways)

Having read more about the device, I wonder about the RAM and the battery... these are strong deal breakers to me... strong enough to put it behind even 4700 (and this really sux)

[surur]

Can we get the error regarding the "first pocketpc with a 1.3 Mpixel camera" removed from the frontpage please? (especially as it's listed as one of pros)

Surur

[NLS]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

[Menneisyys]

interesting that 1-2 people mentioned it has better screen than 720, because 720 has a GREAT screen

I wonder if they saw the two PPC's next to each other :)

IMHO, "seeing is believing". Fortunately, I'll really receive a hx4700/A730/x50v soon so I will be able to post REALLY good comparison pictures of the PDA's.

[Typhoon]

I also got to complain about the RAM as well. It only offers 45 usable MBs. I know most people will think...just add in a memory card! Yes you can...but some programs install by CAB files only. The problem is here because the CAB files automatically install into the PDA RAM and not the memory card, so it really kills the purpose of using a memory card.

The situation is not that bad (see CabInstall, http://www.yorch.net/apps.htm).

Of course, even with CabInstall, you'll still have problems - 64M (that is, 45) is just not enough. Not even on the hx4700 - no wonder the hx4700 folks are diligently trying to move all the DLL's that are otherwise always put in the main memory into storage cards / iPAQ store :) (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&amp;threadid=113915)

IMHO there're a lot of problems with both the A730 and the upcoming A730w. The biggest problem is the 1100 mAh battery, even with the A730w... Yes, the A730w will still have the 1100 mAh battery and not the 1440 mAh one previously advertised.

lol huh? You gotta be kidding me! They left out the 1440 mAh idea? That is just real lame...smallest battery for the most power hungery packed PDA ever made... dumb idea, don't you think?

[Typhoon]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

I think it is supposed to be the most powerful PDA despite it's largets size.

[Zack Mahdavi]

Sorry guys, I've been finishing up final exams, so I've been away from the forums for a little while.

1.3 MP camera, a first for the Pocket PC;

Can some-one say Loox 720?

Surur

Oops, sorry. I guess I forgot that... so the 1.3MP camera isn't then a first for the Pocket PC.

[Zack Mahdavi]

Zack, any idea how this thing compares subjectively with the X50v?

Hmm, I haven't played with the X50v at all. Maybe Jason can make some comments on this?

[Zack Mahdavi]

Nice subtle product placement :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

lol, to tell you the truth, I was having a lot of trouble getting a "top" shot of the Asus A730. I took several pictures, and this is the only one that looked good without being blurry. It was just a coincidence that my Apple Display reflected off the top... I'll work on avoiding subtle product placements in the future. After all, I am interning for Apple in the summer. ;)

[Zack Mahdavi]

very long battery life?

Well, here's how I tested out the device. I completely copied over everything from my regular-usage PDA (iPaq 4155) to the Asus A730. I then carried it with me like how I usually do, and did my usual day-to-day tasks with the device. The device seemed to last pretty long for me, and that includes PIM functions, but I think the A730's lack of WiFi helps extend the battery life.

To tell you the truth, I'm worried that the WiFi version of this device is going to be a real battery drainer.

[Kati Compton]

To tell you the truth, I'm worried that the WiFi version of this device is going to be a real battery drainer.
I was under the impression that the wifi version was going to come with a bigger battery (1400 instead of 1100).

[Menneisyys]

I think it [hx4700] is supposed to be the most powerful PDA despite it's largets size.

It all depends on what you mean by "most powerful". RAM size? Built-in USB host support? CIR? As good and selective a Wi-Fi RF unit as that in the 5450/5550? Camera? Jog dial or any kind of a GOOD controller for turning pages, esp. in one-hand landscape mode? Price? :)

[Menneisyys]

To tell you the truth, I'm worried that the WiFi version of this device is going to be a real battery drainer.
I was under the impression that the wifi version was going to come with a bigger battery (1400 instead of 1100).

Unfortunately, no. Much as PROPortable (http://www.proportable.com/detail.aspx?ID=73) still doesn't have the detailed spec on its homepage / ASUS indeed spoke of 1400 mAh batteries back in Summer, Justin from PROPortable has confirmed on PocketMatrix a lot of times that it only has an 1100 mAh one (the 1400 mAh battery would have costed +20 gramms; this is why it has been abandoned). See e.g. http://pocketmatrix.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=19686

[Menneisyys]

I also got to complain about the RAM as well. It only offers 45 usable MBs. I know most people will think...just add in a memory card! Yes you can...but some programs install by CAB files only. The problem is here because the CAB files automatically install into the PDA RAM and not the memory card, so it really kills the purpose of using a memory card.

The situation is not that bad (see CabInstall, http://www.yorch.net/apps.htm).

Of course, even with CabInstall, you'll still have problems - 64M (that is, 45) is just not enough. Not even on the hx4700 - no wonder the hx4700 folks are diligently trying to move all the DLL's that are otherwise always put in the main memory into storage cards / iPAQ store :) (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&amp;threadid=113915)

IMHO there're a lot of problems with both the A730 and the upcoming A730w. The biggest problem is the 1100 mAh battery, even with the A730w... Yes, the A730w will still have the 1100 mAh battery and not the 1440 mAh one previously advertised.

lol huh? You gotta be kidding me! They left out the 1440 mAh idea? That is just real lame...smallest battery for the most power hungery packed PDA ever made... dumb idea, don't you think?

Indeed it may be... but, taking into account that by abandoning the 1400 mAh battery, ASUS shoved off 20 gramms from the weight of the unit, it may have been a decent move. Let's see how it really fares in Wi-Fi battery tests. (I don't think I would sell my PL720 to switch to the Asus, though :) )

[NLS]

My 64MB 5450 had about 18MB total RAM (I add storage and memory "sides" since it's the same thing).

My LOOX 720 has ONLY half it's RAM available (measured Windows folder without it's subfolders has is some reason 60MB!), but I throw at it (and it easily takes) whatever falls in my hands. If I did this on a 64MB device you can easily see I would be able to run even PocketWord.

Note that there are no mail or mail attachments on the device, not even temporary web pages.

Note that for BOTH devices I tried HARD not to install anything in RAM except if I HAVE to (like programs that don't allow or don't work if they are not there).

To me, case closed. Please guys don't even mention the 4700 when you talk about a powerfull device; I don't know if 720 is, I know 4700 is not.

[Menneisyys]

(measured Windows folder without it's subfolders has is some reason 60MB!),

Because it has a lot of ROM stuff (about 43-45 Mbytes), all shared DLL's (e.g., RFileShell03 for Resco etc.), uninstall infos, even some EXE's and Today wallpapers (tdycust.jpg etc.). You can easily see what's stored in there that is installed by you by having a look at it with a desktop file browser (thru, e.g., the TOtal Commander WinCE FS plug-in) and switching off displaying hidden (ROM) files.

BTW, exactly this (scrutinizizing what shared DLL's are stored in \Windows, looking them up in the registry and trying to move them to a storage card by modifying the registry too) is how the hx4700-people at Brighthand are desperately trying to shave off the memory usage of their apps :devilboy:

[Menneisyys]

Note that there are no mail or mail attachments on the device, not even temporary web pages.

They are stored in subfolders under \Windows (Messaging and Temporary Internet Files) so they would not contribute the 60M you mentioned.

[Menneisyys]

BTW, as far as the 1100 mAh battery is concerned (as opposed to 1440/1650/1800 mAh batteries), Brighthand has a very interesting debate (http://discussion.brighthand.com/showthread.php?s=&amp;threadid=112682&amp;perpage=10&amp;pagenumber=8 ) on this. The following is an answer to a question:

"Going by the dimensions of the a730 BT - it is the thickest of all the VGA Pocket PCs (16.9 mm compared to the 15.2 mm of the Loox 720). It is also marginally wider than the Loox 720 - though it is shorter. The manufacturer quoted weights are identical for both models. That doesn't make it a big Pocket PC - far from it - but it shows your point for the nonsense it is.

So - tell us again - why just 1100 mAh when HTC fitted a 1640 mAh in the Loox? Also - perhaps one of your contacts can explain why they abandoned plans to fit a 1440 mAh battery in the a730w? I have two excellent sources for that - which makes me think that the 1100 mAh has NOTHING to do with the dimensions of the unit."

[Typhoon]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

Mediocre? Why would you call their PDAs that?

[Typhoon]

Sorry guys, I've been finishing up final exams, so I've been away from the forums for a little while.

1.3 MP camera, a first for the Pocket PC;

Can some-one say Loox 720?

Surur

Oops, sorry. I guess I forgot that... so the 1.3MP camera isn't then a first for the Pocket PC.

Isn't there a pocket pc before the loox 720 that had a digital camera? I'm just wondering if maybe there was... I know before the LOOX 720, there was the Viewsonic V36? It either had a 1, 1.2, or 1.3 MP camera...

[Typhoon]

I think it [hx4700] is supposed to be the most powerful PDA despite it's largets size.

It all depends on what you mean by "most powerful". RAM size? Built-in USB host support? CIR? As good and selective a Wi-Fi RF unit as that in the 5450/5550? Camera? Jog dial or any kind of a GOOD controller for turning pages, esp. in one-hand landscape mode? Price? :)

Oh I see, lol, i forgot....the fastest maybe?

[NLS]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

Mediocre? Why would you call their PDAs that?

I have my reasons which I don't even believe they are subjective.
Let's just say that it is not the most fully featured, nor that (some of) it's features are implemented in the best possible way, nor do I agree about the quality of the thing.
But I don't want to open this now and in this unrelated thread.
So you can keep it as "my personal opinion". Fair?

[Typhoon]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

Mediocre? Why would you call their PDAs that?

I have my reasons which I don't even believe they are subjective.
Let's just say that it is not the most fully featured, nor that (some of) it's features are implemented in the best possible way, nor do I agree about the quality of the thing.
But I don't want to open this now and in this unrelated thread.
So you can keep it as "my personal opinion". Fair?

i guessmost people will probably disagree with you then huh? it's ok...let's all talk about the LOOX 720

[NLS]

no you guess wrong - I suspect many of the people that can really evaluate without the prism of a PDA being HP or not, will agree with me... those who have the "HP made it, it must be good" argument in their mind, I don't expect those to agree with me (nor do I care but anyway)

anyway I don't really get your meaning
and why should we talk about 720 in the asus 730 thread?

[Typhoon]

well... the a730 isn't really a strong competitor...maybe the a730w. But the LOOX 720 is really a competitor and probably the best. Now if they can sell them in the US, the ASUS and HP would not have a change against the LOOX. The LOOX has pretty much everything (except 4" screen and a seperate graphics CPU).

[Zack Mahdavi]

More details on the new WiFi Asus MyPal A730 can be found here (http://usa.asus.com/products/pda/A730/index.htm). I don't know the MSRP however.

[Menneisyys]

I think it [hx4700] is supposed to be the most powerful PDA despite it's largets size.

It all depends on what you mean by "most powerful". RAM size? Built-in USB host support? CIR? As good and selective a Wi-Fi RF unit as that in the 5450/5550? Camera? Jog dial or any kind of a GOOD controller for turning pages, esp. in one-hand landscape mode? Price? :)

Oh I see, lol, i forgot....the fastest maybe?

Fastest? What about the Dell x50v, then? :) Jointly fastest at most.

[Menneisyys]

well... the a730 isn't really a strong competitor...maybe the a730w. But the LOOX 720 is really a competitor and probably the best. Now if they can sell them in the US, the ASUS and HP would not have a change against the LOOX. The LOOX has pretty much everything (except 4" screen and a seperate graphics CPU).

The lack of the GPU is not a problem because ATI GPU's are of no help (an exception to the rule may be the hx4700, with its highly optimized ATI code - no wonder e800 users have also adopted that). It's only the 2700 in the x50v that really DOES make the graphics faster, by allowing full-screen seamless video play at 208 MHz (!!) on an x50v.

[Menneisyys]

I esp. love the closing phrase for Asus that "has everything to compete with 4700" or something...

Erm... I seem to miss the point if someone can explain. What is 4700? The holy grail or something? Compete 50v maybe (but not quite), compete 720 maybe (but will lose)... but it's not THAT hard to compete 4700...

Why is everything compared to a mediocre HP all the time? (for all years I remember PDA sites?)

Anyway you can note this as a rhetoric question, I don't really expect an answer (nor want flame by some HP lover).

Mediocre? Why would you call their PDAs that?

I have my reasons which I don't even believe they are subjective.
Let's just say that it is not the most fully featured, nor that (some of) it's features are implemented in the best possible way, nor do I agree about the quality of the thing.
But I don't want to open this now and in this unrelated thread.
So you can keep it as "my personal opinion". Fair?

i guessmost people will probably disagree with you then huh? it's ok...let's all talk about the LOOX 720

Well, I'm a PL720 owner myself, and I think NLS is exaggerating a bit. I've owned several HP machines in the past (starting with the 320LX) and was generally happy with them (except for the infamous 2210 rubber grips and sub-par screen). I also seriosuly considered buying the hx4700 because it IS a great machine with easily the best screen. The lack of the USB host, the jog dial, the CIR and the 128M RAM were a showstopper for me. Still, the hx4700 remains a very good choice for people that don't need the extra functionality I've listed and don't want to store much in the main memory (Outlook mails etc).

[Menneisyys]

Isn't there a pocket pc before the loox 720 that had a digital camera? I'm just wondering if maybe there was... I know before the LOOX 720, there was the Viewsonic V36? It either had a 1, 1.2, or 1.3 MP camera...

Toshiba e550c and Mitac Mio 339, http://www.mobile-review.com/pda/review/mitac-mio339-en.shtml. With even worse quality than that of the PL720 :)

[Menneisyys]

More details on the new WiFi Asus MyPal A730 can be found here (http://usa.asus.com/products/pda/A730/index.htm). I don't know the MSRP however.

170g, 1100 mAh... pretty heavy for what it offers...

[NLS]

well... the a730 isn't really a strong competitor...maybe the a730w. But the LOOX 720 is really a competitor and probably the best. Now if they can sell them in the US, the ASUS and HP would not have a change against the LOOX. The LOOX has pretty much everything (except 4" screen and a seperate graphics CPU).

I don't (PERSONALY) think 4" is better. To me in PDA smaller is better, INCLUDING the screen. Smaller screen, same resolution means SMALLER pixels (you can easily see this in 720) and paper draw quality.

Even my (not too much) myopic eyes can clearly read on 720, I don't think I need 4"... after all those 4" are not even the excuse for the HUGE size (and I would say weight) of 4700 as it manages to be MUCH bigger than it's screen.

Anyway to me 4700 is not even second or third. OK you made me say it (again). :) Happy?

[riuster]

how about the speaker capability of this unit? Comparing it with the LOOX 720?

[riuster]

I believe you can get this unit for about 470 street price, and the wifi unit will be about 520.

so...lets do the math...a 1800 mah battery and back case costs 70 dollars, thats about 590 with two batteries

so you get 2 batts with the asus, compared with one 1600mah batt in the Loox 720 for the price of 620 excluding shipping from www.expansys.com

Also, more accessories for the ASUS..., loox like a no brainer...

[riuster]

720 has more capabilities. This is a good device (of course it's EASY to be better than 4700) but I still prefer my 720.

50v could be second, this third and MAYBE after them, the 4700...

OF COURSE it's not the first device with 1.3MP camera.

In what way does the loox 720 have more capabilities...looks like the same to me, except for the battery life.

[NLS]

(really vital) RAM?
(I have 65MB free in my 720 which means I've eaten up HALF and I even try NOT to use it... there are less than 5 programs installed in RAM)

a SINGLE 1600mAh battery? (so if you get two you have 3200 since you mention the double battery case)

where is WIFI yet? (how much will it cost?)

also I don't get where do you get the "more peripherals" statement... can you elaborate? (both have SDIO, CF, USB host, both have IR, BT, WIFI -hmmm the w-, LOOX I know has chargers, RS232... what do you miss exactly?)

as for pricing... I got my LOOX 720 for 500 euro (do the math) INCLUDING a Peil Frama (that normaly costs 60 dollars) - looks a no brainer TO ME too

[nategesner]

Ladies, ladies, ladies! Let's not forget that functionality is in the eye of the beholder! What is necessary for one is not for the other.

I have absolutely no need for WiFi and don't plan on spending money for something I don't need. However, I need a better screen because I read on it a lot. And I could use USB compatibility to attach it to my phone and surf while on the go (something that's not possible with WiFi in most areas, but is possible almost anywhere with my particular phone).

The ASUS is getting good reviews for what it is. If you want something different, then that just means the ASUS isn't for you. It doesn't mean that it's necessarily bad. And for a VGA screen (and bigger at that), a faster processor, a better carrying case, etc., it's only costing me $50 more than I paid for my Ipaq 2215 a year ago!

I'm expecting mine in a couple days. If any users out there want to share their experiences, I'd love to hear from you on the ASUS forum!

[nategesner]

Forgot one important thing:

Does the ASUS A730 have commercial IR? I use it quite often on my 2215 and hope to still have it on the ASUS, though it's not a necessity.

[Menneisyys]

Some new comparison pictures (Dell Axim x50v vs F-S PL720 vs iPAQ 4150) have just been posted by googleman to Firstloox. They're great and really worth checking out: http://www.firstloox.org/forums/sho...ted=1#post18293

[Menneisyys]

Forgot one important thing:

Does the ASUS A730 have commercial IR?

Unfortunately, no. See http://www.firstloox.org/VGAppc.htm.

[Zack Mahdavi]

Some new comparison pictures (Dell Axim x50v vs F-S PL720 vs iPAQ 4150) have just been posted by googleman to Firstloox. They're great and really worth checking out: http://www.firstloox.org/forums/sho...ted=1#post18293

Menneisyys, I think your link is broken. Let's try this (http://www.firstloox.org/forums/showpost.php?p=18291&amp;postcount=14) instead.

[nategesner]

I'm confused about the CIR. People over at Brighthand are testing it and getting success at 20ft. Even the primary distributor at ProPortable tested one and had the same success.

Is it possible they built in CIR but failed to advertise it? I guess I'll find out when my unit arrives this week...

[riuster]

check out Mobile Planet's reviews..it stinks..I guess im not buying anything from there.

http://www.shopping.com/xMR-MobilePlanet~MRD-90074~S-1

[nategesner]

I received an ASUS A730 (BT only) yesterday. Played with it for about 3 hours and didn't like it. I wrote a looong post about it under the ASUS forum, so I won't bore you with the details here. I can tell you I was so disappointed in it that I didn't even bother trying the IR capability.

I put in an order for the Dell Axim X50v. Let's hope it gives better results. Otherwise, I'm sticking with my Ipaq 2215.