Lycoris Soon to Ship Mobile Linux, Pocket PC Edition

[Andy Sjostrom]

<div class='os_post_top_link'><a href='http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7056225751.html' target='_blank'>http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7056225751.html</a><br /><br /></div>Lycoris is known for its desktop Linux operating system and they are just finishing a mobile version of their distribution. The operating system will be called "Desktop/LX Pocket PC Edition (DL-PPC)" and it will be made available to device makers and consumers directly. DL-PPC origins from the more known OpenZaurus and Opie.<br /><br />"DL-PPC will initially support ARM-based PDAs such as the Sharp Zaurus and HP iPaq. However, it uses a standard Linux kernel -- version 2.4.18 initially, with updates planned soon -- making it relatively easy to port to other architectures, according to Lycoris Founder Joseph Cheek."<br /><br />So, what is this "Pocket PC" all about? Well, founder Joseph Cheek is a former Microsoft employee. Lycoris was first called "Redmond Linux Project" before it was changed to Lycoris in a pre-emptive move. Joseph says they "performed extensive trademark research before choosing the "Pocket PC" name. "We couldn't find anything at the Office of Patents and Trademarks, and we couldn't find anything at Microsoft," he said."<br /><br />Linux in mobile devices has been debated here before. Personally, I believe Linux will eventually make it to noticeable market share numbers. The critical issue is getting a major player, such as Motorola, to set the API standards and UI guidelines. Foster a developer community and attract more device makers. It won't happen this year or the next. But in three years? Likely.<br /><br /><img src="http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/images/web/2003/linux_01.JPG" />

[WillyG]

Interesting. Personally im no Linux fundamentalist. But looking at the nice screenshots of the GUI makes me wonder: :dilemma:
-What will happen if this (windows alike) OS answers all our current requests?
-What if alarms work the way they should?
-What if there is a good sync tool.... that let you sync your with Outlook and your windows pc as a partner?
-What if it got a good wordprocesseor (which can edit word files without chreding them)?
-What if even novices can install (flash) this OS to their Pocket pc's
-What if there are frequent updates, aviable for download and install by the end user?
-What if there is good network tools in it? With OS support for BT and WIFI?
-What if there is a good mail client?
-What if we can swich screen orientation easy without a reset?
-What if....

What will happen to Microsofts OS then? I think this is good news. Not because i nessesairily want to run Linux on my pocket pc, but because it gives me the freedom to chose. And because it might give Microsoft a few ideas what we like and dont like :wink:

[Andrew]

This screen shot looks at like the familiar installation with Opie I have to say.
As Ive mentioned in another thread, Ive installed linux onto two old ipaqs for testing (3870 and 3630) and although work has kept me from playing with them too much yet, one nice feature is the ability to switch between landscape and portrait on-the-fly. No soft reset required. Have to admit that it impressed me at least.
Once Ive had chance to play though, Ill be more than happy to post here what I find out if anyone is interested?
Atm Im having some trouble pulling down some of the packages though, most notably the one for bluetooth which I need to test the GPRS.

Andrew

[arnage2]

looks nice. Hopefully, it will be compatible with my 5555's wifi and bt.

[Stephen Beesley]

Just recently I have been thinking of picking up a second hand Zaurus SL5500 on ebay (they seem to be going for about £100 in the UK) just to have a bit of a play with Linux and see whether a Linux PDA is for me.

This looks like a further interesting development, now I wonder if this release will work on a Jornada (after all it has the same processer as the Ipaq and Zaurus) if so then a future as a Linux PDA might be in store for it - rather than gathering dust in a drawer after I eventually replace it!

[twntaipan]

If someone would write a highly functional Linux ActiveSync replacement it would make the Linux OS even more attractive to the public.

[jizmo]

I have to admit that I've always preferred the looks of PDA linux versions over PPC2003. Making the elements smaller for a smaller screen isn't as stupid as it might sound ;). I've also liked the fact that the OS feels like there has been a lot of efford put into it.

But it's the same reason here why I use windows on my laptop instead of Linux. I have zero tolerance for having to install, tweak and hack something to get it work.

I wish this project all the best. If they get it functioning properly and most importantly easy to install and maintain, I just might leap over to this train that hasn't stopped at the station.

/jizmo

[Jonathan1]

Linux's strong point, at least to me, has always been its robust hardware support. Its weaknesses are obviously its ease of use. Sure once setup and configured it’s a breeze but its that initial setup that has always been a PITA. I think handheld devices is one place where Linux can actually work well considering we aren’t talking as wide a plethora of hardware as desktops and laptops. If Linux distributors can get it to a point where upgrades are as easy as point and click firmware upgrades and can get the various software packages organized and easy to find/install/use I could possibly see Linux being a legit competitor in the PDA market. I think it’s a forgone conclusion that the only two real OS kings in the PDA world will be Pocket PC and Palm OS. Linux will always play, at least 3rd string, but I don't see that as a problem since may Linux distros for the for PDA are aftermarket installs. There is no real pressure on Linux to compete. It/They can just keep doing their thing improving their quality/ease of use/software offerings while Pocket PC and Palm battle it out.

[Jonathan1]

PS- Does anyone know if there is any Linux distro for the HP Jornada 568 device? I'm prob going to upgrade to some uber Pocket PC this summer (PPC 2004 *knock on wood*) and would love to have an alternative Linux device.

[Andrew]

Hi, I didnt find anything for the 5x devices, but found this for the 7x, I never had a jornada so dont know how similar they are, but thought you may be able to adapt this.

http://handhelds.org/~gberenfield/Jornada/

Otherwise handhelds.org itself is pretty much the best resource for putting linux on a handheld.

When I put it on my 3870, it took me about 3 hours for the first time, but once I learnt how, I did it for my colleague here at work on his 3870 in under 10 minutes. If you do decide to try it, I highly recomend Opie, its more 'pda-like' than some of the others.

Regards

Andrew

[Stephen Beesley]

Hi, I didnt find anything for the 5x devices, but found this for the 7x, I never had a jornada so dont know how similar they are, but thought you may be able to adapt this.



Completely different machines unfortunately, the 720 is a Handheld PC. Like Jonathan1 I would love to put Linux on my 568 when I upgrade in the (hopefully near) future

[WillyG]

omg check out the screenshots here 8O http://opie.handhelds.org/gallery/ (several pages)
Click on iPaq/SL-5x00 screenshots. And see what it can do. Looks like they have put a great deal of effort in it.

[Jimmy Dodd]

I may have finally found a use for the free Viewsonic V37 I received from MS for buying Visual Studio. :D

[sponge]

Just because a device has the same processor or is "very similar" doesn't mean you can put Linux on it. Each port has some very specific changes, and that's between iPaqs. So don't expect Linux on whatever device unless it's specifically ported to that.

As for this port, I don't see any advantages of this over Familiar with Opie, so I'm not quite sure what they're trying to push.

[jkendrick]

Just because a device has the same processor or is "very similar" doesn't mean you can put Linux on it. Each port has some very specific changes, and that's between iPaqs. So don't expect Linux on whatever device unless it's specifically ported to that.

As for this port, I don't see any advantages of this over Familiar with Opie, so I'm not quite sure what they're trying to push.

I think they're trying to port a pretested and configured distribution that the end user can install and go. I also think they plan on offering full support for the OS.

It will be interesting to see if they can back up what they offer.

[Jonathan1]

omg check out the screenshots here 8O http://opie.handhelds.org/gallery/ (several pages)
Click on iPaq/SL-5x00 screenshots. And see what it can do. Looks like they have put a great deal of effort in it.

As Vader would say "Most impressive"

As I would say, HOLY [BLEEEEEEEEP] Very nice. *imagines running an SSH server off of this thing* Very nice indeed. :D

[sponge]

*imagines running an SSH server off of this thing* Very nice indeed. :D

Funny story actually. Occasionally, when WinCE really annoys the heck out of me, I'll throw on the latest version of Familiar for a week or two. Anyway, one day I had a paper due, and had a particulary rushed morning, forgot to print it out, AND forgot to take my iPaq out of the charger and bring it with me to school. I get there, and realize what I've done (well, haven't done) Luckily, i had enough time to SSH into my iPaq, grab the file, toss it into Word, and print it out.

I've also ran a WWW, FTP, and VNC server on it just for kicks.

[lapchinj]

... Looks like they have put a great deal of effort in it.
I have both the original SL-5000D released to developers and my first iPAQ 3765 which is now running Opie. There was a tremendous effort in building those OS’s and the community around them. These PDA’s are fast and have a great user interface. They are without a doubt a good OS replacement for Microsoft and for sure the Palm.

The only reasons I still use Microsoft is it’s also an excellent OS with the bugs and issues, and it’s the only place I can find and run software like PI, AF, Sprite, Resco, etc., etc., etc,…… So far I haven’t seen software on any PDA platform that can replace the software I mentioned above and the rest of that list is very long. Without the apps there is no need for the OS. Unless your like me and just enjoy hacking away with an OS or using these PDA’s as a superior platform to build robots and that kind of stuff.

Jeff -

[lapchinj]

In reply to your signature Jonathan1

MICROSOFT: Where do you want to go today? Mars :D

APPLE: Where do you want to go tomorrow? Mars :D

LINUX: Are you coming or what? I'm Here! Waiting for every one else to get up here on Mars. The scenery is simply great. :way to go:

Jeff- 8)

[pet1408]

I do not see an advantage to a linux os for the pda, it would seem to be a step back but then the people who think microsoft is the antichrist probaby will BUY that as well. Been there done that, not going back.

[dean_shan]

I like the screen shots a lot. This looks like it would be really nice to use.

[dmacburry2003]

PDALinuxThoughts.com 8O


AHhhhHHHHhhhHHh stop taking over the world :!: :!: :!:


Better get out that orange tape and shrink wrap... 0X

[lapchinj]

I do not see an advantage to a linux os for the pda, it would seem to be a step back but then the people who think microsoft is the antichrist probaby will BUY that as well. Been there done that, not going back.

I don’t think that everyone that uses another OS thinks that Microsoft is the antichrist and will buy anything as long as it’s not MS. What would you say about Palm users? There are many different OS’s around for many different needs. There isn’t one OS that does it all.

Besides people were saying the same thing about Linux some years ago and look who is taking control of the server market. And this is at the expense of the other Unix companies not MS since they are not very big in the “big iron” multiple processor department (Linux just went from 64 to 128 processors). SCO also has thoughts about the antichrist but instead of it being Microsoft its Linux and Open Source.

Being able to make a choice is the reason behind having so many PDA companies, software companies, OS companies and presidential candidates.

Jeff - :soapbox:

[Bichcake]

I'll try it out if they support the ipaq 2200 series. it's a no brainer to optimize linux for xscale cpus. maybe this will get microsoft to optimize.

[Tom W.M.]

It'd be neat to be able to run this on my MobilePro 780. Is it at all likely to be ported to MIPS, or will support for older devices not likely come? I know that there's a version of BSD that supports a variety of MIPS H/PCs.

I guess I'm most interested in a decent web browser for my H/PC. While I think that CSS4 support as specified in the article must be a typo (CSS3 is the latest spec. I've hear about, and no browser supports that fully yet—IE doesn't even decent CSS2 support :evil: ), any CSS support would be a welcome step up from Pocket Internet Explorer 3.01, which is so archaic that I could never use it for actual browsing.

[jkendrick]

It'd be neat to be able to run this on my MobilePro 780. Is it at all likely to be ported to MIPS, or will support for older devices not likely come? I know that there's a version of BSD that supports a variety of MIPS H/PCs.

I guess I'm most interested in a decent web browser for my H/PC. While I think that CSS4 support as specified in the article must be a typo (CSS3 is the latest spec. I've hear about, and no browser supports that fully yet—IE doesn't even decent CSS2 support :evil: ), any CSS support would be a welcome step up from Pocket Internet Explorer 3.01, which is so archaic that I could never use it for actual browsing.

Every reference to Linux porting that I've seen has always stated XSCALE/ARM devices only.

[Tom W.M.]

Every reference to Linux porting that I've seen has always stated XSCALE/ARM devices only.
Oh, that's a shame. Well, maybe someday someone will do a Gecko or KHTML port for Windows CE—I can dream, can't I? :)

[jkendrick]

How do you like the MobilePro? Do you find all the apps you need for it?

[jizmo]

This might be a stupid question, but does this run all the Zaurus software?

/jizmo

[Huezo]

I'm installing it as soon as its released for the iPAQ 2215.
I've always wanted run Linux on my iPAQ :twisted:

[tsb_hcy]

Can Linux handle multiple language fonts simultaneously? Is it a simple matter of adding the font file to the correct directory? One thing I hate about PPC is the need for registry hacks or installed programs to view other languages. It would be nice just to be able to drop the font file into a folder and reset and be done with it.

How about keyboards or hand writing recognition for multiple languages as well? Is it possible to have keyboard, font, and handwriting support for multiple languages with Linux?

I'd like this on my 2210 as well if it does support multiple languages well. Oh, how much is this gonna cost?

[tsb_hcy]

Anyone?

[Tom W.M.]

How do you like the MobilePro? Do you find all the apps you need for it?
Sorry to have taken so long to repy (and for bumping the thread).

It does pretty much all I want it to do besides play DivX videos, and the sound quality leaves quite a lot to be desired (but it's really too big for that, anyway). I'd have to do some serious learning in order to get the video playback of PocketMVP working, and the MobilePro's not really fast enough for it anyway (note that the Casio E-10x version of PocketMVP will play audio just fine, once you replace the skin). I'm not exactly a heavy user of Pocket Outlook, and the only program I us a whole lot in that suite is Tasks, which does what I need. The only Pocket Office app I use extensively is Word, and while I could use some additional functionality (like outline lists), but I don't need them badly enough to justify the $50 price tag for TextMaker. (Not that I mean that it's an unfair price. I don't want to reopen that arguement.)

There is a lot of software available out there if you look, though there are very few non-puzzle or -arcade games avaiable. My essential apps include Tombo, a note/memo program with a number of advanced features, including encryption and lots of keyboard shortcuts. (Keyboard shortcuts are one of the most important features for an H/PC program, because they make the program so much faster and easier to use.) Also essential is Total Commander/CE, a file explorer replacement, that allows for two panes side-by-side and supports ZIP files and includes it's own text editor (supports Unicode!). I also love uBook on my MobilePro.

The one truly important app that is missing is a decent web browser—the obsolete version of IE included doesn't support CSS at all. No PNG support, either.